The Dark Knight Rises Nolan's Batman in the JLA?

[Crook]

Long story short. Batman needs to be in that film. Not only because he is a founding member - the one who joins the league simply because he doesn't trust their power / judgement - but for his own characterization to continue to grow or ... eh hem, "escalate."

This. I'd argue Bats and Supes are the most important members of the group because of what they bring to the JL story. Imagine a movie based on the 'Tower of Babel' concept, or Superman going rogue (due to circumstances he cannot control, of course).

That's geekasm to the fullest with an immense amount of drama and conflict that everyone wants to see happen.

 

[Mr. Earle]

Pssst. Nolan's "Batman" doesn't exist. There is BATMAN. just Batman. A feature film incarnation of a fictional character.

Just as many have said about the Joker coming back in B3 = No one actor is bigger than the role of the Joker. And Chris Nolan, as much as I love the guy, is not bigger than Batman or his mythology. Batman being the rogue so far is what needed to happen. And it works = for now. But after a while, that story is going to get isolated and boring. You need to grow. Have new things happen. And it's either a JLA / WF type movie or we get Robin. Because at some point or another, just like in Kickass, someone is gonna want to get in on the crime fighting thing.

I'm all for another 2-3 Bat-movies of him by himself. But some of his greatest stories come when he stands with... and sometimes against the League. He is still very much a rogue within the group. The devil's advocate. He and Superman agree on one thing, and only one thing = save people's lives. That's it. They disagree on practically everything else. All great films are about conflict. And a JLA film has so much potential to explore the conflicts of differing Superhero ideologies. The way in which things are handled. It's like superhero politics for crying out loud. (Which again - would get old after a while, but I'm pretty sure after 2 or 3 JLA movies they'd either wrap it up or expand out unto other characters.)

Long story short. Batman needs to be in that film. Not only because he is a founding member - the one who joins the league simply because he doesn't trust their power / judgement - but for his own characterization to continue to grow or ... eh hem, "escalate."

"Oh he doesn't work within that world...." blah blah blah.

THESE ARE FICTIONAL CHARACTERS.

FICTIONAL CHARACTERS.

The rules are whatever the writer / directors decide to make. If Nolan wants Batman to stay out of the JLA - hey, guess what my friend? Don't call it quits the franchise after "your trilogy."

Done and done.

This is Anjow. You are welcome for your weekly pwnage.

- Jow

PS: Jett sucks. That is all.

Good post mate!

 

[Rumpy Bulge Dubz]

People who dont like or arent familiar with the JL can watch the JL animated series that was produced by the same team that gave us BTAS, STAS and Batman Beyond. In fact many fans (including me) consider JL to be the better series of them all. If you are a fan of any of its members, you should watch JL because all of them get a chance to shine.

just got done running through the entire series and want to run through it again, it's an excellent show

 

[3atman]

I don't even like the idea of Batman the character, a guy who is independent and driven, dark, grounded in realism in such a fantastic and colorful world of the JLA. It's a stupid idea for him to be in the JLA, much less Nolan's Batman. Watch those "superman meets Batman" movies to see how stupid of an idea it is to include Batman in a super natural world.

 

[firstclassclown]

I could see nolans batman in jla but not as the leader of the group. I see him as the rogue. raphael in tmnt or sawyer in lost. JMO

 

[Rumpy Bulge Dubz]

I don't even like the idea of Batman the character, a guy who is independent and driven, dark, grounded in realism in such a fantastic and colorful world of the JLA. It's a stupid idea for him to be in the JLA, much less Nolan's Batman. Watch those "superman meets Batman" movies to see how stupid of an idea it is to include Batman in a super natural world.

what Superman meets Batman movies do you speak of?

I am unaware of these

 

[Mr. Earle]

I don't even like the idea of Batman the character, a guy who is independent and driven, dark, grounded in realism in such a fantastic and colorful world of the JLA. It's a stupid idea for him to be in the JLA, much less Nolan's Batman. Watch those "superman meets Batman" movies to see how stupid of an idea it is to include Batman in a super natural world.

You best be trolling! You know that Poison Ivy controls plants telepathetically, Clayface is... well made of clay, Ras uses magic ponds to stay alive for centuries, and Freeze is a dude that needs sub zero temperatures to survive right?

 

[3atman]

Batman the character is grounded in realism. I HATE clayface and all the other supernatural characters. I don't mind Ivy or Freeze when toned down. I just can't see Batman going "o yea superman, this is how my memorycloth works" then supes going "o....I can fly....because uh.....well....I just can"

and here's the batman meets superman
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FywMOuMqNuI

 

[Mr. Earle]

Batman the character is grounded in realism. I HATE clayface and all the other supernatural characters. I don't mind Ivy or Freeze when toned down. I just can't see Batman going "o yea superman, this is how my memorycloth works" then supes going "o....I can fly....because uh.....well....I just can"

and here's the batman meets superman
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FywMOuMqNuI

Christopher Nolan its you, isnt it?

 

[Rumpy Bulge Dubz]

pssst. Nolan's "batman" doesn't exist. There is batman. Just batman. A feature film incarnation of a fictional character.

Just as many have said about the joker coming back in b3 = no one actor is bigger than the role of the joker. And chris nolan, as much as i love the guy, is not bigger than batman or his mythology. Batman being the rogue so far is what needed to happen. And it works = for now. But after a while, that story is going to get isolated and boring. You need to grow. Have new things happen. And it's either a jla / wf type movie or we get robin. Because at some point or another, just like in kickass, someone is gonna want to get in on the crime fighting thing.

I'm all for another 2-3 bat-movies of him by himself. But some of his greatest stories come when he stands with... And sometimes against the league. He is still very much a rogue within the group. The devil's advocate. He and superman agree on one thing, and only one thing = save people's lives. That's it. They disagree on practically everything else. All great films are about conflict. And a jla film has so much potential to explore the conflicts of differing superhero ideologies. The way in which things are handled. It's like superhero politics for crying out loud. (which again - would get old after a while, but i'm pretty sure after 2 or 3 jla movies they'd either wrap it up or expand out unto other characters.)

long story short. Batman needs to be in that film. Not only because he is a founding member - the one who joins the league simply because he doesn't trust their power / judgement - but for his own characterization to continue to grow or ... Eh hem, "escalate."

"oh he doesn't work within that world...." blah blah blah.

These are fictional characters.

Fictional characters.

The rules are whatever the writer / directors decide to make. If nolan wants batman to stay out of the jla - hey, guess what my friend? Don't call it quits the franchise after "your trilogy."

done and done.

This is anjow. You are welcome for your weekly pwnage.

- jow

ps: Jett sucks. That is all.

:d

qft

 

[3atman]

Yea, it is a fictional world, but you can't go crazy and take liberties. You create a reality, if you stray from that, it takes people out of their suspension of disbelief. Batman has a logical and plausible explanation for most things he does (as I said earlier, except for the stuff like clayface, which I don't like because it takes me out of the realm). When you bring Superman and Green Lantern into it, it gets laughable. Like I said, how silly would it be to have Batman, after explaining how all his gadgets work, Green Lantern uses his ring to do anything he wants, Flash runs around the world 10 times, and Superman lifts a continent? Not only that, but it's not even Batman's personality to work WITH other heroes. If he were a rougue with a bit more ridiculous gadgets that weren't explained, that just "were" (as in, a more sci fi universe) then I'd be ok with it.

Bale wouldn't be in this movie I'm guessing, so if Batman were recast, and his universe were retold as a more fantasy universe, then I could see it.

 

[Crook]

The "stuff like Clayface" is found in roughly over half the material Batman is in.

Taking into account that mainstream doesn't give a damn about realism, and how they're so accustomed to associate Batman with the likes of Supes and the Justice League, the fans are the only real concern here.

 

[Blitzkrieg Bop]

Why don't they just not acknowledge the Nolan movies?

 

[Mr. Earle]

Not only that, but it's not even Batman's personality to work WITH other heroes.

Five Robins, three Batgirls, Nightwing and Oracle will disagree with you. And that's just the bat-family. Then its the JL, the Outsiders who he frequently trains, etc...

The "stuff like Clayface" is found in roughly over half the material Batman is in.

Taking into account that mainstream doesn't give a damn about realism, and how they're so accustomed to associate Batman with the likes of Supes and the Justice League, the fans are the only real concern here.

I think its the mainstream audience that could pose a problem. Us fans know about Batman's flexibility, but if they make a more unrealistic Batman film the general audience could interpret that as another Schumacher movie.

 

[3atman]

Five Robins, three Batgirls, Nightwing and Oracle will disagree with you. And that's just the bat-family. Then its the JL, the Outsiders who he frequently trains, etc...

I emphasized WITH for a reason. He's ok with people under him.

I'm ok with a more fantasty oriented Batman, but the question is "Nolan's Batman" no, Nolan's Batman explains things, so a fantasy unexplainable world would totally be out of the realm. Batman in general, yea, it'd work.

 

[petey]

I dont get why so many people are so obsessed with the realism. Bats faces off with unrealistic foes and teams with superpowered heroes all the time. part of the heroic nature of Batman is that imo he goes toe to toe with things that would make other humans wet themselves. he's a man who sees a threat he takes it out. But even he knows sometimes you need to more than he is to take out the threat. so he could work in a JL movie, just dont camp him up. Instead of "Hey supes how's metropolis" he's more like "You got what I need to get the job done."

 

[3atman]

I don't necessarily have a problem with him against supernatural villains, it's that in the reality Nolan has created it would be out of place. You can't explain how everything works then have supernatural stuff happen.

On of the most badass things in Batman comic history was with supernatural stuff. I don't remember exactly, but aliens came down and basically beat down the whole justice league, but paid less attention to Bats, Supes says something like "you're making a mistake, he's the most dangerous being on this planet" Bats saves the entire JLA by exterminating the aliens.

In that sort of instance, it works, but you CAN'T spend 2 (likely 3) movies carefully explaining things to make them plausible then suddenly people are flying all over and blowing stuff up.

Like I said, new actor, new director, new look, yea, it'd work, because you'd create a realm that it's plausible in.

 

[Crook]

I don't necessarily have a problem with him against supernatural villains, it's that in the reality Nolan has created it would be out of place. You can't explain how everything works then have supernatural stuff happen.

On of the most badass things in Batman comic history was with supernatural stuff. I don't remember exactly, but aliens came down and basically beat down the whole justice league, but paid less attention to Bats, Supes says something like "you're making a mistake, he's the most dangerous being on this planet" Bats saves the entire JLA by exterminating the aliens.

In that sort of instance, it works, but you CAN'T spend 2 (likely 3) movies carefully explaining things to make them plausible then suddenly people are flying all over and blowing stuff up.

Like I said, new actor, new director, new look, yea, it'd work, because you'd create a realm that it's plausible in.

Just a hypothetical scenario here: but what if he does? It's a lot more probable now than it was before since Nolan took it upon himself to spearhead SUPERMAN, of all people. So...what if he does?

I'm genuinely curious because this isn't the first time fans have proclaimed this-and-that based on what they thought they knew of Nolan's "world". Since it's his creation, can he really betray himself with whatever creative decision he makes?

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

Okay where do I start?

I will start by saying that I cannot see Christian Bale as Batman in a Justice League film. Thats not gonna happen.

With that said, Batman will still be in a JL film.

Its already known that Batman 3 will be Nolan's last Batman film, so it will most likely be Bale's too. Time to recast!

DC will end up getting a director who (hopefully like Nolan) understands the roots of the character, but (unlike Nolan, a Bruce Timm-like figure) will be willing to have Batman in the JL. Maybe they can also bring in a more fantastical view. People may think its too late to do that, but it definitely isn't. I don't think Nolan isn't putting himself in a corner. He's creating the best Batman stories he can make. If he wants, Nolan can get more fantastical if his story calls for it. Many things Joker does were out of the ordinary so who says things can't get more out of the ordinary? One of Nolan's themes is escalation.

Plus, there won't be huge references to JL like Marvel. We're talking about just a small name drop here. I'm sure than none of us will be phased if we see on the tv in a Batman film about a "flying man in Metropolis" for about 5 seconds. There. Thats the only reference that would be in a Batman film. Nothing else. Its not hurting anyone and it won't ruin the world Nolan set up and it won't ruining my viewing experience for a film. The character will be aware of each others existence, but won't interact at all until a JL film.

I mean everyone is taking Nolan's "realism" out of context. The people won't care about a more fantasy oriented Batman if done right. The keywords: if done right (I'm looking at you Schumacher with Burton at the corner of my eye haha). I don't care if its animated, but Batman the animated series is a perfect example. If it was live action, there wouldn't be much of a difference. That should be the way they evolve things.

You wouldn't be breaking suspension of disbelief, but expanding it slowly.

What I'm basically saying is even though by the time JL rolls by the Batman series will be with a new regime, who says Nolan won't try to push it even more if it makes for a better and more entertaining story? I can see it as a possibility (but not absolute reality).

Batman shouldn't be put in this box because if he's always the absolute only superhero around all the time in the films, you are severely limiting yourself to make great story.

EDIT: Plus the way DC described it was:

BB = Action Comics #1
TDK = Action Comics #2
GL = Action Comics #3

Which means DC's films will be standalone anyway with maybe 1 or 2 small 5 second references. I don't see that as a problem at all. I can easily believe that Superman's in Metropolis in Nolan's Batman films without me ruining the experience of this film.

 

[blackjedi]

What you wrote Parker Wayne:
"EDIT: Plus the way DC described it was:

BB = Action Comics #1
TDK = Action Comics #2
GL = Action Comics #3"

So is that DC's definite plans? I read that article also from an 'source'. If so, then that will be fine.

I also agree that people are taking Nolan and his 'vision' and his 'nolanverse' to seriously. They are acting like he created Batman himself. But I do hope they somehow incorporate this current movie Batman into an shared universe in a believable way that will awe movie goers and comic fans alike.

 

[GL1]

Nolan's Batman is designed to work in a vacuum. He is designed to be the ultimate force in his universe. When we put Nolan's Batman alongside Superman, or Flash, or even just outside of the reference point of Gotham City, he becomes fallible, and in some ways, just plain wrong. He is no longer the moral epitome of manhood, he's just a guy looking out for his city, doing the best he can with what he's got. He is no longer the morally superior response to an irredeemably corrupted world. He's definitely not the smartest or most resourceful guy in the room, neither is he the most intimidating factor as it's all just a mask that any seasoned warrior can see through. I've said it a few times too many, but Nolan's Batman is the Nietzsche Superman. That's why he can't hang out with Superman, because the instant someone who is incorruptible shows up, Nolan's Batman loses its relevance. Nolan's Batman doesn't work in the JLA because he wasn't designed to thematically, not because he's "too realistic." It's because he's not really very Batman-like. Nolan's Batman is also Bale's Batman, btw, so you get both or neither.

The Batman featured in the JLA will almost certainly make heavy nods to Begins, especially in visuals, and maybe in continuity, but I suspect he'll have to play a more guest-like role, unless they make the movie excessively cartoony, which I doubt they will. He'll have to do the detective and resourceful and insightful thing he does in comics (which he does not do in the films), which will make him, in many ways, a different character. He'll also have to lose his everyman persona, which doesn't fit any other characterization of Batman I've seen besides Nolan's.

In short, he'll have to step up his game and become a fallible ubermensch, one that eschews moral superiority in order to become effective beyond human capability. He'll of course still be morally defensible, but he'll no longer be the biggest arsenal in the room.