Joker- Full Spoiler Talk (SPOILERS)

[mddbatman]

You're in the right thread.

Given the previous two posts, im not so sure ha

 

[Mysteryman]

I'm glad Alec Baldwin dropped out of the role of Thomas Wayne. When he was cast they said that Thomas in the movie would be played a like a Trump caricature and Baldwin is known for playing Trump on SNL. Wayne inadvertently starting the uprising due to his comments on the subway killings about the less fortunate being clowns does sound like something Trump would possibly say.

That may have been the original intent, but, I didn't see Thomas Wayne as Trump at all.

 

[Kane52630]

 

[Jekecy]

Something to watch out for people on a rewatch; there’s a clock in both scenes of Arthur with the therapist and asylum doctor. Both read 11:11. Can confirm from someone’s screenshots this is the case. Also when he “punches out” that clock purportedly is the same time as well, but haven’t verified that.

Very interesting interpretations of those numbers if you really wanna research it. Love this film keeps adding more layers of question.

 

[mddbatman]

Something to watch out for people on a rewatch; there’s a clock in both scenes of Arthur with the therapist and asylum doctor. Both read 11:11. Can confirm from someone’s screenshots this is the case. Also when he “punches out” that clock purportedly is the same time as well, but haven’t verified that.

Very interesting interpretations of those numbers if you really wanna research it. Love this film keeps adding more layers of question.

The clock is definitely 11:11 when he punches out of Ha Ha's. Iv watched the film three times now and I noticed the clocks.

 

[Hollis Mason]

Something to watch out for people on a rewatch; there’s a clock in both scenes of Arthur with the therapist and asylum doctor. Both read 11:11. Can confirm from someone’s screenshots this is the case. Also when he “punches out” that clock purportedly is the same time as well, but haven’t verified that.

Very interesting interpretations of those numbers if you really wanna research it. Love this film keeps adding more layers of question.

Yes, saw that one. This is the meaning of 11:11 acording to wiki.
According to numerology, the number 11 is a “master number” which signifies intuition, insight, and enlightenment. ... In other words, seeing 11 11 is a good sign! An energetic doorway is being opened in which you will experience spiritual growth.

 

[mddbatman]

Yes, saw that one. This is the meaning of 11:11 acording to wiki.
According to numerology, the number 11 is a “master number” which signifies intuition, insight, and enlightenment. ... In other words, seeing 11 11 is a good sign! An energetic doorway is being opened in which you will experience spiritual growth.

11:11 often signifies that a period of change is about to start within you. Interestingly enough, when I woke up yesterday morning and checked the time it was 11:11 hmmmm ha.

 

[Vlyse]

Just saw it. I liked it pretty well as an Arthur Fleck story but Joker it is not. It's a decent flick about a mentally ill man but it uses the Batman mythos to give attention to it and spark more "ooo" and "ahh" than there otherwise would be. my 2/c

 

[Stark Bauer]

I still think Heath Ledger’s Joker is the best depiction. This movie was interesting for a comic book movie, but I felt it was a waste of time. I did not like the gratuitous violence, and although I sympathized with him at the start, he just went off into wacko territory and was overall an exercise in disturbing.

I can justify watching The Dark Knight over and over- there is balance between dark and light. There is a solid story. This movie is like Taxi Driver except if the protagonist is one that I don’t find particularly relatable or sympathetic. I get that it’s a movie about a psychopath, but as entertainment, I did not think my money was well spent. I much preferred the way Walter White evolved into Heisenberg in Breaking Bad as how to do a villain story.

 

[Jekecy]

I was looking over the original script draft, and found an interesting change from the actual ending:

I like the film version better. And it should remove all doubt a reference to Batman wasn't something always built-in from the start.

 

[jolldan]

Joaquin Phoenix is damn near perfect (especially in the final act it feels like he even takes it up a notch), rarely give a monkeys about the Oscars but really hope he gets the award as that was one of the best performance's I have seen in a long time.

1. The girlfriend. Firstly I love how the Zazie Beats character just turns out to have been in his girlfriend only in his imagination, not only because the reveal scene was great (honestly didn't know if he would kill her then and there) but because her whole reaction to him stalking her just felt super unrealistic but I just sort of excepted it and it made the reveal even better. (Didn't think you needed the flashbacks though)

2. The first Joker snap. Frankly I should have probably seen it coming as he had the gun at this point but the way he snapped and killed all three of those guys was shot in a way where I was completely taken aback and surprised.

3. Wayne son? Also really liked how they left it open ended if he really was Wayne's son. That note seemed to suggest it was possible but at the same time could that one little bit of attention been what started his mothers delusions, I loved how he crumpled it up and dismissed it as he was done with that part of his life now.

4. Where he kills Randall. That scene felt pretty much how I have imagined a lot of the comic book panels of Joker and some of his goons in his lair would actually go as everything's a joke but nothings funny. Even when Gary can't reach the chain that was meant to be comedic but my whole screen gasped not because anyone was offended or anything like that but you thought it might have been one last gag at Gary's expense before he killed him to.

10/10, A+, 5 stars

 

[FunkMiller]

I was looking over the original script draft, and found an interesting change from the actual ending:

I like the film version better. And it should remove all doubt a reference to Batman wasn't something always built-in from the start.

...alternatively, the script underwent a lot of changes between that draft and the final final film, and the more overt Batman references were deliberately cut out to maintain ambiguity.

 

[Doc Samson]

I've always liked the sort of effeminate, slightly androgynous version of Joker, and I think Joaquin nails that by the end.

The way he talks to Murray ("My life is nothing but a comedy", "MurRay", "they couldn't carry a tune to save their lives") his little dance after killing him, all those nuances were spot on and genius for my own little personal preference...

 

[The Endless]

What I loved about certain parts, like Gary being unable to reach the door latch, is that they were genuinely funny moments.

But actually laughing at it was wrong. Especially after what just happened.

The film did that a few times. Undercutting the tension or violence with humour... then daring you to laugh.

Phillip's made some genius directing decisions here. Little details that make a lot of difference. Saying this film is nothing but a pastiche of King of Comedy/Taxi Driver is doing the director a huge disservice.

 

[Prettyricky]

I like we saw the nasty side of thomas wayne towards arthur. Its a nice counter balance most likely to him being kind towards bruce. I kind of saw him being protective of bruce coming out of the theater.

 

[HopeOfTheFuture]

I was looking over the original script draft, and found an interesting change from the actual ending:

I like the film version better. And it should remove all doubt a reference to Batman wasn't something always built-in from the start.

Is the full original script available to read somewhere?

 

[Maze]

What I loved about certain parts, like Gary being unable to reach the door latch, is that they were genuinely funny moments.

But actually laughing at it was wrong. Especially after what just happened.

The film did that a few times. Undercutting the tension or violence with humour... then daring you to laugh.

Phillip's made some genius directing decisions here. Little details that make a lot of difference. Saying this film is nothing but a pastiche of King of Comedy/Taxi Driver is doing the director a huge disservice.

Totally, i found myself having contradictory emotion, in moments like that. Phillips nuanced those scenes, and that's what give this movie, this uniqueness, and its depht.

 

[TheGuy]

One genuinely terrifying aspect of Phoenix's characterization that I think has been overlooked is the physicality. The performance would not have worked if he weighed an average man his size. Before he killed Randall, he was doing body contortions similar to Pennywise the Clown, but more scary and shocking because it was all performance and no CGI. The film is littered with imagery of his body that depicts an impoverished man, almost emaciated.

 

[FatRobin]

I was looking over the original script draft, and found an interesting change from the actual ending:

I like the film version better. And it should remove all doubt a reference to Batman wasn't something always built-in from the start.

Could you please dm me the script? I haven't been able to find it.

 

[The Endless]

Yea what's up with Phoenix's left shoulder? Has he had it broken or dislocated before? It just didnt look right.

 

[Doc Samson]

Yeah not sure, it's weird though. He kind of has a sunken chest too, noticed that back in Gladiator.

 

[TheGuy]

His chest looks fine, except being skinny. But the abdomen... yikes.

 

[Schlosser85]

I've always liked the sort of effeminate, slightly androgynous version of Joker, and I think Joaquin nails that by the end.

The way he talks to Murray ("My life is nothing but a comedy", "MurRay", "they couldn't carry a tune to save their lives") his little dance after killing him, all those nuances were spot on and genius for my own little personal preference...

I liked Phoenix's dancey body language.

 

[Jekecy]

...alternatively, the script underwent a lot of changes between that draft and the final final film, and the more overt Batman references were deliberately cut out to maintain ambiguity.

Haven’t went through entire draft yet, just glossed over the big parts. What were the overt references that got dropped?

In any case, the coda remains true to the original context of the flashback and “joke” reference. Todd just decided to show it instead of say it. Certainly at the very least it seems like a fair reading of intent.

Arguably the most famous book featuring these characters also ends in a joke. And Todd was clearly pulling from that story’s DNA.

Is the full original script available to read somewhere?

Could you please dm me the script? I haven't been able to find it.

Yea what's up with Phoenix's left shoulder? Has he had it broken or dislocated before? It just didnt look right.

Phoenix actually has it, but I think it’s something he exaggerated. Phillips mentioned it was not something he set out to portray.

 

[Doc Samson]

His chest looks fine, except being skinny. But the abdomen... yikes.

Nah, he just looks so screwed up that it's not as noticeable with the 53 pound drop. But simply put...he's a weird looking dude. Which works wonders for this!