Comics Official ASTONISHING X-MEN Discussion Thread

[Havok83]

Cyke wasn't co-leader of an entire freakin' country.

It was still wrong of him then, as written, but 'Ro shouldn't be playing hero now. How do you think people would react if Bush or any other world leaders acted like that? They complain about him taking too many vacations as it is.

well I dont look at it that way bc Black Panther is the ruler of Wakanda. Its his responsibility to lead it. Storm is his wife, but I dont place that all on her shoulders. Besides, BP has been hero, having several stints as an Avenger outside of his own country. He just had a recent stint as a member of the FF, complete with adventures in space. Storm is following his lead and if its okay for him, then it shouldnt be an issue for her. I didnt even think this was really much of an issue.

 

[Brand]

well I dont look at it that way bc Black Panther is the ruler of Wakanda. Its his responsibility to lead it. Storm is his wife, but I dont place that all on her shoulders. Besides, BP has been hero, having several stints as an Avenger outside of his own country. He just had a recent stint as a member of the FF, complete with adventures in space. Storm is following his lead and if its okay for him, then it shouldnt be an issue for her. I didnt even think this was really much of an issue.

I hear all the time about Storm being the "Queen" of Wakanda or whatever and how she should be more than BP's sidekick. That's great. I agree.

However, that also means that Ororo's primary responsibilities are no longer focused on the X-Men (at least, they shouldn't be). Just because she doesn't make all of the decisions doesn't mean she doesn't have some other role to play--it would be a bit odd if she served no purpose at all in the government, even if it was just as a figurehead. That responsibility to Wakanda would cause a conflict if Storm seriously wanted to take up leadership in the X-Men again--she could be called away at any time to take up her duties at home, whatever those may be. Heck, Cyke even made a comment about a possible war between Wakanda and another country (Zimbabwe, perhaps; I'll have to check again) and Storm's hypothetical decisions, so it's obvious she has some measure of responsibility in the government. I don't know that Marvel has ever specifically stated just how the government works there, especially with BP gone all the time.

As for BP, I don't think it's right for him to leave his people all the time, either, but that's comics for ya. Realistically, it's a crap thing to do (just ask Bush--he gets jumped on just for taking vacations), but it doesn't have quite the impact of "left his wife and baby" so people don't get as upset. That doesn't mean it's any less of a shirking of responsibility.

 

[Manic]

Ro is a Queen Consort. Royal consorts rarely have any actual power.

 

[Hyperion1320]

Yeah, walking out on your wife(who you only married to fulfill your own selfish desires to be with your "dead" ex-girlfriend) and newborn child is no where close to not making appearances in the royal court of your newly married-into country. Wakanda is an ancient, elder-ruled, divinely protected land. Its not like the power mongering that happens in the over-inflated beaurocracy we call a government in the States.

As Queen, she serves a symbolic role in the lives of the people of Wakanda, not a clerical one. In other words, she's not playing 'hookie' by leading a humanitarian outreach/ international emergency-response squad responsible for saving a violently oppressed and endangered species. She's a warrior-goddess-queen, in the vein of Hatchepshut or Oya. And she's about to destroy an alien invasion force and free her people. I don't think they have any point of contention with their new Queen.

Cyclops, on the other hand, is a *****e-bag, who in his attempts to save an endangered species, brings them together in one area and boinks his plastic, [formerly] dementedly-villianous girlfriend while they die off/get beaten to pulp in nice groups of busloads or twos and threes, depending on the day.

Some leader.

I say Storm is the better leader for mutantkind.

She actually has politcal power in the world, as the only mutant head of state(outside of the besieged Inhumans and dispersed Atlanteans), she can make mutant rights an international issue.

She has the resources of the most technologically advanced and one of the richest countries in the world at her fingertips. Warren is loaded, but he can't compete with Wakanda.

I beseech the writers to make wise descions here and now, and let the stories be written, let Storm free her people from imminent catastrophe.

She's been in the business of saving people from desparate situations since she was 12.

She can do it.

 

[UraniaChang]

I never saw anything spectacular in Storm's 'leading' ability, she was just given that place because Claremont had hots for her when he run the X-books, like he does now for Dazzler, or any other females he's interested in these days. Most of Storm characteristics (if there're any substantial ones) are conveniently made or exagrrated by most of her fans who can't even accept the fact that she isn't as 'perfect' as they like to pretend.

Besides, she already has enough titles, warrior, queen, Goddess whatever, for only one head, they should be enough to keep Storm fans happy, and keep her away from us who aren't fans of her.

I've always just been kinda pissed at the concept of Cyclops walking out on his family. It makes him look like a complete ass hat. His decision to assemble a team a few months ago to kill part of said family is just...

Let's just say Cyclops is a candidate for "Worst Superhero Father/Husband."

Well, how many superheroes out there that have to face a realistic situation in a relationship like him? Women are the key factors in a relationship, there are women who handle the same situation like his maturely and gracefully in my country, unlike Maydelyn (that's why I never have too much sympathy for her), so as far as I'm concerned, I can understand how Scott made those mistakes (even if he stayed with Madelyne their marriage still wouldn't work, not for long anyway) and that make him real, not just like other characters have plain character settings, meaning with all 'good' qualities, but no reasonable flaws.

 

[Brand]

Ro is a Queen Consort. Royal consorts rarely have any actual power.

As I said above, she may not be calling the shots. That doesn't mean she couldn't be doing something about the potential war her people face or any of the other issues in Wakanda at the moment. I'm sure Wakanda would win easily, but people would still die. If the intervention of someone with Ororo's power--and, yes, maybe even her social ability--could prevent those deaths...I don't see how anyone could argue for her presence in SF. At least, not unless the person is okay with Scott leaving Maddie and Nate to check on Jean. Heck, at least he wasn't leaving people to DIE.

But a comic where 'Ro plays peacekeeper wouldn't exactly be a big seller, so we get her in SF with the AXM team. And since she hasn't left a wife and baby behind, that's just fine with everyone. Though a comic where 'Ro has a wife and baby . . . now that has possibilities . . .

 

[UraniaChang]

You know, there's no way she would get a baby, nothing substantial will come off her
meaningless marriage.

 

[Brand]

You know, there's no way she would get a baby, nothing substantial will come off her
meaningless marriage.

Actually, if my memory hasn't failed me, I remember reading somewhere that the Watcher had said Storm and BP's children would have a great destiny or something. I think this occurred back when Marvel was trying to really push the marriage as hard as they could, but I doubt it's been forgotten.

Ororo, Emma . . . something tells me all of the main X-Women are gonna find themselves about nine months pregnant right when the next big world-sized threat comes along and they'll have to sit it out.

 

[Hotaru]

Actually, if my memory hasn't failed me, I remember reading somewhere that the Watcher had said Storm and BP's children would have a great destiny or something.

It was Hudlin's script and if Marvel has any brains left, they will eventually forget everything the guy has written. So don't hold your breath.

 

[El Bastardo]

Storm sucks.

SRSLY.

 

[Brainiac 8]

 

[DarthCyclopsRLZ]

Storm couldn't even be bothered to care about her alleged soul sister's resurrection. Some friend.

And people wonder why Jean never seriously considered switching teams ('Ro) or Logan being a viable option.

ZING.

 

[chris moore]

Bianchi's panel layouts are really starting to bug me for some reason

 

[stormwatcher]

goddes!!!!
all this ororo and scott bashing.

i didn't care for scott walking out on his wife.
but i've always looked at him like this.
i dislike scott summer's
but cyclops of the x-men he's all right.

what ticks me about the wedding with T'challa and ororo is that t'challa kept all his responsbility, but ororo has to give up her's.

the future bady thing with the watcher was the FF writer not hudlin

 

[Hotaru]

the future bady thing with the watcher was the FF writer not hudlin

Hudlin and McDuffie were cooperating on their F4 scripts. Hudlin simply has written Watcher's appearence during the wedding, and then asked McDuffie to tease it further while they were visiting Uatu on the pages of F4.

 

[Brand]

Storm sucks.

Of course she does. Just look at those lips . . .

 

[Manic]

Well, how many superheroes out there that have to face a realistic situation in a relationship like him? Women are the key factors in a relationship, there are women who handle the same situation like his maturely and gracefully in my country, unlike Maydelyn (that's why I never have too much sympathy for her), so as far as I'm concerned, I can understand how Scott made those mistakes (even if he stayed with Madelyne their marriage still wouldn't work, not for long anyway) and that make him real, not just like other characters have plain character settings, meaning with all 'good' qualities, but no reasonable flaws.

I get that his relationship with Maddy wasn't working, but there's a significant difference between "I think we need a divorce" and "I'm leaving you to check on my ex-girlfriend and I'm not going to come home until I eventually tell her I'm married a few months down the line and she practically forces me to try to contact you."

As I said above, she may not be calling the shots. That doesn't mean she couldn't be doing something about the potential war her people face or any of the other issues in Wakanda at the moment. I'm sure Wakanda would win easily, but people would still die. If the intervention of someone with Ororo's power--and, yes, maybe even her social ability--could prevent those deaths...I don't see how anyone could argue for her presence in SF. At least, not unless the person is okay with Scott leaving Maddie and Nate to check on Jean. Heck, at least he wasn't leaving people to DIE.

Actually, as soon as he left Madelyne and Nathan, Sinister kidnapped them, kept Nathan for himself, and dumped Mads after wiping her records and making it look like she never existed. So no, Scott didn't leave anyone to die. He left them to suffer.

Also, I'm not keeping up with Black Panther's comic. What war are we talking about?

 

[Brand]

I get that his relationship with Maddy wasn't working, but there's a significant difference between "I think we need a divorce" and "I'm leaving you to check on my ex-girlfriend and I'm not going to come home until I eventually tell her I'm married a few months down the line and she practically forces me to try to contact you."

Thus the "dick move" comment from Darth earlier. I don't think you'll find any who would say otherwise.

Actually, as soon as he left Madelyne and Nathan, Sinister kidnapped them, kept Nathan for himself, and dumped Mads after wiping her records and making it look like she never existed. So no, Scott didn't leave anyone to die. He left them to suffer.

But Scott didn't KNOW that his wife and child were in trouble--he thought they were perfectly safe and sound at home. Storm should be aware that there are other things she can do to help Wakanda.

Also, I'm not keeping up with Black Panther's comic. What war are we talking about?

It's a potential war with some other African country. I don't read BP, either, and I honestly doubt that an actual war will occur; something tells me Marvel won't want to mess with something like that. The info came from the latest issue of AXM. Cyke put up a hypothetical scenario where war broke out to Ororo--which he said was actually likely, and he should know 'cuz he reads the papers--and said she would have to sign the declaration of war since she was Queen. She said she would find another way and not be responsible for all the deaths. That made me wonder why she was with the X-Men and not trying to avert such a war in the first place.

 

[Brainiac 8]

The reason she isn't in Wakanda and with the X-Men is that she realizes how stupid her marriage to BP was, just like everyone else.

 

[nikbackm]

Black Panther already took care of the war on his own. Ok, he had some small help from his army and Monica Rambeau (Captain Marvel/Pulsar). Seemed some of the Wacandans would have preferred her as their Queen.

 

[Varient]

I wish Storm had never run off w/ BP. She feels like such a stranger to the X-Men now :

Meh.
I disagree. She needed Change and Validation. This works - Now if we could just get past the Hudlin Hate for Hudlin's sake that is riding on momentum,...

I kept hoping she'd be reveal to be a skrull, but...nooo.

Case -

That'd be great and make a lot of sense.

- In

IA. It would be something a skrull would do as placing her as queen of Wakanda as well as member of the Fantastic Four gave her alot of power and positioned her in a good place to help with their invasion

- Point,....
Wishing she were a skrull to invalidate the Marriage? SIGH.

that's true manic.

but she's the only other x-men to lead just as long and good as scott.

but you do make fine point.


justabill calm down i dont see nothing here that was said that should make you upset


i love her and T'challa being together their perfect for one another.
the best i've seen so far since reed and sue and peter/mj-
the wedding was just rushed and BP could use another writer.

Marvel has a bad habit of not having many married SuperHeroes but lots of disfunctional ****s,.. both Male and Female.
As a "Stick in the mud" I WANT a few stable relationships in the Marvel Universe.

Not to mention the fact that Storm was both chosen by Xavier to lead the X-Men after his departure after the Phoenix saga, and challenged and defeated Cyclops when he wanted to come back into the fold and take leadership again. None of those other characters listed did anything close to that.

What I also find very irritating about the current push with Cyclops is his decision to use lethal force is somehow seen as revolutionary when Storm has cut a b!tch in her day, not to mention a searing moment that comes to mind when she killed that demon in the Inferno, and Cyclops was like "Storm! We don't kill, do you think you're judge, jury and exocutioner?" and Storm looks deadpan at him and says, "Yes, I am."

Storm was bad@ss decades before Scott was allowed to grow some nuts. I think its ridiculous that now that they're in a book together again, Storm is relagated to some pawning simpleton wishing for the 'good ole days' while General Cyclops leads mutants into oblivion.

Foolish Marvel, running around in circles like a chicken with its head cut off.

I saw it as Ororo being Bored with Stability after running with the X-men. You have to admit that Wakanda Doesn't have the issues the X-men have because the Panther has been written on Prep time since his intro in Fantastic Four - way before Batman got his first Kyrptonite ring. As such,... the stuff that falls thru the cracks requiring her will almost always be small potatoes.

The X-men are probably a vacation from normalacy for her.

well times have changed and Cyclops is adapting.

I guess what is frustrating for all fans is the disregard for past events by present writers. I guess some of it is necessary because with all of the history the characters would seem quite old. I guess that's why DC reboots and changes heroes every so often to avoid this issue. But at the same time some blatant disregards just seem surprising. I mean Storm questioning Scott's decision is somewhat weird...but was Storm effected by Inferno's aura so to speak which made her a darker character then? And how much did the Siege Perilous reboot everything? (Or was this a moment of sarcasm between Storm and Cyclops to some degree due to the obvious role reversal.) I don't know as I really haven't read every comic in X history but it is a shame that its writers seem to know less about the x mythos than some of its more general fans.

Also, these fluctuations in power are interesting. Storm not being able to lift Wolverine but being able to blow the Hulk around on multiple occasions? Strange....However, I guess for the writers its about making the story work more so than continuity and sometimes to make the story work certain things have to take place. (In the original X Men cartoon series how many times were Jean and Storm taken out early despite being clearly two of the more powerful members of the team. And despite having only claws and a healing factor...Wolverine appears to be fine competition for even Superman these days LOL!)

No doubt.

In order to write Stories,.. Ororo and Jean were nerfed regularly. Currently someone is dropping her power levels for reasons unknown,... of course she could be pregnant,....

V.

 

[El Bastardo]

And if only we could stop butchering grammar by putting ellipses after commas.

SIGH.

 

[AndThePickles]

The reason she isn't in Wakanda and with the X-Men is that she realizes how stupid her marriage to BP was, just like everyone else.

I'm all for married couples in the X-world, but Storm and BP just felt forced. Not a fan

 

[Varient]

And if only we could stop butchering grammar by putting ellipses after commas.

SIGH.

Meh.

Does it REALLY bother you that much?

I see poor grammar on here everyday, and understand that a person SHOULD be able to relax and type at speed w/o worry or concern that they would be misunderstood.

Esp in a media like comic books where grammar is usually written as spoken.

V.

 

[Manic]

I'm all for married couples in the X-world, but Storm and BP just felt forced. Not a fan

It was especially forced because the whole Storm/Black Panther wedding thing was being promoted right about the time Claremont had Storm dating Wolverine.