'Super Max' - Goyer's new DC film project

[Hooded Justice]

No one denies that his origin COULD be a movie. I just dont think anyone is particularly interested in it. So many filmmakers have said, "Now that we're passed the origin, we can get into the real good stuff" (in some way). The truth is a play by play shot for shot origin story isnt always necessary. You can get a really good story laced with origin flashbacks just as easy.

But the origin develops character and motivation. It connects us to the characters and helps us understand all the various relationships.

 

[TwilightPro101]

In terms of Green Arrow with an origin movie, it could work if they went the Year One route. But overall depending on which version a writer goes off (there's three mini-versions out there from DC Comics alone), it could be referenced ala SUPER MAX or completely done in one act and done with.

The flashbacks themselves can be placed within the film itself ala SMALLVILLE's version or even SUPER MAX and still forward the character.

In the case of SUPER MAX or at least the draft, we had at present, it started off simply enough with a flashback prologue. While I admit I wasn't happy with it at first. The film fleshed out the details of his origin as the story went along and allowed the character to progress both emotionally and physically through his interaction with the villains in play.

 

[Evil Twin]

GA's origin is narratively inert as there's never a doubt that he'll get off the island. Not to mention there's noone for him to interact with, there's a reason for Friday and Wilson. Using it as a thematic counterpart to the main plot, this is a character that is adaptable and clever, is a better cinematic way to tell the story. Not to mention, the best things about Oliver Queen is his personality and attitude not how he learned to shoot a bow and arrow.

An origin story is one way to tell a story. It's not the only way and for many characters it's not the best way. Especially for a character whose origin isn't that interesting or is a knockoff of another story. In addition to Robinson Crusoe and Cast Away, it's also reminiscent of the origin of Iron Man, irresponsible millionaire gets a comeuppance and comes back a changed person. Differentiating the story from other similar stories is going to be necessary for GA to fly with the general public.

 

[TwilightPro101]

GA's origin is narratively inert as there's never a doubt that he'll get off the island. Not to mention there's noone for him to interact with, there's a reason for Friday and Wilson. Using it as a thematic counterpart to the main plot, this is a character that is adaptable and clever, is a better cinematic way to tell the story. Not to mention, the best things about Oliver Queen is his personality and attitude not how he learned to shoot a bow and arrow.

An origin story is one way to tell a story. It's not the only way and for many characters it's not the best way. Especially for a character whose origin isn't that interesting or is a knockoff of another story. In addition to Robinson Crusoe and Cast Away, it's also reminiscent of the origin of Iron Man, irresponsible millionaire gets a comeuppance and comes back a changed person. Differentiating the story from other similar stories is going to be necessary for GA to fly with the general public.

Sums it up.

 

[Evil Twin]

But the origin develops character and motivation. It connects us to the characters and helps us understand all the various relationships.

Going through trials and tribulations reveals character and explores motivation as well.

 

[cerealkiller182]

But the origin develops character and motivation. It connects us to the characters and helps us understand all the various relationships.

its not the only thing. the way a character reacts to situations and the decisions they make all hint at the character's being. A scene by scene zero hour origin isnt the only way to convey that.

 

[Webhead2006]

yea there is so many ways things could turn out for the project.

 

[Hooded Justice]

Going through trials and tribulations reveals character and explores motivation as well.

I don't really understand a superhero though unless I know how and why he became a superhero.

its not the only thing. the way a character reacts to situations and the decisions they make all hint at the character's being. A scene by scene zero hour origin isnt the only way to convey that.

Maybe not, but it's the best way to me.

 

[TwilightPro101]

The origin is still addressed irregardless of where it is within the film. It's more along the lines of BATMAN 1989.

 

[Hooded Justice]

The origin is still addressed irregardless of where it is within the film. It's more along the lines of BATMAN 1989.

That movie didn't address the origin at all. Oh sure, a flashback to his parents' murder, big deal. His parents get murdered, and then he's Batman. Yeah, that makes sense.

 

[TwilightPro101]

its not the only thing. the way a character reacts to situations and the decisions they make all hint at the character's being. A scene by scene zero hour origin isnt the only way to convey that.

Completely agree.

 

[Evil Twin]

That movie didn't address the origin at all. Oh sure, a flashback to his parents' murder, big deal. His parents get murdered, and then he's Batman. Yeah, that makes sense.

That was the basic origin for 50 years+. There was no long drawn out origin in the comics. Heck, his abbreviated origin wasn't told until months after he first appeared. And it directly told you the most important thing to get from an origin, "why he does what he does". I often find "How?" the least important thing to be answered, especially since that's basically told with every shot. Even then, he's a billionaire who can afford high tech toys / vehicles, he traveled the world at some point as you can tell by his armor collection, and he knows martial arts. The beauty of that story is that you didn't have to shove the hero into the last half of the story or the villain into the last act.

It's ironic. The people most concerned about origin stories are the same fanboys that already know the origin.

 

[protocida]

We are only concerned about the origin because it's a important part of the character and some people, like me, think it could become a movie. It's not a big deal, just a opinion.

 

[Evil Twin]

We are only concerned about the origin because it's a important part of the character and some people, like me, think it could become a movie. It's not a big deal, just a opinion.

It's an important part of some characters, but I'm not so convinced that it's that important to Green Arrow. It doesn't tell us about his personality, politics or womanizing, for instance. While I understand that GA Year One is a good mini-series, that doesn't mean that it would necessarily make a good movie. Or that the same basic facts can't be delivered in more abbreviated fashion. Or as counterpoint to a more interesting story, ala Supermax. Or even skipped, as the basic idea that he's a really good archer isn't that outlandish. Robin Hood didn't have to go through an elaborate origin to explain that he was good at archery. Zorro didn't need an origin either.

 

[The Major]

GA's origin is narratively inert as there's never a doubt that he'll get off the island. Not to mention there's noone for him to interact with, there's a reason for Friday and Wilson. Using it as a thematic counterpart to the main plot, this is a character that is adaptable and clever, is a better cinematic way to tell the story. Not to mention, the best things about Oliver Queen is his personality and attitude not how he learned to shoot a bow and arrow.

This is what narrative dialogue is for.

Ollie wasn't exactly aone on the island, either. He has to fight the drug smugglers IIRC.

Ollie's personality would be fascinating to see breaking apart trying to adapt to the island.

An origin story is one way to tell a story. It's not the only way and for many characters it's not the best way.

True, but it could still be a minor plot shown in flashback like in Batman Begins.

Where else is the audience going to learn how he became Green Arrow? He didn't juts decide one random day to put on a mask to become a vigilante. there's a story to tell.

Especially for a character whose origin isn't that interesting or is a knockoff of another story. In addition to Robinson Crusoe and Cast Away, it's also reminiscent of the origin of Iron Man, irresponsible millionaire gets a comeuppance and comes back a changed person. Differentiating the story from other similar stories is going to be necessary for GA to fly with the general public.

It's all in the execution. Make it unique enough with a good twist and the public will like it.

Ollie does have similarities with Batman and Iron Man, but he isn't a clone.No is his origin an exact duplicate of their's.

 

[Evil Twin]

Let me say that I'm not against an origin story, but Green Arrow's origin has a number of problems that should make the filmmakers think creatively. The lack of a marquee villain being one of those problems. And, it doesn't matter how big a star you get, you're going to have a hard time getting people to part with their money if you only have a superhero up against a bunch of drug dealers.

Supermax's script needs a lot of work, but it includes the backstory in a way that's relevant to the present story, it shows his personality, and it has plenty of formidible foes for Green Arrow to overcome. It's definitely more of a "movie sized" script and has plenty of elements that could be considered fresh as opposed to being a knockoff.

 

[protocida]

A movie about his origin would't be set intirelly in the Island. He would come back to Star City withim the middle of the movie, where he would become Green Arrow and fight the movie's villain, much like Iron Man.

 

[Evil Twin]

A movie about his origin would't be set intirelly in the Island. He would come back to Star City withim the middle of the movie, where he would become Green Arrow and fight the movie's villain, much like Iron Man.

Yeah, and the villain is? Also, why should we care if the villain isn't in the first half?

You can tell Green Arrow's origin in one or two comic book pages. What's interesting enough and unique enough about it to justify half a movie? And how do you avoid a schism where the second half seems unconnected to the first half?

 

[protocida]

I don't really want to discuss right know.

Let's agree to disagree, shall we?

 

[Man of Tomorrow]

I wonder if Leo Dicaprio would work as Green Arrow. I think a big name actor would help to sell this thing.

 

[protocida]

No.

 

[Webhead2006]

would be an interesting choice, though he has for some time been rumored for captain america, though i like him as an actor though wouldnt like to see as cap. With ollie and aquaman there is so many people they could get to play the character and then what take on the characters they would want to do.

 

[Changeling]

I like him! Think he'd make an awesome GA

 

[TwilightPro101]

That was the basic origin for 50 years+. There was no long drawn out origin in the comics. Heck, his abbreviated origin wasn't told until months after he first appeared. And it directly told you the most important thing to get from an origin, "why he does what he does". I often find "How?" the least important thing to be answered, especially since that's basically told with every shot. Even then, he's a billionaire who can afford high tech toys / vehicles, he traveled the world at some point as you can tell by his armor collection, and he knows martial arts. The beauty of that story is that you didn't have to shove the hero into the last half of the story or the villain into the last act.

It's ironic. The people most concerned about origin stories are the same fanboys that already know the origin.

Sums up matters again.

 

[The Guard]

BATMAN does address Batman's origins, and even his time overseas, etc. The rest, well, not explicity seen, but enough is shown that some clear ideas can be made about how he wages his war on crime, etc. The movie just doesn't address it in depth, but the origins of Batman's character are seen. I've long believed that if you cannot understand why Bruce Wayne does what he does after BATMAN, you will never truly understand why he does what he does.

I wouldn't call anything in SUPERMAX "fleshed out". Green Arrow's origin is included, but not developed in a particularly compelling way. I think there's an opportunity there to do a lot more with the themes of alienation, resourcefulness, evolution, etc he faces when on the island, and later, in prison (another island, essentially).