Invisible Woman vs. Wolverine

[Trask]

Not everything in the universe is made of molecules.
Energy is not made of molecules.
Gravitational waves are not made out of molecules.
Cosmic rays are not made of molecules.

I did say "almost" everything.

Fair enough.
And do you honestly think soft human flesh will have any chance at all against this tactic?

It could work but only until it comes up to his bones and then it would not be able to expand anymore, and lets face it that wont kill him, just hurt like hell.

Sue isn't as dumb as to not even know the basics of survival; the FF have been stranded in alien environments for Pete's sake. She's not some airhead that hasn't learned anything. How will Wolverine tire her out when all she's doing is resting? She can walk the island with her forcefield on protecting her of traps. She can even make forcefields to carry water and stuff. There's very little pshychological impact since she know where she is and she know her and Wolverine's mission.

I never implied she was dumb, but comparing her survival skills to those of Logans is a not very realistic. When the FF were stranded she had the rest of the team with her, she had her brother for fire, Reed to figure out a way to get back home and Ben to help out. They had each other to look after one another. That is not the same as surviving on your own, while Logan is right at home in the jungle. Her walking around with a forcefield surrounding her all day would be very draining on her, how long do you think she can continue like that? Also she needs to sleep and let her gaurd down sometime and that is all Logan will need. There is no way she can win in this situation.

You don't need to make a hand, a circular field which is solid around the hilt would be enough to grab it. You know, kinda like the ones she uses to bind people's hands togehter. The only way Sue would get impaled by the sword is if she makes a field tightly around herself instead of projecting the walls and dome like fields she mostly uses. Why? Because although the sword itself, or it's edge, would (in speculation) "cut" the energy field but the sword GUARD and HILT wouldn't. The aperture provided by the incision wouldn't be enough to provide passage to neither of those pieces that are in fact wider than the blade.

But what kind of effect would that have on the field? Would the whole field break down once it has been breached? Would the shock of the sword penetrating the shield distract her enough to buy Logan the time he needs to close down the gap and kill her? Would the force field be far enough away from her that the sword does not reach her?

Oh, also... I have been reading a couple of recent FF that I took from a friend and it seems that she favors using a round disk of forcfield instead of a dome when she is only protecting herself, and it is usually placed quite close to her (certainly closer than the length of the sword), so I dont think the gaurd/hilt of the sword getting stuck would save her.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Her walking around with a forcefield surrounding her all day would be very draining on her, how long do you think she can continue like that?

It's not very draining on her. She's encased the entire island of Manhattan in a force field before. I'm sure she could keep a human-sized force field up indefinitely. Plus, Wolverine would have no way of knowing she even has a force field up. It's invisible and odorless.

 

[Tropico]

Oy! Another round of this. Look, I'm not saying that Wolverine would never win in the jungle scenario, I'm just saying that he wouldn't take the majority like you infer.

I never implied she was dumb, but comparing her survival skills to those of Logans is a not very realistic. When the FF were stranded she had the rest of the team with her, she had her brother for fire, Reed to figure out a way to get back home and Ben to help out. They had each other to look after one another. That is not the same as surviving on your own, while Logan is right at home in the jungle. Her walking around with a forcefield surrounding her all day would be very draining on her, how long do you think she can continue like that? Also she needs to sleep and let her gaurd down sometime and that is all Logan will need. There is no way she can win in this situation.

Dude, she doesn't have to have survival skills a la par with Wolverine! Don't you get it? Just because she doesn't have his same training doesn't negate that she does have some. Soemone with a Survival Handbook doesn't compare with an Army Ranger trained to do so, but fact is the person with the book can still survive. If she has basic survival skills she can cope for whatever amount of time until Wolverine gets antsy and goes in for the kill. Fire? Just gather enough wood to keep feeding it and launch the FF flare at the pile of wood. I'm not a "survival expert" but even I can come up with stuff like this. You're gonna tell me that a way more experienced and seasoned hero wouldn't be able to do that? Puh-leeze!:

Like I said before, she doesn't have to walk around all day. All she has to do is CLEAR A MILE AROUND HER and let HIM come to HER. She could effectively clear area by area with rest periods without draining herself before resting and keeping in peak form. If by now you think that "there is no way she can win in a situation like this" then you just don't want to see it. I'm not wasting any more time in someone who just HAS to find a way where Invisible Woman loses to Wolverine all or most of the time.



But what kind of effect would that have on the field? Would the whole field break down once it has been breached? Would the shock of the sword penetrating the shield distract her enough to buy Logan the time he needs to close down the gap and kill her? Would the force field be far enough away from her that the sword does not reach her?
Dude, I already covered the reach thing in my previous post. I already said that if she doesn't make her field far away from her body and the sword IS capable (it's still speculation at this point) of penetrating her field that it would cut her.

Oh, also... I have been reading a couple of recent FF that I took from a friend and it seems that she favors using a round disk of forcfield instead of a dome when she is only protecting herself, and it is usually placed quite close to her (certainly closer than the length of the sword), so I dont think the gaurd/hilt of the sword getting stuck would save her.

Whatever, man. I don't know every type of hit Sue's field has sustained but I know that seeing the sword penetrate it wouldn't make her drop the field in shock. I'm quitting this before soemone posts that wolverine takes off the gaurd and hilt and throws just the blade at Sue and then I go and say that she catches it between two forcefields like samurai's do with their hands.

Peace, y'all!!

 

[Zeu]

I did say "almost" everything.

You were implying that forcefields are made out of matter when it´s more likely they´re made of energy. Psionic energy.

It could work but only until it comes up to his bones and then it would not be able to expand anymore, and lets face it that wont kill him, just hurt like hell.

Wrong in all counts.

1) There are no no bones in the abdomen cavity and thus Sue could effectivelly explode its entire content this way: stomach, spleen, liver, kidneys, genitalia. But worse yet, if she creates the buble in his upper chest and detonates it downward, it´ll take not only the abdominal organs but also the heart and lungs.

2)You DO realise that Logan´s bones are not WELDED together but that each bone is actually LACED in adamantium, right?
Otherwise his joints wouldn´t move and he wouldn´t even be able walk, move or even to BREATHE!
So, yes, you are completelly wrong!
Once her forcefield hits his skeletons, it WILL dismantle the skeleton apart. It will not break the individual bones because they´re invulnerable but the skeleton structure WILL explode outward along with his organs.

 

[Zeu]

Oh, also... I have been reading a couple of recent FF that I took from a friend and it seems that she favors using a round disk of forcfield instead of a dome when she is only protecting herself, and it is usually placed quite close to her (certainly closer than the length of the sword), so I dont think the gaurd/hilt of the sword getting stuck would save her.

You are still assuming that his sword can penetrate forcefields on the grounds that it can penetrate matter.
Don´t.
As the wise poet once said,

"Assumptions is the mother of all f**k ups."

There is no proof to consubstantiate your theory, PLUS Sue´s forcefields have contained magical entities before, if that´s the reasoning you´re trying to follow.

 

[foxx5]

Plus, Wolverine would have no way of knowing she even has a force field up. It's invisible and odorless.

Wolveirne has been able to detect invisible force fields before, his senses tell him that something is not right.

 

[Trask]

It's not very draining on her. She's encased the entire island of Manhattan in a force field before. I'm sure she could keep a human-sized force field up indefinitely. Plus, Wolverine would have no way of knowing she even has a force field up. It's invisible and odorless.

I have to disagree on this point, because if she could surround herself in forcefield all the time then she would always have it on as soon as she gets into a fight but she does not. Also just because she can encase a large area with her forcefield does not mean she can hold it indefenitaly if she decreases the size of the field. And what happens when she sleeps?

Dude, she doesn't have to have survival skills a la par with Wolverine! Don't you get it? Just because she doesn't have his same training doesn't negate that she does have some. Soemone with a Survival Handbook doesn't compare with an Army Ranger trained to do so, but fact is the person with the book can still survive. If she has basic survival skills she can cope for whatever amount of time until Wolverine gets antsy and goes in for the kill. Fire? Just gather enough wood to keep feeding it and launch the FF flare at the pile of wood. I'm not a "survival expert" but even I can come up with stuff like this. You're gonna tell me that a way more experienced and seasoned hero wouldn't be able to do that? Puh-leeze!:

Well using your analagry it is like saying that you give someone with basic survival skill a mashine gun and an Army Ranger with a knife and see who comes out alive. Sure normally the basic survival skills would be enough to keep him alive but when you have an Army Ranger hunting you, your chances of coming out alive is very slim.

Just because you are an experienced hero does not mean you are experienced in all areas. If wolverine came up against a cosmic foe he would have little chance of winning, just because he has very little experiece with them (altho he has had over a hundred years of experience at killing and hunting). I am sorry but Logan has forgotten more about hunting/tracking/surviving/killing than Sue will ever learn in her life (and now he remebers his whole life again you can guess how good he is).

Like I said before, she doesn't have to walk around all day. All she has to do is CLEAR A MILE AROUND HER and let HIM come to HER. She could effectively clear area by area with rest periods without draining herself before resting and keeping in peak form. If by now you think that "there is no way she can win in a situation like this" then you just don't want to see it. I'm not wasting any more time in someone who just HAS to find a way where Invisible Woman loses to Wolverine all or most of the time.

And you see that is the problem. As soon as you become the hunted and not the hunter you have lost half the battle. All he has to do is wait till she is asleep and then sneak in and kill her. Hell he does not even have to get close to her, he could create weapons like spears and bows and attack her from far away. She has to be on the alert all the time because she has decided to be on the defence while all he needs is for her to slip up once. He can play the waiting game, time is on his side in this match. In a situation like this he will win most of the time, just because she is not used to fighting like this, while he has had a lot (and I mean a lot) of years of fighting like this. I am sorry but I dont see how you can think she would have a better chance of winning in this battle than him.

Whatever, man. I don't know every type of hit Sue's field has sustained but I know that seeing the sword penetrate it wouldn't make her drop the field in shock. I'm quitting this before soemone posts that wolverine takes off the gaurd and hilt and throws just the blade at Sue and then I go and say that she catches it between two forcefields like samurai's do with their hands.

Damn!!! That was going to be my next argument, can you edit your post and remove that part so I can use it as my argument please.

You are still assuming that his sword can penetrate forcefields on the grounds that it can penetrate matter.
Don´t.
As the wise poet once said,

"Assumptions is the mother of all f**k ups."

There is no proof to consubstantiate your theory, PLUS Sue´s forcefields have contained magical entities before, if that´s the reasoning you´re trying to follow.

Hmm... as I said at the very beginning of my very early posts, this argument is only "If" the sword could penetrate her shield. I never said that it could, I am just saying "if" it could. I already did say that if it can not then Logan is going down. The only reason I brought up the sword is because it is a new thing that has been shown to cut through most things and we do not know the extenct of the swords power. It is hinted as being a mistical and old and refered to as the "ultimate weapon" (The people at marvel probably thought that there are too many things that Wolverines claws could not cut through and thought they would make him more powerful and unstopable by giving him this new weapon). I am sure we will see the extenct of this new sword of his as the story goes along and he will probably loose it at the end of the arc so we shall see.

Almost everything in this Vs. threads are speculations by nature, it is just a matter of which speculations sound more plausable.

 

[gildea]

It occurs actually there is nothing to stop sue making force bubbles inside wolverines joints, expanding them to crush the joints agains his admantium laced skeleton thereby stopping him from doing anything.

 

[Darth Adder]

Not to Mention she should just be able to suffocate him with one of her force fields.

 

[Zeu]

(...).

I´m curious.

At exactly which point are you gonna finally accept that Wolverine has not one chance in Hell of pulling a survival against bloodlusted Sue, let alone a win?

 

[BrianWilly]

Has everyone forgotten that Sue can fly?

She flies into the air and out of the jungle, makes a flat force disc the size of Manhattan, and then flattens the entire frikkin' jungle from mid-air, Wolverine included.

See, all that wilderness, combat, and army survival training is going to mean jack sht when your opponent can raise the fields of play by miles upon miles. Sue is so far out of Wolverine's league, there shouldn't even be a discussion on this.

 

[Zeu]

She doesn´t really fly but she can project a forcefield to lift her up in the air and from there proceed to unleash some jungle devastation at her own leisure.

Or she can cover the area with a forcefiled and expand it, effectivelly sucking the air out and suffocating the mutant.

 

[Vanguard07]

There are hundreds of ways Sue could incapacitate or kill logan. There are only a few ways Logan could beat sue and most of them rely on her being asleep or unaware of his approach.

Logan could Hunt Sue if sue didnt know about maybe but in a fight he just stands no chance.
Plain and simple.

 

[Trask]

Has everyone forgotten that Sue can fly?

She flies into the air and out of the jungle, makes a flat force disc the size of Manhattan, and then flattens the entire frikkin' jungle from mid-air, Wolverine included.

See, all that wilderness, combat, and army survival training is going to mean jack sht when your opponent can raise the fields of play by miles upon miles. Sue is so far out of Wolverine's league, there shouldn't even be a discussion on this.

Ehhh ok, I dont mean to complain but how come I never see her do anything of this magnitude in the comics? Take FF 536 for example, if she could do all that why did she not just user her forcefield to smash all the doombots by herself but instead she just "repels" a few of them and if Reed didnt cover her back she would have been hurt.

The way you guys are talking you make it sound like there is no limit to her power, I mean flattening an entire jungle? Do you know what kind of force is needed to flatten that many trees all at once? I mean come on... if she is that powerful then why do they ever need Ben? Just so I know what are some of the greatest feats she has performed?

There are hundreds of ways Sue could incapacitate or kill logan. There are only a few ways Logan could beat sue and most of them rely on her being asleep or unaware of his approach.

Logan could Hunt Sue if sue didnt know about maybe but in a fight he just stands no chance.
Plain and simple.

The senario we are discussing is if they were both dropped into a jungle at different positions and the only way out is for one to kill the other.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Why doesn't Superman punch a hole through everybody he encounters? It's not in his character to use such force against just anyone, that's why. Same with Sue. She's capable of a lot, but she holds back because it's the responsible thing to do. She knows Wolverine, however, and she knows how much of a threat he can be. If she found herself alone in a jungle with Wolverine on her tail and no other options, do or die, I believe she'd do and just crush Wolverine. She'd be safe and she knows he can handle it anyway, so it's not like she really did anything too damaging in the long run.

Which brings me to another point I hadn't thought of until now: has anyone ever given some thought to the idea that Wolverine's healing factor is so potent that it might actually work against him? If I were, say, Spider-Man and Wolverine were trying to kill me, I'd probably stop holding back since I'd know Wolverine could take it. He's ****ing Wolverine, after all.

 

[BrianWilly]

Exactly. Why does Cyclops always shoot thin little bursts of optic pellets when he's fully capable of levelling a city with his eyes? A lot of very, very powerful characters get psyched all the time; for every instance of Sue getting Punk'd! by the likes of Mole Man, there's another example of her liftings buildings and stopping nuclear explosions with her powers.

 

[Varient]

Ehhh ok, I dont mean to complain but how come I never see her do anything of this magnitude in the comics? Take FF 536 for example, if she could do all that why did she not just user her forcefield to smash all the doombots by herself but instead she just "repels" a few of them and if Reed didnt cover her back she would have been hurt.

The way you guys are talking you make it sound like there is no limit to her power, I mean flattening an entire jungle? Do you know what kind of force is needed to flatten that many trees all at once? I mean come on... if she is that powerful then why do they ever need Ben? Just so I know what are some of the greatest feats she has performed?



The senario we are discussing is if they were both dropped into a jungle at different positions and the only way out is for one to kill the other.

If sue were not how she's written,.. the doombots and every being in that fight save her teamates would be destroyed.
I really wish you guys would stop this.
By the nature of her powers,.. the ONLY way logan wins is by her NOT BEING AWARE OF HIM.

Even at her gentlest all she has to do is wrap him up,.. it's over.


Hunting her? LOL
Sue Richards Beat the SUPER SKRULL into bad health becauase she had a better grasp of her powers than he did of all four if his,... Logan isn't up for this.

 

[Trask]

Exactly. Why does Cyclops always shoot thin little bursts of optic pellets when he's fully capable of levelling a city with his eyes? A lot of very, very powerful characters get psyched all the time; for every instance of Sue getting Punk'd! by the likes of Mole Man, there's another example of her liftings buildings and stopping nuclear explosions with her powers.

I can understand that, there will always be stories in which superheroes are overpowered or underpowered (within thier own power levels) for a story. Like Logan surviving a direct nuclear explosion. But I dont use those to illustrate the extenct of that persons powers or abilities because it is just an exaguration of thier powers for that one issue and never shown again to that extenct. So when I argue, I use what I have seen consistantly of that persons power/skill and not what I see in one or two issue's because those are too much of an anamoly to be used as arguments.

 

[Silicon Surfer]

Sue could simply make the island and its vegetation invisible leaving Logan visible with nowhere to hide. then she attacks any way she chooses.

 

[Zeu]

Good point.

I am AMAZED at how this thread lasted 6 pages.

I can´t wait for the next Thanos VS Wolverine or Spider-man VS Wolverine thread.

Wolverine fans should learn that it´s not a matter of who the character can beat.
Daredevil is extremelly popular and yet you´ll never see his fans defending til the last ounce that he has a chance in hell against Spiderman, let alone Invisible Woman or Thor.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

I can understand that, there will always be stories in which superheroes are overpowered or underpowered (within thier own power levels) for a story. Like Logan surviving a direct nuclear explosion. But I dont use those to illustrate the extenct of that persons powers or abilities because it is just an exaguration of thier powers for that one issue and never shown again to that extenct. So when I argue, I use what I have seen consistantly of that persons power/skill and not what I see in one or two issue's because those are too much of an anamoly to be used as arguments.

Do you read a lot of FF? Because those displays of power are seen sparingly, yes, but they're seen consistently over the course of a few years in desperate situations. When Sue needs to pour on the power, the comics support the idea that she can through repeated instances of her doing just that.

 

[BAH HUMBBUG!]

Wolveirne has been able to detect invisible force fields before, his senses tell him that something is not right.

Have you read the issue in question? He walked right into it, didn't even know it was comming.

 

[foxx5]

Have you read the issue in question? He walked right into it, didn't even know it was comming.

no but i have read Wolverine Vol.1 #92-93,95-96, 124 in a couple of those issues Wolveirne is able to detect invisiable people.

 

[UK_Stu]

no but i have read Wolverine Vol.1 #92-93,95-96, 124 in a couple of those issues Wolveirne is able to detect invisiable people.

umm, well yeah. Its a bit different detecting force fields to detecting invisible people. Regardless of whether you are invisible or not you will have a scent, a force field won't - so while its reasonable to assume Wolverine might detect an invisible person by their scent, I can't see any way in which he can detect force fields

Plus there is still no way Wolverine would stand any chance against Sue

 

[Horrorfan]

Like someone said, not in a fair fight, no.

But Wolverine can do stealth better than anyone. And if he wouldn't hold back, and she didn't know he was coming, she would be disected before her dying brain could even register what had happened.