How close is Maguire to the comics?

[Green Goblin]

I sat down and watched all 3 Rami films the other day. I found the while I do like the first two, SM1 was my favourite. The reason is that I felt out of the 3 it was the closest to the comics. Now we know Maguire is based on 616 Parker but how close was he. While his SM felt much to be desired how close was he to 616? I read Ultimate so I am unfamiliar with 616 for the most part. I thought that he was a good Peter Parker in SM1 but lacked the confidence and witty nature of him in College years. Didn't he even show signs of that pre-spiderbite? The only Origin Stories I read are Ultimate and Season One.
Can someone give me an insightful look into Rami Parker and his Comic Book counter part?

 

[OcStat]

Both films take bits and pieces from the original Amazing series and the Ultimate line.

As far as Peter's persona...Maguire did a very good job of capturing Stan Lee's Peter Parker but like you mentioned, in the other films he never let his character really grow, which Stan did in less than 40 issues.

In Spider-Man 2 and 3 we see Peter getting picked on in college. Like you said, Maguire's Peter never acquired the confidence Comic Peter did after the spider-bite. Comic Peter was not the perpetual bookworm/easy target for jocks or whatever.

 

[Green Goblin]

just to let people know this isn't a Garfield vs Maguire debate.

 

[The Joker]

Since Spider-Man 2 is the one I consider to be the best one and my personal favorite, I'll show you the influences that were used on Peter's story in that.

Here's where he is suffering with the guilt over Uncle Ben's death so badly it starts to affect his powers:

Then Betty Brant is kidnapped by Doc Ock and his Sinister Six to lure Spider-Man into meeting them, similar to how Ock kidnapped MJ in SM-2 to force Spidey to meet him:

His powers come back, realizing he lost them because of psychological stress:

Here's where he's feeling so miserable over his life as Spider-Man that he quits:

And a fun little side note, Jonah Jameson getting the Spidey costume he threw away, printing headlines about Spidey quitting, and having the costume displayed on his office wall:

So Peter in Spider-Man 2 is heavily influenced by the Stan Lee era.

 

[Green Goblin]

Since Spider-Man 2 is the one I consider to be the best one and my personal favorite, I'll show you the influences that were used on Peter's story in that.

Here's where he is suffering with the guilt over Uncle Ben's death so badly it starts to affect his powers:

Then Betty Brant is kidnapped by Doc Ock and his Sinister Six to lure Spider-Man into meeting them, similar to how Ock kidnapped MJ in SM-2 to force Spidey to meet him:

His powers come back, realizing he lost them because of psychological stress:

Here's where he's feeling so miserable over his life as Spider-Man that he quits:

And a fun little side note, Jonah Jameson getting the Spidey costume he threw away, printing headlines about Spidey quitting, and having the costume displayed on his office wall:

So Peter in Spider-Man 2 is heavily influenced by the Stan Lee era.

Wow, didn't realise SM2 took heavy inspiration from a CB arc.

 

[Senator Pleasury]

It's funny to see the scene when Jameson is given the Spider-man suit and compare it to the scene in SM2 (with the garbage man).

Even in the comics, the scene is a little more plausible. Jameson says "This looks like the Real McCoy" and he prints "Is Spider-man Through?"

In SM2, he gets a Spider-man suit for a reward and Jameson doesn't even question the legitimacy of the item (not even as a mistrustful cheap character he is). Then, he just prints "Spider-man No More" as a fact, without even having the information verified or at least having a different source (which is what every journalist learns in their first year).

I think SM2 is one of the best superhero movies out there, but I have never been able to overcome Raimi's juvenile tone.

 

[pr0xyt0xin]

Yeah. Raimi's were well-crafted. But just too childish and filled with actors I can't stand.

 

[Vid Electricz]

As opposed to dark, gritty, seriousness of skateboarding to Coldplay, basketball hijinks, "Freddy" the mutant rat, Peter falling into an abandoned wrestling ring, etc... Doesn't get more childish than that.

I'd argue that TASM tries to put on the illusion that it's "more realistic" than the Raimi series, but the Raimi series is ultimately more mature (even though it does have a very strong tongue-in-cheek sense of humour)

 

[ThePhantasm]

I think SM2 is one of the best superhero movies out there, but I have never been able to overcome Raimi's juvenile tone.

I loved it. Made it feel just like the comics to me.

 

[Senator Pleasury]

As opposed to dark, gritty, seriousness of skateboarding to Coldplay, basketball hijinks, "Freddy" the mutant rat, Peter falling into an abandoned wrestling ring, etc... Doesn't get more childish than that.

First off, I'm not sure what could TASM have to do here.

But well, it does (get more childish), since teenager universal problems of lack of self-steem, trying to impress the girl and such is one thing, and one thing that's observable, it does happen. Freddy the rat, though, is just campiness, and unnecessary campiness. But a grumpy editor acting like a caricature is another. Jameson is cheap and suspicious, always have been, in comic and in Raimi's movies. He wouldn't accept any item - much less pay for it - without some little evidence that's true. Orb else, anyone could come with some home-made Spider-man suit or... a piece of a UFO.

I'd argue that TASM tries to put on the illusion that it's "more realistic" than the Raimi series, but the Raimi series is ultimately more mature (even though it does have a very strong tongue-in-cheek sense of humour)

How is more mature?

I loved it. Made it feel just like the comics to me.

I agree. Which is why I support Stan lee's words when he says that what works in comics doesn't necessarily work in movies.

 

[DX]

So....Spidey yelling "CROTCH!!!" isn't childish?

 

[Senator Pleasury]

So....Spidey yelling "CROTCH!!!" isn't childish?

Has anyone said otherwise?

It's the way Spider-man is suppose to behave with criminals (calling them names like "Fishbowl head" and whatnot).

 

[Vid Electricz]

First off, I'm not sure what could TASM have to do here.

But well, it does (get more childish), since teenager universal problems of lack of self-steem, trying to impress the girl and such is one thing, and one thing that's observable, it does happen. Freddy the rat, though, is just campiness, and unnecessary campiness. But a grumpy editor acting like a caricature is another. Jameson is cheap and suspicious, always have been, in comic and in Raimi's movies. He wouldn't accept any item - much less pay for it - without some little evidence that's true. Orb else, anyone could come with some home-made Spider-man suit or... a piece of a UFO.

So if a movie features/concerning teenagers must inherently be childish? Why is a movie like Hugo (which features children) not childish and juvenile in the way that TASM is?

Like another poster said, Spider-Man is a movie that makes you feel like a 13 year old kid again...TASM is a movie written for 13 year old kids.

How is more mature?

It's more mature in that it doesn't have any pretense about what it is, it's goofy, serious, melodramatic, dark, campy and fun all in equal measure- and they're confident in what they are.

TASM is like the child trying to gain more credibility by dressing up like an adult (ie. the facade of being "grounded" and "dark")

 

[ThePhantasm]

It's the way Spider-man is suppose to behave with criminals (calling them names like "Fishbowl head" and whatnot).

Yeah but I thought...

What works in comics doesn't necessarily work in movies.

 

[Senator Pleasury]

So if a movie features/concerning teenagers must inherently be childish? Why is a movie like Hugo (which features children) not childish and juvenile in the way that TASM is?

I'm, saying the oppsoite when I say "teenager universal problems ... is one thing, and one thing that's observable, it does happen... But a grumpy editor acting like a caricature is another."

I'm precisely saying that the age of the main character and the behavior defined by their age don't define how childish the movie is. This, because you implied that it did ("seriousness of skateboarding to Coldplay, basketball hijinks").

Like another poster said, Spider-Man is a movie that makes you feel like a 13 year old kid again...TASM is a movie written for 13 year old kids.

The opposite actually. Raimi's movies have these adult characters acting for a childish audience; Jameson being suddenly naive, that usher and his neverending comic routine, caricatures of what a nerd is and what a school bully is. In TASM the bully and the nerd are not defined by old-fashioned cliches like Raimi does. I mean, even Uncle Ben was one-dimensional unable to get angry at Peter (because he is the old good guy and old good guys don't get angry). TASM gave development to those. Finally.

It's more mature in that it doesn't have any pretense about what it is, it's goofy, serious, melodramatic, dark, campy and fun all in equal measure- and they're confident in what they are.

It's overall goofy in the way the characters are depicted and portrayed. Even the creepy Green Goblin comes up with "We'll meet again, Spidah-maaan" and cheese like that (not to mention that he's given no purpose at all, other than becoming Spidey's BFF).

TASM is like the child trying to gain more credibility by dressing up like an adult (ie. the facade of being "grounded" and "dark")

It's exactly Peter's story.

Raimi was satisfied with displaying a long collection of old cliches (nerds misses the bus, they are not allowed to seat next to any girl, people tell them "lame" and push them around, they are teased in classes and school trips, they wear thick frame glasses). TASM said, yes some of those happen, but they can be heroic and not totally ******s with women.

And school bullies can learn and see things from a different perspective.


*****************************

Yeah but I thought...

So, you decided to ignore the word "necessarily"?

 

[WarriorDreamer]

Peter didn't learn any responsibilty whatsoever in ASM, while Peter in Raimi series, in the orgin learnt it. He seemed wise beyond his years because of it. Unlike in ASM, where he was still immature in the sense of ignoring grown ups wishes.

 

[Senator Pleasury]

Peter didn't learn any responsibilty whatsoever in ASM, while Peter in Raimi series, in the orgin learnt it. He seemed wise beyond his years because of it. Unlike in ASM, where he was still immature in the sense of ignoring grown ups wishes.

Both learned their share of responsibility, but when it was about the girl, they just went on. TASM Peter was shown all bruised up but doing what his aunt asked him to, but he ignored his promise to Stacy. Maguire's Peter learned responsibility but he didn't have a problem making his moves to get his best friend's girlfriend to himself behind his back.

 

[Green Goblin]

As opposed to dark, gritty, seriousness of skateboarding to Coldplay, basketball hijinks, "Freddy" the mutant rat, Peter falling into an abandoned wrestling ring, etc... Doesn't get more childish than that.

I'd argue that TASM tries to put on the illusion that it's "more realistic" than the Raimi series, but the Raimi series is ultimately more mature (even though it does have a very strong tongue-in-cheek sense of humour)

Off topic. How the F*** is TASM dark or gritty? It's less cheesy.

 

[Green Goblin]

This is about Maguire and how close he is to the comics

 

[DX]

Off topic. How the F*** is TASM dark or gritty? It's less cheesy.

It isn't dark or gritty. It tries to be but fails miserably.

 

[Green Goblin]

It isn't dark or gritty. It tries to be but fails miserably.

Again this is very off the tread subject but please explain.

 

[ThePhantasm]

So, you decided to ignore the word "necessarily"?

I'm saying your criteria seems highly arbitrary in its application, unless you mean to clarify as to why Raimi-verse childishness is inferior to Webb-verse childishness...

The word "necessarily" is meaningless when you don't clarify what's necessary.

 

[Senator Pleasury]

I'm saying your criteria seems highly arbitrary in its application, unless you mean to clarify as to why Raimi-verse childishness is inferior to Webb-verse childishness...

The word "necessarily" is meaningless when you don't clarify what's necessary.

Concrete example: if the movie itself states that a character like Jameson is suspicious and cheap and suddenly he is not because it's funny, I call that childish, because it gives more importance to the immediate effect, not coherence or consistency.

 

[ThePhantasm]

So really you have no problem with the tone of the Raimi films, just with moments where humor takes precedence over plot.

 

[FN Spider-man]

Leave it to vid to bring TASM up>.>. Stay on topic and not try and find it away to bring TASM in this. Tired of people trying to silently trash the movie.