Plot holes/poor storytelling discussion

[MrWayne]

the asian nurse who scratched her nails into the floor looked more in pain than wolverine

... Thank you!

 

[Ace of Knaves]

I would too but come on if this gavin hood is so good then he should have been able to do both.

Why is it Hood's fault that Sabertooth in X-1 was crap?

If I was the director of this movie I would of said "**** X-1's Sabertooth" too.

Why should Hood restrict his vision of a great villain (and Creed was a truly great villain) just because a film that is like, nearly 10 years old decided to make Sabertooth a crap villain.

 

[Ace of Knaves]

exactly. Its been a while since i left a theater feeling empty and mad about a picture. its sucks these studios dont have the balls to go through r rated comic book movies. thank god for watchmen.

Well to be honest you can't blame them.

Sure I would love a r rated Wolverine movie.

But these days a film that has a budget over 100 million is never going to be rated r. And Watchmen, even though it was great IMO has put the nail in the coffin. They lost a lot of money on Watchmen. A company that is in the business of making money won't be doing that again any time soon.

 

[danoyse]

exactly. Its been a while since i left a theater feeling empty and mad about a picture. its sucks these studios dont have the balls to go through r rated comic book movies. thank god for watchmen.

Which won't be happening again anytime soon, since Watchmen didn't bring in the box office they wanted.

I think TDK proved how much you can push PG-13. Should have been the case here too, but I'm not surprised it didn't turn out that way.

 

[Ace of Knaves]

the asian nurse who scratched her nails into the floor looked more in pain than wolverine

Well she had the benefit of being able to scream and we could see her face.

Wolverine was in a tub and had a mask over his face. But still, you could see him convulsing and what not in the water.

 

[Ace of Knaves]

Which won't be happening again anytime soon, since Watchmen didn't bring in the box office they wanted.

I think TDK proved how much you can push PG-13. Should have been the case here too, but I'm not surprised it didn't turn out that way.

I don't think TDK pushed the limit that much. There wasn't any blood in that either. And we didn't actually see people get stabbed or impaled or decapitated like we do in this.

 

[danoyse]

And while it wasn't nearly as graphic as it should have been - I saw the film 3 times and each time people in the audience were ducking just at the sight of the needles going in.

 

[roach]

yeah what limit did TDK push???
hell Nicholsons Joker killed more people than Heath's

 

[Nathan]

I don't think TDK pushed the limit that much. There wasn't any blood in that either. And we didn't actually see people get stabbed or impaled or decapitated like we do in this.

The scene in the bank is really annoying. You see that guy get shot in the leg and there's isn't a drop of blood. Was there a hint of blood anywhere in the entire movie?

 

[roach]

maybe on Harvey's bandages

 

[danoyse]

I don't think TDK pushed the limit that much. There wasn't any blood in that either. And we didn't actually see people get stabbed or impaled or decapitated like we do in this.

It had the intensity of an R-rated film, and the Joker scenes are still keeping many of my friends' superhero-loving kids from seeing the movie.

I saw Wolverine a few weeks ago with a friend who has 10-year-old twins. The kids want to see the movie, and afterwards their dad was asking us "Is it Spideman bad, or Dark Knight bad?" in regards to the violence. And they're both PG-13 movies, but they know there's a difference.

 

[Ace of Knaves]

Yea it actually took me out of the movie when the bank manager got shot for a second there. I think he got shot in the gut, not the leg. And if it was a gut shot then there should of been at least a little pool of blood where he was laying.

The only blood in the whole movie was on Dent's dressing when he got burned.

 

[Ace of Knaves]

It had the intensity of an R-rated film, and the Joker scenes are still keeping many of my friends' superhero-loving kids from seeing the movie.

I saw Wolverine a few weeks ago with a friend who has 10-year-old twins. The kids want to see the movie, and afterwards their dad was asking us "Is it Spideman bad, or Dark Knight bad?" in regards to the violence. And they're both PG-13 movies, but they know there's a difference.

Yea it did have intense scenes.

But in terms of actual violence Wolverine is much, much more graphic.

 

[danoyse]

yeah what limit did TDK push???
hell Nicholsons Joker killed more people than Heath's

The pencil scene, Harvey's scars, a few of the scenes with the Joker - they barely got away with that PG-13.

Like I said, my friends have superhero-loving kids. They'll let them watch Spiderman, which is also PG-13...but they aren't allowed anywhere near TDK.

 

[roach]

TDK was a dark film psycologically but I didnt see a scene that was particularly brutal

 

[marvelman2006]

The popular rumor going around a few months ago was that Fox wanted to keep the movie as bloodless as possible, and kept interfering in what Hood envisioned for the film (there's a story that Rothman even had a set repainted a lighter color). Then there's that other rumor that he was even replaced at one point.

It's all internet rumor, who knows what's true and what's not...but going from the interviews I've seen with Gavin Hood, I liked his take on the character. And I loved Tsotsi - the film he won the Oscar for - so I know he's capable. He was just up against Fox, unfortunately.

I tend believe that crap about fox. all there movies seem to be crap now and you can tell the way there made are only to get that cash from the people.

 

[roach]

The pencil scene, Harvey's scars, a few of the scenes with the Joker - they barely got away with that PG-13.

Like I said, my friends have superhero-loving kids. They'll let them watch Spiderman, which is also PG-13...but they aren't allowed anywhere near TDK.

the pencil scene happened to fast and its not like we saw the pencil sticking out of the guys head.
Harvey's scars we've seen for years in the Terminator movies.

but i would agree to keep the kiddies away from it

 

[danoyse]

the pencil scene happened to fast and its not like we saw the pencil sticking out of the guys head.
Harvey's scars we've seen for years in the Terminator movies.

but i would agree to keep the kiddies away from it

Harvey's scars were nothing like the Terminator movies.

 

[BMM]

Harvey's scars were nothing like the Terminator movies.

And, even then, the Terminator movies are rated R.

 

[MrWayne]

The popular rumor going around a few months ago was that Fox wanted to keep the movie as bloodless as possible, and kept interfering in what Hood envisioned for the film (there's a story that Rothman even had a set repainted a lighter color). Then there's that other rumor that he was even replaced at one point.

It's all internet rumor, who knows what's true and what's not...but going from the interviews I've seen with Gavin Hood, I liked his take on the character. And I loved Tsotsi - the film he won the Oscar for - so I know he's capable. He was just up against Fox, unfortunately.

yea like i said.. where was his movie magic for this movie.. ugh! i wont put the blame entirely on him cuz i feel bad for the guy or anyone who has to deal with politics and or corporate dictating the direction of a movie... sad. but then again... we have to blame somebody lol

 

[chaseter]

It had the intensity of an R-rated film, and the Joker scenes are still keeping many of my friends' superhero-loving kids from seeing the movie.

I saw Wolverine a few weeks ago with a friend who has 10-year-old twins. The kids want to see the movie, and afterwards their dad was asking us "Is it Spideman bad, or Dark Knight bad?" in regards to the violence. And they're both PG-13 movies, but they know there's a difference.

Spider-Man bad!??? Spider-Man is about the campiest and playful superhero movie out there, aside from FF.

 

[chaseter]

TDK was a dark film psycologically but I didnt see a scene that was particularly brutal

That video camera scene in which that guy was tied up in the chair with Joker taunting him was pretty sadistic. You could also tell that the scenes where Joker cuts Gamble's face and when Batman shoots out the cuff razors were edited so that we don't see anything. Harvey's scars were also pretty brutal. All of that coupled with the abundance of gun violence made them push the limits of PG-13 because it was so realistic, dark, and gritty. You can be brutal without showing people's head being cut off or being dismembered.

That is what I would have liked this movie to do...push the limits on PG-13 without going R. I understand why we will never get an R Wolverine movie but you could at least push the limits like TDK did. This movie just felt neutered and I would say easily was the least brutal of the series. Which, is sort of backwards because Wolverine's past is extremely brutal.

 

[LastSunrise1981]

Spider-Man bad!??? Spider-Man is about the campiest and playful superhero movie out there, aside from FF.

To be fair, Raimi had to cut down the last fight sequence in the first Spider-Man film. He stated what he originally filmed was longer, more brutal, violent, and somewhat more bloodier. When Goblin punched Peter and see spit coming out it was supposed to be blood, however, they changed it to spit in order to avoid scaring the kids.

 

[LastSunrise1981]

Which won't be happening again anytime soon, since Watchmen didn't bring in the box office they wanted.

I think TDK proved how much you can push PG-13. Should have been the case here too, but I'm not surprised it didn't turn out that way.

WB advertised Watchmen in the wrong fashion. The rating had nothing to do with it. They advertised it like a balls out action film and while it's a critically acclaimed graphic novel, it's not well known in the mainstream like Spider-Man, Batman, Hulk, Superman, Iron Man, and the upcoming Captain America.

Films like 300, Saw, 30 Days of Night, Matrix trilogy, Kill Bill, and other R rated films show that they can be successful if done right.

 

[Ace of Knaves]

But it's all about the budget. None of those films apart from The Matrix were anywhere near the budget of Watchmen, which had to be in excess of 200 million.

But I do agree about the marketing. People probably thought it was just going to be a traditional super hero movie, but with amped up violence. What they got was a twisty conspiracy/cold war thriller, with comic book characters.

There is no way there will be another massive budget rated r film again. Well, not in the foreseeable future.