Is fandom scaring away top talent?

[samsnee]

I don't know if any creative can say that out loud because it kind of taints them with any fans of existing material going forward, doesn't it? If someone says "I would've done SW but the zealous fan base was a bit too much" that kind of gives them a bad reputation with anything that has an 'enthusiastic' fan base in the future IMO.

I think they'd be really careful not to put that sentiment into so many words.

Basically this. I don’t think it’s an epidemic. There are enough starving directors and actors that need a paycheck that will always say yes. But someone who has more clout or is considered more visionary may have second thoughts about signing up.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Is what I am doing right now cyber-bullying? Because that is what I am talking about. Calling a **** movie **** on an internet forum. Is that acceptable?

Because that's freedom of speech.

No one is saying you cannot call a movie you don't like crap. Not even Rian Johnson. What we are condemning are scumbags sending creators/performers death threats and bullying them. Which you previously supported because "they're rich so they can deal with it." I am sorry but anyone who cyber-bullies anyone, even a guy who made a movie you hated, is a flat out scumbag. Anyone who supports people being cyber-bullied is also a scumbag.

Freedom of speech doesn't give you the freedom to harass people. Nor threaten their life. If you think it does, learn the law. Because then your definition of freedom of speech is very wrong.

 

[Abudefduf]

And again, millionaire Rian Johnson is not the only person being targeted by the anti-TLJ mob. Just a couple of days ago they all dogpiled on Andi Gutierrez, host of The Star Wars Show, because of an old photo where she was posing with a mug saying "fanboy tears".

These people are rabid.

 

[P Supreme]

And again, millionaire Rian Johnson is not the only person being targeted by the anti-TLJ mob. Just a couple of days ago they all dogpiled on Andi Gutierrez, host of The Star Wars Show, because of an old photo where she was posing with a mug saying "fanboy tears".

These people are rabid.

then maybe stop baiting them with that just a thought

When I dislike a movie I go in say my piece and bounce from the thread no need to argue been here long enough to know when to walk away from some of you nutjobs t:

I see no benefit of attacking these people online i'm 38 so this social media thing is not my cup of tea so don't see how you can get satisfaction from getting banned by a celebrity that just makes you a complete Ahole

 

[CaptainWagner]

There is subjectivity and then there is Rose stopping Finn from ramming himself into that laser cannon. How was that going to work? How does love save them? If Luke hadn't shown up, they would all have been killed. Rebellion over. Did she know he was coming? Of course not. So... what is that?

Also, there is no gravity in space, Aximili!

Why doesn't the First Order just jump to lightspeed and get in front of the rebel fleet?

Why did admiral pink hair not tell Poe the plan? Why has no one ever used a star destroyer as a weapon before? Did she invent that? Why did she wait to do that until all the other ships had been destroyed?

And then there's the bathos. Remember when Luke made a "your momma" joke to Tarkin? Wasn't that great?

This movie was terrible. I paid for this damn movie, I did not enjoy it. I am sure many more got suckered into watching it. And now no one is going to Solo. Which again, is apparently not even a bad film. Solo is paying the price. Though I guess to be fair it could also be the fact that Disney is churning out these movies like Ubisoft.

Anyway I said my piece, so I will move on. Meanwhile I will wait for that tech from Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind so that I can delete this train wreck from my brain.

-No one ever said that Rose was making a rational decision. She's impulsive, she's in the middle of a warzone, and someone she cares deeply about is about to die. It's ridiculous to complain that she "wasn't thinking about the big picture".

-There's also no fire in space. Or sound.

-Because she's a superior officer and both real life history and film history are littered with military officers who kept there inferiors out of the loop, especially those they don't like or trust. Also, massive space ships are super expensive, you can't just weaponize them willy nilly.

-It wouldn't have fit Luke's character. But it fits Poe's. Different characters have different senses of humor. But apparently Star Wars is a "No Momma Jokes Zone". That's news to me...

The fact that your attempts to "prove" this was a terrible film ignore the actual quality judgements like writing, acting, cinematography, and originality says it all. You fall back on hypocritical nitpicks or complaining about plot points that didn't go the way you wanted them to. It's fine if you didn't like the movie. But be honest about WHY you dislike it and stop attacking the people who did and the people who made it.

And no, for the millionth time, Solo did not fail because of TLJ. People were not interested in the movie and Lucasfilm failed to convince those people they should see it. That's the end of the story. The childish fans boycotting a movie made for them because they didn't like TLJ have a severe case of delusions of grandeur.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Hey guys, no more debating The Last Jedi's plot points in here. TLJ has a forum, and honestly, the plot of the film itself is not relevant to this topic. The topic is about cyber-bullying celebrities, so the finer plot points of TLJ mean nothing really. Reaction to the movie is relevant, debating if Rose is an awful character is not.

Thank you

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

Well, James Mangold certainly seems to think it's happening

Ah... I had forgotten about Mangold talking about this relatively recently.

 

[Abudefduf]

then maybe stop baiting them with that just a thought

Victim blaming. Nice. So let me get this straight... Gutierrez deserves abuse because she was "baiting them", Johnson deserves abuse because he's a millionaire and made a divisive movie... what's the punishment for sending death threats over stupid crap?

 

[P Supreme]

Victim blaming. Nice. So let me get this straight... Gutierrez deserves abuse because she was "baiting them", Johnson deserves abuse because he's a millionaire and made a divisive movie... what's the punishment for sending death threats over stupid crap?

Of course not but you are inviting some reaction with wearing that shirt?

 

[Herofan]

I can definitely understand why directors and possibly actors would stay away. Of course, the nice paycheck will always be an enticement for younger talent, but why would more established directors take the risk?

You spend two years or more of your life developing it, then it comes out, people either love it or hate it, and then you get asked for the next two years during every other interview for whatever project you are on, when the sequel is coming out.

I think it's pretty fair to say that for a long time top talent generally hasn't been interested in making sf/f or comic book films, either from lack of interest in the original material at all or fear of overly high expectations; the massive success of Nolan Batman and MCU and maybe Craig Bond creating a brief exceptional period and fan negativity just returns things more to normal.

Yeah, harassing the talent is not OK but a lot of the talent also resents and is alienated by substantive, even if petty and even if not, criticism of the work. The fans would actually probably get better work from talent that was not considered the top but was more open to/accepting of criticism.

 

[Milk Tray Guy]

the massive success of Nolan Batman and MCU and maybe Craig Bond creating a brief exceptional period and fan negativity just returns things more to normal.

Such a shame that that^ is 'normal'!

 

[samsnee]

It’s human nature to complain. Don’t think anyone is saying that’s not allowed.

Scorsese is producing a new Joker movie with Joaquin Phoenix attached. Clearly they aren’t worried about audience negativity. But it has been ten years since TDK and Leto didn’t exactly set the world on fire with his version.

 

[Teelie]

Hey guys, no more debating The Last Jedi's plot points in here. TLJ has a forum, and honestly, the plot of the film itself is not relevant to this topic. The topic is about cyber-bullying celebrities, so the finer plot points of TLJ mean nothing really. Reaction to the movie is relevant, debating if Rose is an awful character is not.

Thank you

One thing that did ironically prove is exactly why the fandom has grown so toxic. People don't see the internet as a place to respect other people. If you are online, you are not worth respect or consideration. You aren't even a person who has feelings or can be impacted by your toxic behavior.

This is why I think the fandom has become intolerable. Even on these forums I very rarely go into specific forums because the fanboys in there are way too serious and aggressive towards anyone who has a differing opinion.

That "passion" people have is merely an excuse to just treat other people like **** because you feel you can get away with it.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

That's not a fandom thing though. That's an Internet thing. Try going to a news site or a sports site, and it is just as bad if not worse. Fans aren't jerks. PEOPLE are jerks. And fans just happen to be people.

 

[Teelie]

True, but it gets distilled into its absolute worst in the fandoms.

 

[Milk Tray Guy]

If you are online, you are not worth respect or consideration. You aren't even a person who has feelings or can be impacted by your toxic behavior.

In the Community Forum there's a 'Depression and Suicide' thread. I thought as I was reading through it how something like that really serves as a reminder that behind these anonymous usernames and avatars are people, often living with circumstances that we can't even begin to imagine.

 

[Aximili86]

As far as the "is it happening or is it not?" discussion, the directors think it is. That's what's of consequence here. At a certain point anyone who's already established just isn't going to want to get down in the gutter and fight it out with these kids, they'll pass, and the only people taking these gigs will be younger guys with something to prove, willing to take the heat.

Which hasn't worked out with the Tranks and Lord/Millers of the world. Lesser extent with Edwards, but he had team player instincts and was willing to work with those who know better.

Yeah I wouldn't be able to defend that crap either. Nice cop out. At least we can all agree Justice League sucked. I pray. Anyway see you in the Politics section.

It's a perfectly sound rebuttal. You don't kamikaze ships into capital ships other than as a last resort. Watch a WWII documentary sometime.

Any military force, especially a group considering themselves of sound moral principle as the Rebel Alliance/Resistance, isn't going to just order their guys to go all Imperial Japanese as a first option. Pilots and ships are both at a premium, unlike with the Empire. Making an argument of "why doesn't the Empire do it? They have a few hundred thousand ships and don't give a crap about their grunts" would have far more merit.

As for the gravity thing, yeah, again:

The bombers in the OT work on exactly the same principle. There's clearly artificial gravity inside these ships (people aren't floating about), the bombs start their falling inside the ships, passing through those transparent fields, same as are in the capital ship hangar bays. Once they're through, they continue on the same downward trajectory they were when there was gravity and atmosphere.

You'll ignore this because it's who you are, but there's the exact same reasoning behind it in-universe as there was in George's movies.

 

[Silvermoth]

I must admit, I am very worried when they cast the new xmen films when they cast for younger actors people might flip their lids a bit. People have been dreaming about an mcu xmen flick for so long, it’s impossible to live up to it and I’m worried younger actors will cop the brunt of that

 

[samsnee]

So Ruby Rose quit Twitter because apparently some critics thought she wasn’t “lesbian enough” to play Batwoman. Really, fandom can be the worst sometimes.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

So Ruby Rose quit Twitter because apparently some critics thought she wasn’t “lesbian enough” to play Batwoman. Really, fandom can be the worst sometimes.

in many of these cases it isn't fans at all, but SJWs complaining that they should have hired *insert minority here* instead or about what they did or said once years ago.

See the complaints about The Rock taking away jobs from actual amputees, for example.

 

[Abudefduf]

We're reaching the point where some people want actors to be of the exact same race, religion and sexual orientation as the characters they play, and it's kinda the dumbest thing ever?

I mean, it's one thing to criticize Scarlett Johansson for basically casting herself as a trans man, but this? This is ridiculous.

 

[Prettyricky]

Honestly if your an actor just take role and stay off forums and social media of any kind. It will be a much better experience for them which I truly believe alot of them do anyway.

 

[samsnee]

I get that there are some legitimate concerns that a gay person’s story may best be told through the lens of someone who’s lived through the gay experience. But for movies that aren’t necessarily about the gay experience, does it really matter? If the argument is that it’s about gay or trans actors just getting a seat at the table, isn’t it better to fight for them to get roles that are diverse so they aren’t typecast?

 

[jmc]

This is getting utterly ridiculous to be honest. This is what happens when studios caves to ideologies. Hiring someone based on their sexuality was dumb to begin with, but now it’s blown up in their face because like everything with people obsessed with group identities it’s never good enough. Can’t blame the alt-righters on this one, this one’s on the SJW’s.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

I ask again though... How many are actually complaining? If we literally counted up the amount of people that Tweeted to Rose negatively... How many of the 300 million plus population of the USA would that equal?