Marvels Biggest mistakes?

[roach]

Lets face it, some of you just enjoy *****ing. Its not well thought out critique most of the time. Dredd is pretty much the only one I can think of off the top of my head (though I know there are more of you so I apologise for not remembering you by name) who puts thought and effort into it and isn't just ''OMFG EVERYTHING MARVEL PRETTY MUCH SUXXX'' like say Roach.

I go on vacation and come back and see this....Internet Immortality

Yes I have a pretty bad opinion or Marvel. It comes from me seeing them misuse their characters because hot creator wants to do so. I pretty much see Marvel throwing throwing crap at the wall hoping something sticks. Series that I got in to became late to the point that I forgot what was going on in the books. I have been collecting comics since I was 16....I have not been to my LCS in 2 months. I blame that on Marvel.
You will experience it too....one day. When the wool is removed and you realize that all is not good at Marvel

 

[Electro UK]

The Trouble mini series.

Joey Q: We think fans'll be prud to call this the true origin of Spider-man

Hmm, Aunt May's actually a **** and is Peter's real mother.

Joey Q: Okay okay okay, its out of continuity, I'm sorry!

 

[Arkady Rossovich]

To my way of thinking, Marvel's mishandling of Spider-Man over the past several years deserves a category unto itself, simply because it is the result of compounding problems rather than solving them, especially in the 1990s. We got:
--Venom, "lethal protector," which lead to the creation of Carnage, which lead to "Maximum Carnage," which lead to several failed Venom series and making the Scorpion the new Venom.
--The dragging out of the robot parents storyline, which lead to Spidey being a Batman wannabe spouting "Parker is dead, I am the Spider," which lead to the clone saga and negating 20 years worth of Spider-Man comics, which lead to bringing back Norman Osborn (which would eventually lead to [blackout]Sins Past[/blackout]), which lead to the return of Aunt May back from the dead, which lead to leaving the fate of baby May up unresolved, which lead to the reboot and Chapter One, which lead to Mary Jane's supposed death, which lead to her coming back, which lead to Spidey's origin being tied in with totemism, which lead to The Other:Evolve or Die.
--Revealing Ned Leeds as the Hobgoblin, which gave us the Macdendale/Jack O'Lantern as the Hobgoblin, which gave us the Demogoblin, which gave us the cybernetic Hobgoblin.
--Killing off Mysterio, which lead to TWO Mysterio replacements plus the original Mysterio coming back as an undead servant of Hell. This also lead to the Evil That Men Do, which also retconned Black Cat's origins into having her be a rape victim.
--Then there's Spidey joining the New Avengers, which lead him to get his ugly Iron Spidey costume, which lead to him becoming Iron Man's sidekick, which lead to the unmasking, which will probably lead to some other form of reboot.

Of course, X-Men has had their problems as well. The whole thing with Jean Grey not being the real Pheonix for one thing and the confussion that followed with that. Also, after Chris Claremont left, you had everybody else trying to outdo him or recycle his plots, which gave us Onslaught, which gave us Heroes Reborn. Not to mention the Twelve. Then when Claremont came back, we got the Neo. And when Grant Morrison came on board and breathed new life into the franchise (although yes, some ideas worked better than others) after he left, Marvel systematically starting scrapping them (except for Beast's new look and the Scott/Emma affair) which lead to the whole convoluted mess that Xorn wasn't Magento after all, and of course House of M. And there was also Chuck Austen and his making Nightcrawler the son of an actual demon, Havok getting involved with the nurse, Polaris becoming a psycho, Angel and Husk's Lolita-esque romance, etc. And you can bet that Storm's marriage to Black Panther will eventually be a mistake as well.

Some of these make refrences to the late 1980`s,do you think Marvel has been in the pits for that long?The detail in your post makes it,so you know what your talking about..which is good.

Its common sence to any real Spider-Man reader that ASM has been in a downhill cause since the 1980`s.I cant think of anything that has changed that.

As for the X-Men,the whole Scott/Emma affair is so out of character,only readers from Claremont`s 1980`s X-Men run can tell the difference.Some of those stories,mostly Nightcrawler`s "demon origin" has been so bad,it hasnt been refrenced to.Storm`s marriage to Black Panther will no doubt be a few years at most,but i think its BP`s chance at exposure by Joe Q or such.

 

[roach]

As for the X-Men,the whole Scott/Emma affair is so out of character,only readers from Claremont`s 1980`s X-Men run can tell the difference.

Having been around to read comics then my thoughts on the subject would be that Scott would hold a grudge against her since she was causing trouble when "Jean" first died. Yet the only person who seemed to remember that Emma used to be a bad guy was Claremont during his Xtreme and Uncanny run. Emma stole Storm's body and during that time did damage to Strom and Kitty's friendship...not something easily forgivable.

 

[gildea]

Emma stole Storm's body and during that time did damage to Strom and Kitty's friendship...not something easily forgivable.

Magneto almost killed kitty and was then allowed to lead the xmen in a far shorter time frame than emmas acceptance (which kitty doesn't really follow as per astonishing).

 

[Horrorfan]

Magneto almost killed kitty and was then allowed to lead the xmen in a far shorter time frame than emmas acceptance (which kitty doesn't really follow as per astonishing).

To be fair, from what I remember , Magneto killed her almost accidentally, and thats when he decided to turn around, so it did sort of make sense.


Yeah I kinda understand that frost was a bad guy, but the x men are about a chance for redemption. Thats part of the philosiphy behind xavier's teaching. Not saying i think she deserves it, but its how the x men work. hell they even tried to rehab sabretooth.

 

[Darthphere]

I go on vacation and come back and see this....Internet Immortality

Yes I have a pretty bad opinion or Marvel. It comes from me seeing them misuse their characters because hot creator wants to do so. I pretty much see Marvel throwing throwing crap at the wall hoping something sticks. Series that I got in to became late to the point that I forgot what was going on in the books. I have been collecting comics since I was 16....I have not been to my LCS in 2 months. I blame that on Marvel.
You will experience it too....one day. When the wool is removed and you realize that all is not good at Marvel

And all is not bad at Marvel either.

 

[gildea]

To be fair, from what I remember , Magneto killed her almost accidentally, and thats when he decided to turn around, so it did sort of make sense.

He was sorry after it but he basically lost his temper in a fight and almost killed her.

I was just observing that people (and I include everyone) sometimes ignore the exact same criticism they have just made if it's applied to a different writer and are very selective with their memory (for instance roach claims only claremont recalls emma being a "baddie" yet its been a recurring theme in Astonishing xmen).

 

[Horrorfan]

He was sorry after it but he basically lost his temper in a fight and almost killed her.

I was just observing that people (and I include everyone) sometimes ignore the exact same criticism they have just made if it's applied to a different writer and are very selective with their memory (for instance roach claims only claremont recalls emma being a "baddie" yet its been a recurring theme in Astonishing xmen).

I actually do agree with you, I just thought that Magneto killing kitty was a little different. But I agree 100% with your selective memory comment. we all do it at some point.

And yeah you're right, Kitty pretty much never lets up on mistrusting emma, and wolverine has had a few little digs at scott dating her too.

 

[Galact-Gal]

Magneto almost killed kitty and was then allowed to lead the xmen in a far shorter time frame than emmas acceptance (which kitty doesn't really follow as per astonishing).

Magneto didn't lead the X-Men. He was the headmaster of the school (thanks to Charlie hanging a guilt trip on him). For some reason Marvel kept putting his head up in the corner box on covers of Uncanny, but he only worked with the team a few times & Storm was the team leader.

 

[roach]

He was sorry after it but he basically lost his temper in a fight and almost killed her.

I was just observing that people (and I include everyone) sometimes ignore the exact same criticism they have just made if it's applied to a different writer and are very selective with their memory (for instance roach claims only claremont recalls emma being a "baddie" yet its been a recurring theme in Astonishing xmen).

I stand corrected I was thinking back to the time when Morrison made her his "Mary Sue"
and while I do see the X-men trying to rehabilitate their enemies there should be some that certain X-men stay away from. I wouldnt expect Wolverine and Sabretooth to start hanging out and being buddy buddy...

 

[roach]

Magneto didn't lead the X-Men. He was the headmaster of the school (thanks to Charlie hanging a guilt trip on him). For some reason Marvel kept putting his head up in the corner box on covers of Uncanny, but he only worked with the team a few times & Storm was the team leader.

You also have to look at the fact that Magneto and Xavier were friends before all this happened. I believe Xavier has always tried to bring Magneto back to his side. "Michael Xavier" appeared more in the New Mutants than in the Uncanny books but continuity was much tighter then

 

[Galact-Gal]

The point I was trying to make was that he did not lead the X-Men. Every time somebody says that it reminds me of New Mutants #75, which makes me want to spit!!! A story that, as far as I can see, existed mainly to trash Magneto's character & turn him back into Mr.Evil Crazy Guy. A story which flat-out contradicted incidents from both New Mutants & Uncanny!!! And I'd better stop now, before I turn into a raving maniac.

 

[Victor Von Doom]

New Mutant, which eventually became New X-men: Academy X

Talk about a pointless excuse to create a bunch of random heroes whose devlopment has no meaning. How'd they get so good at using their powers? Well they went through the academy, case closed. ZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

Now there were a few characters that had potential to actually become halfway decent, non-overpowered heroes, but they were bogged down by Jonny telekinetic, or Larry Stone fist. They just rehashed other peoples powers and made them slightly different. There was nothing interesting or creative about it.

 

[Snikt 6]

New Mutant, which eventually became New X-men: Academy X

Talk about a pointless excuse to create a bunch of random heroes whose devlopment has no meaning. How'd they get so good at using their powers? Well they went through the academy, case closed. ZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

Now there were a few characters that had potential to actually become halfway decent, non-overpowered heroes, but they were bogged down by Jonny telekinetic, or Larry Stone fist. They just rehashed other peoples powers and made them slightly different. There was nothing interesting or creative about it.

I wouldnt call it pointless.....or uninteresting. I found it to be good, not great mind you, but good. I think the execution could have been much better, but it was a good thought.

 

[LivingTribunal]

I was wonder what people's opinions were on the worst events in Marvel history.... It doesn't have to be a company wide crossover, but it shouldn't be a single issue bad story. I'm going to get it started with my list.

Heroes Reborn....
Maximum Clonage
Bringing Norman Osborn and Aunt May back from the dead.
Gwen Stacy Having Osborn's kids.
Iron Man turned to villain and replaced by Younger "Hipper" version of himself.
Avengers Dissembled (especially turning She-Hulk into the a female savage Hulk. The Hulk was a product of Banner's MPD, something Jen doesn't have.)

I'm sure there are more, but these are the ones that come to mind.

Marvel vs DC
Marvel Universe: The End 1-6
Retconning the Beyonder

 

[Doc Destruction]

New Mutant, which eventually became New X-men: Academy X

Talk about a pointless excuse to create a bunch of random heroes whose devlopment has no meaning. How'd they get so good at using their powers? Well they went through the academy, case closed. ZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

Now there were a few characters that had potential to actually become halfway decent, non-overpowered heroes, but they were bogged down by Jonny telekinetic, or Larry Stone fist. They just rehashed other peoples powers and made them slightly different. There was nothing interesting or creative about it.

New X-Men is one of the better X-Books. Has been for some time.

 

[juggster-rules]

ego and slapstick. slapstick looks like some dude off of cartoon network and who keeps up with him. i looked it up and they only made 20 comic books of him. ego the most borin out of all of them. wow a living planet big deal. wtf can he do ?

 

[Vanguard07]

Sins Past

 

[Brainiac 8]

New X-Men is one of the better X-Books. Has been for some time.

Yes it is.

 

[ang_hulk]

I wanna say again-clor

also i just realized bendis=tom burton know why? tims best work is in his own universe,edward sissor hands,ed wood,nbx and so on,hes also done well with never before filmed series,his worst works? stuff other people have done before,there not unbearable but there not anything like they were and often changes are made that just suck,my prime example being planet of the apes.Now bendis has done great work with his own universes and stories that werent really connected but when he jumps into set stories and so on he starts changing things.

 

[Red]

Disassembled

 

[Snikt 6]

New X-Men is one of the better X-Books. Has been for some time.

It sure is, it suprised me how good it was.

 

[Genesis 1.0]

I go on vacation and come back and see this....Internet Immortality

Yes I have a pretty bad opinion or Marvel. It comes from me seeing them misuse their characters because hot creator wants to do so. I pretty much see Marvel throwing throwing crap at the wall hoping something sticks. Series that I got in to became late to the point that I forgot what was going on in the books. I have been collecting comics since I was 16....I have not been to my LCS in 2 months. I blame that on Marvel.
You will experience it too....one day. When the wool is removed and you realize that all is not good at Marvel

Everything's not bad either, which the casual observer might draw from that post. There's always a mix of good and bad at either company, that's a constant. The only deciding factor is if there's more or less piss in your lemon snowcone.

 

[roach]

Everything's not bad either, which the casual observer might draw from that post. There's always a mix of good and bad at either company, that's a constant. The only deciding factor is if there's more or less piss in your lemon snowcone.

well if you look at the words I highlighted the major one being my opinion. Yes Marvel has been doing some good but in MY OPINION they have been doing more stupid than good.