New Battle Plan for WB/DC

Kevin Smith

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OK. With the recent news on the GL film and DC/WB's plans regarding the comic book movies, it seems like they might be trying the Marvel Movie Method. :D

But wait - the Nolan/Singer worlds are uncompatible, as I've explained before
Only if A - Routh was older and B - both Bale and Routh were playing completely different versions of their respective characters, as in not the Singer and Nolan versions.

Guys, it just would not, could not, should not, and does not make any damned sense. Let's start with the obvious:

Routh is nearly 6 years younger than Bale and looks it. Batman and Superman are supposed to be the same age! If anything, Superman should be a couple months older, but a 30 something Batman with a 20 something Superman is complete ********. If there were different actors who were being cast like that, people would be flipping out! Bad casting.

Nolan's Batman does not work with the more sci fi and fantasy oriented JLA universe. Picture yourself watching The Dark Knight and then suddenly Superman or GL shows up. You'd be like "WTF?!". The JLA Batman needs to be one that's conducive to the rest of the DC Universe, now that doesn't mean "jokey" or "campy" as some *******s would put it, but he needs to be the DC Comics Batman, not the "Punisher" Batman of the Nolan films. Not only that but Nolan's Batman hasn't really been Batman that long, I'd say he's been Batman for 16 months maximum, while Singer's Superman must have been at the Superman career for at least 6 years, yet Singer's Superman is played by an actor who is nearly 6 years younger than the actor playing Nolan's Batman. Face the facts, folks, it just don't make sense. So even waiting till the Nolan series is finished, as some naive people have suggested, does not solve this problem.


Perhaps Routh's Superman and a different Batman would work, but even that still seems unlikely to me.

And, again, the Nolan Universe and the Singer Universe were not set up in conjunction with each other from the start, this isn't Iron Man and the Hulk here, people. You're trying to apply the Marvel Movie Method's casting to films that weren't meant to be intertwined in the first place. Had DC/WB been smarter about things, they could have had a game plan with the Batman and Superman franchises (along with the other DC heroes) set up in the same universe from the very start leading into a JLA film (Marvel Movie Method), but since they didn't set them up that way there is no way in hell that Nolan's Batman and Singer's Superman would fit into a JLA film. You guys have got the pieces from the Marvel puzzle trying to fit into the DC puzzle; they don't belong. Instead, DC/WB should work with what they've niavley set up and do a JLA film with a completely seperate Superman and Batman. Look, it's not like the lesser well known Iron Man, this isn't the first time an audience has been exposed to the characters, this is Superman and Batman - the first 2 superheroes ever, they're extremely iconic and recognizable, everybody and their grandparents is familiar with them in some form, they've been played by numerous actors hardly years apart since the forties, as long as they're good choices, nobody will care that they're recasted except for impetuous, small minded fanboys trolling the internet, who will piss and moan until they see the trailers.

So since you asked, recasting with GOOD choices is the logical, reasonable, and wise thing to do, dealing with how the folks at WB/DC decided to do their films in the first place.


http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?t=308968&page=3
and it is unlikely that we will see those respective versions of Superman and Batman join forces in a World's Finest or JLA film. So, I present my suggestion -

Set up the following films in the same universe, bridge them together so that they will lead into a JLA film:

the possible Superman reboot

Green Lantern (Hal Jordan, origin)

The Flash (Barry Allen, origin)

Wonder Woman (origin)

World's Finest (Superman and Batman teamup film with new versions of Superman and Batman completely unrelated to Nolan/Singer's versions)

then do a JLA film I say. :)

Everyone's happy that way! We have individual films that lead into a JLA film with both Batman and Superman in it that's completely unrelated/doesn't interfere with the Nolan version of Batman. Bickety bam! Whattaya think? :grin:
 
I agree.

They don't need to connect them to work, either.

The first films could give the audience the basics of the character they can build from.
 
I agree.

They don't need to connect them to work, either.

The first films could give the audience the basics of the character they can build from.


Right on, my brother. :)

That's just my suggestion if they are to connect them.
 
I kind of have to disagree on the whole Routh/Bale age issue.


Superman is not human, he doesn't have to be the same age.


I could easily see Routh and Bale in the same movie



I would have much more of a probelm if they just said..oh well ignore the two movies the masses have seen, go ahead with totaly different actors confuse the general audience to no end because they just won't get it.
 
i agree with the different actors thing but not b/c of the (they're supposed to look different ages since clark is alien) but rather b/c routh and bale bring in too much baggage from their respective movies for a joint film to make any sense
 
Bale's price tag might make him expendable, too.

I assume he was fairly expensive after Batman Begins. TDK could have quadrupled it.
 
I personally LOVE the idea that the Dark Knight takes place in a world of aliens and supervillains. The idea that these weird fantastical things happen in the world, just not in Gotham. And it'd be done in a way that BB/TDK are canon in the JL world, but not vice versa unless you want so. That way the OMG THIS FILM WAS DONE UBER-REALISTIC THEREFORE THE UNIVERSE IS UBER-REALISTIC fans remain happy and we still get Bale as Batman.
 
for the marvel method to work, DC's characters would have to be modernized.
 
This would be the direct cop out of the Marvel plan. Now WB wants to look like second class citizens? I am not suggesting there is a better way. Bale and Routh will never do a film together as those characters. But if you are going to do this while Marvel is still in the middle of their stuff it's going to come across as cheap. Let them finish this Batman trilogy first. Then you reboot Superman three years after that. Then you do the other solo films and eventually cross over. But this shouldn't be done in the near future because the DC characters will be overlooked by Marvel. I know DC fans are going to be up in arms when I say that but that's the reality. Outside of Batman, no one really cares for the DC superheroes especially with the big hit Superman has taken after SR's reception. So I am all for this but they have to wait until after Avengers. So no solo movies of these other characters for another five six years.
 
They can do solo films without tying everything together.

They would be vital in letting the public know the basics about their characters so that when JL is released they'll now what's what even if it isn't connected in its continuity.
 
Regardless they have to have to same cast so that means the same continuity. Don't need cameos and everything... but you need to keep the same cast. It ain't worth rebooting Superman IMO. Just don't connect the new Superman to the Donner/Singer films. No need for Lois Lane in a Justice League movie. But yeah we need Flash, GL, and WW films if this is going to work.
 
They don't have to have the same cast to work.

It would actually make it easier to show that both are in different continuities.

Superman's franchise does need a soft reboot IMO. At least with Lex. But they shouldn't use him for the next few films any way.

They have to do something with the whole Richard and Superman Junior from SR. Unless they want to kill them that's going to take some major retconning.

I agree they need to move on from the Donner stuff.
 
My problems with SR:

the bastard kid (wrong for so many reasons lol), the connection to the reeve films, the jesus references (superman ain't a god and he certainly is more moses then jesus anyday), the lack of action, the proverbial *****fying of superman again (I'm tired of superman the wimp in the movies, I want to see the tougher, Superman: TAS/JLU/George Reeves/Byrne era Superman), and Lex luthor as the main villain with a land based plot again.

Everything else, IMO, was fine. the best thing about it was Routh. If he never plays Supes again, WB should pay him for life. The suit was OK (s coulda been bigger but who cares), and the score was great. The special FX were the best in a superhero film to date, IMO.
 
Kevin:

Agreed.

It was a good movie. Just not a good Superman movie.
 
I dont want to go all debatey with Sr i only liked some things while the majority of the film sucked for me. I would love for a reboot for supes and and all fresh take and take all the characters to their modern incarnations and all that.
 
They will settle and the movie will move forward. It will cost WB a bit though.
 
The argument that the Batman and Superman played by Bale and Routh from the current films couldn't mesh in a Justice League picture due to their age difference is one of the dumbest arguments I've read.

Superman is about thirty in this continuity. He disapeared for five years- after being Superman for about 2 or 3 (Superman: The Movie & Superman II) if the Justice League film takes place in a few years- this will put our Clark, believably in his thirties. I mean- his Superman career will have been about 10 years old- and he certainly was "older than 21" when he started (according to Superman in Superman: The Movie.

Why is a 30-33 year old Superman too young to work with a 35/36 year old Batman? It's never been completely established that they are the exact same age...they've always been similar and close in age- it's not drastic like Bruce and Wally West- but they aren't sharing birthday cakes.

Then there is the fact that Superman is a damn ALIEN. Who is to say how much better he would age- compared to a man who RARELY sleeps and basically FIGHTS for a living...of course the superpowered alien would look younger.


The real argument is tone.

If they can nail a Justice League tone that will satisfy ALL of the character- INCLUDING but not exclusive to Batman. The comics have done serious The Dark Knight type Batman stories followed by more outlandish "comicky" stories. Hush which featured Superman and Poison Ivy and a mutated Killer Croc was directly followed by Broken City which was a more real and gritty approach that returned Croc to a more "skin condition" version and a more believable story compared to Hush...both were great.


Batman can fit in Justice League. If they have to do Justice League, start filming in about 6-7 years. Have other films take place:

Man of Steel
Green Lantern
SuperMax
The Flash
Batman 3
WonderWoman

Have Clark Kent appear in Green Lantern, Lex Luthor and the Joker appear in SuperMax, mention Gotham or Metropolis in The Flash, and maybe Central City in Batman 3.

Just set the stage. Then treat the Justice League film as the first encounter with Jon Jonz and I would even replace Aquaman with Green Arrow (depending on the success of SuperMax)...blasphemy, I know.

Have the tone of the individual hero films be somewhere in line with the Nolan Batman films and the Singer Superman films. It doesn't have to be as dark as the Nolan world or as deco as the Superman film....but it has to be like- magical realism. Grand things happening around normal people- that has to be the tone. Gotham will always be the darkest- most serious place in the DCverse...it's Gotham. But it doesn't mean Central City will be "Toon Town"...it can still have some grit to it. After all- why would these towns need heros if there weren't problems and corruption?

Treat Justice League like a quasi-sequel to the franchises. Like count it as The Flash 2, WonderWoman 2, Green Lantern 2, Batman 4, Superman 3, Green Arrow 2 stuff like that. So they can build the character's story from their first films and expand on them in the future solo sequels of the characters.

This is just the way I would do it. But I think a singleverse could work.

-R
 

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