Is anybody else TOTALLY confused? (SPOILERS!)

[chamber-music]

You assume that it is her though.

Anyhow, I too agree that OMACs are a bad idea for a first movie. The plot of this movie sounds like a sequel. They should've used white martians for the original. It is a good way to unite the heroes. The villain does not require much development, so you can focus on the league, and because they can appear as normal people you save money on effects.

I don't think this is an orgin story. I thought JLA already exsisted so they didn't do a storyline that unites all of them together.

 

[Paste Pot Pete]

Just keep in mind, it's a different universe.

And isn't that a little...******ed?

They really seem to want to have their cake and eat it too with this movie. The only way general audiences would even understand any connection between Batman and Ra's Al Ghul (and who he or Talia even are, for that matter) is because of Begins. Yet at the same time they're distancing themselves from the movie?

Ra's/Talia is not, for lack of a better term, "common knowledge." It would be at least a little more acceptable to have someone like Lex as a villain/central figure, because at least he's well known enough and there have been enough depictions of him to more easily distance the film from the current Superman movies. Ra's (and by association, his offspring) are too closely (exclusively, to the general public) related to Begins.

And people thought SR's "vague history" was unnecessarily complex...

 

[Majik1387]

And isn't that a little...******ed?

It's as ******ed as having Elseworlds and other universes in the comics.

 

[Sun_Down]

And isn't that a little...******ed?

They really seem to want to have their cake and eat it too with this movie. The only way general audiences would even understand any connection between Batman and Ra's Al Ghul (and who he or Talia even are, for that matter) is because of Begins. Yet at the same time they're distancing themselves from the movie?

Ra's/Talia is not, for lack of a better term, "common knowledge." It would be at least a little more acceptable to have someone like Lex as a villain/central figure, because at least he's well known enough and there have been enough depictions of him to more easily distance the film from the current Superman movies. Ra's (and by association, his offspring) are too closely (exclusively, to the general public) related to Begins.

And people thought SR's "vague history" was unnecessarily complex...

Ya know, they can introduce characters into films without those characters being recognizable to the audience previously. It's actually worked in the vast majority of movies in history.

 

[Nokio]

I don't mind the Max and Talia as the villians, they can be formidable enough to take on the JLA, and the OMACs are good as the muscle, but the way the storyline is sounding this really would have been a good follow up, like a 3rd film, but not a first one.

 

[TheVileOne]

It's pretty simple. The people that think the moviegoers will accept this movie as being outside of Batman Begins and Superman Returns are WRONG as Lex Luthor would say.

 

[Jake Cassidy]

It's pretty simple. The people that think the moviegoers will accept this movie as being outside of Batman Begins and Superman Returns are WRONG as Lex Luthor would say.

Let us all bow to the Mighty VileOne. For he is always right.

 

[Paste Pot Pete]

Ya know, they can introduce characters into films without those characters being recognizable to the audience previously. It's actually worked in the vast majority of movies in history.

Did I say otherwise?

I said it's ******ed to introduce the idea of another Ra's Al Ghul to an audience that's already accepted one.

 

[Jake Cassidy]

Did I say otherwise?

I said it's ******ed to introduce the idea of another Ra's Al Ghul to an audience that's already accepted one.

I don't think Ra's is gonna be in this, just Talia.

 

[Paste Pot Pete]

It's as ******ed as having Elseworlds and other universes in the comics.

Comic fans accept them because they grew up with them; we swallow ridiculous stories like Crisis. They're essentially necessary in comics; things tend to get a little confusing and convoluted after 50+ years of history and sometimes its nice to start things from scratch.

It can also be nice in movies. Begins was a great idea, and quite necessary to clean out what had become an overcrowded, over-the-top franchise. But Begins is still a baby of a franchise, yet to even release its second installment, and WB wants to introduce another Batman/DC universe? There is no need for multiple universes at this point in WB/DC Film, unlike there is in DC Comics, as you refer to. Batman, Superman, and all the as-of-yet unintroduced heroes are not irreconcilable. WB just lacks the patience to see it through, and instead of people calling it out for what it is (a quick cash grab), it's apparently appealing to some fans' multiverse fetish.

 

[Majik1387]

BB is a different universe from Burton's/Schumacher's/60's series, so there's no problem. I'm also sure that Superman will be different from the Donnerverse and Wonder Woman will be different from the old series.

 

[Paste Pot Pete]

I don't think Ra's is gonna be in this, just Talia.

Who is his daughter, a relationship that's pretty much guaranteed to be referenced, and in turn, Ra's relationship to Batman. But apparently, JL does not take place within the universe of Begins, so what is that relationship? The same as it was portrayed in Begins? Different? Will it not matter? Are we going to be told? Are we to assume? All these questions could be avoided by just connecting the two series'.

 

[Paste Pot Pete]

BB is a different universe from Burton's/Schumacher's, so there's no problem. I'm also sure that Superman will be different from the Donnerverse.

It wasn't a problem. But don't you see the difference? Begins didn't come out till 8 years after B&R.

JL and the Nolan series will be running concurrently. Nolan's Batman in TDK in '08, Miller's Batman in JL in '09, then Nolan's Batman again in '10 or '11. It's just...illogical.

 

[Paste Pot Pete]

double post

 

[pwl4life]

look at x men- we started with toad and sabretooth and ended with the dark phoenix! have faith

that statement has just crushed any faith i once had in this film...

 

[Heretic]

Here's the thing about the general public...they don't patention to anything outside of their immediate interests unless something big happens. You have no idea how many people out there still think that Superman is dead. For that reason, it was smart to tie in the franchise with previous films, though to be honest Smallville may have been a smarter business decision for a tie in.

Batman Begins was needed, seriously. However, I still have people regularly ask me why Joker is in The Dark Knight when he was already killed off in the first Batman movie.

People who don't love this stuff don't pay it too much mind, and therefore are easily confused. By having Batman and Superman in JLA the vast majority of moviegoers will assume that it is the same universe...because to them there are no alternate universes. Imagine the confusion if Lost were to have a second weekly series that runs on a different night. Same characters, same basic idea, but on the new show the characters had different love interests, some dead people were still alive, etc. The average Joe and Jane Idiot would be...well...lost.

I'm looking forward to the movie, but its a bad idea to do it now. Its a bad idea to not have Roth and Bale. It's a bad idea to not have an origin story. Green Arrow has that prison movie coming out...throw out a few more superhero movies and then unite them all in a big slugfest in a few years.

 

[Doctor of Doom]

I find the choice of plot a little wierd too. To me, it's perfect for a sequel. The first movie should be about establishing the League and building them up. Batman's betrayal of them should come as a shock and should tear apart the JLA internally, but tearing them apart *means nothing* unless we've seen them built up first. That's what I feel the weakness of this film's plot will be- it's acting as though we already know and care about the characters, which the majority of the audience will not!

I hold out my hopes to get Darkseid, if not as the villain of this film then as the ultimate villain of a JLA trilogy.

 

[Majik1387]

I'm getting sick of hearing that the first movie should be about them putting the League together. We know why they do it, we don't need a whole movie about it.

 

[ClarkLuther55]

I'm getting sick of hearing that the first movie should be about them putting the League together. We know why they do it, we don't need a whole movie about it.

Really, people know about how the League gets together? What exactly is their origin these days, after so many retcons? And let's not forget that most people will not be comic fans.

Brian Singer figured that people already knew Superman, and that he didn't need to tell the origin story. He didn't care about pulling in kids, or even casual viewers who had only the most superficial surface knowledge of the character. So he made a movie that didn't bother to draw in the viewers, to properly introduce them to the characters and take them along on the characters' journeys.

Yeah, that worked real well.

 

[strikezone89]

im just glad we finally got a jla forum

 

[Cmill216]

Really, people know about how the League gets together? What exactly is their origin these days, after so many retcons? And let's not forget that most people will not be comic fans.

Brian Singer figured that people already knew Superman, and that he didn't need to tell the origin story. He didn't care about pulling in kids, or even casual viewers who had only the most superficial surface knowledge of the character. So he made a movie that didn't bother to draw in the viewers, to properly introduce them to the characters and take them along on the characters' journeys.

Yeah, that worked real well.

 

[Sun_Down]

It's pretty simple. The people that think the moviegoers will accept this movie as being outside of Batman Begins and Superman Returns are WRONG as Lex Luthor would say.

And yet another of VileOne's opinions stated as fact with absolutely nothing to back it up.

Do you people honestly think that a little confusion about continuity is going to have any effect on the average moviegoer's experience? Because the only people who care about those things are people like us. People can think JLA is a sequel to/extension of Nolan's or Singer's franchise all they want, it won't matter. Most people don't remember the nuances of those films enough to notice, let alone be bothered by, violations of continuity. Most people are going to walk into that theater and just enjoy what is presented and probably won't even think about Begins or Returns or TDK or whatever, especially if the actors are recast and the overall tone is so different.

Another poster summed it up best when he/she said this : Even if people get confused, so the hell what? Are they going to be so bothered and so paralyzed by that thought that they'll storm out of the movie and demand their money back? No. They'll just watch the damn movie and maybe talk about it with their friends after the credits roll.

 

[dnno1]

And yet another of VileOne's opinions stated as fact with absolutely nothing to back it up.

Do you people honestly think that a little confusion about continuity is going to have any effect on the average moviegoer's experience? Because the only people who care about those things are people like us. People can think JLA is a sequel to/extension of Nolan's or Singer's franchise all they want, it won't matter. Most people don't remember the nuances of those films enough to notice, let alone be bothered by, violations of continuity. Most people are going to walk into that theater and just enjoy what is presented and probably won't even think about Begins or Returns or TDK or whatever, especially if the actors are recast and the overall tone is so different.

Another poster summed it up best when he/she said this : Even if people get confused, so the hell what? Are they going to be so bothered and so paralyzed by that thought that they'll storm out of the movie and demand their money back? No. They'll just watch the damn movie and maybe talk about it with their friends after the credits roll.

It happens all the time in the comics, don't it?

 

[The Guard]

Really, people know about how the League gets together? What exactly is their origin these days, after so many retcons? And let's not forget that most people will not be comic fans.

They came together to battle threats to The Earth and its people greater than any one or two of them could handle. Pinning it to any "one" threat is pointless. Especially if it's something lame like the Appelexans.

I really don't think "separate" franchises will be that confusing for people.

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

Is anyone else totally confused you ask?

*raises hand*