Playstation Insomniac's Wolverine

[Lip]

This discussion is kind of interesting because, as someone mentioned before, this is a choice that most likely comes from how popular Jackman's Wolverine has become. So Jackman's version of Wolverine seems to be more of an inspiration than the comics.

I particularly dislike conversations like "nobody else can play this character" that we see a lot around Logan and Wade. I think that's the issue when the actor becomes more important than the character. Jackman, by the way, is rumoured to stick around after Secret Wars.

Anyway, Jackman's Logan seem to be a big inspiration to pick from, despite decades of comics. Doesn't help much that the most popular Wolverine game comes also from Jackman.

 

[XtremelyBaneful]

Just watching I can tell he's not tall but he's clearly not 5'3. But to each their own. Sitting out on the principal of height is definitely a choice, But you gotta live your truth.

The way I see it is this: Insomniac had one job. All I wanted was a new mainstream take on Wolverine with this accurate height, finally showing some representation for short men. Alas, I guess that was just too complicated, too much to ask for.

I agree with @lenz in criticizing Insomniac over the past, for me because I’m never gonna get over the fact that they recast their Spider-Man. I was pleasantly surprised to see the OG’s actor’s face play a cameo in Across the Spider-Verse, but I refuse to spend money on their second and third Spider-Man games because of the recast.

 

[Gamma Goliath]

To each their own, I mean you already have your axe to grind with Insomniac even before the trailer dropped, maybe you just aren't in the market to support their work.

I do think we get it in our minds that something has to come out exactly as we imagined it, and if it doesn't it's invalid or immediately less than.

Not saying thats you, but its definitely a thing, especially in fandoms like this.

 

[XtremelyBaneful]

To each their own, I mean you already have your axe to grind with Insomniac even before the trailer dropped, maybe you just aren't in the market to support their work.

I do think we get it in our minds that something has to come out exactly as we imagined it, and if it doesn't it's invalid or immediately less than.

Not saying thats you, but its definitely a thing, especially in fandoms like this.

I just want to be clear to the bolded that for me, it's only about Logan's height. it's honestly something I was looking forward to with this game, so it's very disappointing to see that they didn't think it was important.

I said this on the previous page but I'm fully aware that it's something that's only bothering me. I don't know if any of the discourse anywhere is complaining about it, so I might as well be literally the only one in the whole world that's upset over it lol.

And I know what you mean about fandoms; if Insomniac for example decided to race swap Logan, something like that would be fine with me personally, but I can imagine the fandom largely getting bent out of shape about it.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

this pissed me off so much because the actor whose physique they used here was 4'11" so this was very much a stupid exaggeration of what an accurate live action Wolverine's height would've looked like.

Dafne Keen is 5'3", probably wearing heels onscreen as X-23 so Wolverine would be not that far off from her height side by side. it's not a mystery to me only because I know that society likes to shame and poke fun at short men.

that's why the alt Wolverine in Deadpool 3 was 4 inches shorter than comic book Wolverine, and it's most likely why Insomniac didn't bother to make their Wolverine comic book accurate height either.

everyone is saying he looks 5'8", and that's average, not short, going by worldwide standards.

Actually the average height of men in Canada is 5'9. So 5'8 is short.

This thread is wild. People don't want gore in a Wolverine game? Complaining that he's not incredibly short? Not buying a game because Spider-Man's face, when he wears a mask the vast majority of the time? I'm not even Insomniac's biggest fan when it comes to their superhero stuff, but I'm definitely happy they're the ones in charge here.

 

[XtremelyBaneful]

Actually the average height of men in Canada is 5'9. So 5'8 is short.

first of all, I literally said 5'8" is average height by worldwide standards. Canada is not the only place in the world; it coexists with the rest of the world. and second of all, 5'8" is still 5 inches above Wolverine's height. so for the character, it would be another version of him taller than he's originally supposed to be.

This thread is wild. People don't want gore in a Wolverine game?

this part has nothing to do with me, but for the people who are turned off by gore, they've actually made their case for it. what's so "wild" about someone having or not having a taste for gratuity?

Complaining that he's not incredibly short?

??? why is it "wild" for me to complain about something I don't like? am I not allowed to voice my own criticism or unpopular opinion?

Not buying a game because Spider-Man's face, when he wears a mask the vast majority of the time?

it's my money to spend or not spend, and just because he wears a mask the vast majority of the time doesn't mean he wears it all of the time. I'm pretty sure there was a period of controversy back with the first game was remastered for Ps5.

I'm not even Insomniac's biggest fan when it comes to their superhero stuff, but I'm definitely happy they're the ones in charge here.

I'm not even sure what argument you're countering here. Insomniac is the one selling the product, and I'm the consumer, in charge of my wallet. what's your point?

 

[DarthSkywalker]

first of all, I literally said 5'8" is average height by worldwide standards. Canada is not the only place in the world; it coexists with the rest of the world. and second of all, 5'8" is still 5 inches above Wolverine's height. so for the character, it would be another version of him taller than he's originally supposed to be.

Are you aware that Logan is Canadian?

"Originally suppose to be". Comic heights are suggestions. Never been firm and you can see it with all character. Scott's 6'3. That would put a foot between him and Logan. How often are they portrayed like there is a foot between them?

this part has nothing to do with me, but for the people who are turned off by gore, they've actually made their case for it. what's so "wild" about someone having or not having a taste for gratuity?

It's a Wolverine. He's a mutant with swords for hands and a healing factor. Gore is a part of his character. This is like playing a Superman game and being turned off by him flying. I get a lot of people grew up with cartoons, but what Wolverine is, is not a mystery. He's a samurai Terminator.

??? why is it "wild" for me to complain about something I don't like? am I not allowed to voice my own criticism or unpopular opinion?

You can complain. But it's a wild complaint. There is a reason Wolverine is rarely portrayed in that manner consistently. It's because portions like that only work in drawn/animated media where realism isn't the aim. This is a video game where they are striving for something a bit more realistic.

And let's be real, he's pretty short in the game. Might even be 5'5 looking at the footage. Which, fun fact, was his original height.

it's my money to spend or not spend, and just because he wears a mask the vast majority of the time doesn't mean he wears it all of the time. I'm pretty sure there was a period of controversy back with the first game was remastered for Ps5.

Yes you can.

I'm not even sure what argument you're countering here. Insomniac is the one selling the product, and I'm the consumer, in charge of my wallet. what's your point?

That I'm happy fans aren't the ones making these decisions.

 

[XtremelyBaneful]

Are you aware that Logan is Canadian?

yes I am aware. are you aware that Canada is one part out of many other parts of the same planet?

"Originally suppose to be". Comic heights are suggestions. Never been firm and you can see it with all character. Scott's 6'3. That would put a foot between him and Logan.

show me a source indicating that Logan's comic height is a suggestion and not canonically 5'3".

How often are they portrayed like there is a foot between them?

not often at all. I don't really care how tall other characters are, because there is no shortage of tall characters being represented. short men on the other hand are bullied, shamed, and ridiculed just for being short. so it would have been cool to see a mainstream version of a badass 5'3" character for a change.

It's a Wolverine. He's a mutant with swords for hands and a healing factor. Gore is a part of his character. This is like playing a Superman game and being turned off by him flying. I get a lot of people grew up with cartoons, but what Wolverine is, is not a mystery. He's a samurai Terminator.

look man, as I already told you, the complaints about gore have nothing to do with me. I didn't say anything about it. you should have quoted someone else and responded to them with this.

You can complain. But it's a wild complaint.

why is it "wild"?

There is a reason Wolverine is rarely portrayed in that manner consistently.

the glaringly obvious reason to me is that the entertainment industry at large does not care to depict short men in representation of them.

It's because portions like that only work in drawn/animated media where realism isn't the aim. This is a video game where they are striving for something a bit more realistic.

whether Logan is drawn as a comic book character, animated as a cartoon character, or designed as a video game character, he's a fictional character. so from where I'm sitting, saying that Insomniac made him taller to go for something realistic is pretty much just insulting to men who aren't tall.

Yes you can.

I can what?

That I'm happy fans aren't the ones making these decisions.

...I am making the decision to not waste my money on this game, just like I did with SM2. what were you counter arguing?

 

[DarthSkywalker]

yes I am aware. are you aware that Canada is one part out of many other parts of the same planet?

Yes. Do you understand that if you're going to bring up average height, context matters. In Canada and the US, 5'9 is average height. Japan, 5'7. Being a short stack one place, is not the same as the other.

show me a source indicating that Logan's comic height is a suggestion and not canonically 5'3".

How often is Logan drawn as 5'3?

not often at all. I don't really care how tall other characters are, because there is no shortage of tall characters being represented. short men on the other hand are bullied, shamed, and ridiculed just for being short. so it would have been cool to see a mainstream version of a badass 5'3" character for a change.

The distance between "it would have been cool" and "not buying the game" is as vast as the height difference between Logan and Scott.

look man, as I already told you, the complaints about gore have nothing to do with me. I didn't say anything about it. you should have quoted someone else and responded to them with this.

I had two different paragraphs in my original post for a reason. But did respond to this and have no decided you don't want to answer my point. Okay.

why is it "wild"?

Do you respond to these one at a time before reading the rest of the post? Because it's literally the next line.

the glaringly obvious reason to me is that the entertainment industry at large does not care to depict short men in representation of them.

whether Logan is drawn as a comic book character, animated as a cartoon character, or designed as a video game character, he's a fictional character. so from where I'm sitting, saying that Insomniac made him taller to go for something realistic is pretty much just insulting to men who aren't tall.

I'm not tall. I am not insulted. They clearly made an effort to make him shorter then those around him. He looks short.

I can what?

Please, read the posts.

...I am making the decision to not waste my money on this game, just like I did with SM2. what were you counter arguing?

Please, please read it.

The point is, they have to make the game. They have to deal with combat. They are the ones who need to make the game as good and fun as possible. Making Logan 5'3, with his skill set. Probably wouldn't of worked very well in that regard. I'm glad the professionals are in charge.

 

[XtremelyBaneful]

Yes. Do you understand that if you're going to bring up average height, context matters. In Canada and the US, 5'9 is average height. Japan, 5'7. Being a short stack one place, is not the same as the other.

Do you understand that whether you're in the US or Japan, you're still on the same planet as all other inhabitants as Canada? Your argument about context would hold water if Logan's comic book height actual was 5'8", but the fact remains that it's significantly different than 5'3".

How often is Logan drawn as 5'3?

I requested a source, since you made a claim. Should I take this to mean you have no source or just didn't even care to back your claim up?

Anyway, I don't know how often he's drawn as 5'3" but I already addressed my thoughts on what you're insinuating, so I'll just copy paste:

"it's one thing for comic book artists to struggle to reflect his accurate height properly, since they at least back in the day had to hand draw everything.

but it's another thing for Insomniac, a video game's studio full of experts & professional developers to not reflect it. if they wanted to, they definitely could have. this was a creative choice, one that I don't respect. hell even X-Men '97 got it right."

The distance between "it would have been cool" and "not buying the game" is as vast as the height difference between Logan and Scott.

maybe for you, but not for me. this is a matter of opinion. if you take the words "it would have been cool" as me saying it's not that big of a deal for me, then let me clarify that what I meant by that is that it for me it is in fact a deal breaker.

I don't feel like buying the game because Insomniac's decision to make Logan taller, so I won't waste my money it. this might be the 4th or 5th time now that I've discussed this with someone expressing my self awareness, but no one else was actively making it personal like you are.

I had two different paragraphs in my original post for a reason. But did respond to this and have no decided you don't want to answer my point. Okay.

4 out of the 5 sentences in your second paragraph of the original post was a response to me. in my first response to you, I said that the complaints about gore have no connection to me. but in your followup response to me, you decided to make your case in favor of gore in the game anyway.

I'm not tall. I am not insulted.

I'm not tall either. I'm probably even shorter than you. and when you imply that it's unrealistic for a fictional character like Logan to be as short as 5'3", that's insulting to actual people of that height.

Please, read the posts.

Please stop the condescension. This isn't the first time you've talked to me in this way. It's a tone like this that makes me want to stop posting here for good, or just ask for a permanent ban.

Anyway, this is what I said:

"it's my money to spend or not spend, and just because he wears a mask the vast majority of the time doesn't mean he wears it all of the time. I'm pretty sure there was a period of controversy back with the first game was remastered for Ps5."

this is all you said in response:

"Yes you can."

it's not clear to me at all what exactly you're saying. if you could just specify what you meant, that would be helpful.

Please, please read it. The point is, they have to make the game. They have to deal with combat. They are the ones who need to make the game as good and fun as possible. Making Logan 5'3, with his skill set. Probably wouldn't have worked very well in that regard. I'm glad the professionals are in charge.

I did read it. ever since I was conversing with other people in the thread I have expressed full self awareness about how this is something that only bothers me. no one else but myself is gonna fork over their $70 if I want to play it, and I don't.

Please, please answer. What point of mine are you counter arguing here?I don't get why you felt the need to bring up the fact that the developers are in charge. unless it was one of the points I made that you were counter arguing by bringing this up, then you bringing this up was pointless.

btw, unless you're a developer, you don't know how well or not well it would have worked. given Insomniac's experience, I'm inclined to believe they very much could have pulled it off if they cared to.

 

[Lip]

That I'm happy fans aren't the ones making these decisions.

I don't care about his height because I usually don't care about the character in general, but I wanted to reply to this because I'm currently playing Digimon Time Stranger and damn... it's awesome.

I'm really, really happy when a game is made by fans for fans. It's so cool!

 

[XtremelyBaneful]

I don't care about his height because I usually don't care about the character in general, but I wanted to reply to this because I'm currently playing Digimon Time Stranger and damn... it's awesome.

I'm really, really happy when a game is made by fans for fans. It's so cool!

I played Cyber Sleuth & Hacker’s Memory back in the day on Ps4. Time Stranger looks awesome

 

[DarthSkywalker]

I don't care about his height because I usually don't care about the character in general, but I wanted to reply to this because I'm currently playing Digimon Time Stranger and damn... it's awesome.

I'm really, really happy when a game is made by fans for fans. It's so cool!

They may or may not be fans. But do you know what they are first and foremost? Video game developers. Who understand what goes into making games.

 

[Lip]

They may or may not be fans. But do you know what they are first and foremost? Video game developers. Who understand what goes into making games.

That's obvious. I'm saying when they're fans, who have a different passion when seeing these characters, it makes me really happy.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Do you understand that whether you're in the US or Japan, you're still on the same planet as all other inhabitants as Canada? Your argument about context would hold water if Logan's comic book height actual was 5'8", but the fact remains that it's significantly different than 5'3".

Do you understand that being short in Canada/US is different then being short other places? Logan just needs to look short next to the other characters. This is not complicated.

I requested a source, since you made a claim. Should I take this to mean you have no source or just didn't even care to back your claim up?

The comics.

I also don't think you know what 5'3 looks like. Here is example:

Anyway, I don't know how often he's drawn as 5'3" but I already addressed my thoughts on what you're insinuating, so I'll just copy paste:

"it's one thing for comic book artists to struggle to reflect his accurate height properly, since they at least back in the day had to hand draw everything.

but it's another thing for Insomniac, a video game's studio full of experts & professional developers to not reflect it. if they wanted to, they definitely could have. this was a creative choice, one that I don't respect. hell even X-Men '97 got it right."

So, if Scott is 6'3, Logan would be at his shoulders. He's not.


Jean's official height is 5'6. Look at her next to Scott. If it's heels, she's shorter then Logan. There is a reason artist make these choices. It's not because they hate short people. It's about framing.

maybe for you, but not for me. this is a matter of opinion. if you take the words "it would have been cool" as me saying it's not that big of a deal for me, then let me clarify that what I meant by that is that it for me it is in fact a deal breaker.

I don't feel like buying the game because Insomniac's decision to make Logan taller, so I won't waste my money it. this might be the 4th or 5th time now that I've discussed this with someone expressing my self awareness, but no one else was actively making it personal like you are.

To be clear, this is not a subjective point. There is a very big difference between thinking something would be cool and boycotting something over it not being that way. That's zero to 100. Wild.

You are the one making it personal.

4 out of the 5 sentences in your second paragraph of the original post was a response to me. in my first response to you, I said that the complaints about gore have no connection to me. but in your followup response to me, you decided to make your case in favor of gore in the game anyway.

The first paragraph is directly to you. The second one is an overall view of the wildness of this thread.

I'm not tall either. I'm probably even shorter than you. and when you imply that it's unrealistic for a fictional character like Logan to be as short as 5'3", that's insulting to actual people of that height.

How is it insulting? Is it insulting to people 7'8 that when Sony Santa Monica started the Norse saga of God of War they made Kratos 6'4 because the other height did not translate?

Please stop the condescension. This isn't the first time you've talked to me in this way. It's a tone like this that makes me want to stop posting here for good, or just ask for a permanent ban.

This not condescension. You ask me things I've already answered. You just need to read the post.

Anyway, this is what I said:

"it's my money to spend or not spend, and just because he wears a mask the vast majority of the time doesn't mean he wears it all of the time. I'm pretty sure there was a period of controversy back with the first game was remastered for Ps5."

this is all you said in response:

"Yes you can."

Read the two paragraphs back to back. I'm clearly responding to the first sentence as it's the only thing that could possibly make sense.

it's not clear to me at all what exactly you're saying. if you could just specify what you meant, that would be helpful.

I did read it. ever since I was conversing with other people in the thread I have expressed full self awareness about how this is something that only bothers me. no one else but myself is gonna fork over their $70 if I want to play it, and I don't.

Please, please answer. What point of mine are you counter arguing here?I don't get why you felt the need to bring up the fact that the developers are in charge. unless it was one of the points I made that you were counter arguing by bringing this up, then you bringing this up was pointless.

btw, unless you're a developer, you don't know how well or not well it would have worked. given Insomniac's experience, I'm inclined to believe they very much could have pulled it off if they cared to.

That making him 5'3 would've been a bad idea. And I'm glad they are making the game and not people who think you need to adhere to a "canon height" no one else does.

Given Insomniac's experience, I'm inclined to believe they very much know what they could and could not pull off.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

That's obvious. I'm saying when they're fans, who have a different passion when seeing these characters, it makes me really happy.

What you responded to is specifically about how "fans" who divorce themselves from the process of actually making art. Of course Insomniac has Wolverine fans.

 

[XtremelyBaneful]

Do you understand that being short in Canada/US is different then being short other places?

Do you understand that other places do not cease to exist just because short people also exist in Canada/US?

again, your argument would hold water if Logan's comic book height was something other than 5'3", which is significantly shorter than both 5'9", Canada's average eight, and 5'8", the average height worldwide.

The comics.

back to square one: show me a source indicating that Logan's height in the comics is a suggestion and not canonically 5'3".

I also don't think you know what 5'3 looks like. Here is example:

So, if Scott is 6'3, Logan would be at his shoulders. He's not.


Jean's official height is 5'6. Look at her next to Scott. If it's heels, she's shorter then Logan. There is a reason artist make these choices. It's not because they hate short people. It's about framing.

alright. I'll concede here that X-Men '97's animation is inconsistent in depicting the character's specific heights. you got me there.

Wolverine on Ps5 is going for photorealistic graphics, just as Insomniac did with their Spider-Man games. I'll only believe that they couldn't do it (instead of didn't do it) if they say so in an interview. I don't think this will ever come up, because it's not even a major complaint.

To be clear, this is not a subjective point. There is a very big difference between thinking something would be cool and boycotting something over it not being that way. That's zero to 100. Wild.

hold up, are you telling me that you consider me not buying this game over a personal preference to be a boycott? so anytime there's a video game or any product for that matter, that I decide to by for X reasons, that makes it a boycott?

I haven't ordered McDonald's or Starbucks in nearly 3 years. I traded my Android phone in for an old iPhone. I canceled my Disney+ and my Paramount+ subscriptions. I actively avoid buying CoD despite it being my go-to multiplayer game for a decade and a half, plus any other Microsoft products as much as I possibly can. those are all acts of boycotting from me.

I even said that maybe I'll buy Wolverine at a discount in the future. so how and why are you lumping this into an act of boycotting?

You are the one making it personal.

I'll just say this now then that if I said anything in my posts that personally offended you, I did not mean to offend you. if I said something that bothered you on a personal level, then I'll concede there too.

The first paragraph is directly to you.

in the second paragraph you said this thread is wild, and in our ongoing conversation you went on to elaborate that part of that wildness was my opinion. you also went on about complaining about Wolverine's height and avoiding buying Spider-Man 2 in the second paragraph. both of those things were directly about me.

The second one is an overall view of the wildness of this thread.

then why didn't you quote anyone else? on the previous page, there were at least 2 other folks discussing on some level their distaste for the gore, yet you chose to single me out in your first response despite this forum having the ability for multi-quote posting. this is why it particular makes me feel like you're making it personal.

How is it insulting?

you said, and I quote, "There is a reason Wolverine is rarely portrayed in that manner consistently. It's because portions like that only work in drawn/animated media where realism isn't the aim. This is a video game where they are striving for something a bit more realistic."

you're implying that it's less realistic for a fictional character like Wolverine to be portrayed as 5'3". the insult is implying that a character can't be badass if they're 5'3".

Is it insulting to people 7'8 that when Sony Santa Monica started the Norse saga of God of War they made Kratos 6'4 because the other height did not translate?

as I said before, there is absolutely no shortage of tall characters in media and representation. short men are ridiculed, bullied, and shamed just for being short in society. and as far as representation goes, we also always get the short end of the stick. like we did again here.

This not condescension.

I'm just telling you how it came across and how it makes me feel. you can say it's not condescension, but it feels personal.

You ask me things I've already answered. You just need to read the post.

I already told you that I read your post. it's unclear, and that's why I asked you to specify with more than just 3 words.

That making him 5'3 would've been a bad idea.

why would it be a bad idea?

And I'm glad they are making the game and not people who think you need to adhere to a "canon height" no one else does.

this is an example of how I feel like you're being condescending. I've said countless times how self aware I am about this criticism. did you need to come out and say "canon height" that "no one else" cares about?

Given Insomniac's experience, I'm inclined to believe they very much know what they could and could not pull off.

yeah they're a very capable developer that's made best selling playstation games. I'm inclined to believe they could have pulled it off and just chose not to.

 

[Link]

He's a mutant with swords for hands and a healing factor. Gore is a part of his character. This is like playing a Superman game and being turned off by him flying. I get a lot of people grew up with cartoons, but what Wolverine is, is not a mystery. He's a samurai Terminator.

You'd be surprised, I've seen people say that the Spider-Man games would be better if you could drive a car instead of webslinging all the time

 

[DarthSkywalker]

You'd be surprised, I've seen people say that the Spider-Man games would be better if you could drive a car instead of webslinging all the time

Not everyone should reproduce.

 

[Sithborg]

From the 97 animation guide. Assuming some things about the graph lines, he is about 5'6. In that line up, does he look wrong? Compare Jubilee to Bishop, that is the kind of height difference you are looking for. Yet look at the Wolverine. Clearly shorter than the other X-men. But not as short as you are demanding. And here's the funny thing. Databanks can say whatever the **** they want about height/weight. But artists don't follow specs. And Wolverine while consistently portrayed as shorter than the other characters, is still not portrayed as short as you want. This argument is on par with the various MJ fights, just without the sexism.

I don't care about his height because I usually don't care about the character in general, but I wanted to reply to this because I'm currently playing Digimon Time Stranger and damn... it's awesome.

I'm really, really happy when a game is made by fans for fans. It's so cool!

I want Time Stranger, but I really want it on my Switch.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Do you understand that other places do not cease to exist just because short people also exist in Canada/US?

again, your argument would hold water if Logan's comic book height was something other than 5'3", which is significantly shorter than both 5'9", Canada's average eight, and 5'8", the average height worldwide.

back to square one: show me a source indicating that Logan's height in the comics is a suggestion and not canonically 5'3".

Perspective is what matters in this context. It's why it's hard to tell height of characters in most things. You see this a lot in video games. How tall Mario is in actual inches, is irrelevant. Because what matters is his height relative to those around him.

If they slap in the manual that Logan is 5'3 in the game, how will you prove them wrong?

alright. I'll concede here that X-Men '97's animation is inconsistent in depicting the character's specific heights. you got me there.

Wolverine on Ps5 is going for photorealistic graphics, just as Insomniac did with their Spider-Man games. I'll only believe that they couldn't do it (instead of didn't do it) if they say so in an interview. I don't think this will ever come up, because it's not even a major complaint.

It being photorealistic makes it harder. I'm sure they didn't want to make a 5'3 guy built with Logan's unrealistic proportions. Because Logan in the comics, is built like a 6'5 guy. His chest width is insane. Which is why Logan doesn't look like his comic self in anyway from the neck down. If that is what they wanted to make, it would be more stylistic.

hold up, are you telling me that you consider me not buying this game over a personal preference to be a boycott? so anytime there's a video game or any product for that matter, that I decide to by for X reasons, that makes it a boycott?

I haven't ordered McDonald's or Starbucks in nearly 3 years. I traded my Android phone in for an old iPhone. I canceled my Disney+ and my Paramount+ subscriptions. I actively avoid buying CoD despite it being my go-to multiplayer game for a decade and a half, plus any other Microsoft products as much as I possibly can. those are all acts of boycotting from me.

I even said that maybe I'll buy Wolverine at a discount in the future. so how and why are you lumping this into an act of boycotting?

Fine. Not a boycott. Just not gonna buy the game until discount for height reasons.

I'll just say this now then that if I said anything in my posts that personally offended you, I did not mean to offend you. if I said something that bothered you on a personal level, then I'll concede there too.

No. I think you are personalizing the issue. The way you talk about people under average height is with a lot of emotion. It has you misconstruing what I'm saying. And I'm not sure why. No one is making fun of short people here. I'm short.

in the second paragraph you said this thread is wild, and in our ongoing conversation you went on to elaborate that part of that wildness was my opinion. you also went on about complaining about Wolverine's height and avoiding buying Spider-Man 2 in the second paragraph. both of those things were directly about me.

then why didn't you quote anyone else? on the previous page, there were at least 2 other folks discussing on some level their distaste for the gore, yet you chose to single me out in your first response despite this forum having the ability for multi-quote posting. this is why it particular makes me feel like you're making it personal.

I didn't feel like it. Wasn't necessary.

you said, and I quote, "There is a reason Wolverine is rarely portrayed in that manner consistently. It's because portions like that only work in drawn/animated media where realism isn't the aim. This is a video game where they are striving for something a bit more realistic."

you're implying that it's less realistic for a fictional character like Wolverine to be portrayed as 5'3". the insult is implying that a character can't be badass if they're 5'3".

No. That's not what I'm implying. I'm talking about how he's built. See above.

as I said before, there is absolutely no shortage of tall characters in media and representation. short men are ridiculed, bullied, and shamed just for being short in society. and as far as representation goes, we also always get the short end of the stick. like we did again here.

I mean being extremely tall gets you ridicule.

why would it be a bad idea?

How Logan is built in the comics would look ridiculous in a realistic looking game.

this is an example of how I feel like you're being condescending. I've said countless times how self aware I am about this criticism. did you need to come out and say "canon height" that "no one else" cares about?

yeah they're a very capable developer that's made best selling playstation games. I'm inclined to believe they could have pulled it off and just chose not to.

This is what I'm talking about. You say you're reading and then your quote me wrong. I didn't say no one else cares. I said no one else uses it. Including the comics. So why expect it from Insomniac? This sounds like an ax to grind situation.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

From the 97 animation guide. Assuming some things about the graph lines, he is about 5'6. In that line up, does he look wrong? Compare Jubilee to Bishop, that is the kind of height difference you are looking for. Yet look at the Wolverine. Clearly shorter than the other X-men. But not as short as you are demanding. And here's the funny thing. Databanks can say whatever the **** they want about height/weight. But artists don't follow specs. And Wolverine while consistently portrayed as shorter than the other characters, is still not portrayed as short as you want. This argument is on par with the various MJ fights, just without the sexism.



I want Time Stranger, but I really want it on my Switch.

Funny enough, Jubilee shoul be taller then Logan.

What's important about Logan physically is he's shorter then most others and he's built Ford tough. Both of those are in this game.

 

[lenz]

John Byrne is my favorite Wolverine artist. Here is a drawing he did of Wolverine and Batman. In the comics, Bruce is traditionally 6'2", possibly an inch taller suited up. In terms of the dimensions in this drawing, there is no way Batman is portrayed 12 inches taller. If we start from the taller character, Wolverine looks to be drawn about 5'7" here.

 

[Shinobi Shaw]

Not everyone should reproduce.

You are such a jerk

But again you're right.

 

[XtremelyBaneful]

Perspective is what matters in this context. It's why it's hard to tell height of characters in most things. You see this a lot in video games. How tall Mario is in actual inches, is irrelevant. Because what matters is his height relative to those around him.

If they slap in the manual that Logan is 5'3 in the game, how will you prove them wrong?

if they confirm that he's meant to be 5'3" despite looking so, then I'll cut them some slack and concede some more.

It being photorealistic makes it harder. I'm sure they didn't want to make a 5'3 guy built with Logan's unrealistic proportions. Because Logan in the comics, is built like a 6'5 guy. His chest width is insane. Which is why Logan doesn't look like his comic self in anyway from the neck down. If that is what they wanted to make, it would be more stylistic.

they would just have to design him with a bodybuilder's physique in a shorter stature. such people also exist in real life, which means it would be realistic without compromising on bodily proportions.

Fine. Not a boycott. Just not gonna buy the game until discount for height reasons.

yep. and even then it's a maybe.

No. I think you are personalizing the issue. The way you talk about people under average height is with a lot of emotion. It has you misconstruing what I'm saying. And I'm not sure why.

I didn't misconstrue what you said. you literally said my reason for not wanting to waste money on this game is "wild" because of this personal issue. it is emotional for me as a short man who has been bullied, humiliated, and ridiculed for being short. a lot of short men have. I'm not sure if you can relate, maybe you can.

No. That's not what I'm implying. I'm talking about how he's built. See above.

I read what you wrote above, and I replied accordingly. Insomniac is plenty capable of designing the character to be 5'3" if they saw fit.

I mean being extremely tall gets you ridicule.

"I mean" this is a whataboutism that is completely irrelevant since Logan was originally meant to be seen as short, not extremely tall. his original height was supposed to be relatable to short men.

How Logan is built in the comics would look ridiculous in a realistic looking game.

I disagree. if Insomniac wished to, they could have pulled off a comic accurate height Wolverine in their Ps5 game without coming off as ridiculous.

This is what I'm talking about. You say you're reading and then your quote me wrong. I didn't say no one else cares. I said no one else uses it. Including the comics. So why expect it from Insomniac? This sounds like an ax to grind situation.

you didn't write "no one else cares" verbatim but the meaning of what you're saying is still the same. I expected this from Insomniac because most fictional characters aren't below average height and we had a chance here to get a mainstream version of one such character who was.

you can call it an ax to grind, but all I'm doing is voting with my wallet and not wasting money on this game.