Siege

[SouLeSS]

Good point. Another reason that OMD was trash. I swear to God, that crap is as bad as the Clone Saga.


But he should--Norman's always been obsessed with Spider-Man above all other considerations.

Didn't you read Spiderman The List? Norman basically comes to the conclusion that ONE person (spidey) shouldn't matter compared to the real problems.

 

[Saint]

Didn't you read Spiderman The List? Norman basically comes to the conclusion that ONE person (spidey) shouldn't matter compared to the real problems.

Yes, I read it. The fact that they wrote it that way doesn't mean it makes sense for the character. For Norman, Spider-Man is the "real problem."

 

[SouLeSS]

Uh, no? For Goblin, maybe. For Norman though?

I mean, sure, he's sort of written like that 10 years ago before he was resurrected.

But since he's been back he's been about a big picture. Spiderman is a thorn in his ass, but he's moved on.

 

[Manic]

He never moved on from Spidey. Throughout Dark Reign, whenever someone brought up Spider-Man, he went into Goblin-mode for a quick minute. He tried to recruit Mystique for the Dark X-Men, and he lost his mind when she turned into Spider-Man in front of him. When talking to Franklin and Val Richards, he started flipping out and shooting at them when Franklin put on a Spider-Man mask.

 

[Aesop Rocks]

 

[Franklin Richards]

 

[SouLeSS]

He never moved on from Spidey. Throughout Dark Reign, whenever someone brought up Spider-Man, he went into Goblin-mode for a quick minute. He tried to recruit Mystique for the Dark X-Men, and he lost his mind when she turned into Spider-Man in front of him. When talking to Franklin and Val Richards, he started flipping out and shooting at them when Franklin put on a Spider-Man mask.

And yet anytime Bendis wrote him (which was pretty much all that "matters" when you think about it) he pretty much didn't give a **** about Spiderman past "I'll deal with him after all the big things".

 

[Saint]

Uh, no? For Goblin, maybe. For Norman though?

Irrelevant distinction.

I mean, sure, he's sort of written like that 10 years ago before he was resurrected.

But since he's been back he's been about a big picture. Spiderman is a thorn in his ass, but he's moved on.

No. Considering that his return involved an intricate plan involving years of work specifically designed to screw with Peter, no, he has definitely not moved on. Then there was the time he bought the Bugle to screw with Peter, the time he arranged to be granted mythical powers so he could screw with Peter, the whole debacle with Aunt May's "return," the time he allowed his own capture, organized all of Peter's villains and kept Aunt May buried alive for months straight...just to screw with Peter. No, Peter isn't a thorn. The destruction of Peter Parker is the driving concern of Norman Osborn's existence.

And yet anytime Bendis wrote him (which was pretty much all that "matters" when you think about it) he pretty much didn't give a **** about Spiderman past "I'll deal with him after all the big things".

If you've been reading the conversation, this is exactly the problem we've been discussing. Or, one of the problems, anyway. The portrayal of Norman and Peter both was not quite what it should have been, and some good opportunities were missed because of that.

 

[Spider-Gnome]

And yet anytime Bendis wrote him (which was pretty much all that "matters" when you think about it) he pretty much didn't give a **** about Spiderman past "I'll deal with him after all the big things".

And again, as others have said, it shows not understanding the character.

 

[Spider-Vader]

Nightcrawler's been dead for like 3 minutes, chum.

& will come back in even less time!

 

[Alastor]

I think it was more "saving the best for last", than "I'll deal with him after all the big things".

 

[kguillou]

But again, this begs the question, now that OMD changed the rules, how much DOES Norman care about Spiderman now? The fact that he no longer knows he is Peter Parker is largely significant. Many of the devious things that Norman's done over the years are now null and void because of OMD, its no longer personal for Norman. For all we know, Spider-man just annoys the hell out of him just like any other of Spidey's rogues. Its purely Spiderman vs the Goblin now instead of Peter Parker vs Norman Osborn.

 

[imdaly]

If I remember correctly, Norman remembers that he USED to know who Spider-Man was, and it chaps his *** that for some reason he doesn't remember now.

 

[Alastor]

True. OMD really ruined their dynamic. Dark Reign would have been much better had Osborn known Spidey's ID. Completely ruin his life, giving him a reason to have a bigger stake in Siege.

 

[Ace of Knaves]

I remember in i think it was Ellis' T-Bolts, they were going after Steele Spider and Osborne was like

"Right, so we are going to aprehend Steele Spider... man"

"Did you just say Spider-Man?"

"No! No! No! No! I did not say Spider-Man... i said Steele Spider, man! I did not say Spider-Man!!!!!"

In other words he always had Spider-Man on his mind, but he was constantly trying to supress his urges and hate whilst he was in charge i think. In other books he said his obsession with Spider-Man is the one thing that kept him from rising to the top.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Exactly. If Norman's obsession with Spider-Man were as all-consuming as some people are painting it to be, he never would've been functional enough to gain the Fury/Iron Man position in the first place. Every single Thunderbolts mission would've been about murdering Spider-Man and his only concern during Secret Invasion would've been whether Spider-Man was a Skrull because then he'd have wasted all his time chasing after the wrong white whale.

But he's been out of the limelight for about 3 years. He hasn't done anything since Rise & Fall of the Shi'ar Empire, which was done in 2007. After that, he didn't do anything during Messiah CompleX or Utopia, he wasn't in X-Force, Mike Carey didn't use him because he wasn't Rogue, and I think Matt Fraction gave him no more than a page of panel-time during most of his run.

Then he came back during the current crossover and died after a couple of issues.


It's the same thing, except in a different order. Thor died first, then stayed away for 3 years. Nightcrawler disappeared for 3 years first, then came back and died right away.

He was a major part of X-Infernus (a.k.a. the worst-titled comic in the history of ever). Anyway, don't worry, he'll be back eventually. Death doesn't matter in comics.

 

[BoredGuy]

Anybody notice Bucky's arm wasn't metallic on the Siege #4 cover?

just wanted to point that out..lol...don't they have editors for that kinda thing?

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Nick Fury gave him a more incognito-ish flesh-colored one in Captain America a few issues ago. I'm guessing Brubaker or an editor or someone did that for just such situations, where people might forget he even has a bionic arm now that it's covered up most of the time.

 

[BoredGuy]

Really?? hmmm weird. I haven't missed any issues of Cap, but I didn't see that...
Any idea which issue?

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Early in the last arc, I think. I want to say #602, maybe...

 

[the_ultimate_evil]

all i care about is they actually do something with norman/goblin now, not right away but they can't have this build up and then nothing..... ohh wait yes they can it's marvel

 

[TheCorpulent1]

What are you talking about? Dark Reign and Siege were all about Osborn hitting the big time.

 

[Saint]

Early in the last arc, I think. I want to say #602, maybe...

It was the first issue after Reborn (in which Bucky's existing arm was destroyed), so yeah, that was either 602 or 603.

 

[fifthfiend]

all i care about is they actually do something with norman/goblin now, not right away but they can't have this build up and then nothing..... ohh wait yes they can it's marvel

What are you talking about? Dark Reign and Siege were all about Osborn hitting the big time.

Yeah, I'd be interested to know what more you think is supposed to happen.

 

[Anubis]

He probably meant with Spider-Man, to which I would like to reiterate...F**k Spider-Man.