Invisible Woman vs. Wolverine

[Harlekin]

Again, like I said. We suspend realism for the creation of these characters. After the level of their abilities has been set however, we expect them to adhere to realism, which is what you call common sense, really. That's been the lynchpin in all this. We're talking about the same thing with different terms.

So, yes, we suspend disbelief so that Bruce can be the Hulk, but we then expect common sense to mean that Wolverine wouldn't survive two seconds with him.

 

[Zeu]

Exactly.

We expect a universe to have a certain level of consistency.

Marvel´s humans are supposed to have the durability of real world humans - to a certain degree - .

Wolverine iis supposed to have peak human durability, not full-blown I-can-survive-a-12-stories-fall-and-walk-away-whistling Spiderman durability.

And yet from his encounters with the likes of Hulk and Thing suggest that he has cartoon Daffy Duck/Bugs Bunny-level durability, which of course irks readers.

 

[Harlekin]

It doesn't really irk me these days. Probably would've irked me if I lived in the 80's, but there's a lot of foundation for Wolverine holding his own against the Hulk, so I accept it.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

It still irks me. It's never made any sense to me.

 

[Horrorfan]

Again, like I said. We suspend realism for the creation of these characters. After the level of their abilities has been set however, we expect them to adhere to realism, which is what you call common sense, really. That's been the lynchpin in all this. We're talking about the same thing with different terms.

So, yes, we suspend disbelief so that Bruce can be the Hulk, but we then expect common sense to mean that Wolverine wouldn't survive two seconds with him.

That makes no sense whatsoever that you can suspend disbelief for a nuke dropping on a guy but not a guy getting punched, even by a huge guy.

It's another case of disgarding what actually happened because you don't agree with it.

It's not possible to write with 100% fluidity and in complete accordance with other comics. Thats common sense.

It's times like this I understand exactly why Joe Q has the '**** the internet fans' attitude. I hope he doesn't lose it since this is beyond insane at times. I wonder if some of you actually like comics the way you pick it apart so much . I feel sorry for people who read a comic and get so irked that someone gets up from a punch. 'OMG THE LAWS OF PHYSICS ARE DEAD! OH NOES!'. I wonder how you can get ANY enjoyment out of them whatsoever.

 

[Harlekin]

That makes no sense whatsoever that you can suspend disbelief for a nuke dropping on a guy but not a guy getting punched, even by a huge guy.

It does, in a twisted way. We need to make allowances to let a character get their superpowers. From then on however, it should adhere to common sense.

It's not possible to write with 100% fluidity and in complete accordance with other comics. Thats common sense.

It is, but requires a highly controlled circumstance.

 

[Bullseye]

The Invisible Woman is the most powerful of The Fantastic Four.

She stopped Wolverine in his tracks by putting a force field inside his lungs.

 

[Tropico]

That makes no sense whatsoever that you can suspend disbelief for a nuke dropping on a guy but not a guy getting punched, even by a huge guy.

It's another case of disgarding what actually happened because you don't agree with it.

It's not possible to write with 100% fluidity and in complete accordance with other comics. Thats common sense.

It's times like this I understand exactly why Joe Q has the '**** the internet fans' attitude. I hope he doesn't lose it since this is beyond insane at times. I wonder if some of you actually like comics the way you pick it apart so much . I feel sorry for people who read a comic and get so irked that someone gets up from a punch. 'OMG THE LAWS OF PHYSICS ARE DEAD! OH NOES!'. I wonder how you can get ANY enjoyment out of them whatsoever.

You're no better than those people you criticize since you seem to only want to believe what YOU want to believe. When one of "your" characters gets bashed you make a big fuss and deconstruct just as much as the "OH NOES" posters you're criticizing.

You're missing the point. People here are telling you that they know that the laws of physics don't always work how they should in the MU. What they're telling you is that Wolverine isn't handled in a consitent way and there are things he should get hurt from that apparently don't hurt them. Let me give you an example:

Wolverine gets hurt by bullets, kives and swords penetrate his skin just like any other person. So, we've seen that he doesn't have any special resistance to blunt or piercing damage. Can we agree that the Thing can hit you harder than a bullet can? Can we agree that the Wrecker with his magical crowbar can hit AT LEAST as hard as the Thing?

Ok, explain to me how a bullet can break his skin but a villain who ISN'T holding back doesn't do any discernible physical damage to Logan's flesh? THIS is what these people are trying to tell you. Why can a bullet, an bullets ARE blunt make no mistake, blow a chunk out of him but a crowbar hit to the jaw doesn't leave the adamantium covered jaw exposed? Boxers get cuts on their face and their opponent is using GLOVES!!! See, one moment he's vulnerable to something and the next he isn't. Get it?

 

[Horrorfan]

Ok, explain to me how a bullet can break his skin but a villain who ISN'T holding back doesn't do any discernible physical damage to Logan's flesh? THIS is what these people are trying to tell you. Why can a bullet, an bullets ARE blunt make no mistake, blow a chunk out of him but a crowbar hit to the jaw doesn't leave the adamantium covered jaw exposed? Boxers get cuts on their face and their opponent is using GLOVES!!! See, one moment he's vulnerable to something and the next he isn't. Get it?

BECAUSE IT'S A ****ING GOD DAMNED COMIC.

Jesus H Christ on a bike, are people that dense? LOGIC AND REALITY IS NOT APPLICABLE. It's what SERVES THE STORY IN THAT MOMENT.

Get it?

Christ it's like talking to a particularly dense brick wall..

 

[Zeu]

BECAUSE IT'S A ****ING GOD DAMNED COMIC.

Jesus H Christ on a bike, are people that dense? LOGIC AND REALITY IS NOT APPLICABLE. It's what SERVES THE STORY IN THAT MOMENT.

Get it?

Christ it's like talking to a particularly dense brick wall..

You do realise you´re the one who´s being stubborn, hiding behind the lame "it´s a comic" excuse, right?

There are comics and then there are comics.
Daffy Duck and Bugs bunny can fall from a bridge and walk away smiling.
Those are cartoon comics with their own set of rules.

And then we have other comics who try to replicate our reality and most of its rules.
Notice the wording there: Most. Not all.
Gwen Stacy is a comic character. But if she falls from a bridge, she can expect to DIE.

Bullets still can kill regular people in comics.
Crashing your car into a tree can kill regular people in comics.
Falling from a bridge can kill regular people in comics.
And being hit by a class 100 WILL kill regular people in comics.

Wolverine is as resiliant as an olympic athlete in tip-op shape.
In comics, do olympic athlete in tip-op shape get scared when someone points a gun to their face?
Yes, because even though "it´s a comic", they can die from a shot just like everyone else.

Do olympic athlete in tip-op shape fear crashing their car into a tree?
Yes, because even though "it´s a comic", they too can die from crashing their car into a tree.

Do olympic athlete in tip-op shape fear falling from a bridge?
Yes, because even though "it´s a comic", they can die from falling from a bridge.

Like any olympic athlete in tip-top shape, Wolverine should fear being hit by a class 100 brick since his body would sustain the same or worst amount of damage as being encased in an adamantium box and thrown out of a plane.
He would DIE.
Even though "it´s a comic",
So why doesn´t he?
Because whereas everyone around him has to obey to comic rules, Wolverine only has to obey to cartoon comics rules.

Which makes him the spandex-clad equivalent to Daffy Duck and Bugs Bunny.

Only not nearly half as funny.

 

[Horrorfan]

I don't think comics are really for you. Have you ever thought about stamp collecting? Or something like that? It's nice, logical and neat


But yeah, I really think you need a new hobby if things like that in comics bother you (and the reason I am being stubborn as you say is because I KNOW I am right in this case...it's not even a debate in my mind).

 

[Harlekin]

You didn't even bother to read his post did you? I don't necessarily agree (Wolverine has been going up against those bruisers for ages now, let him), but he makes sense. There are still some things in comics that we'll need to adhere to logic aka common sense.

 

[Trask]

Logan just got a new sword that can cut through anything didnt he? Would that work against Sue's force field? I dont think there are a lot of people that can beat him with his new sword.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Why the hell would Wolverine need a sword?

 

[Tropico]

Because he just HAS to have something that cuts through magic (probably) and things that are harder than adamantium. He took out a couple of Shiva robots (which are supposed to be made of adamantium and provide Logan a hell of a fight) with a few swipes of his Muramasa blade.

 

[Tropico]

BECAUSE IT'S A ****ING GOD DAMNED COMIC.

Jesus H Christ on a bike, are people that dense? LOGIC AND REALITY IS NOT APPLICABLE. It's what SERVES THE STORY IN THAT MOMENT.

Get it?

Christ it's like talking to a particularly dense brick wall..

I don't think comics are really for you. Have you ever thought about stamp collecting? Or something like that? It's nice, logical and neat


But yeah, I really think you need a new hobby if things like that in comics bother you (and the reason I am being stubborn as you say is because I KNOW I am right in this case...it's not even a debate in my mind).

Thanks for proving that the dense stubborn brick wall is, in fact, you. I'd like to see your reaction on these boards if suddenly they wrote a comic where they reveal that the Venom symbiote is really made of chocolate frosting and Big Betha defeats it by eating it.up:

 

[LibrarianThorne]

Logan just got a new sword that can cut through anything didnt he? Would that work against Sue's force field? I dont think there are a lot of people that can beat him with his new sword.

The problem isn't really that Sue can make a force field and stop Wolverine from stabbing her to death. Wolvie's big problem against Sue is Sue's versatility. Forcefield in the lungs to knock him out, turn his optic nerves invisible making him blind, heck she can decapitate him or just bisect his brain with her power. Wolvie really has no counter against the Invisible Woman.

 

[3dman27]

susie

 

[Morg]

Horrorfan, play nice or you will deal with me

 

[BrianWilly]

Edit...nevermind.

 

[C. Lee]

Horrorfan, play nice or you will deal with me

Dangit....I was about to pounce on him.

 

[Morg]

Pounce away C Lee

 

[ElectroFlare]

Mods taking turns on beating up on posters...can I watch?

 

[BAH HUMBBUG!]

I believe they tussled here and she just threw him out a window or something

http://milehighcomics.com/cgi-bin/backissue.cgi?action=fullsize&issue=30929984076%20374


I think it's been established he also can't pierce Reed Richards

They also fought in Wolverine V.3 issues 20ish. When Wolverine had

Spoiler

died and becamse an agent of the hand or something. He broke into the Baxter building and Sue just put two rock sized invis fields in his lungs and Logan went down to the floor immediately. I thought it was damn cool

 

[Trask]

They also fought in Wolverine V.3 issues 20ish. When Wolverine had

Spoiler

died and becamse an agent of the hand or something. He broke into the Baxter building and Sue just put two rock sized invis fields in his lungs and Logan went down to the floor immediately. I thought it was damn cool

I dont read a lot of FF, but I was under the impression that Sue could only create one bubble field at a time, regardless of size or power of the field.

And why would he go down to the floor immediately, he should still have enough Oxygen in him for at least a couple of sec, which should be enough to deal with Sue unless she used the field to protect herself.