Hulk VS DC ?????

[Gimili]

Originally posted by CaptainStacy
Speaking of Hercules; in regards to an earlier post stating DC's version once held up the country of Themyscira for 3000 years, and that being "more than Marvel's Hercules can do"; You must have forgotten that Marvel's Herc is the same Herc that succeeded in the 12 labors of Greek Mythology. One of which had him take the weight of the ENTIRE planet off of the Titan Atlas' shoulders. And he was prepared to hold it for eternity.

Yet the Hulk nearly killed him in a fight.

So if DC's Captain Marvel is only as strong as DC's Hercules, and can knock out Superman....then I GUESS the Hulk can too.

Also; check out Thor Vol. I #445; Gladiator is running super-speed circles around Thor. Hardly a "straight line".


Also; Check out Avengers Vol. I # 70; Oh, look! Hyperion's doing the same!

Yet....the Hulk has beaten both of them.

Also, for the record; in the recent Kang storyline, in Avengers, Kang hits Washington DC with a futuristic "nuke", but what's this? Thor AND Wonderman are at ground zero.... and survive? And neither of them have EVER stopped the Hulk. But in Kingdom Come, wasn't it shown that Captain Marvel can be killed by a nuke? And didn't Green Lantern shield Superman from it? A nuke built by technology HUNDREDS of years inferior in technology than the one Kang used on Thor and Wonderman?

Food for thought.......

Whether or not DC's Hercules can compare to DC's heroes, it remains a fact that from what we have seen of the DC heroes, their feats throughly outclass their Marvel counterparts.

According to Greek mythology, Hercules did hold the planet up. He
also had trouble with monsters that were below the power of even a calm Hulk.

As a matter of fact, Marvel made Hercules a lot more powerful than his mythological counterpart. They did the same thing with Thor.

Gladiator and Hyperion may maneuver at super-speed, but he doesn't fight at super-speed. And when the Hulk beat Gladiator, he had the benefit of Gladiator losing his confidence.

Kingdom Come is not in continuity. Anything from it doesn't count.

In this month's issue of JLA, Superman contains a supernova in his
hands. That's infinitely superior to that futuristic nuke Thor and Wonder Man survived.

And no, Superman cannot be killed by a nuke. In the mid-90s, when everybody in DC was weaker, Superboy, who has always been far inferior to Superman, survived an explosion that was big enough to destroy Metropolis.

And I notice you made no response to GL's ability to drain the Hulk. Does that mean that you concede to it?

 

[Gimili]

Originally posted by web-slinger
DC zombie....

What are you talking about. It is official that Superman can at least move the moon. In general, moving a mountain is about as impressive as even the Hulk gets.

The fact is that in general, DC's power levels are greater than Marvel's.

 

[Guyverjay]

In this month's issue of JLA, Superman contains a supernova in his hands

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH....NO offence but that is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. Post crisis supes is slowly becoming the ridiculous pre crisis super man all over again.. What a Joke.

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

"do i concede to it"? No. I thought i already established that GL is no where near the Surfer's level of power, as shown by the Surfer's embarassingly easy victory over him. So saying that if the Surfer can do it, GL can is moot.


"Dc heroes out class their Marvel counterparts" Really? Perhaps you didn't see my example of Hercules balancing the world compared to his DC couterpart balancing a mere "country". Herc also had little trouble with monsters in the stories that I read.

Read those issues featuring Gladiator and Hyperion i quoted to see those two fighting at super-speed. There's another example of Gladiator doing that in Simonson's run on F.F. And he STILL didn't beat the Hulk.

Kingdom Come may not be in continuity, but It's STILL shows Cap can be oblterated by a nuke. This was writtn by a prominent DC scribe.

"That's Infinitly more powerful than the Nuke Thor and Wonder Man survived" Really? Prove it. Kang's technology is hundreds, even THOUSANDS of years more advanced than the science of today.


So to sum up; You aven't successfully proved that these DC heroes are any more powerful than the Hulk is, yet I've given countless examples of the Hulk being able to preform feats just as Impressive as DC's guys, or beating Marvel guys who's feats and abilities, at the very LEAST, rival their DC counterparts.

Throw in Hulk's healing factor and unlimited strength and...well...do YOU concede?

 

[Jakesteraholic]

What a ridiculous thread. Comparisons keep being made between Hulk and Superman and Thor and Green Lantern and Silver Surfer. Well guess what? There's no way you can compare any of them. I mean really, how do you know that Superman could beat Thor or that Green Lanter would school Hulk. The power levels are in different worlds; if DC and Marvel really went at it somewhere other than the crappy multiverse, you couldn't predict who would beat whom. How do you people know that Hulk isn't as strong as Superman, or that Green Lantern would beat Silver Surfer now? All your "evidence" of how they could beat each other by examples of previous feats of strength mean nothing. For the love of Mike.

 

[Guyverjay]

Who is mike?

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

You're right of course, Jake; at the end of the day, it's all just speculation. But it's all done in good fun.

 

[arachnid_style]

Who's mike? Oh stupid question by the way , who did hulk fight in amalgam saga?

 

[Gimili]

Originally posted by CaptainStacy
"do i concede to it"? No. I thought i already established that GL is no where near the Surfer's level of power, as shown by the Surfer's embarassingly easy victory over him. So saying that if the Surfer can do it, GL can is moot.


"Dc heroes out class their Marvel counterparts" Really? Perhaps you didn't see my example of Hercules balancing the world compared to his DC couterpart balancing a mere "country". Herc also had little trouble with monsters in the stories that I read.

Read those issues featuring Gladiator and Hyperion i quoted to see those two fighting at super-speed. There's another example of Gladiator doing that in Simonson's run on F.F. And he STILL didn't beat the Hulk.

Kingdom Come may not be in continuity, but It's STILL shows Cap can be oblterated by a nuke. This was writtn by a prominent DC scribe.

"That's Infinitly more powerful than the Nuke Thor and Wonder Man survived" Really? Prove it. Kang's technology is hundreds, even THOUSANDS of years more advanced than the science of today.


So to sum up; You aven't successfully proved that these DC heroes are any more powerful than the Hulk is, yet I've given countless examples of the Hulk being able to preform feats just as Impressive as DC's guys, or beating Marvel guys who's feats and abilities, at the very LEAST, rival their DC counterparts.

Throw in Hulk's healing factor and unlimited strength and...well...do YOU concede?

Well, the fact is that it's proven that the Hulk's gamma can be drained. You've got to prove that GL somehow can't drain him. And not through GL's fight with the Silver Surfer. That doesn't remove GL's ability to drain energy. Besides, the Surfer's victory over GL was not as easy as you make it sound. They engaged in
a Jousting match, with a huge burst of energy from both. The Surfer emerged from the explosion victorious. However, the amount of energy the Surfer used indicates that this was a test for both of them. After all, I don't see any blocks get demolished when the Surfer gains easy victories.

(I do believe that, yes, the Silver Surfer should beat the Green Lantern, but you're really twisting the ease in Surfer's victory.)

Like I said, the Greek myths were rather inconsistent in the power
levels of their characters. Hercules had quite a hard time with that
hydra, which couldn't be considered anywhere near planet-lifting power.

Do Gladiator and Hyperion always fight at super-speed? Somehow I doubt it. Flying circles doesn't count. To escape the speed blitz, you will have to prove that when these guys fought the Hulk, they were not only moving, but also punching or kicking with their speed. Otherwise, everybody and their mother has lightspeed reflexes.

Kingdom Come is not in continuity. Therefore, it didn't happen. Galactus lost to the X-men in Age of Apocalypse. Even if you ignore facts and say that the JLA are in the same league as Thor, Iron Man, and the like, they are still well above the X-men's league, save a few exceptions. By your logic, the JLA can kick Galactus' ash, which we all know is nonsense.

You're completely ignoring my statement about Superman containing a supernova. Do you know what a supernova is? A supernova can destroy a solar system. I don't care how advanced
that nuke that those three guys took; a nuke is a nuke.

You're also ignoring my point that when Superman was far weaker than his now, a poor man's version of him survived a nuke. This doesn't work. You can't just ignore statements.

Another thing you're ignoring is my earlier claim that the Hulk's unlimited strength is not that user-friendly. He needs a lot of anger just to lift a mountain vs. Superman's moon-moving and now possibly even contain a universe destroying blast.

Oh, and the Hulk's healing factor is nowhere near quick enough to
repel a JLA beating. It took a couple panels just to replace a destroyed layer of skin.

 

[Guyverjay]

Can you tell me some instances of GL draining energy?

Im not saying he can't, I'd just like some examples.

 

[Jakesteraholic]

Originally posted by CaptainStacy
You're right of course, Jake; at the end of the day, it's all just speculation. But it's all done in good fun.

No it isn't.

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

Gimili; the Hulk's body produces Gamma radiation. Back in Tales To Astonish #92 (I believe), the Surfer used the POWER COSMIC to drain the Hulk's power. Unless GL is utilizing the Power Cosmic, there is not enough evidence to proove that he will be anymore successful at draining the Hulk of his power than, say, Absorbing Man.

In Greek Mythology, the Hydra had a healing factor on par with the Hulk's.


"do Gladiator and Superman always fight at super speed?" I don't know. Does Superman, Captain Marvel, etc.?

I realise KC is not continuity, but a prominent writer established that Captain Marvel would not survive a nuke. Thor beat CM, but can't seem to beat the Hulk. Ergo, Captain Marvel can't either. I have no idea what point you're trying to make about Galactus.

I haven't read JLA yet. I'm sure Superman did what you said, but how does that proove he would be sucessful against the Hulk.

I'm glad Supes can survive a nuke. I've shown examples where various Marvel characters survive worse. Yet...they STILL can't seem to beat the Hulk. Ergo, surviving a nuke is not sufficient proof that Superman can beat the Hulk.

"possibly containing a universe destroying blast." POSSIBLY? You said he DID. Make up your mind.

In battle with the U-Foes, Hulk regenerated over 70% of his body in seconds. Unless the JLA are planning murder, and we know they wouldn't, they aren't going to deliver life-threatening wounds to him. However, if they DID, the U-Foe battle prooves Hulk would survive.

 

[Guyverjay]

I found it quite funny when he said " It took a couple panels just to replace a destroyed layer of skin." How inaccurate is that?

The Hulks got the best healing factor in Marvel and Captain stacy is right the Hydra could grow back any part of its body is seconds.

Another thing you're ignoring is my earlier claim that the Hulk's unlimited strength is not that user-friendly. He needs a lot of anger just to lift a mountain vs. Superman's moon-moving and now possibly even contain a universe destroying blast.

Thats also false he braced an entire mountain in secret wars, plus it was dropped on him from god knows how high up. He had Banner's brain at that time and wasn't angry at all. Plus he seemed to surpass Onslaughts strength in "a couple of panels" as you put it.

Containing a universe destroying blast? Why did they even bother offing pre crisis supes if they were just going to make the same mistake again by making supes more and more powerful every issue?

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

Also; Super Nova's hardly destroy "the universe". Regardless, keep in mind that an exploding sun wouldn't be a big deal for Superman, as his powers are derived from them. He's basically basking in his own essense. So again; that wouldn't prove he's too tough for the Hulk to deal with.

 

[Bapman]

Originally posted by web-slinger
Genius, CapStacy. Pure genius. Excellent job at digging up evidence, my friend.

DUDE !!! YOU DA MAN !!! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA!

And my SALUTE to YOU CAPTAIN STACY !!!

HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA! HA!

 

[jan walenta]

As powerful as Superman is rightnow his power doesn't scratch the surface of what Steel in the Aegis armor can do. You are talking about a guy who killed Doomsday for good like you or anyone else would step on and kill a bug. And in comparison to MArvel Characters Steel in the Aegis I have been told compares to a fully fed Galactus or the Celestials.

 

[Bapman]

'Cause frankly idiots like Mr. SHAZAM n HERCULES taking down HULK ???
LISTEN TO YOURSELF !!!
DC Heroes n more leved up... true BUT tht's 'cause Marvel doesn't go OVERBOARD... ... ... ok maybe they do at times
BUT my point is tht DC hereos are pretty much ALL at the same level of power
BUT MARVEL ones vary a LITTLE too much
Batman fought against Superman to a stalemate... ... ... plain out REDICULOUSLY stupid BUT he did none the less... meaning same level character... wht powers he doesn't have makes up with his ingenuity.
Have you EVER seen DAREDEVIL go against HULK ??? FINE !!! ppl will say DD is weaker thn BATS
What about Cap Amrica ??? has he went alone ???
NO single "normal" superheroes have EVER gone against HULK straight atleast not in ANY issue I've read.

Hercules carrying n entire world... DUDE u think HULK CAN'T DO THT ??? DUDE he smashed a mountain in one "HULK SMASH" move !!! He took out ONSLAUGHT's armour with ONE FREAKIN HIT !!!

FANTASTIC FOUR... heck the ENTIRE Superhero team manages to win 'casue of him.

I think all you are kinda underestimating HULK's strength... DUDE !!! why do you THINK HULK is used as the EMBODIMENT of strength ??? Why not SUPERMAN ??? why not tht dumbass SHAZAM MAN or even HERCULES

'CAuse they have a LIMIT... no matter HOW AWESOMELY high... it STILL is a limit.
HULK... no limit... GET IT !!! NOOO LIMIT !!!

He took an ARMADA of a DAMN ADVANCED race as DARKSEID's race.

And you guy's talking about HULK VS. DC

This is SOOO STUPID !!!

 

[JINoside]

Originally posted by jan walenta
As powerful as Superman is rightnow his power doesn't scratch the surface of what Steel in the Aegis armor can do. You are talking about a guy who killed Doomsday for good like you or anyone else would step on and kill a bug. And in comparison to MArvel Characters Steel in the Aegis I have been told compares to a fully fed Galactus or the Celestials.

Dam, are you sure? A FULLY fed galactus Thats a lot of power right theyre, TOO much actually. Most of the times we seen him hes hungry and hes strong as bad place. Just imagine him fully fed .............

 

[Gimili]

Originally posted by CaptainStacy
Gimili; the Hulk's body produces Gamma radiation. Back in Tales To Astonish #92 (I believe), the Surfer used the POWER COSMIC to drain the Hulk's power. Unless GL is utilizing the Power Cosmic, there is not enough evidence to proove that he will be anymore successful at draining the Hulk of his power than, say, Absorbing Man.

In Greek Mythology, the Hydra had a healing factor on par with the Hulk's.


"do Gladiator and Superman always fight at super speed?" I don't know. Does Superman, Captain Marvel, etc.?

I realise KC is not continuity, but a prominent writer established that Captain Marvel would not survive a nuke. Thor beat CM, but can't seem to beat the Hulk. Ergo, Captain Marvel can't either. I have no idea what point you're trying to make about Galactus.

I haven't read JLA yet. I'm sure Superman did what you said, but how does that proove he would be sucessful against the Hulk.

I'm glad Supes can survive a nuke. I've shown examples where various Marvel characters survive worse. Yet...they STILL can't seem to beat the Hulk. Ergo, surviving a nuke is not sufficient proof that Superman can beat the Hulk.

"possibly containing a universe destroying blast." POSSIBLY? You said he DID. Make up your mind.

In battle with the U-Foes, Hulk regenerated over 70% of his body in seconds. Unless the JLA are planning murder, and we know they wouldn't, they aren't going to deliver life-threatening wounds to him. However, if they DID, the U-Foe battle prooves Hulk would survive.

The Silver Surfer did use the Power Cosmic to drain the Hulk, but he only has so much access to it. An impressive absorbsion feat for the Surfer is abosorbing a star.

And what's to stop the Green Lantern from launching the Hulk into
space and leaving him to float around until he eventually reverts to Banner?

Do Superman and Captain Marvel always do speed-blitzes? Not always, but usually they do. Gladiator has got to take somebody out in the blink of an eye before you can take this further. Besides, Spider-man has danced circles around the Hulk.

Whoever said that Captain Marvel cannot take a nuke is wrong. If
he couldn't, he'd be paste on contact with Superman's fists. Are you prepared to say he's less durable than Superboy was in the early 90s? Because that's kinda where you're going.

Thor beat Captain Marvel. Superman beat the Hulk. A weaker and rookie Green Lantern did a lot better against the Silver Surfer than the Hulk did. Except for Superman's victory over the Hulk, I don't think any of these three fights made sense. Still, there was a lot of bad writing during the Marvel/DC crossover era, and will probably be again in JLA/Avengers. Scenes like Batman beating Carnage without heat or sound and bone claw Wolverine cutting through Thanos come to mind.

As you know, I brought up the supernova incident to bring in some reality to your view of DC's power levels. He can also officially move the moon and in one issue, he actually split a moon
in half with the aid of his speed. I can link you to scan of it if you want.

Superman would not have trouble surviving a nuke.

I said "possibly contain a universe destroying blast" because I'm not quick to conclude that these things are canon unless they've happened more than once. The same goes for Superman splitting a moon and those guys surviving a nuke.

Who says the JLA actually need to kill the Hulk? All they need to do is knock him out like Abomination, Apocalypse, and the Juggernaut did.

Just out of curiosity: how much JLA have you read?

 

[jan walenta]

While Hulks strength is limitless it takes him longer to get to that point than it takes other hero's. Now I like you believe that if Herculescan lift a planet so can Hulk. Hulk has over powered Hercules everytime they have faced each other. Superman in my opinion is starting to go to far. DC seems so desperate that they are making superman do things that aren't even physically possible. Holding and crushing a blackhole with his barehands. bad place Superman is the only character in DC with these types of feats that I know of. Guys like Shazaam who has been said to be Superman's equal in every aspect isn;t given feats like this. DC wants you to beliece Superman is the most powerful being there is, but he isn't Doomsday killed and beat his ash twice after that. Then Superman beat him in Doomsday REX. But not even Doomsday who was proven to be physically superior to Superman doesn't have those feats.

 

[Gimili]

Originally posted by Bapman
'Cause frankly idiots like Mr. SHAZAM n HERCULES taking down HULK ???
LISTEN TO YOURSELF !!!
DC Heroes n more leved up... true BUT tht's 'cause Marvel doesn't go OVERBOARD... ... ... ok maybe they do at times
BUT my point is tht DC hereos are pretty much ALL at the same level of power
BUT MARVEL ones vary a LITTLE too much
Batman fought against Superman to a stalemate... ... ... plain out REDICULOUSLY stupid BUT he did none the less... meaning same level character... wht powers he doesn't have makes up with his ingenuity.
Have you EVER seen DAREDEVIL go against HULK ??? FINE !!! ppl will say DD is weaker thn BATS
What about Cap Amrica ??? has he went alone ???
NO single "normal" superheroes have EVER gone against HULK straight atleast not in ANY issue I've read.

Hercules carrying n entire world... DUDE u think HULK CAN'T DO THT ??? DUDE he smashed a mountain in one "HULK SMASH" move !!! He took out ONSLAUGHT's armour with ONE FREAKIN HIT !!!

FANTASTIC FOUR... heck the ENTIRE Superhero team manages to win 'casue of him.

I think all you are kinda underestimating HULK's strength... DUDE !!! why do you THINK HULK is used as the EMBODIMENT of strength ??? Why not SUPERMAN ??? why not tht dumbass SHAZAM MAN or even HERCULES

'CAuse they have a LIMIT... no matter HOW AWESOMELY high... it STILL is a limit.
HULK... no limit... GET IT !!! NOOO LIMIT !!!

He took an ARMADA of a DAMN ADVANCED race as DARKSEID's race.

And you guy's talking about HULK VS. DC

This is SOOO STUPID !!!

DC heroes are more powerful than Marvel ones, save the entities.
Saying Marvel doesn't go too far is no excuse. The fact is that Marvel doesn't give their heroes as much power. Deal with it.

Batman doesn't fight powered characters Daredevil style. He uses
his brain and clever plans thought through in advance. In the Marvel Universe, Dr. Doom, with his intelligence, has beat people the Hulk can't touch.

I explained before, Hercules could have (doesn't mean he did) held up the world according to myths that portrayed him inconsistently. The Hulk might do that, if he were angry for a few hours, but until then, forget it.

Onslaught wanted the Hulk to smash his body. He was not actively opposing the Hulk. Otherwise, the Hulk wouldn't have gotten to him. It is also notable that the Hulk was fresh off a power-up at the time.

The Hulk's strength is potentially limitless, but that doesn't make it as user-friendly as you describe. To dispute this point, you'll have to explain why the Thing, Thor, and Iron man can last a 1/100th of the time they do. Not even the Mindless Hulk's strength was as convenient as you describe it.

Fact is, with Superman's speed, he can take the Hulk out before he becomes strong enough to even lift a city.

 

[JINoside]

um...........Captain Marvel's a weaklink our Captain would wip your Captain in seconds. Especially when he goes crazy. Cap.Marvel could take hits, but hes not good at it.......

Some DC heroes are more stronger than Marvels, but it applies to both really....

Hulk could take superman anytime ands crap everysingle time hes lost agaisnt him. Like when superma punched Hulk into the grand canyon ad superman winning after wards, its bull. Emideatlly after Hulk would have been touched he would have been pissed, slowly makin him stronger. But i didn't even see Hulk get stronger one bit. I mean, looking at the fight again he was gettin man handled. Mindless Hulk, he has no thought or remorse for his actions. Filled with more rage than any of the Hulk's, hes pure rage and strength, superman would be beaten easier here. Its admitable that he has a better chance with anyother of Hulk's incarnations except mindless Hulk....

JLA vs. Hulk. No matter what, if superman's absent from this........theyre goin down.....

 

[Erik Magnus Lehnsherr]

Originally posted by JINoside
Dam, are you sure? A FULLY fed galactus Thats a lot of power right theyre, TOO much actually. Most of the times we seen him hes hungry and hes strong as bad place. Just imagine him fully fed .............

Fully Fed Galactus is like well...Godly. If his hunger was ever fulfilled, he'd be extrememly powerful, and could kick any mortal's ash.

 

[web-slinger]

Originally posted by Erik Magnus Lehnsherr
Fully Fed Galactus is like well...Godly. If his hunger was ever fulfilled, he'd be extrememly powerful, and could kick any mortal's ash.

Including yours, eh, Magneto?

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

"what's to stop GL from launching the Hulk into space" Why, the Hulk himself, of course. Hulk has crushed force fields before, including Dr. Strange's, the Sorceror Supreme of the Marvel Universe. If Hulk doesn't want to go anywhere, he's not going to. If it becomes a battle of wills, well, like I said earlier; GL will tire LONG before the Hulk does.

Super-strong speedsters lke Hyperion and Gladiator have BOTH taken out Wonder-Man with super-speed. Not sure what your point is about Spider-Man. He's Marvel, not DC. Besides, you're not suggesting Spider-Man could out-last the Hulk...are you?

Mark Waid sez Captain Marvel can't take a nuke. Go discuss it with him. Regardless; let's say Cap could withstand it. He STILL has to deal with an opponent with limitless strength and healing capabilities.

I agree, to some extent about the Marvel/DC mini series. Wolverine, Storm, Aquaman, and Batman should NOT have won their respective battles, but that's discussion for a whole DIFFERENT debate.

I've been reading JLA off and on for thirty years or so. I stopped shortly after the Tower Of Babel arc.