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Is fandom scaring away top talent?

Why would you be fired for creating a critically and commercially successful product?

It was a terrible film. I don't care how many critics you put in front of me, I will argue with them if it kills them all. But people are speaking with their wallets.

Now Solo has bombed. Which is ironic, because it is actually better than Last Jedi apparently. Star Wars has lost its magic thanks to a mixture of Johnson's incompetence and Disney's greed.

It's the perfect storm.
 
Filmmaking is not my passion or career. I enjoy my career. If I was as bad as Johnson I would be fired, or at least not picked to direct films with a 300 million dollar budget. I'm not even a Star Wars fan at this point. But I still think what he did to Luke Skywalker is a disgrace. That character deserved better.

That said, I can assure you if you gave me 300 million dollars I would make a superior film. I would just hire better writers and a better director.

I am not going to pretend that that movie was anything short of a disaster to spare some rich *******'s ego. I'm just glad the wheels are coming off this franchise. Disney is turning it into Call of Duty.

Why would you be fired for creating a critically and commercially successful product?
^^^ This. I think a whole lot of filmmakers would LOVE to be as "bad" as Rian Johnson. You need to stop pretending that the movie was in any way a "disaster" just to satisfy your indigence at not being pandered to.
 
^^^ This. I think a whole lot of filmmakers would LOVE to be as "bad" as Rian Johnson. You need to stop pretending that the movie was in any way a "disaster" just to satisfy your indigence at not being pandered to.

I think you need to look up indigence.

Honestly, if Rian Johnson is what you aspire to as a filmmaker, don't quit your day job.

I watched that ridiculous movie. Hell will freeze over before you convince me it wasn't a terrible film.

Plot holes galore, terrible pacing, side stories that go nowhere, pointless characters, the bad use of comedy, and then there's Snoke and what they did with Luke Skywalker.

But Solo though. You can take that to the bank. It's failure, I man. Not actual money.

So tell me I am wrong, but explain that one.

I think part of the reason this film gets such a visceral reaction from me is because people pretend it is anything other than a cinematic abomination. Justice League was terrible, but at least every person with the sense to turn on a computer and pay a cable bill realizes it is awful.

Also what does me being pandered to mean? Not being discombobulated? Not sucking at world building? Am I asking for the moon?
 
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You can dislike the damn movie all you want, but you're dismissal (scratch that, basically APPROVAL) of the ****ing disgraceful conduct of fanboys because "he's rich" took you from a poster I respected... to one that I don't. Thundercrack85 = villain.
 
Most definitely they're being scared away when receiving death threats or insults.
 
You can dislike the damn movie all you want, but you're dismissal (scratch that, basically APPROVAL) of the ****ing disgraceful conduct of fanboys because "he's rich" took you from a poster I respected... to one that I don't. Thundercrack85 = villain.

What conduct? People *****ing online?

I disapprove of harassing people in person (that's illegal btw) or going after them on a personal level. But people *****ing on an internet forum about a movie?
 
What conduct? People *****ing online?

I disapprove of harassing people in person (that's illegal btw) or going after them on a personal level. But people *****ing on an internet forum about a movie?

So it's okay. Cyber bullying is okay. Bye.
 
So it's okay. Cyber bullying is okay. Bye.

Is what I am doing right now cyber-bullying? Because that is what I am talking about. Calling a **** movie **** on an internet forum. Is that acceptable?

Because that's freedom of speech.
 
Most definitely they're being scared away when receiving death threats or insults.

Its really crazy to think that some human beings would want to threaten to kill someone, or even wish death upon someone, simply because they didn't like a movie. I don't care how much I hate a movie, I could never bring myself to pour out that much hatred on another human being that didn't do anything to me personally. You would think these filmmakers murdered their entire family the way some of them act. Honestly, if movies affect you this much, you probably need to find something else to do with your time.
 
Breh, why are you this mad though?

I thought it was an awful movie, and it's a shame what it did to Star Wars (especially Luke Swkyalker). I thought this was clear. Additionally it annoys me that people act like it is anything but a bad movie given the glaring problems. All they seem to be able to do is tout some critics who I have never heard of. Let them watch this two hour **** show with me (as if they or I would sit through it twice), and then converse about it. I want to make sure we're watching the same film in the same reality.

I am becoming genuinely curious how anyone can defend this movie. I didn't like Force Awakens, but it looks like A New Hope next to this, and not just because it copies so much from said film.

Having said that, let me make it clear that I am against death threats, injuring people, and attacking people on a non-professional level for whatever reason.

As far as I know, however, Rian Johnson is mostly complaining about fans being unhappy and being salty on the interwebs.

I just want to be able to voice my dislike for this movie on internet forums.
 
It was a terrible film. I don't care how many critics you put in front of me, I will argue with them if it kills them all. But people are speaking with their wallets.

Now Solo has bombed. Which is ironic, because it is actually better than Last Jedi apparently. Star Wars has lost its magic thanks to a mixture of Johnson's incompetence and Disney's greed.

It's the perfect storm.

People are speaking with their wallets by giving 1.3 billion dollars to a terrible film and letting a good film completely flop. Also, all this is Rian Johnson's fault as well as Disney's even though Johnson had LITERALLY nothing to do with Solo and Solo had tons of obvious problems that cannot possibly be attributed to any sort of fallout from TLJ - ranging from bts drama to recasting an iconic character to no one really giving a damn about a Han Solo movie in the first place to Disney not even bothering with any real marketing campaign for it.

Your 'logic' is pathetic.
 
I thought it was an awful movie, and it's a shame what it did to Star Wars (especially Luke Swkyalker). I thought this was clear. Additionally it annoys me that people act like it is anything but a bad movie given the glaring problems. All they seem to be able to do is tout some critics who I have never heard of. Let them watch this two hour **** show with me (as if they or I would sit through it twice), and then converse about it. I want to make sure we're watching the same film in the same reality.

I am becoming genuinely curious how anyone can defend this movie. I didn't like Force Awakens, but it looks like A New Hope next to this, and not just because it copies so much from said film.

Having said that, let me make it clear that I am against death threats, injuring people, and attacking people on a non-professional level for whatever reason.

As far as I know, however, Rian Johnson is mostly complaining about fans being unhappy and being salty on the interwebs.

I just want to be able to voice my dislike for this movie on internet forums.

Is this even based on the quotes this discussion is supposed to be about? Because if you read those original links, Rian Johnson literally didn't say a single word about fans being unhappy or salty. He had a short conversation with Chris McQuarrie about how to approach critical reviews as a director, saying he personally didn't find them useful to himself. Nothing at all about anyone else needing to agree with him nor even the slightest implication that the reviews shouldn't exist.

And the one who said the fan outrage would eventually prove detrimental was James Mangold, and even he only said that if fans couldn't learn to be **** civil they would ultimately drive away the best independent talent from their precious franchises. Still absolutely nothing about anyone stopping you from voicing your dislike.
 
People are speaking with their wallets by giving 1.3 billion dollars to a terrible film and letting a good film completely flop. Also, all this is Rian Johnson's fault as well as Disney's even though Johnson had LITERALLY nothing to do with Solo and Solo had tons of obvious problems that cannot possibly be attributed to any sort of fallout from TLJ - ranging from bts drama to recasting an iconic character to no one really giving a damn about a Han Solo movie in the first place to Disney not even bothering with any real marketing campaign for it.

Your 'logic' is pathetic.

I am curious to see what these obvious problems are, considering how blind you are to the Last Jedi's glaring problems. Does Han Solo get hit in the head with a boom mic?

But I don't buy your logic either. People went to see Star Wars, because that name means something. They wanted to see Luke Skywalker. They got Johnson's vision. His discombobulated, unsatisfying vision. Solo suffered for it. Hell, by all accounts it's a fairly decent, if unambitious adventure movie.
 
You seriously don't seem to get that "terrible film" is subjective, unlike a sporting result or a bottom line performance at a job. Which is win/lose, pass/fail.

People enjoyed TLJ to the tune of 1.3 billion dollars. That's nothing to do with critics, beyond positive word of mouth.

At a certain point, maybe it's you, not Rian.
 
You seriously don't seem to get that "terrible film" is subjective, unlike a sporting result or a bottom line performance at a job. Which is win/lose, pass/fail.

People enjoyed TLJ to the tune of 1.3 billion dollars. That's nothing to do with critics, beyond positive word of mouth.

At a certain point, maybe it's you, not Rian.

There is subjectivity and then there is Rose stopping Finn from ramming himself into that laser cannon. How was that going to work? How does love save them? If Luke hadn't shown up, they would all have been killed. Rebellion over. Did she know he was coming? Of course not. So... what is that?

Also, there is no gravity in space, Aximili!

Why doesn't the First Order just jump to lightspeed and get in front of the rebel fleet?

Why did admiral pink hair not tell Poe the plan? Why has no one ever used a star destroyer as a weapon before? Did she invent that? Why did she wait to do that until all the other ships had been destroyed?

And then there's the bathos. Remember when Luke made a "your momma" joke to Tarkin? Wasn't that great?

This movie was terrible. I paid for this damn movie, I did not enjoy it. I am sure many more got suckered into watching it. And now no one is going to Solo. Which again, is apparently not even a bad film. Solo is paying the price. Though I guess to be fair it could also be the fact that Disney is churning out these movies like Ubisoft.

Anyway I said my piece, so I will move on. Meanwhile I will wait for that tech from Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind so that I can delete this train wreck from my brain.
 
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I am curious to see what these obvious problems are, considering how blind you are to the Last Jedi's glaring problems. Does Han Solo get hit in the head with a boom mic?

But I don't buy your logic either. People went to see Star Wars, because that name means something. They wanted to see Luke Skywalker. They got Johnson's vision. His discombobulated, unsatisfying vision. Solo suffered for it. Hell, by all accounts it's a fairly decent, if unambitious adventure movie.

You didn't read the post you just quoted? I just mentioned several of them. Solo had major bts drama which, first, indicated to some people that the movie might have issues and might not be worth paying for and second caused massive reshoots that ballooned its budget beyond all proportion. Without those reshoots, the movie might have had a chance to break even even with low attendance. It suffered from being the first movie to have have Han Solo without Harrison Ford, which a lot of people weren't interested in seeing. It suffered from being a SW movie that was only, exclusively about Han Solo, which a lot of people weren't interested in seeing. It suffered from being a side story completely unnecessary to the story of the main series, which a lot of people weren't interested in seeing. It suffered from being the second SW movie in less than 6 months, which a lot of people felt was too soon and took away the special event nature of going to see a SW movie. And on top of all that, Disney refused to market the damn movie decently because they didn't want to draw attention away from the Avengers.
 
Also, there is no gravity in space, Aximili!


Goddammit, not this again. Stop your ranting for a second, go watch The Empire Strikes back. You didn't have any problem with the physics that's been established in this 'verse since 1980 back then. 'Cause white people & penises.



Why has no one ever used a star destroyer as a weapon before?


Been covered too. Hardly economical, or good for morale, just going all Japanese Empire with your devoted pilots at the first sight of a Destroyer.

And the rest of your post is pretty much irrational blowhard whining, not even worth it.



I paid for this damn movie, I did not enjoy it.


Whoop-diggity-****ing-doo. Something in life didn't turn out the way you wanted it to. You're going to have to accept it, act like an adult, and move on.

You're probably better off just bowing out of the Disney-era Star Wars for good at this point, you're not going to enjoy yourself. Just exercise a little self-restraint and don't go see whatever they put out next. But the incessant whineing for half a year on the topic tends to point to something deeper, maybe go talk to someone professional over it. This isn't what normal people do.

Hell, I hated The Dark Knight Rises, after loving the first two. You just express that at the time, and move the hell on. And certainly not develop some irrational hatred for the director as a person over it. There's a whole big world out there, Star Wars doesn't rise to the bar of being more than what it is, a movie.

Whoever made the thing doesn't owe you a damn thing. You don't have to like it. The guy's been polite to those of you who don't. Just...you know, you can act your age too, this is kindergarten tantrum bull**** at a certain point.
 
Yeah I wouldn't be able to defend that crap either. Nice cop out.

At least we can all agree Justice League sucked. I pray.

Anyway see you in the Politics section.
 
To get more on topic...

Outside of that Macquarie and Johnson Tweet exchange is there concrete proof this IS happening? I initially posted that social media is now a new factor in things but it's one of many considerations for talent in front of or behind the camera. Can anyone point to a writer, director or performers that have basically said either they wete approached to become part of a genre piece with a built in fan base or were going to initiate an adaptation themselves but thought the fans were too big of a hassle and declined? Has this been stated publicly?
 
I don’t think you really understand how difficult it is to direct these bug budget movies. It isn’t some small indie movie where you can make quick decisions. Every change in the script, location, etc requires moving hundreds of people, going through approval processes, etc.

This is part of the issue right here. You seem to think your opinion is fact and not acknowledging that TLJ made a lot of money. Using Solo’s box office as proof that audiences hated it doesn’t make sense. Solo had entirely different characters. It was a different story.

I definitely had my issues with TLJ. But I’m imagining if you were the director, and had to deal with level of vitriol from someone similar to yourself, but times a thousand, you probably would get just as frustrated.
 
I like the idea that if Finn had destroyed the gun, the FO would have just gone "Oh well, let's go home."
 
To get more on topic...

Outside of that Macquarie and Johnson Tweet exchange is there concrete proof this IS happening? I initially posted that social media is now a new factor in things but it's one of many considerations for talent in front of or behind the camera. Can anyone point to a writer, director or performers that have basically said either they wete approached to become part of a genre piece with a built in fan base or were going to initiate an adaptation themselves but thought the fans were too big of a hassle and declined? Has this been stated publicly?

I don't know if any creative can say that out loud because it kind of taints them with any fans of existing material going forward, doesn't it? If someone says "I would've done SW but the zealous fan base was a bit too much" that kind of gives them a bad reputation with anything that has an 'enthusiastic' fan base in the future IMO.

I think they'd be really careful not to put that sentiment into so many words.
 
To get more on topic...

Outside of that Macquarie and Johnson Tweet exchange is there concrete proof this IS happening? I initially posted that social media is now a new factor in things but it's one of many considerations for talent in front of or behind the camera. Can anyone point to a writer, director or performers that have basically said either they wete approached to become part of a genre piece with a built in fan base or were going to initiate an adaptation themselves but thought the fans were too big of a hassle and declined? Has this been stated publicly?



Well, James Mangold certainly seems to think it's happening
 
I don’t think you really understand how difficult it is to direct these bug budget movies. It isn’t some small indie movie where you can make quick decisions. Every change in the script, location, etc requires moving hundreds of people, going through approval processes, etc.

This is part of the issue right here. You seem to think your opinion is fact and not acknowledging that TLJ made a lot of money. Using Solo’s box office as proof that audiences hated it doesn’t make sense. Solo had entirely different characters. It was a different story.

I definitely had my issues with TLJ. But I’m imagining if you were the director, and had to deal with level of vitriol from someone similar to yourself, but times a thousand, you probably would get just as frustrated.

Fair enough, but if you give me millions of dollars, everyone in this forum can punch me in the face. Twice. I'll just buy a new face.
 

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