I think a clean slate would be best...

Sawyer

17 and AFRAID of Sabrina Carpenter
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New screenwriters, new director, new actors (or, prefferably, the actors who are playing the solo roles: Christian Bale, etc.)

Marvel is leading the solo movies of Iron Man and Incredible Hulk into an Avengers film, which sounds like a great idea, and I would love if my favorite superteam would get the same treatment, instead of what is going on now. I think that the Green Lantern, Flash, and Wonder Woman films should be done well and lead into an amazing Justice League film, instead of having crappy sounding spinoffs from a crappy sounding JLA.

WB should really think this over, instead of rushing into this.
 
Again, and Again, And again.

God, how can you repeat the same thing so many times?
 
Marvel has a gameplan and WB doesn't. Sure, Marvel's plan is ambitious as hell, even Favreau stated this but at least they have a clear idea of what they want to do.

WB is clueless. Superman Returns' performance and its reception threw a wrench into their original plans. WB panicked with SR and decided to put plans together for a guranteed superhero movie mega blockbuster to be released in 2009. Superman Returns was supposed to be that for WB but it failed to do that for studio. Little do they know that's more of a result of the audience getting more "Singerman" than Superman.

One thing is clear, WB has lost confidence in Singer and his vision for Superman otherwise this forum would not exist and we would be getting SR2 in 2009. The original writers from SR are already gone and while Singer has recently said he plans to begin working on the sequel, the studio has said nothing (though that's not a surprise with most projects that are just beginning).

What we have now is a project thrown in the middle of two franchises: one that is healthy (Batman) and one that is on life support (Superman). Some execs are unsure on how to proceed with Singer and SR and are pushing JL while others are undecided with both projects (SR and JL). It's a mess at WB with these superheroes movies. There's no clear unanimous agreement among the executives. It's no wonder we only ever get Batman and Superman movies from this studio.

WB is lost. Marvel isn't. Marvel's willingness to reboot Hulk just proves this. Meanwhile we still have no clue what's going on with Singer's Superman. WB needs to finish out Nolan's Batman movies, reboot Superman and take a freakin shot at a solo movie(GL or Flash). And then follow up with a team-up movie. Save the biggest and best for last! They had this or something similar to this in mind originally (Bale and Routh had a team-up clause in their contracts). What we have now is a mess on our hands with a project that can't even get out of its own way in JL.
 
Again, and Again, And again.

God, how can you repeat the same thing so many times?

As many times as it takes for everyone on the planet to realize that this plan of the WB's is terrible.
 
WB is lost. Marvel isn't. Marvel's willingness to reboot Hulk just proves this. Meanwhile we still have no clue what's going on with Singer's Superman. WB needs to finish out Nolan's Batman movies, reboot Superman and take a freakin shot at a solo movie(GL or Flash). And then follow up with a team-up movie. Save the biggest and best for last!
While i agree with you that WB seems to be pretty clueless how to handle their Superhero franchises right, i don't think you can say having solo movies first is the only right way to built up a team-up flick. Just because this is what marvel is PLANING to do and it's the most obvious thing for fanboys (in theroy) dosn't mean you can't make solo spin offs following up a team up flick working. In my opinion this is the by far better possibility to make these solo movies successful, while it'd be very insecure to try it the other way around, at least if it's really the goal to make a team-up flick. But that's something we can only speculate about. But my point is, if you make great movies, it dosn't matter if you do the team-up flick or the solo-films first. Done right, even solo-movies, which aren't meant to be in the same universe as the team-up film, would work. Ultimately it is just a matter of personal taste. I for one think the best thing for fans of the characters would be different universes for every movie. Not only would that give every individual director the chance to go completely the way he invisions his movie, without being bound to anything or anyone else, but it would give us also the possibility to see different versions of characters, from which no ultimate version exists and from which different fans prefer different versions. Anyway, the way i see it, a JLA flick is the only realistic possibility to get most of the big name DC Heros on big screen anyway, considering how many problems WB always has getting a Superhero off the ground. And personally, i'm by far more interested in a Justice League movie than i'd be in a Wonder Woman or Flash flick. And i think the possibility that they'll make a great JL flick now is by far bigger than that they'd be able to succeed with the plan to built up one by making dozens of great solo-movies. From my point of view, fanboys give that hole whole "connected movie universe" thing way to much weight anyway. I for one couldn't care less about stuff like that, as long as i get good movies about the characters i like so much and i don't think the often mentioned average moviegoer does as much as fans always claim.
 
As many times as it takes for everyone on the planet to realize that this plan of the WB's is terrible.
I don't think telling your opinion on one subject over and over again will make people, who simply don't agree with you, change their opinion. Especially not if you just say "that way is crap, while this would be the right way" without using any arguments for it.
 
I've said this maybe twice. I wouldnt consider this saying it "over and over again."

And, Orin, what you quoted was sarcasm.
 
I haven't said you said this over and over again. But since you've said you'll keep repeading it until everyone has realized it, i was just trying to explain, that telling a opinion over and over again won't make people change theirs.
 
If their actual films are anything to go by, I guess making crap films has been Marvel's "plan" since 2005 :o
 
If their actual films are anything to go by, I guess making crap films has been Marvel's "plan" since 2005 :o

You've got a point there. Iron Man and TIH will change that, though...
 
While i agree with you that WB seems to be pretty clueless how to handle their Superhero franchises right, i don't think you can say having solo movies first is the only right way to built up a team-up flick. Just because this is what marvel is PLANING to do and it's the most obvious thing for fanboys (in theroy) dosn't mean you can't make solo spin offs following up a team up flick working. In my opinion this is the by far better possibility to make these solo movies successful, while it'd be very insecure to try it the other way around, at least if it's really the goal to make a team-up flick. But that's something we can only speculate about. But my point is, if you make great movies, it dosn't matter if you do the team-up flick or the solo-films first. Done right, even solo-movies, which aren't meant to be in the same universe as the team-up film, would work. Ultimately it is just a matter of personal taste. I for one think the best thing for fans of the characters would be different universes for every movie. Not only would that give every individual director the chance to go completely the way he invisions his movie, without being bound to anything or anyone else, but it would give us also the possibility to see different versions of characters, from which no ultimate version exists and from which different fans prefer different versions. Anyway, the way i see it, a JLA flick is the only realistic possibility to get most of the big name DC Heros on big screen anyway, considering how many problems WB always has getting a Superhero off the ground. And personally, i'm by far more interested in a Justice League movie than i'd be in a Wonder Woman or Flash flick. And i think the possibility that they'll make a great JL flick now is by far bigger than that they'd be able to succeed with the plan to built up one by making dozens of great solo-movies. From my point of view, fanboys give that hole whole "connected movie universe" thing way to much weight anyway. I for one couldn't care less about stuff like that, as long as i get good movies about the characters i like so much and i don't think the often mentioned average moviegoer does as much as fans always claim.

I don't quite get the fanboy need for the whole single universe, one continuity thing. Who cares what Marvel are planning, the whole Mavel v DC thing is pointless when it comes to film.
 
If their actual films are anything to go by, I guess making crap films has been Marvel's "plan" since 2005 :o
Can't argue with that. But I'd take Spidey 1 and 2,and Blade 1 and 2
over any WB/DC film thats been released. And yes, that includes Batman Begins. Batman is my favorite character so thats sad to me.
 
Unfortunately, Batman is holding up Warner Bros./DC's entire movie franchises. Now that's a damn shame, it use to be both Supes and Bats, but they can't even count on Superman anymore.
 
^ The only thing holding WB are themselves, they're just too scared to back themselves and have a go at another character, the current Batman series isn't to blame, if anything it should have given them the confidence to move forward with solo flicks of the same quality, it's the Superman flick that scared them off.
 
Yea u would think if they could get someone like a nolan on their other properties they could be out doing solo films for other big characters. AS for JLA i just hope they do decide to move to canada. drop miller and go with a new and hopefully better director and get a better suited cast.
 
Yea u would think if they could get someone like a nolan on their other properties they could be out doing solo films for other big characters. AS for JLA i just hope they do decide to move to canada. drop miller and go with a new and hopefully better director and get a better suited cast.

Agreed, on all counts. Miller is no fit for something like JLA, and neither are the other planned directors. I mean, when you look at the GL and Flash solo films that WB has planned, I mean...David Dobkin and Greg Berlant?!

Grow a pair and get someone who can handle these films, Warner Brothers...
 
Yea i really hope WB drops miller and goes in a new direction. But nothing is official untill we get official word on the film. So we should take everything in stride because we dont know what will end up happening. So as i said lets hope and pray we end up with a better director/cast and film then what it was looking like from miller. I have nothing against him just from the rumors and most of the casting decisions it isnt looking good.
 
Nolan really treated his Batman film as a serious film, not a 'comic book movie', it was treated like an any other adaption, it's origin as a comic was irrelevant. WB needs people with that attitude.
 
Nolan really treated his Batman film as a serious film, not a 'comic book movie', it was treated like an any other adaption, it's origin as a comic was irrelevant. WB needs people with that attitude.

Precisely. Although it may be a bit hard to not make things like The Flash seem like a "comic book movie."

But stories like Wonder Woman, Green Lantern and J'onn J'onzz could definately be treated with the same respect that Nolan gave Batman.

WB seems to be disillusioned enough to think that anything from DC that isnt Batman and Superman is just about people in colorful costumes jumping around and beating up bad guys.
 
While i agree with you that WB seems to be pretty clueless how to handle their Superhero franchises right, i don't think you can say having solo movies first is the only right way to built up a team-up flick.

It is when the corporation making the solo movies will blame the franchises for the failure if the franchise they want to adapt, which has several franchise characters in it, ends up being a turkey.

Just because this is what marvel is PLANING to do and it's the most obvious thing for fanboys (in theroy) dosn't mean you can't make solo spin offs following up a team up flick working.

A solo film failing won't make WB refuse to adapt several franchises at once for years or decades. JL does.

In my opinion this is the by far better possibility to make these solo movies successful, while it'd be very insecure to try it the other way around, at least if it's really the goal to make a team-up flick. But that's something we can only speculate about. But my point is, if you make great movies, it dosn't matter if you do the team-up flick or the solo-films first. Done right, even solo-movies, which aren't meant to be in the same universe as the team-up film, would work.

Your theory only works if every adaption is given respect to the franchise and that the right people are given the right franchises to adapt. Hollywood hasn't perfected that yet.

Ultimately it is just a matter of personal taste. I for one think the best thing for fans of the characters would be different universes for every movie. Not only would that give every individual director the chance to go completely the way he invisions his movie, without being bound to anything or anyone else, but it would give us also the possibility to see different versions of characters, from which no ultimate version exists and from which different fans prefer different versions.

It would fine if Hollywood respected super-hero franchises enough that we could rely on their visions being good adaptions. They aren't.


Anyway, the way i see it, a JLA flick is the only realistic possibility to get most of the big name DC Heros on big screen anyway, considering how many problems WB always has getting a Superhero off the ground.

It's only "realistic" because WB has no faith or respect for anything that isn't Superman or Batman.

There's absolutely no reason JL has to be made before the solo movies. It's not like the licenses are going to run out.

And i think the possibility that they'll make a great JL flick now is by far bigger than that they'd be able to succeed with the plan to built up one by making dozens of great solo-movies.

The possibility of a great JL film is only because WB finally is trying to get the other franchises a chance on the big screen. If they bothered doing this with every other franchise like WW, Flash, GL etc they would be in the same position right now not JL.

From my point of view, fanboys give that hole whole "connected movie universe" thing way to much weight anyway. I for one couldn't care less about stuff like that, as long as i get good movies about the characters i like so much and i don't think the often mentioned average moviegoer does as much as fans always claim.

I agree with this.
 
It is when the corporation making the solo movies will blame the franchises for the failure if the franchise they want to adapt, which has several franchise characters in it, ends up being a turkey.
You can also argue that if they do a solo-flick for lets say the Flash and for whatever reason it dosn't work out, they're gonna say "Okay, now we tried to do a superhero movie besides Batman and Superman and it failed, the lesser known characters just don't work". Not to mention that the chances that a JLA flick would fail are very slim, even if it's not all that good. While a Flash movie would have to be really great to meet the high expectations that i think they'd have.

A solo film failing won't make WB refuse to adapt several franchises at once for years or decades. JL does.
I think it would!

Your theory only works if every adaption is given respect to the franchise and that the right people are given the right franchises to adapt. Hollywood hasn't perfected that yet.
Frankly, that's the whole reason why i think building up a Justice League by having solo-movies for every individual character first isn't ever going to work. What are the chances for a successful Justice League film? Let's say 50/50, if you want to. (even if i think they're MUCH higher) And what are the chances that they're gonna make FIVE successful solo-movies? Like 10 %? And even if they'd be able to pull off these five successful solo-movies, there'd still be plenty of possible problems, that could come in the way of the team-up flick after this. Like actors don't wanting to play the role anymore, asking for way to much money cause they're big stars now or not wanting to share their solo spot-light in a team-up flick and stuff like that. And what if you've got four successful solo-movies, but the fifth one totally fails? Than the whole plane for the team-up flick would collapse, cause of course everything is tight together. And who tells me there is even a market for Superhero movies in about ten years, when all these solo-movies would be done and the team-up flick could finally be considered again? Sorry, but i'm willing to take that 50/50 chance for a good Justice League film over the 5-10 % chance that i'd get my team-up flick after all that solo-movies any day. A great Justice League movie is the thing i want to see and i don't see what it'd help me if they'd make a solo-movie for all the individual characters first. I mean, it dosn't increase the chance that the team-up flick will be good or anything. And i think fanboys would be even more afraid of a crappy team-up flick, that could ruin their precious solo-franchises when they are already established. If you want to see a Justice League movie, there's always this chance, that it fails, no matter what you do. So if you're afraid of that chance, you can never have such a movie.

It would fine if Hollywood respected super-hero franchises enough that we could rely on their visions being good adaptions. They aren't.

And that's why more than one movie version of our favorite characters at the same time would be such a good thing, it increases the chance that there's at least one you could like. I hate the Superman Retruns version of the character, but that's what we're stuck with at the solo-franchise. If they'd use this version for the team-up flick too, i still wouldn't like it. But if they're using a different version, there's at least a new chance that i'm gonna like it.


It's only "realistic" because WB has no faith or respect for anything that isn't Superman or Batman.
Yeah, but that's the reality we have to deal with. I don't think it makes much sense to say "i don't want this movie, cause they should deal with their Superhero franchises like this..." if "like this" sounds good in an ideal world kinda context, but isn't ever going to happen. With the given circumstances, i think a successful JLA flick is the best thing that could happen for fans of the DC characters. It's something the studio would do, cause they don't have to rely on the characaters, they're obviously having no faith in, but they're still appearing side by side with the characters they trust. And if it does good box office numbers, which i think is a good chance for, they're maybe gonna reconsider, cause all the characters are known now. I seriously believe this JLA flick is the best chance for EVERY DC fan, no matter what he likes better, solo-movies, team-up flicks or whatever, to get what he wants, so i really don't understand all the hate. People need to face what's given, not what could be...

There's absolutely no reason JL has to be made before the solo movies. It's not like the licenses are going to run out.
It's not like there's a reason for solo-movies being made before JL either. ;)

The possibility of a great JL film is only because WB finally is trying to get the other franchises a chance on the big screen. If they bothered doing this with every other franchise like WW, Flash, GL etc they would be in the same position right now not JL.
But that wasn't what i was talking about. I was talking about the possibility that they'd be able to pull off a great JL flick that isn't bound to any solo-movies, which is by far bigger, than that they're gonna succeed with a plan to built up a great JL flick by making dozens of great AND successful solo-movies. Not only now, but generally. But yeah, they're planing to do a JLA flick now, while there's no indication that they'd be considering built up one with solo-movies, if this one dosn't happen now. So why should i what that? But i think the basic point of our argument is that your main priority seems to be great solo-movies and if that results in a great time-up flick, it's nothing more than a nice side-effect, while my main priority is the League movie and the solo spin-offs would be the nice side-effects.
 
Unfortunately, Batman is holding up Warner Bros./DC's entire movie franchises. Now that's a damn shame, it use to be both Supes and Bats, but they can't even count on Superman anymore.

The problem isn't that WB can't count on Superman, it's that they don't know how to handle the character of Superman.
 
I seriously believe this JLA flick is the best chance for EVERY DC fan, no matter what he likes better, solo-movies, team-up flicks or whatever, to get what he wants, so i really don't understand all the hate. People need to face what's given, not what could be...

I've never seen a comic adaption (or any adaption) get so much hate before anything has been shot. I think the main reason for so much anti-JL is the belief that failure will all but destroy any chance of future solo film for the other characters for the foreseeable future, that exces at WB will see a failure as proof the characters aren't viable for solo films, that 50/50 risk is not good enough odds for some. There's also the mere timing, the thought of 2 separate Batmen and Supermen doesn't sit well with people. Personally I'm fine with different continuities for all solo films, however, I don't like the idea of the JL film coz I don't believe 7 major characters can be done justice in a little over 2 hours, I believe JL should have remained nothing but a fanboy dream.
 

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