Born Again Season 1, Episode 4: "Sic Semper Systema" (SPOILERS)

[Dr. Evil]

The fact they made Frank Castle a cop/FBI agent in the previous movies always annoyed me given one of the core facets of The Punisher is his lack of faith in the justice system.

That was stupid. He is not a fan of the police, but his methods of dealing with them on an individual basis depends on if they are a good cop with strong morals or a bad one who must be dealt with. Same for the FBI and other federal agents. In his series, he has a bit of an antagonistic relationship with Madani, but he wasn't ever going to kill her. It's very likely that if he ever meets Jimmy Woo, he's not going to kill Jimmy. He's not going to be like Woo's friend, but he's not going to kill Jimmy.

Castle is smart. He knows who's bad and good among law enforcement and deals with them accordingly. If he ever encounters Luke Cage, Jessica Jones, Danny Rand or Colleen Wing, he'll most likely treat them like he's treated Matt in season two of the Netflix series.

 

[Gu3ree]

Based on the trailer for DD: Born Again, I thought they were showing us Matt revealing to Frank that he was 'Red' as Castle used to call him that as DD. But Castle already knew Daredevil's secret identity in this episode.

I didn't recall Castle finding out Matt was Daredevil in DD season 2. It was ages ago since I watched it, but did Castle find out?

That was the best scene in this episode.

So Kingpin is torturing Adam, and eating again. Personally, as I have stated before, I like the larger sized Kingpin. I wonder how Fisk and Vanessa's relationship will work out. Imagine if Fisk did kill Adam. Where would that drive Vanessa? If she leaves him, I just wonder if Fisk would really try to kill her despite loving her passionately. Would Fisk really cross that line?

So anyone think it was Kingpin that killed White Tiger?

I hope by next week, Matt is back in the suit. Seems like all he needed was a little motivation from his good friend, Frank.

But do we know why Castle is hiding out again? If he is. I don't know. New York out of all places though. He chose the most aggressive city in the world.

Decent episode. I'm enjoying it thus far, but in much need of Daredevil back in action. It's been a bit of a slow build-up.

 

[3rdstone]

I'm late here on comments, but damn one of the highlights was when Fisk dissed that adorable children choir for more songs after We Built This City (totally understandable), only to get the Latvian version on his next chore as a Mayor the same day. LMAO.

I really like Fisk's "political advisor" (or what she'd be called?). I loved how she teached the Blake kid (regarding his leaking misfortune) that she'd still be around after both he and Fisk would be gone, as the experienced pro she is. Hopefully she stays around this season.

And yeah, of course lots of other great more serious stuff here, like Matt's meeting with Frank, the run through we got about American legal system regarding Matt's client etc. Over all a great episode IMHO, and hopefully the building up scenes we got will also lead to some great DD action further on.

 

[Dr. Evil]

Based on the trailer for DD: Born Again, I thought they were showing us Matt revealing to Frank that he was 'Red' as Castle used to call him that as DD. But Castle already knew Daredevil's secret identity in this episode.

I didn't recall Castle finding out Matt was Daredevil in DD season 2. It was ages ago since I watched it, but did Castle find out?

That was the best scene in this episode.

So Kingpin is torturing Adam, and eating again. Personally, as I have stated before, I like the larger sized Kingpin. I wonder how Fisk and Vanessa's relationship will work out. Imagine if Fisk did kill Adam. Where would that drive Vanessa? If she leaves him, I just wonder if Fisk would really try to kill her despite loving her passionately. Would Fisk really cross that line?

So anyone think it was Kingpin that killed White Tiger?

I hope by next week, Matt is back in the suit. Seems like all he needed was a little motivation from his good friend, Frank.

But do we know why Castle is hiding out again? If he is. I don't know. New York out of all places though. He chose the most aggressive city in the world.

Decent episode. I'm enjoying it thus far, but in much need of Daredevil back in action. It's been a bit of a slow build-up.

Cole North

Officer Cole North is an officer of the Anti-Vigilante Task Force who idolizes Punisher.[1] To be added To be added To be added To be added Bulletproof Vest: As an Anti-Vigilante Task Force officer, North wears a bulletproof vest with a skull insignia, resembling the Punisher's vest. To be added...

marvelcinematicuniverse.fandom.com

 

[Gu3ree]

Cole North

Officer Cole North is an officer of the Anti-Vigilante Task Force who idolizes Punisher.[1] To be added To be added To be added To be added Bulletproof Vest: As an Anti-Vigilante Task Force officer, North wears a bulletproof vest with a skull insignia, resembling the Punisher's vest. To be added...

marvelcinematicuniverse.fandom.com

Ah, what I meant was, if Kingpin hired a gunman to take down White Tiger. Obviously it wasn't Kingpin that pulled the trigger directly.

 

[Dr. Evil]

Ah, what I meant was, if Kingpin hired a gunman to take down White Tiger. Obviously it wasn't Kingpin that pulled the trigger directly.

it's likely a cop, which I assume North is.

 

[Still Wynning]

I am not really trying to pick out these kinds of things. If I notice them, I notice them. But to date, I think the show does a good job at flowing on its own. I am not consciously thinking about the reshoots every 2 seconds or anything

I mean, I did notice during the scene of Matt investigating the scene of Hector’s murder the lighting, color, set dressing and composition is noticeably different when it quickly flashes back and forth, indicating that scene was definitely added in the reworked version. I did read that this episode was probably the one that got the most overhauled, and you can sort of feel it a bit.

Other than that, I have really been enjoying this show so much that I haven’t been taken out of my watching experience. It definitely has a bit of a different feel and tone than the Netflix show, which took a little adjustment, but I’m fine with that.

 

[BobJM]

Based on the trailer for DD: Born Again, I thought they were showing us Matt revealing to Frank that he was 'Red' as Castle used to call him that as DD. But Castle already knew Daredevil's secret identity in this episode.

I didn't recall Castle finding out Matt was Daredevil in DD season 2. It was ages ago since I watched it, but did Castle find out?

They didn't explicitly mention it in Season 2, but I always thought Frank put it together when Matt was speaking to the jury during his trial.

 

[BoredGuy]

Based on the trailer for DD: Born Again, I thought they were showing us Matt revealing to Frank that he was 'Red' as Castle used to call him that as DD. But Castle already knew Daredevil's secret identity in this episode.

I didn't recall Castle finding out Matt was Daredevil in DD season 2. It was ages ago since I watched it, but did Castle find out?

That was the best scene in this episode.

So Kingpin is torturing Adam, and eating again. Personally, as I have stated before, I like the larger sized Kingpin. I wonder how Fisk and Vanessa's relationship will work out. Imagine if Fisk did kill Adam. Where would that drive Vanessa? If she leaves him, I just wonder if Fisk would really try to kill her despite loving her passionately. Would Fisk really cross that line?

So anyone think it was Kingpin that killed White Tiger?

I hope by next week, Matt is back in the suit. Seems like all he needed was a little motivation from his good friend, Frank.

But do we know why Castle is hiding out again? If he is. I don't know. New York out of all places though. He chose the most aggressive city in the world.

Decent episode. I'm enjoying it thus far, but in much need of Daredevil back in action. It's been a bit of a slow build-up.

Yeah, When Matt says "Frank" at the trial in season 2, there's a flash across Frank's face of recognition

And as far as Large Kingpin, man was trimming down to be mayor with the eggwhite omelets. I think him indulging in a big plate of pasta and sausage indicates he'll be back to a bigger size by season's end

Agreed about Matt suiting up though, please don't make us wait any longer!

 

[LoganPool]

Umm, yeah, so... that was a phenomenal episode! Easily the best of the season. Every scene was captivating. Best episode of television that Marvel has released since Loki season 1. Can't wait for Frank and Red to team up! Also, Adam does not look at all like how I pictured him. I thought he was gonna be a classy businessman type.

 

[BoredGuy]

Umm, yeah, so... that was a phenomenal episode! Easily the best of the season. Every scene was captivating. Best episode of television that Marvel has released since Loki season 1. Can't wait for Frank and Red to team up! Also, Adam does not look at all like how I pictured him. I thought he was gonna be a classy businessman type.

Well who knows how long he's been in that cell
may not have been so fuzzy when Vanessa was hittin' it

 

[BlackFox]

Umm, yeah, so... that was a phenomenal episode! Easily the best of the season. Every scene was captivating. Best episode of television that Marvel has released since Loki season 1. Can't wait for Frank and Red to team up! Also, Adam does not look at all like how I pictured him. I thought he was gonna be a classy businessman type.

Yeah compared to other Disney+ shows this stands head and shoulders above the rest at least in terms of writing and acting, its just on another level. That may be damning with feint praise give the overall quality of their efforts, but I recently finished Agatha and while that was one of the better efforts overall this is still well ahead of that. This episode pushed things to a new level, mostly because of Bernthal and Cox knowing their roles so well now and having crazy chemistry, the best praise I can give it is, it doesnt feel like a Disney+ show.

 

[Deck Rickard]

Yeah how come NYC wasn't decimated in the Defenders shows?

LISTEN. We need to collectively understand that all the Netflix shows were perfect and that everything about them was 100 times better than anything FEIGE has had anything to do with, including the Hand blowing holes across New York so that they could go beneath the city and extract marrow from magical dinosaur bones or something.

 

[NewYorkSpider]

They didn't explicitly mention it in Season 2, but I always thought Frank put it together when Matt was speaking to the jury during his trial.

Yeah there's a moment where Frank pauses and looks at Matt and you can tell he's putting two and two together. I think Matt says his name and he instantly recognizes his voice.

 

[Mike Murdock]

You can call me crazy all you want, but I actually enjoy this iteration more than the Netflix show (which I also loved.)

I don’t typically like legal dramas because I work as a lawyer all day and I don’t want work drama invading my recreation time. But this season on this show has been surprisingly accurate in how court proceedings work. The only knock I’d give it would be the fact that Hector’s trial was scheduled way too quickly.
But the depiction of the misdemeanor court and the petty theft case was crazy accurate. That’s actually how all of that would have gone down, from Matt meeting his client and then going in and finding a prosecutor who is only marginally invested in the case and getting a “good deal” by sheer charisma. That’s how those cases work. And the moral dilemma that Matt feels in having a client who is on probation but who is innocent, for whom staying in jail for 10 days is a “gift” despite doing absolutely nothing wrong—that’s all accurate of what you deal with in misdemeanor criminal courts. And that’s why that case wears on Matt just as much as White Tiger getting gunned down despite his acquittal. It’s all broken down justice.

Public Defender here (not in New York) so the procedure isn't quite the same. That being said, that scene was triggering. Nobody is right, but he's not being realistic either. It very much is pushing the point that the system is broken. That being said, this isn't a problem that can be fixed with Daredevil either.

I thought this was a phenomenal episode. Sure, it was low on the action, but it made up for it with wonderful character moments. Even some scenes that technically go nowhere (such as the scene with Frank Castle) hit powerfully.

I'm now two episodes behind, but I'm looking forward to the next one.

 

[Babillygunn]

Public Defender here (not in New York) so the procedure isn't quite the same. That being said, that scene was triggering. Nobody is right, but he's not being realistic either. It very much is pushing the point that the system is broken. That being said, this isn't a problem that can be fixed with Daredevil either.

I thought this was a phenomenal episode. Sure, it was low on the action, but it made up for it with wonderful character moments. Even some scenes that technically go nowhere (such as the scene with Frank Castle) hit powerfully.

I'm now two episodes behind, but I'm looking forward to the next one.

Good to see you here again. I haven’t noticed you posting in quite a while.
Where are you a PD? It’s funny because I spent the first almost ten years of my practice trolling misdemeanor courts, first as a prosecutor and then as a criminal defense lawyer. And this was exactly how it looks like in my jurisdiction.

And yes, the misdemeanor stacked shelf time is one of the most frustrating parts of misdemeanor practice. Huge injustices happen as a result

 

[Mike Murdock]

Good to see you here again. I haven’t noticed you posting in quite a while.
Where are you a PD? It’s funny because I spent the first almost ten years of my practice trolling misdemeanor courts, first as a prosecutor and then as a criminal defense lawyer. And this was exactly how it looks like in my jurisdiction.

And yes, the misdemeanor stacked shelf time is one of the most frustrating parts of misdemeanor practice. Huge injustices happen as a result

Virginia (not a large jurisdiction, but not a small one either). Probably one of the biggest differences is prosecutors aren't required to prosecute misdemeanors (leaving it either to the officer or the victim themselves to prosecute).

The biggest difference is cases wouldn't resolve on the very first appearance. There's an initial appearance, then a bail hearing, then the trial date. If someone is denied bail, there wouldn't be an opportunity to resolve until that trial date.

When I was briefly in Northern Virginia, it's a bit closer. The single prosecutor dominating a table and handing out deals very much resembled that. Over here, they have fewer cases so it's a bit different. I did love seeing the prosecutor get interrupted and literally handle negotiating two cases at the same time. That part definitely was true to form.