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[Horhey]

What annoys me even more about the movie is that Ratner changed the already mediocre script for the worse.

Originally Alactraz was going to be a mutant prison, and Magneto was going to move the bridge there to free the mutants. We would've gotten an awesome scene with Magneto attacking an entire prison faciltiy to free Mystique and gather Brotherhood members, not to mention Magneto just moving the bridge made sense. Then the final battle scene was supposed to be in Washington DC, where the public would be in direct danger. This all sounded really good to me.

But Ratner, genius that he is, thought they should save the bridge-moving sequence for the end because it's too cool to have in the middle of the movie.

So instead, we just got Magneto wrecking a few cars on an isolated road in the middle of nowhere, and then having the final battle on a little island isolated from the public. Not to mention setting the bridge down right next to the facility he wants to destroy instead of, oh, I don't know, maybe DROPPING THE BRIDGE ON IT?

Magneto didnt drop the bridge on the prison becouse he wanted to "take control of the cure". Not just kill Leech.

 

[Leon the Professional]

Magneto didnt drop the bridge on the prison becouse he wanted to "take control of the cure". Not just kill Leech.

Magneto, who loathes the concept of the cure so much that he makes Storm look like a fan of the cure, wants to "take control of it"? And his plan to do this is by sending Juggernaut to kill the boy who is the source of the cure?

 

[danoyse]

It's weird, I hear that about The Godfather, but my father, who's a huge fan of the Godfather films, isn't so high on 3. The first one is definatley his favorite, and he really likes 2, but I don't think he was too big on 3.

Most Godfather fans aren't. I remember it getting a very mixed reaction when it first opened. Robert Duvall wouldn't come back for it, Francis Ford Coppola got ripped for casting his daughter (she's a great director, not a good actress). They even rip it on The Sopranos from time to time.

I loved the first two movies, but I've still only seen parts of Godfather III. To be honest, I don't think it needed a third film. It was kind of fitting to see Michael Corelone where he was at the end of II, who wants to see him redeemed?

I would say the same thing about Die Hard...they never topped the first movie. I wasn't crazy about Die Hard 2, and the best part of Die Hard 3 was Samuel Jackson.

As far as the Hulk...it's definitely in a different situation than X-Men. The first movie had a mixed response (as opposed to the 3 successful X-Men movies), a sequel to that movie would probably draw a much smaller crowd.

A restart is tricky, because people who didn't like the last movie have probably had their fill of the Hulk, but at the same time...there's no harm in doing a good new Hulk movie.

 

[Horhey]

Magneto, who loathes the concept of the cure so much that he makes Storm look like a fan of the cure, wants to "take control of it"? And his plan to do this is by sending Juggernaut to kill the boy who is the source of the cure?

Magneto wanted to take control of the cure to use it against the X-Men if they confronted him.

Magneto: "We will go to Alcatraz Island, take control of the cure, and destroy its source. Then, nothing can stop us!"

Wolverine: "If Magneto gets a hold of that cure there will be no stopping him."

 

[Leon the Professional]

Magneto wanted to take control of the cure to use it against the X-Men if they confronted him.

Magneto: "We will go to Alcatraz Island, take control of the cure, and destroy its source. Then, nothing can stop us!"

Wolverine: "If Magneto gets a hold of that cure there will be no stopping him."

So you're saying that it is not piss-poor writing to portray Magneto as willing to hypocritically utilize the "cure" he hates with every ounce of his being?

It is like a Jew rebel leader using a Nazi ethnic-cleansing "cure" against other Jews who get in his way

 

[La_She-Beast]

There is a danger in making superhero movies too 'arty'.

I'm afraid so

 

[Theweepeople]

Magneto, who loathes the concept of the cure so much that he makes Storm look like a fan of the cure, wants to "take control of it"? And his plan to do this is by sending Juggernaut to kill the boy who is the source of the cure?

You're probably wasting your time trying to explain the idiocy of Magneto's plan to people who love the film. It is true that Magneto did plan to take over the cure to use it against the X-Men and other mutants who would unite against him. I guess I can accept this even though it is hard for me to believe that someone who hated the cure like Magneto would even fathom up the idea of using it against other mutants. Another thing that bothered me about this is for some unexplained reason Magneto failes to realize that he and his brotherhood could run out of cure needles to use against their enemies by killing off leech.

One should wonder why Magneto defends Xavier's cause in front of Pyro yet a few scenes later he expresses hate towards Xavier's X-Men and suggests using the cure on them. How can Magneto have respect for Xavier and a complete disrespect for his supporters? That doesn't make much sense. This makes about as much sense as the way Magneto treated Mystique after her curing. He was able to forget about all the years they worked together, the time Mystique got him out of prison, and the significance of Mystique sacrificing herself for him in a few seconds? Bullcrap!!! That's the epitome of bad writing and horrible directing. I guess Magneto forget that he was a scientist who could come up with a serum to reverse the effects of the cure.

 

[Theweepeople]

So you're saying that it is not piss-poor writing to portray Magneto as willing to hypocritically utilize the "cure" he hates with every ounce of his being?

It is like a Jew rebel leader using a Nazi ethnic-cleansing "cure" against other Jews who get in his way

Great analogy. I'm shocked that I never made this connection. It's just another example of how poorly the characterizations were written in X3. The Magneto in X1 and X2 was a lot more philosophical in his thinking this X3's Magneto. The writer's of X3 turned him into a deranged tactical moron.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

Not to mention setting the bridge down right next to the facility he wants to destroy instead of, oh, I don't know, maybe DROPPING THE BRIDGE ON IT?

Watch the movie. Watch the scene when the President and his advisors see the bridge on their screen.

The width of the bridge: =

The width of Alcatraz:
_______________





_______________

Dropping the bridge on the island, which you all claim as so tactically smart, wouldn't be smart, because the bridge is too slim to destroy the entire facility. It wouldn't even remotley destroy all of the soldiers, who most were outside anyways. So Magneto would end up in the middle of the island, surounded by enemy soldiers, and just as there are survivors of 9-11, Pearl Harbor, Oklahoma City, and other attacks, dropping the bridge on the facility would not ensure the death of Leech, which was one of the objectives, so Juggernaut would have to be sent in to find Leech ANYWAYS to make sure the child was dead. Only, as I said, the Brotherhood would be surrounded by enemy troops, and have cure darts coming at them from all angles, instead of fighting them on one front, having all the attacks coming from one front, and having a strategic advantage with the high ground of the bridge, which acted as a hill over the battle field where Magneto had both better visual and physical vantage points over his enemy. Not to mention that dropping the bridge on the island would mean that it wasn't connected to the mainland, which means the Brotherhood would have no way to get off of the island after they've completed their objective (or needed to retreat had they been beaten back).

Dropping the bridge on the island was even more tactically "stupid" than you claim his current plan, and is the reason why YOU aren't scriptwriters (thank god) nor are you military generals (an even bigger "thank god", for the sake of our troops who would needlessly sacrifice their lives over your questionable "strategy")

 

[The Guard]

On Storm not trying to hit Magneto with lightning:

Yes, it would have been great to see Storm use her power on Magneto...for no reason at all. So, playing Devil's Advocate for a moment...am I not to understand that you all want to see Storm fail?

People, as much as you think you can, you cannot just run with what comes into your head and go "They should have done this!" and act like it's that simple to write or change a story. You have to THINK about how EACH and EVERY "story" point you want to see "added" to what's already there affects the larger story. Think about what is added...and what is removed from what's on the page and in the story. And, in the case of a real, actual movie production, writers have to think about how much it costs. I doubt FOX would want to waste money on fairly elaborate effects that don't really MEAN anything to the story. Oooh! More lightning! Pretty! Oooh! A magnetic bubble with no actual story significance! Pretty!

One, the entire point of showing Magneto throwing flaming cars is to give him and PYRO a well-deserved "teamwork" moment. That moment is designed to end with Bobby stopping Pyro, and Magneto ceasing his actions. So why the hell would you eliminate or take that away to see Storm fry, or even attempt to fry Magneto? After Bobby stops the car onslaught, Magneto does nothing for a while. So would Storm then just fry Magneto when he's not doing anything? When's she supposed to fry Magneto exactly? Before Bobby takes over? How's it going to work? Is she going to GUESS where Magneto is and hope lightning hits him while she's hiding from the flaming car grenades?

Two, Magneto wasn't even that immediate a THREAT for a while. Callisto was. Storm was occupied with Callisto. We got to see Storm do quite a bit with her in this film. So don't act like she doesn't do anything at all.

Three, Storm has done nothing BUT fry people in this franchise. Toad, Sabertooth, Callisto, and then she used more bolts to drive a wedge between the opposing sides in X3. Explain to me how the hell one more attempt or use of lightning is going to be all that satisfying a story point? Especially since she JUST DID IT TO CALLISTO. It'd be REDUNDANT. And that IS a staple of bad writing. It's one thing to have Wolverine, who basically just stabs and hits people anyway, keep stabbing and hitting people. It's quite another to have Storm, who has a RANGE of powers, just keep making lightning.

Fourth, Storm seems to be a little busy running and hiding from flaming cars. I don't blame her for not shooting bolt after bolt.

Fifth, and perhaps most importantly, you might as well ask why didn't Storm fry Magneto on Liberty Island? Why didn't Storm fry Jason Stryker? Why didn't she fry the Sentinel? She had opportunities in several sequences in X-MEN, X2 and X3. Real ones, where her lightning would have made a HUGE difference.

Why didn't she? Because she didn't. Because it was someone else's turn to shine. Because it better SERVES THE STORY for her not to, and for someone else to "save the day", as it does in this case. I'd much rather see BOBBY halt Magneto and Pyro than see Storm fry someone yet again in this franchise. Been there. Done that.

Stories don't have to be written one way. Just as there is not only one choice of actions in life, there isn't one choice of actions in fantasy.

Poor screenwriting? No. It's screenwriting that doesn't fully utilize the fact that everyone has powers they can use constructively. And SO WHAT? It's not like this is the first time someone hasn't done something they possibly conceivievably maybe could have done if you'd written the movie. If anything, it's the OPPOSITE of poor screenwriting, because it actually allows for some tension to the moment, and doesn't present characters doing predictable things.

And now you seem to be...breeding with each other...it's like a hive mind in here...

Oh, and the whole "Take control of the cure" thing is a ruse. He actually wants to kill the kid, as evidenced by the film showing us that he wants the kid dead. He uses the threat of the cure to bring others to his cause, as the movie both shows and tells, but as usual, he has his own motives, which are to eliminate the cure completely.

"So you want a realistic down to earth show...that's completely off the wall and swarming with magic robots"

"Oh! Oh! And also! You should win things by watching!"

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

You're probably wasting your time trying to explain the idiocy of Magneto's plan to people who love the film.

I guess it's just as much a waste of time to explain the flaws of the "drop the bridge on the island" plan to those who hate the movie so much that they will come up with any point to argue against it, as long as it's opposite of what happened in the film, despite the actual circumstances of logic, reality, and what happened in the movie.

Great analogy. I'm shocked that I never made this connection. It's just another example of how poorly the characterizations were written in X3. The Magneto in X1 and X2 was a lot more philosophical in his thinking this X3's Magneto. The writer's of X3 turned him into a deranged tactical moron.

No, it's not a "great analogy", that's exactly what Magneto's character is!

The man who survived the concentration camps of the Holocause, and because of it, became bitter towards humans and their intolerance to those who are different, yet takes on the same methods as the Nazi's did of trying to eliminate those who HE finds inferior so that it can be him and his kind who are superior, and in power.

THAT is Magneto's character.

One should wonder why Magneto defends Xavier's cause in front of Pyro yet a few scenes later he expresses hate towards Xavier's X-Men and suggests using the cure on them. How can Magneto have respect for Xavier and a complete disrespect for his supporters?

Um... that's exactly what Magneto has always been; respectful of Charles Xavier, because they are old friends and allies, who in the end are fighting for the same cause, but he does not like Xavier's supporters (X-Men) because they have different methods of going about their goals, and he believes that his methods are right, and Xavier's methods will get them nowhere, and he is willing to fight for his goal at all costs, even if it means going up against others whom he respects, but are holding back the cause.

This is exactly what I hate about people who hate this film, they start to ***** about anything and everything that happened in the movie, just because it happened in the movie, despite the source material which the film is adapted from, providing the elements that are found in the film that you people are *****ing about.

It becomes quite obvious that this is just blind hatred for the sake of hatred, without taking ANYTHING at all into consideration, except the fact that it happened in the movie so it must be bad.

I have no problems with people disliking this movie and having complaints about it. This being the "those who were disappointed by the movie" thread, I'd have no problem listing those problems. This movie obviously suffers from problems that X-Men and X2 don't suffer from, as both an adaptation as well as film making.

But most of the reasons that I see around here are so ridiculously absurd. People I know in real life who hate the movie laugh at the "reasoning" stated here for liking the film. Dropping the bridge on Alcatraz?! Storm not firing a bolt of lightning at Magneto first? I mean, come on, what the hell is this crap?! That's not disliking the movie, that's having an axe to grind.

That's why it looks like I'm such a "blind defender" in these threads for people who don't like the film. It's not because I want everyone to love the film because I do too. It's because I'm sick and tired of this totally absurd and ridiculous logic, and reasoning behind hating the film, which obviously stems from the fact that you just don't like Ratner, or Fox, or love Singer so much that you hate anyone that's not him, that you will hate anything that's in the film, just because it's in the film, regardless of actual logic, and regardless of the source material that it's actually adapted from.

Because anyone who was actually looking at this as an adaptation of the X-Men, and anyone who is an X-Men fan, would know that Magneto respecting Xavier but carrying a strong dislike for the X-Men is one of the defining attributes that makes Magneto's character. They would know that the man who survived the Holocaust, but comes back using very similar tactics to achieve his goal of mutant SUPERIORITY is one of the defining attributes that makes Magneto's character. But no, you forget about all of that, just because that aspect was used in this movie, so you call it bad filmwriting because it's a hypocrasy of himself.

THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT MAGNETO IS! If it's bad filmwriting, that means that the source material also suffers from bad writing, because that is where that aspect came from; the source material, so you need to be taking your issues up with Stan Lee, not Simon Kinberg.

 

[flavio_lebeau]

Watch the movie. Watch the scene when the President and his advisors see the bridge on their screen.

The width of the bridge: =

The width of Alcatraz:
_______________





_______________

Dropping the bridge on the island, which you all claim as so tactically smart, wouldn't be smart, because the bridge is too slim to destroy the entire facility. It wouldn't even remotley destroy all of the soldiers, who most were outside anyways. So Magneto would end up in the middle of the island, surounded by enemy soldiers, and just as there are survivors of 9-11, Pearl Harbor, Oklahoma City, and other attacks, dropping the bridge on the facility would not ensure the death of Leech, which was one of the objectives, so Juggernaut would have to be sent in to find Leech ANYWAYS to make sure the child was dead. Only, as I said, the Brotherhood would be surrounded by enemy troops, and have cure darts coming at them from all angles, instead of fighting them on one front, having all the attacks coming from one front, and having a strategic advantage with the high ground of the bridge, which acted as a hill over the battle field where Magneto had both better visual and physical vantage points over his enemy. Not to mention that dropping the bridge on the island would mean that it wasn't connected to the mainland, which means the Brotherhood would have no way to get off of the island after they've completed their objective (or needed to retreat had they been beaten back).

Dropping the bridge on the island was even more tactically "stupid" than you claim his current plan, and is the reason why YOU aren't scriptwriters (thank god) nor are you military generals (an even bigger "thank god", for the sake of our troops who would needlessly sacrifice their lives over your questionable "strategy")

you have this post saved on your desktop, right?

This makes about as much sense as the way Magneto treated Mystique after her curing. He was able to forget about all the years they worked together, the time Mystique got him out of prison, and the significance of Mystique sacrificing herself for him in a few seconds? Bullcrap!!! That's the epitome of bad writing and horrible directing.

Man, that killed the movie for me. When I saw that scene I was about to leave the cinema. Maybe I should have.
They couldn't find a worse way to end Mystique's character. And for those who always come up with schedule problems, here I say it again: it doesn't have anything to do with it. Rogue and Mystique were screwed due to horrible writing. Nothing else.

-Rebecca was there on the day they filmed that scene. It could have been one of the most heartbreaking moments, Magneto losing the woman who he knew was very good, the woman who so many times saved him and fought blindly for his cause. Instead, we get the biggest cringe worthy moment of the movie. Seriously, because you just had to make an ugly face at how poor and bad that scene was written. You could feel ashamed of being a fan, of supporting a series of movies that has such scenes. That moment, I couldn't tell anyone how much you can take the films seriously, simply because that scene would contradict me so badly.

-As for Rogue, blah, said it 1000 times, screwed due to bad writing too, not schedule. Anna was there in the Danger Room scene. Instead of making her a competent X-men, to give more substance to her dilemma, they portray her as a bomb who can only cry. That gives so much for her conflict...She was there to film various scenes, but they hardly have any good dialogue, at all. They're mostly brief and superficial, when she shouldd have longer, more emotional scenes. They could make her role 100% better, just by rewriting the scenes she already had. No need for new footage.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

On Storm not trying to hit Magneto with lightning:

Yes, it would have been great to see Storm use her power on Magneto...for no reason at all. So, playing Devil's Advocate for a moment...am I not to understand that you all want to see Storm fail?

People, as much as you think you can, you cannot just run with what comes into your head and go "They should have done this!" and act like it's that simple to write or change a story. You have to THINK about how EACH and EVERY "story" point you want to see "added" to what's already there affects the larger story. Think about what is added...and what is removed from what's on the page and in the story. And, in the case of a real, actual movie production, writers have to think about how much it costs. I doubt FOX would want to waste money on fairly elaborate effects that don't really MEAN anything to the story. Oooh! More lightning! Pretty! Oooh! A magnetic bubble with no actual story significance! Pretty!

One, the entire point of showing Magneto throwing flaming cars is to give him and PYRO a well-deserved "teamwork" moment. That moment is designed to end with Bobby stopping Pyro, and Magneto ceasing his actions. So why the hell would you eliminate or take that away to see Storm fry, or even attempt to fry Magneto? After Bobby stops the car onslaught, Magneto does nothing for a while. So would Storm then just fry Magneto when he's not doing anything? When's she supposed to fry Magneto exactly? Before Bobby takes over? How's it going to work? Is she going to GUESS where Magneto is and hope lightning hits him while she's hiding from the flaming car grenades?

Two, Magneto wasn't even that immediate a THREAT for a while. Callisto was. Storm was occupied with Callisto. We got to see Storm do quite a bit with her in this film. So don't act like she doesn't do anything at all.

Three, Storm has done nothing BUT fry people in this franchise. Toad, Sabertooth, Callisto, and then she used more bolts to drive a wedge between the opposing sides in X3. Explain to me how the hell one more attempt or use of lightning is going to be all that satisfying a story point? Especially since she JUST DID IT TO CALLISTO. It'd be REDUNDANT. And that IS a staple of bad writing. It's one thing to have Wolverine, who basically just stabs and hits people anyway, keep stabbing and hitting people. It's quite another to have Storm, who has a RANGE of powers, just keep making lightning.

Fourth, Storm seems to be a little busy running and hiding from flaming cars. I don't blame her for not shooting bolt after bolt.

Fifth, and perhaps most importantly, you might as well ask why didn't Storm fry Magneto on Liberty Island? Why didn't Storm fry Jason Stryker? She had opportunities there. Real ones, where her lightning would have made a HUGE difference. Because she didn't. Because it was someone else's turn to shine. Because it better SERVES THE STORY for her not to, and for someone else to "save the day", as it does in this case. I'd much rather see BOBBY halt Magneto and Pyro than see Storm fry someone yet again in this franchise. Been there. Done that.

Stories don't have to be written one way. Just as there is not only one choice of actions in life, there isn't one choice of actions in fantasy.

Poor screenwriting? No. It's screenwriting that doesn't fully utilize the fact that everyone has powers they can use constructively. And SO WHAT? It's not like this is the first time someone hasn't done something they possibly conceivievably maybe could have done if you'd written the movie. If anything, it's the OPPOSITE of poor screenwriting, because it actually allows for some tension to the moment, and doesn't present characters doing predictable things.

And now you seem to be...breeding with each other...it's like a hive mind in here...

"So you want a realistic down to earth show...that's completely off the wall and swarming with magic robots"

"Oh! Oh! And also! You should win things by watching!"

Exactly!!!!!

It's bad scriptwriting that Storm didn't fire a bolt of lightning at Magneto, which, as you said, would serve no purpose to the film anyways...

Why is it not bad scriptwriting when in X2, when the soldiers raid the mansion, and Pyro is blatantly shown grabbing his lighter, that he never uses his powers against the soldiers when, throughout the movie, we are shown that he doesn't really care about authority, nor holding back, and is blatantly showcased to use his powers against authority figures later on? Instead, he runs around a whole bunch with Rogue and Iceman, the latter of those 2 also being able to do some pretty good damage with his powers as well. Why did they just run around the mansion, running away from soldiers, when Pyro on his own could have very well have fought back against the soldiers, toasted a bunch of them in the process, and was showcased to having just the mindset to do it?

Because it happened in X2, so it's okay, but with X-Men: The Last Stand, we have to ***** about everything that happened in the movie for the simple fact that it happened in the movie, and cite the opposite of what happened as a better choice in a ridiculous attempt to make Ratner, Kinberg, and Penn bad (in our own minds only) to try to justify our unjustified hatred of the movie, and those 3 men as human beings.

 

[Leon the Professional]

Watch the movie. Watch the scene when the President and his advisors see the bridge on their screen.

The width of the bridge: =

The width of Alcatraz:
_______________





_______________

Dropping the bridge on the island, which you all claim as so tactically smart, wouldn't be smart, because the bridge is too slim to destroy the entire facility. It wouldn't even remotley destroy all of the soldiers, who most were outside anyways. So Magneto would end up in the middle of the island, surounded by enemy soldiers, and just as there are survivors of 9-11, Pearl Harbor, Oklahoma City, and other attacks, dropping the bridge on the facility would not ensure the death of Leech, which was one of the objectives, so Juggernaut would have to be sent in to find Leech ANYWAYS to make sure the child was dead. Only, as I said, the Brotherhood would be surrounded by enemy troops, and have cure darts coming at them from all angles, instead of fighting them on one front, having all the attacks coming from one front, and having a strategic advantage with the high ground of the bridge, which acted as a hill over the battle field where Magneto had both better visual and physical vantage points over his enemy. Not to mention that dropping the bridge on the island would mean that it wasn't connected to the mainland, which means the Brotherhood would have no way to get off of the island after they've completed their objective (or needed to retreat had they been beaten back).

Dropping the bridge on the island was even more tactically "stupid" than you claim his current plan, and is the reason why YOU aren't scriptwriters (thank god) nor are you military generals (an even bigger "thank god", for the sake of our troops who would needlessly sacrifice their lives over your questionable "strategy")

Well, if I were a scriptwriter (and thank god I'm not, because I have the audacity to demand logical writing), I would have the sense to realize that Magneto can not only drop the bridge, but he could corrugate the bridge before dropping it so that it crushes a much larger area of the island, and then if necessary also dismantle the bridge into a steel tempest that would demolish the entire facility and army, crushing anything in his path. Plus he could do all of this while hovering in the air with a protective barrier of metal orbiting around him.

Which, not to mention, would have been much cooler to see than a completely uselelss army of Toad-wannabees hopping around.

As for the rest of the Brotherhood, they were completely useless for this attack. He could have done it all alone.

And I don't even understand what you are talking about with troops needlessly sacrificing their lives if I were a US general ???

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

As far as the Hulk...it's definitely in a different situation than X-Men. The first movie had a mixed response (as opposed to the 3 successful X-Men movies), a sequel to that movie would probably draw a much smaller crowd.

A restart is tricky, because people who didn't like the last movie have probably had their fill of the Hulk, but at the same time...there's no harm in doing a good new Hulk movie.

And I think that's the thing...

The new Hulk is still going to have the taste of the last one in people's minds. It's been so recent, that the negatives of that film are going to effect this film. And seeing as how Hulk isn't Batman or Superman, that inherent interest isn't there.

I just really don't see this film being successful, even if it is good. Nobody liked the original, and people don't care about Hulk the way they do Batman, Superman, and hell even Spiderman.

I think with Hulk, they should just let it be.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

Well, if I were a scriptwriter (and thank god I'm not, because I have the audacity to demand logical writing), I would have the sense to realize that Magneto can not only drop the bridge, but he could corrugate the bridge before dropping it so that it crushes a much larger area of the island, and then if necessary also dismantle the bridge into a steel tempest that would demolish the entire facility and army, crushing anything in his path. Plus he could do all of this while hovering in the air with a protective barrier of metal orbiting around him.

Which, not to mention, would have been much cooler to see than a completely uselelss army of Toad-wannabees hopping around.

As for the rest of the Brotherhood, they were completely useless for this attack.

And I don't even understand what you are talking about with troops needlessly sacrificing their lives if I were a US general ???

Okay, so in YOUR version of screenwriting and storytelling, we have Magneto going through these elaborate displays of power to make sure the bridge destroys the entire facility, and for the sake of arguement, the kid and all the soldiers also.

So... the villian has won. What now is the point of the X-Men coming to stop Magneto, when he has already accomplished his goals? The bad guys won, the good guys lost, and the movie is over.

That, to you, is "logical" storytelling?

Again, thank god you're not a scriptwriter. And if you ever are, let me know what movies you're making so I can make sure to avoid them.

 

[Horhey]

I guess it's just as much a waste of time to explain the flaws of the "drop the bridge on the island" plan to those who hate the movie so much that they will come up with any point to argue against it, as long as it's opposite of what happened in the film, despite the actual circumstances of logic, reality, and what happened in the movie.



No, it's not a "great analogy", that's exactly what Magneto's character is!

The man who survived the concentration camps of the Holocause, and because of it, became bitter towards humans and their intolerance to those who are different, yet takes on the same methods as the Nazi's did of trying to eliminate those who HE finds inferior so that it can be him and his kind who are superior, and in power.

THAT is Magneto's character.



Um... that's exactly what Magneto has always been; respectful of Charles Xavier, because they are old friends and allies, who in the end are fighting for the same cause, but he does not like Xavier's supporters (X-Men) because they have different methods of going about their goals, and he believes that his methods are right, and Xavier's methods will get them nowhere, and he is willing to fight for his goal at all costs, even if it means going up against others whom he respects, but are holding back the cause.

This is exactly what I hate about people who hate this film, they start to ***** about anything and everything that happened in the movie, just because it happened in the movie, despite the source material which the film is adapted from, providing the elements that are found in the film that you people are *****ing about.

It becomes quite obvious that this is just blind hatred for the sake of hatred, without taking ANYTHING at all into consideration, except the fact that it happened in the movie so it must be bad.

I have no problems with people disliking this movie and having complaints about it. This being the "those who were disappointed by the movie" thread, I'd have no problem listing those problems. This movie obviously suffers from problems that X-Men and X2 don't suffer from, as both an adaptation as well as film making.

But most of the reasons that I see around here are so ridiculously absurd. People I know in real life who hate the movie laugh at the "reasoning" stated here for liking the film. Dropping the bridge on Alcatraz?! Storm not firing a bolt of lightning at Magneto first? I mean, come on, what the hell is this crap?! That's not disliking the movie, that's having an axe to grind.

That's why it looks like I'm such a "blind defender" in these threads for people who don't like the film. It's not because I want everyone to love the film because I do too. It's because I'm sick and tired of this totally absurd and ridiculous logic, and reasoning behind hating the film, which obviously stems from the fact that you just don't like Ratner, or Fox, or love Singer so much that you hate anyone that's not him, that you will hate anything that's in the film, just because it's in the film, regardless of actual logic, and regardless of the source material that it's actually adapted from.

Because anyone who was actually looking at this as an adaptation of the X-Men, and anyone who is an X-Men fan, would know that Magneto respecting Xavier but carrying a strong dislike for the X-Men is one of the defining attributes that makes Magneto's character. They would know that the man who survived the Holocaust, but comes back using very similar tactics to achieve his goal of mutant SUPERIORITY is one of the defining attributes that makes Magneto's character. But no, you forget about all of that, just because that aspect was used in this movie, so you call it bad filmwriting because it's a hypocrasy of himself.

THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT MAGNETO IS! If it's bad filmwriting, that means that the source material also suffers from bad writing, because that is where that aspect came from; the source material, so you need to be taking your issues up with Stan Lee, not Simon Kinberg.

Co-singed! As I have said before. Alot of the X3 bashers are obviously searching for flaws to complain about no matter how trivial or imaginary.

 

[Leon the Professional]

Exactly!!!!!

It's bad scriptwriting that Storm didn't fire a bolt of lightning at Magneto, which, as you said, would serve no purpose to the film anyways...

Why is it not bad scriptwriting when in X2, when the soldiers raid the mansion, and Pyro is blatantly shown grabbing his lighter, that he never uses his powers against the soldiers when, throughout the movie, we are shown that he doesn't really care about authority, nor holding back, and is blatantly showcased to use his powers against authority figures later on? Instead, he runs around a whole bunch with Rogue and Iceman, the latter of those 2 also being able to do some pretty good damage with his powers as well. Why did they just run around the mansion, running away from soldiers, when Pyro on his own could have very well have fought back against the soldiers, toasted a bunch of them in the process, and was showcased to having just the mindset to do it?

Because it happened in X2, so it's okay, but with X-Men: The Last Stand, we have to ***** about everything that happened in the movie for the simple fact that it happened in the movie, and cite the opposite of what happened as a better choice in a ridiculous attempt to make Ratner, Kinberg, and Penn bad (in our own minds only) to try to justify our unjustified hatred of the movie, and those 3 men as human beings.

If you were actually following all my posts in this thread, you would see that I don't think X2 or X1 are perfect at all. I have brought up many of my own criticisms about those movies, and I happen to agree that it is NOT okay that Pyro or Iceman for that matter did not try fighting back against the soldiers.

But this is the X3 forum, not the X2 forum. Further, this is a thread for the flaws of X3, not its strengths. And just because I defend X2 and X1 as better than X3, does not mean I'm some Singer fanboy who hates X3 just because Singer didn't direct it, because if Ratner did a better job than him I would be first in line to praise him for it.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

does not mean I'm some Singer fanboy who hates X3 just because Singer didn't direct it, because if Ratner did a better job than him I would be first in line to praise him for it.

Sure doesn't sound like it with the stuff you are picking out to complain about.

 

[Leon the Professional]

double post

 

[Leon the Professional]

Okay, so in YOUR version of screenwriting and storytelling, we have Magneto going through these elaborate displays of power to make sure the bridge destroys the entire facility, and for the sake of arguement, the kid and all the soldiers also.

So... the villian has won. What now is the point of the X-Men coming to stop Magneto, when he has already accomplished his goals? The bad guys won, the good guys lost, and the movie is over.

That, to you, is "logical" storytelling?

Again, thank god you're not a scriptwriter. And if you ever are, let me know what movies you're making so I can make sure to avoid them.

You think he shouldn't use the bridge as a weapon of mass destruction because it's too elaborate? lol I think most people would love to see something as badass as that, much cooler than him simply moving it. Are you telling me that if Magneto had done something like that, you would be criticizing the movie for it?

Logical storytelling avoids plotholes,character inconsistencies, and the like.

Do I think that Magneto should have won? Of course not. Do I think that the circumstances of Magneto's defeat should have been written such that they do not entail him being nonsensically negligent of his own powers. Yes.

 

[Leon the Professional]

No, it's not a "great analogy", that's exactly what Magneto's character is!

The man who survived the concentration camps of the Holocause, and because of it, became bitter towards humans and their intolerance to those who are different, yet takes on the same methods as the Nazi's did of trying to eliminate those who HE finds inferior so that it can be him and his kind who are superior, and in power.

THAT is Magneto's character.

So Magneto would accomplish this goal by utilizing a "cure" that has absolutely no effect on the humans that he wants to eliminate, and can only be used against other people of his own kind?

How in God's name does that make sense?

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

So Magneto would accomplish this goal by utilizing a "cure" that has absolutely no effect on the humans that he wants to eliminate, and can only be used against other people of his own kind?

How in God's name does that make sense?

When the X-Men lands, he calls them "traitors to their own cause"

With the cure taken away from humans, the humans have no weapon against Magneto and the Brotherhood. The mutant powers they possess are enough of a weapon against the humans.

But for mutants who would stand in their way (X-Men), they have powers who could allow them to stand toe to toe, Magneto would have the cure, as a weapon against those who he deems as "traitors", who he would see as not fit to be part of this "mutant superiority".

It's quite simple, really, if you actually pay attention to the movie without trying to rip it to shreds at every moment, and have an understanding of the characters that the movie is based upon.

 

[Leon the Professional]

Um... that's exactly what Magneto has always been; respectful of Charles Xavier, because they are old friends and allies, who in the end are fighting for the same cause, but he does not like Xavier's supporters (X-Men) because they have different methods of going about their goals, and he believes that his methods are right, and Xavier's methods will get them nowhere, and he is willing to fight for his goal at all costs, even if it means going up against others whom he respects, but are holding back the cause.

Guess what? I AGREE WITH YOU.

This is exactly what I hate about people who hate this film, they start to ***** about anything and everything that happened in the movie, just because it happened in the movie, despite the source material which the film is adapted from, providing the elements that are found in the film that you people are *****ing about.

It becomes quite obvious that this is just blind hatred for the sake of hatred, without taking ANYTHING at all into consideration, except the fact that it happened in the movie so it must be bad.

I have no problems with people disliking this movie and having complaints about it. This being the "those who were disappointed by the movie" thread, I'd have no problem listing those problems. This movie obviously suffers from problems that X-Men and X2 don't suffer from, as both an adaptation as well as film making.

But most of the reasons that I see around here are so ridiculously absurd. People I know in real life who hate the movie laugh at the "reasoning" stated here for liking the film. Dropping the bridge on Alcatraz?! Storm not firing a bolt of lightning at Magneto first? I mean, come on, what the hell is this crap?! That's not disliking the movie, that's having an axe to grind.

That's why it looks like I'm such a "blind defender" in these threads for people who don't like the film. It's not because I want everyone to love the film because I do too. It's because I'm sick and tired of this totally absurd and ridiculous logic, and reasoning behind hating the film, which obviously stems from the fact that you just don't like Ratner, or Fox, or love Singer so much that you hate anyone that's not him, that you will hate anything that's in the film, just because it's in the film, regardless of actual logic, and regardless of the source material that it's actually adapted from.

Because anyone who was actually looking at this as an adaptation of the X-Men, and anyone who is an X-Men fan, would know that Magneto respecting Xavier but carrying a strong dislike for the X-Men is one of the defining attributes that makes Magneto's character. They would know that the man who survived the Holocaust, but comes back using very similar tactics to achieve his goal of mutant SUPERIORITY is one of the defining attributes that makes Magneto's character. But no, you forget about all of that, just because that aspect was used in this movie, so you call it bad filmwriting because it's a hypocrasy of himself.

THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT MAGNETO IS! If it's bad filmwriting, that means that the source material also suffers from bad writing, because that is where that aspect came from; the source material, so you need to be taking your issues up with Stan Lee, not Simon Kinberg.

I don't "hate" X3, I have no "axe to grind", and my criticisms are not "absurd" but simply point out an abundance of instances of poor storytelling that anyone who tries to view the movie as more than just mindless action can see.

I think that X3 is an "okay" movie that is fun to watch but wasted and ruined the setup of the first two movies. And what is most frustrating about it is that the story itself, the concept of the mutant-human war finally occuring because of the introduction of the cure, is a great idea with huge potential, which simply was not actualized because of rushed production, creative decisions based on studio politics, poor scriptwriting, and average directing.

 

[Theweepeople]

Dropping the bridge on the island was even more tactically "stupid" than you claim his current plan, and is the reason why YOU aren't scriptwriters (thank god) nor are you military generals (an even bigger "thank god", for the sake of our troops who would needlessly sacrifice their lives over your questionable "strategy")

Why are you being so rude to me Nell? I have never tried to insult your inteligence so why are you doing the same to me. I never suggested dropping the bridge on Alcatraz.