The Dark Knight Might Batman acquire the title "The Dark Knight" in the film?

[7Hells]

you've heard the term "public servant", haven't you? you've heard the cop's mantra "to serve and protect", haven't you? who do you think they are serving and protecting?

So i guess all public servants arent part of the public then. Teachers, fireman, social aid workers. They pay taxes and live there next to the average Joe but they arent the public. I guess they dont vote or buy anything or patronize local businesses either.

your specific example was the escalation business. he most certainly was acting on police business when sharing evidence with Batman.

If he was actng on police business he would have had a swat team there to take Batman down once he showed. Arresting Batman was a direct order from his superiors.

 

[7Hells]

again, not public opinion. a reference, perhaps, but not a presentation of public opinon. certainly not one of mocking or praising. i'm still trying to understand how in the world you got "mockery vs. praise" is a theme of the movie.

appreciation vs mockery is a theme of the movie pertaining to the publics view of Batman.

What im not understanding is how you expect Nolan to address this issue in the future? We both know it needs to continue/happen. What would you consider a representation of public opinion?

 

[Ronny Shade]

The public is an intagible term that refers to those outside of those involved.

Involved in what? Depends.

To filmmakers, the "public" is the potential audience, the community removed from hollywood/moviemaking, so it does not include the actors, directors, grips, gaffers, cinematographers, writers, producers, etc.

To crimefighters, the "public" are the people they are protecting...so government, police and superheroes and their expressed enemies are not the "public"

 

[Mysterio]

So i guess all public servants arent part of the public then. Teachers, fireman, social aid workers. They pay taxes and live there next to the average Joe but they arent the public. I guess they dont vote or buy anything or patronize local businesses either.

again, out of their uniforms and roles, they are; however, when they are acting on their duties of office, they aren't. they are representatives of the government.

If he was actng on police business he would have had a swat team there to take Batman down once he showed. Arresting Batman was a direct order from his superiors.

now that is ridiculous. if he were truly human he would've had to have gone to sleep and taken a piss at some point. we didn't see him do either, therefore DETECTIVE GORDON IS NOT HUMAN!

 

[7Hells]

Thats a ridiculous analogy of my point.
No need to get defensive, call names and mock me.
Unless you really are upset over this discussion and cannot think of anything else but flippant responses to prove your point.

 

[Mysterio]

appreciation vs mockery is a theme of the movie pertaining to the publics view of Batman.

no, it is not. it isn't a theme of the movie at all.

What im not understanding is how you expect Nolan to address this issue in the future?

i don't expect him to address it; i really don't care what the public's opinion is of batman. nor do i think it needs to happen, unless it's integral to the plot and needed to push the story ahead. for example, batman being framed.

 

[Mysterio]

Thats a ridiculous analogy of my point.
No need to get defensive, call names and mock me.

i'm doing no such thing, but we can't go outside of the movie such as you just did. of course it was a ridiculous analogy; it was meant to be. in the movie, gordon is acting in an official capacity, even if he's disobeying his superiors' orders.

you keep changing things around. you said "taste for the theater" as an alleged example. i pointed out that gordon was sharing evidence from a crime scene with batman; he was acting in an official capacity. swat team or no swat team, following orders or not, gordon was still acting in an official capacity and not as an off-duty public citizen.

 

[7Hells]

i'm doing no such thing, but we can't go outside of the movie such as you just did. of course it was a ridiculous analogy; it was meant to be.

Look ive ignored your previous attacks on my intelligence but now its starting to affect your arguments. Which means this discussion will cease to be constructive and no longer be worth continuing. So why dont we leave all that stuff out and get on with it?

in the movie, gordon is acting in an official capacity, even if he's disobeying his superiors' orders.

Gordon cant work with Batman in an official capacity because the only capacity he has officially regarding Batman is to arrest him.
Gordon was acting as a man.

you keep changing things around. you said "taste for the theater" as an alleged example.

I'm not changing things around it is an example. Gordon was mocking Batman by saying that and saying wearing a costume and jumping off rooftops. If you disagree I urge you to watch the scene again and note the sarcasm in the delivery.

But lets get off of the fact you believe all public servants arent actaully the public.
We can agree to disagree.
How about criminals and the people at the hotel?

 

[7Hells]

i don't expect him to address it; i really don't care what the public's opinion is of batman. nor do i think it needs to happen, unless it's integral to the plot and needed to push the story ahead. for example, batman being framed.

Well, we very much disagree on this.
I think public opinion is imperative in a superhero movie. Its the only way we can adjust to the world as the audience. It sets the tone for our hero, what he has to live with and without. It gives us the necessary sympathy for our protaginist and connects us with something bigger than just the main character. I just cant see a superhero movie without public view.
I see the public view as an actual antagonist for the hero, thats how important I think it is.

ps I have to go for a bit

 

[Mysterio]

Gordon cant work with Batman in an official capacity because the only capacity he has officially regarding Batman is to arrest him.
Gordon was acting as a man.

that's a flawed hypothesis. one can still act in an official capacity and disobey orders. i think you should substitute "order" for "capacity" (the only order he has officially regarding...).

I'm not changing things around it is an example. Gordon was mocking Batman by saying that and saying wearing a costume and jumping off rooftops. If you disagree I urge you to watch the scene again and note the sarcasm in the delivery.

he wasn't mocking him in that scene.

But lets get off of the fact you believe all public servants arent actaully the public.

citizens are the public. when a public servant is acting in the role of his office and position, he is not acting as a citizen. there is a line between citizen and police. the police refer to the public as citizens. i'm sure you've even heard the term 'citizen's arrest'.

notice the name of this survey: http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/abstract/cpp99.htm

notice the last line in the opening paragraph:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public

the police, firemen, etc., are all paid out of government coffers.

i've already said that criminals are not the public. they are the antithesis of law, order, and society; they are anti-public.

 

[Ronny Shade]

good god

 

[Cinemaman]

As what I think, police should be this time in good relationship with Batman, because he is their helper.

Besides, at the end of BB we see searchlight on the rooftop, what means that people now know who is their hero.

 

[Mysterio]

ok, back to the point of the thread.

chess piece.

 

[Mr. Vice]

ok, back to the point of the thread.

chess piece.

There's a chess scene in the Dark Knight!? OMG!!

 

[Mysterio]

There's a chess scene in the Dark Knight!? OMG!!

maybe more than just a scene...

The Dark Knight?

​

 

[Ronny Shade]

 

[Mysterio]

i'm telling ya...we're on to something.

 

[7Hells]

Mysterio your second link proves we are both right about public servants being considered the public. I am unsure of why you added the first link.

Gordon isnt just a police officer in Batman. I think we can both agree on that.
His idea of justice obviously goes beyond what his badge and his office allot him. He takes it a step further by breaking the law to create a partnership with a known criminal. If he wanted to make it legal he would take the steps needed to use and list Batman as an informant to the agency. But he isnt doing that, he isnt using Batman as an informant he is using him to serve justice.
Which is his job as a policeman/detective. He is basically switching roles with Batman.
Now Gordon has become the criminal informant.

I know I cant change your mind about whether or not Gordon was mocking Batman in that scene. The sarcasm is there, I cant imagine someone not seeing it but it is art so there will always be opposing interpretations.
I mean, afterall, Batman is "just some nut."

 

[7Hells]

Ronny I shall shave your head for posting that

 

[Cinemaman]

I'd be happy, if there wasn't this s***!

 

[Ronny Shade]

Ronny I shall shave your head for posting that

I couldn't resist

 

[ChrisBaleBatman]

Wow....I've missed alot.....