Comics Oh, Come On!!!!

[Cullen]

morlun is out of his fighting range, technically so should electro but that is a personality trait of maxwell that comes into play.

i personally think spidey should remain in a range where cap could take him on a good day when he's off his game, i mean he's only in a 10 ton weight class, he comes across as the ultimate fighting machine at times.

him and his ultimate ego need to be grounded big time...it's as if they have no equals in physical combat.

I'm not quite sure you're reading the same comics everyone else is...

 

[diespinne]

ABOUT TIME?

He's been getting his ass kicked in for YEARS.

Yeah... take issue 197 for instance...

For years and years and years!!! GUHHH... The issue right before this one, he gets captured and beat-up by two of Kingpin's regular thugs, and this issue features Spidey getting nearly killed by the Kingpin.

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

Look at the page with Spider-Man falling through the glass; His costume is intact.

On the next page, "fourteen operatives" are ordered to assist in capturing Spider-Man. Several of them, such as Gargan, Atlas, and Taskmaster, have beaten Peter by themselves in the past.

On the NEXT page, we see Spidey again, only now his costume is in tatters.

It was clearly obvious to ME that we got the abridged version of Peter vs an army of super-psychos (with details to follow in the next issue of ASM), probably in teams of two, with Jester & Jack being last.

Also; SHIELD uses high-powered weapons, which is why the window shattered.

Anyway; awesome issue! I cheered when Punisher showed up and blew those two maniacs away!

Excellent chapter to an excellent story, in my humble opinion.

 

[Doc Destruction]

The scales were tipped a little further in Spidey's direction back then.

 

[Genixx]

personally, i think every hero needs to get his ass handed to him every once in a while. makes them more 'human' IMHO. having them get beat..then come back for the win later adds to their interst. allows them to learn and grow..and whoop the baddies asses later

 

[The Bruce]

Didn't Jester get an insane power-up in a recent Bendis DD?

 

[MyDixieWrecked]

I bet Peter starts feeling like garbage after losing to two clowns, even though I like Jack. then he starts getting into a mental mindframe and wants to go back to the black suit for its power, even though it's not the symbiote, hell still think about his win whoop ass ratio in the black suit. I dunno, just a thought.

 

[Grim Goblin]

This is so stupid. Unless there's been one HELL of a fight off-panel, No way does Spidey lose to those two punks.

And even then, if Marvel does explain it away in ASM that he indeed fought off a lot of A-listers, it still going to end up feeling dumb to me. I mean, you have important stuff happening off-panel in THE MAIN TITLE of the whole event! Granted those that want to know what really happened will buy ASM but until that comes out, or for those who won't get the other titles, the story remains half-told because Marvel wanted to spread it around(great marketing trick, but damn if it stinks up the story) .

Newsflash Marvel: Try to be consistant in one ****ing title on a regular basis and THEN, maybe you can begin to think of spreading the story around.

 

[VuMania]

The Jester and Jack O Lantern huh? So Spidey is getting his Ass handed to him by a Marvel's weak version of the Joker and a mercenary with a flaming head and a hyped up pogo stick.

Aw well, Spidey has had his ups and downs before (of course the storylines in thr past were interesting regardless). Hopefully, Spidey will get a creative team soon who can appreciate continuity in the Spidey titles. I'm in agreement with the rest of you in saying that it would be nice to read a Spider-Man story where he's at his best (physcially and mentally).

At this rate, I wouldn't be surprise to see Anna Watson lay a beat down on Spidey.

 

[diespinne]

The scales were tipped a little further in Spidey's direction back then.

That's true, but that particular issue and the one before really bugged me, though... it was tough seeing Spidey get beat-up by two regular thugs, then get dumped in front of the Kingpin only to get beat-up some more and barely survive, not because of his own abilities/resolve, but because Kingpin's wife steps-in at the last minute and convinces him not to kill Spidey. Man...

So, what are some other really embarassing/disturbing Spidey defeats that everyone remembers throughout his history?

 

[shinlyle]

The Jester and Jack O Lantern huh? So Spidey is getting his Ass handed to him by a Marvel's weak version of the Joker and a mercenary with a flaming head and a hyped up pogo stick.

Aw well, Spidey has had his ups and downs before (of course the storylines in thr past were interesting regardless). Hopefully, Spidey will get a creative team soon who can appreciate continuity in the Spidey titles. I'm in agreement with the rest of you in saying that it would be nice to read a Spider-Man story where he's at his best (physcially and mentally).

At this rate, I wouldn't be surprise to see Anna Watson lay a beat down on Spidey.

Dude....don't give Marvel any more ideas. I'm now expecting Anna to give Peter and Mj up to SHIELD ala "Oh, Brother, Where Art Thou".

Peter: You Judas, Iscariot, Watson!!!

Anna: Sorry, Peter....I know we's is kin, but we got this here recession going on....

(waits for the three people who know that movie to get the joke...)

 

[Doc Destruction]

I got it

 

[shinlyle]

I got it

Bless you....you are a true friend, Doc!

 

[Themanofbat]

Yeah... take issue 197 for instance...

For years and years and years!!! GUHHH... The issue right before this one, he gets captured and beat-up by two of Kingpin's regular thugs, and this issue features Spidey getting nearly killed by the Kingpin.

Man, that was the BEST Kingpin/Spidey clash ever told...

And don't forget, Spidey had a broken arm in a sling...

 

[Themanofbat]

Look at the page with Spider-Man falling through the glass; His costume is intact.

On the next page, "fourteen operatives" are ordered to assist in capturing Spider-Man. Several of them, such as Gargan, Atlas, and Taskmaster, have beaten Peter by themselves in the past.

On the NEXT page, we see Spidey again, only now his costume is in tatters.

It was clearly obvious to ME that we got the abridged version of Peter vs an army of super-psychos (with details to follow in the next issue of ASM), probably in teams of two, with Jester & Jack being last.

Also; SHIELD uses high-powered weapons, which is why the window shattered.

Anyway; awesome issue! I cheered when Punisher showed up and blew those two maniacs away!

Excellent chapter to an excellent story, in my humble opinion.

I feel the same way... there was a LOT of action that we didn't see, which I'm sure we'll see in next week's ASM, but people like to biaatch about anything these days...

 

[Ultra-Spidey]

Why the hell can't Spidey break the glass window in Stark's tower? If bullets can, then why not Spidey? Also, didn't Spidey PUNCH Wolverine threw the glass window months ago?

This makes no sense...

When did this Spidey and Wolvie fight happen??? The one I remember ended when Wolvie stabs Spidey and then passes out from blood loss?!?!?!?!

 

[HoratioRome]

THis is KILLING me...KILLING me.
Someone's got to put a stop to this.

What the HELL is going on?
Why are they doing this to a FLAGSHIP character?

I am so freaking full of anger.

and to read the lame ass "fans" talking about "bumping him down", or defending this crap.

I don't know which is worst. QEusada raping spidey or the so called fans accepting the rape.

GET IT STRAIGHT PEOPLE. SPIDER-MAN IS THE FLAGSHIP HERO OF THE MU. DO YOU KNOW WHAT THAT MEANS? SPIDER-MAN IS THE BEST AT WHAT HE DOES.
THE POUND FOR POUND BEST HERO OF THE MU.
HE LIFTS 10 TONS,..DO YOU KNOW WHAT THAT MEANS? IT MEANS CAP WOLVERINE, DD, ETC. COULDN'T HOPE TO BE IN HIS CLASS. THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN SPIDEY AND CAP IS GREATER THAN THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN HULK AND SPIDER-MAN. WOULD BE BE OK TO HAVE SPIDEY KNOCK HULK AROUND LIKE A RAG DOLL?
NOT TO MENTION SPIDEY'S SPEED WHICH IS WAY MORE THAN THOSE GUYS, PLUS HIS SPIDEY SENSE.

YOU "FANS" ARE EITHER AS STUPID AS QUESADA AND HIS CRONIES
OR THE DESTRUCTION OF SM HAS WORKED TO THE POINT WHERE YOU THINK HE IS THE BUM THEY'VE MADE HIM OUT TO BE.

THIS IS CRAPPP

 

[SpideyInATree]

I love the people who think we who hate this lame excuse for a comic are over-reacting. It just really brings out the people with zero taste and blind loyalty.

A crappy book is a crappy book, no matter how much you try to polish it.

But there are some people who are overreacting. Amazing Spider-Man # 536 didn't even come out yet. If you've noticed Civil War sets things up and ASM goes into much further detail to fill in the blanks.

As CaptainStacy, a fine poster on this board, pointed out...that when falling through the window his suit was intact. Then when we go back to Spidey later in the ish...it looks like he got caught in a meat grinder.

So, yeah, it's overreaction when it's obvious we, the readers, don't have the full story. It seems the so called "real Spider-Man fans" certainly seem to find anything they can to complain about ANYTHING.

The only thing that I can say is justified in plethora of moaning is that Spider-Man and Iron Man didn't exactly get to have the insane throw down that we were all expecting. And I doubt that's going to get dealt with in ASM because Civil War # 5 picked up from the end of ASM # 535. THAT I can understand because that peeved me off.

But COME ON look who is writing Civil War. Mark F'n Millar. The guy who wrote the Marvel Knights Spider-Man run. While I didn't enjoy the run completely Millar did throw in some awesome moments and knew the characters. I doubt he was going to have Jack O Lantern and The Jester do ALL OF THAT to Spider-Man. As I said, just an overreaction from fans who seem to LOVE to hate Spider-Man these days.

 

[Themanofbat]

THis is KILLING me...KILLING me.
Someone's got to put a stop to this.

What the HELL is going on?
Why are they doing this to a FLAGSHIP character?

I am so freaking full of anger.

and to read the lame ass "fans" talking about "bumping him down", or defending this crap.

I don't know which is worst. QEusada raping spidey or the so called fans accepting the rape.

GET IT STRAIGTH PEOPLE. SPIDER-MAN IS THE FLAGSHIP HERO OF THE MU. DO YOU KNOW WHAT THAT MEANS? SPIDER-MAN IS THE BEST AT WHAT HE DOES.
THE POUND FOR POUND BEST HERO OF THE MU.
HE LIFTS 10 TONS,..DO YOU KNOW WHAT THAT MEANS? IT MEANS CAP WOLVERINE, DD, ETC. COULDN'T HOPE TO BE IN HIS CLASS. THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN SPIDEY AND CAP IS GREATER THAN THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN HULK AND SPIDER-MAN. WOULD BE BE OK TO HAVE SPIDEY KNOCK HULK AROUND LIKE A RAG DOLL?
NO TO MENTION SPIDEY SPEED WHICH IS WAY MORE THAN THOSE GUYS, PLUS HIS SPIDEY SENSE.

YOU "FANS" ARE EITHER AS STUPID AS QUESADA AND HIS CRONIES
OR THE DESTRUCTION OF SM HAS WORKED TO THE POINT WHERE YOU THINK HE IS THE BUM THEY'VE MADE HIM OUT TO BE.

THIS IS CRAPPP

I'm neither stupid nor a bum.

But thanks for the judgement.

 

[Shadowknight]

When did this Spidey and Wolvie fight happen??? The one I remember ended when Wolvie stabs Spidey and then passes out from blood loss?!?!?!?!

It wasn't really a fight. Wolverine said something to piss off Peter, so he threw him through a window, where he apparently landed on top of a cab.

 

[USMC]

When did this Spidey and Wolvie fight happen??? The one I remember ended when Wolvie stabs Spidey and then passes out from blood loss?!?!?!?!

Peter knocked Wolverine thru the glass. Easily.

So how come he couldn't break it on his own in this one?

Other than that, I'm willing to wait til ASM to pass judgement on the fight itself.

 

[DarkArachknight]

It was clearly obvious to ME that we got the abridged version of Peter vs an army of super-psychos (with details to follow in the next issue of ASM), probably in teams of two, with Jester & Jack being last.

god, i hope they do that.

 

[HoratioRome]

I'm neither stupid nor a bum.

But thanks for the judgement.

t: You're not making a very good case for yourself since I said

"YOU "FANS" ARE EITHER AS STUPID AS QUESADA AND HIS CRONIES
OR THE DESTRUCTION OF SM HAS WORKED TO THE POINT WHERE YOU THINK HE IS THE BUM THEY'VE MADE HIM OUT TO BE."

I wonder who I could be referring to?

IOW, it's either you're stupid or you believe that SPIDER-MAN is in fact the bum/loser they've made him out to be.

I had to throw that last bit of explanation in there just in case you still didn't get it.

 

[HoratioRome]

But there are some people who are overreacting. Amazing Spider-Man # 536 didn't even come out yet. If you've noticed Civil War sets things up and ASM goes into much further detail to fill in the blanks.

As CaptainStacy, a fine poster on this board, pointed out...that when falling through the window his suit was intact. Then when we go back to Spidey later in the ish...it looks like he got caught in a meat grinder.

So, yeah, it's overreaction when it's obvious we, the readers, don't have the full story. It seems the so called "real Spider-Man fans" certainly seem to find anything they can to complain about ANYTHING.

The only thing that I can say is justified in plethora of moaning is that Spider-Man and Iron Man didn't exactly get to have the insane throw down that we were all expecting. And I doubt that's going to get dealt with in ASM because Civil War # 5 picked up from the end of ASM # 535. THAT I can understand because that peeved me off.

But COME ON look who is writing Civil War. Mark F'n Millar. The guy who wrote the Marvel Knights Spider-Man run. While I didn't enjoy the run completely Millar did throw in some awesome moments and knew the characters. I doubt he was going to have Jack O Lantern and The Jester do ALL OF THAT to Spider-Man. As I said, just an overreaction from fans who seem to LOVE to hate Spider-Man these days.

it's silly to say that fans are overreacting when the complaints CLEARLY cover a period of years. It's not just ONE event which is ticking us off, it's a compilation of events that seem designed to ruin and lessen the character.
Having SM lose yet again
Having Spider-man have to be rescued by a MUCH less powerful character yet again
Having SM get the short end of the stick of the stick YET AGAIN, .....is the complaint

the key word being YET FREAKING AGAIN.

That is not over reaction, it's frustration.

In fact the thread Specifically made this clear. it even started off saying exactly that

Okay...over the last 5 or 10 years, we've had to endure some crap in the spider-verse. We all know it. Whether you liked some parts or hated them all, it's been less than a "blessed time" to be a Spider-Fan.

For those of you who haven't read it yet, Spider-Man turns on Iron Man in Civil War #5. He goes to leave, and can't break through the reinforced glass (?!). SHIELD shows up to apprehend him, and they shoot at him...and their bullets[/] break the glass, allowing Spider-Man to escape. Then, he is hunted down by two members of the new Thunderbolts, and they beat his ass.

Who could it be, you ask?
Green Goblin?
No.
Venom?
No.
Bullseye?
No.

No other than the Jester and Jack O' Lantern.

This is bulls***!! When is the last time Spidey actually one a fight without having to rely on back-up or a lightning bolt or new powers or some other s***?! Anyone?!

The guy who beat the Sinister Six, held his own against the Sinister 12, and has beaten everyone from Firelord to Juggernaut to the freakin' Hulk, gets his ass handed to him by two guys who couldn'y beat a one-legged Daredevil.

LAME.


I'm sorry, but this crap has got to stop. I could handle the unamsking. I could handle him getting all kinds of ridiculous new powers, but having him get beaten by EVERYONE he fights?! That's stupid!!

Mr Jeph Loeb, if you ever read this, please Please PLEASE remember that Spider-Man IS a tough fighter who can handle 2/3 of the Marvel Universe. No, he shouldn't win all the time, but DAMMIT, he's supposed to win most of the time!! Even Ultimate Spider-Man gets to win, and he's an IDIOT!!

So...voice your concerns, and, just for s***s and giggles, post one fight since the realunch back in 2000 that Spider-Man has won. Not tied. Not a draw. Not the bad guy getting away. A fight he actually WON decisively.

 

[HoratioRome]

I know I'm not endearing myself to the "the way they're treating SM is ok" crowd because I'm quite angry about this. However, I would like to make something clear to everyone.
like me or hate me, please consider and remember the following.

We are not talking about some randomn character here. We are talking about Spider-man.
SM is uniquely powerful because of the combination of his powers.
first-
Though he is far from being the strongest in the MU, we MUST remember that SM is no light weight. In fact he is quite strong. being able to lift 10 tons makes him capable of dealing with all but class 100 characters.
He is as strong as

Moonstone (I) a hulk villain, Dreadnought and Stryfe an x-men villain​

​

SM has always been able to handle those right below class hundred. Characters like the THING, Namor, Titania, Rhino, Firelord, etc.
and this makes sense. it wasn't just hype which made him do things he is not capable of doing (like having Captain America go toe to toe with the Hulk in the latest ultimates).
The reason SM is able to handle characters much stronger than he is comes from the fact that SM is just strong enough that repeated blows will have an effect on even much stronger characters.
It's like having a 10 year facing an adult. If that 10 year old is trained to punch, AND the adult is not capable of hitting that 10 year old, guess what? getting hit over and over again even by a 10 yrs old can kill even an adult.
remember, the HUlk is ONLY 10 times stronger than SM.
However, comparing Spider-man to Wolverine or Cap (who are the strongest "human" superheroes) we find a MUCH greated disparity.
Wolverine lifts 800 pounds while SM lifts 20,000 pounds.
yeah that's right I said 20,000. That makes Spider-man 25 times stronger than Wolverine or cap.
Hulk is ONLY 10 times stronger than SM.

furthermore, "His reflexes are faster than an average human by about a factor of 15 (he is often able to dodge bullets, if he is far enough away). "

a factor of 15.
So not only is he stronger, he is also much faster than any human.

But wait that's not all.
He happens to be the flagship hero of the MU. The man. the guy. that means he is no slouch in the fighting department. He is not some bum who in spite of being much more powerful than everyone else doesn't have the character to fight and win.
uh uh, that's NOT SM. He is the type to overcome even the impossible odds.
But wait, that's not all,........

He happens to have a spiders-sense which warns him of danger PRIOR to it coming. What you say, he is fast enough to dodge bullets AND he gets a pre warning? Yes, that's exactly right.

And I'm not even going to mention his webbing which gives him a longe range weapon strong enough to hold all but class 100 characters.

Now ,...given these facts, these powers, these advantages. I ask you, isn't it ridiculous to have SM lose to the likes of Cap, Wolverine, struggle against DD, and so on?

I know that SM has been mishandled in the past but is that an excuse for us to accept his mishandling today?

SM has faced more villains and heroes in the MU than ANY other character (due to his many comics, guest appearances, and Marvel 2 in 1). He has fought and beaten the best of the best.

can't you understand why a fan would be upset by his mishandling?

Is it REALLY overreaction to be frustrated by having him lose to the likes of the jester (under any circumstance)?