SUPERNATURAL Season 8! - Part 1

[Kar]

I'll give you that, but that wouldn't have been the first time they've driven around with a dismembered head in their car. Like the Leviathans for instance.

 

[The Question]

I'll give you that, but that wouldn't have been the first time they've driven around with a dismembered head in their car. Like the Leviathans for instance.

Yeah, but I'd suspect that the distance between where the buried Abbadon and the bunker is a lot further than the distance they drove to dispose of the Leviathan's heads, and probably crosses a few state lines. There's a bigger risk there.

 

[iamlegend]

I don't think their leaving her unattended was stupid or lazy writing. It made perfect sense in context. Crowley called them on the phone (which had never happened before) and told them that he was murdering all the people they had saved one by one. It seems totally believable to me that they'd be distracted by that.

And it makes sense to me that they'd chose Abaddon in the first place. She's a demon they have access to who's not in contact with Crowley so them taking her wouldn't tip their hand as to what they're doing, and they didn't imagine she'd ever be able to dig the bullet out. They under estimated her, sure, but the way they did seems totally believable and in-character to me.

The only thing that seems logically shaky is the fact that they didn't use the dungeon in the bunker. It seemed like they were setting it up for them to take her there, but they just didn't.

Absolutely, positively not. She's a mega demon! A Knight of Hell, or whatever. A breed that the Archangels, who all happen to be dead/incapacitated, had to personally smite. Choosing her was plot convenience, and poorly written plot convenience. The boys aren't stupid, you don't dig up a mega demon when a local chump would do.

The writers could have found a way to make certain that it had to be her that the boys "cured." Instead they never bothered justifying the choice, and it makes the Winchesters look like total idiots.

 

[jaqua99]

I'm sick of Crowley. He's not a great villain anymore, he's annoying, he's flamboyant, he's totally overstayed his welcome, I want him off the show, he's annoying.

Remember back when the villain was...you know..the freakin devil himself? the most evil guy to the general public when it comes to heaven and hell, and he's been irrelevant in this show. It's gone downhill since season 5

 

[Sawyer]

 

[The Question]

Absolutely, positively not. She's a mega demon! A Knight of Hell, or whatever. A breed that the Archangels, who all happen to be dead/incapacitated, had to personally smite. Choosing her was plot convenience, and poorly written plot convenience. The boys aren't stupid, you don't dig up a mega demon when a local chump would do.

The writers could have found a way to make certain that it had to be her that the boys "cured." Instead they never bothered justifying the choice, and it makes the Winchesters look like total idiots.

Except a local chump would have tipped off Crowley to what they were doing. Abbadon was off his radar.

 

[jaqua99]

It's true. I'm sick of him.

 

[Marvolo]

I'm sick of Crowley. He's not a great villain anymore, he's annoying, he's flamboyant, he's totally overstayed his welcome, I want him off the show, he's annoying.

Remember back when the villain was...you know..the freakin devil himself? the most evil guy to the general public when it comes to heaven and hell, and he's been irrelevant in this show. It's gone downhill since season 5

A villain we can be sick of and hate...how quaint. He is the king of hell who climbed his way from the bottom. You aren't meant to like him. You aren't meant to even enjoy him. He is a POS and that is exactly what he is supposed to be.

Crowley has been catching hell for one reason or another from the fanbase from the beginning. I think its nice having a villain I won't to see put through a woodchipper. The devil in the show was charismatic and hell maybe not even entirely wrong. The leviathans were just PR minded CEOs. Lillith only showed up occasionally. With Crowley we have a villain who has dogged the boys since his introduction to the point of desperation and has actually made them his own personal whipping boys. Its even at a point where the fan base feels it, and when he finely gets it it will be all the more satisfying because of that. I think that is a great villain.

 

[DarkSovereignty]

Yeah Crowley is a great villain. He's a had a great, natural development over the course of three seasons and it looks like its about to finally pay off.

 

[iamlegend]

Except a local chump would have tipped off Crowley to what they were doing. Abbadon was off his radar.

Would have tipped off Crowley to what, exactly? That the Winchesters were trying to capture a demon? They and their allies do that on a pretty regular basis. They went with Abaddon because the writers wanted to get her back into play and were too lazy to come up with a legitimate story.

 

[iamlegend]

A villain we can be sick of and hate...how quaint. He is the king of hell who climbed his way from the bottom. You aren't meant to like him. You aren't meant to even enjoy him. He is a POS and that is exactly what he is supposed to be.

Crowley has been catching hell for one reason or another from the fanbase from the beginning. I think its nice having a villain I won't to see put through a woodchipper. The devil in the show was charismatic and hell maybe not even entirely wrong. The leviathans were just PR minded CEOs. Lillith only showed up occasionally. With Crowley we have a villain who has dogged the boys since his introduction to the point of desperation and has actually made them his own personal whipping boys. Its even at a point where the fan base feels it, and when he finely gets it it will be all the more satisfying because of that. I think that is a great villain.

I think the biggest thing that's hurt Crowley is... There's been an awful lot of Crowley. We've seen him far more often than any other "Big Bad," and at times he's gotten a little stale. In part because, sometimes, I think they play up his humorous side a little too much at times. Last night's ep was a great reminder of how evil and crafty he can be.

 

[Marvolo]

I do hope we get a baddie of more biblical proportions for the next two seasons tho. Abbadon being a Knight of Hell and hand picked by Lucifer could maybe fill that role. Crowley, great tho he may be, will always just be a salesman who climbed his way to the top. He is a thug/gangster. He doesn't have that aura of celestial destruction. I really wish they would bring back Michael and Lucifer for the final bad guys. Seems a shame leaving them locked up for the rest of the show. Perhaps Abbadon knows a trick to release him.

Thought: is it possible that Cas succeeds in closing heaven in the finale, but sam and dean fail to close Hell leaving the demons with free reign on earth? That seems like something that would happen on this show.

 

[Kar]

Yeah I really don't see the boys shutting down Hell.

And I love Crowley as a villain only because we've watched him grow and prove himself as a villain. We have gotten a bit too much of him which wouldn't have happened if Kripke was running the show still. I remember him saying that's why he never had the other villains show up all the time because he didn't want them to look like the typical recurring villain or something. Crowley's the smartest villain they've had because he never underestimates Sam and Dean. Ever. He's the only one that knows what they're capable of (as stated in "The Man Who Would Be King"). If anything he knows the boys better than Yellow Eyes ever did.

Another thing though I wish the writers did a better job at explaining the whole curing the demon thing. Like...does the purified soul stay in the body or does it leave eventually? What happens to the original soul that was in the meat suit?

 

[S. Grundy]

The Lucifer story is done, no need to bring him back into the fold.

Also, Sheriff Mills is coming back for the finale, hope she makes it out alive.

 

[Orb]

Anybody still wondering who was watching Sam outside Amelia's house in the premiere?

 

[DarkSovereignty]

Erik Kripke.

 

[Kar]

Anybody still wondering who was watching Sam outside Amelia's house in the premiere?

I am. If the writers don't address this it will really bother me.

 

[X-Ray]

Anybody still wondering who was watching Sam outside Amelia's house in the premiere?

Took a look since I don't recall the scene & yeah there's definitely someone there. I hope they do address it as well. It could be one of Naiomi's lap dog. Crowley would have already played that card instead of relying on the books.

 

[Ken-Kaniff]

I'm sick of Crowley. He's not a great villain anymore, he's annoying, he's flamboyant, he's totally overstayed his welcome, I want him off the show, he's annoying.

Remember back when the villain was...you know..the freakin devil himself? the most evil guy to the general public when it comes to heaven and hell, and he's been irrelevant in this show. It's gone downhill since season 5

Yeah man, it's what I keep friggin' sayin'! The older villains were badass, while Crowley just comes more of a joker! Also imho, the weakest villains (in terms of EVERYTHING) of SPN were, ironically, the most powerful: Leviathans! How the hell did Bobby manage to toss Dicky around for instance? I Mean powerful beings as demons & angels couldn't make themselves invisible and use their powers against Leviathans, but a Ghost who supposedly is WEAKER, could. And the whole thing being so political took a lot away from the creepy feeling of the Leviathans. Imo Leviathans were only brought cause the most powerful villain was caged already. Originally Leviathan was actually a demon from hell or a serpent if I know well, certainly not as it was represented in SPN.

I think the biggest thing that's hurt Crowley is... There's been an awful lot of Crowley. We've seen him far more often than any other "Big Bad," and at times he's gotten a little stale. In part because, sometimes, I think they play up his humorous side a little too much at times. Last night's ep was a great reminder of how evil and crafty he can be.

No, you're half right only. It's just one of the reasons. He was never really that threatning, but he was kept still. They boys never really went for Crowley, yet he screw them each time.

I do hope we get a baddie of more biblical proportions for the next two seasons tho. Abbadon being a Knight of Hell and hand picked by Lucifer could maybe fill that role. Crowley, great tho he may be, will always just be a salesman who climbed his way to the top. He is a thug/gangster. He doesn't have that aura of celestial destruction. I really wish they would bring back Michael and Lucifer for the final bad guys. Seems a shame leaving them locked up for the rest of the show. Perhaps Abbadon knows a trick to release him.

Thought: is it possible that Cas succeeds in closing heaven in the finale, but sam and dean fail to close Hell leaving the demons with free reign on earth? That seems like something that would happen on this show.

I'll be rooting for Abaddon to be the next big baddie, she's powerful and I like the actress who portrays her and I also found her more "frightening" (meh as frightening as it can be in this type of show, since it isn't really that much of a horror anymore, anyway!).

And I totally agree with everything you said, I wouldn't mind if she free'd Lucifer and Michael also gets out, but it needs a totally different storyline then having them fight again and trying to have Dean & Sam as vessels. Maybe Michael has a change of heart, would be good to see him on the boys side finally for example and maybe they can go after the tablets? Idk, Kripke is great at writting, he can come up with something good.

Yeah I really don't see the boys shutting down Hell.

I think the same, in fact I won't be surprised if neither Heaven nor Hell get shutdown at the end of the season. I just don't see them giving up angels & demons, cause what's next? Leviathans? No thanks, I don't wanna see that anymore. Or maybe something more lame than Leviathans! They find the PEREZ HILTON Tablet: "Before God 's failed experiment with Leviathans, there was ANOTHER failed experiment called PEREZ HILTON and he was the most powerful creature in the whole universe! "

The Lucifer story is done, no need to bring him back into the fold.

Really? You're telling me they can't think of a good storyline if they bring him back, instead we will have Season 5 all over again? Please! He was baddie with much potential and if they ever bring him back they don't need to create the same story over again! There's totally many ways he can screw of humanity/ even go after the tablets why not? It doesn't have to be the whole Lucy vs. Michael fight (which never really existed in the first place lol!).

 

[Wyrminarrd]

They don't actually have to bring Lucifer back, they could just have the plot revolve around someone trying to free him again.

 

[Marvolo]

I want Lucifer back on the show, because of Mark Pellegrino. There is much more that could be done with that character, and the talents of Mark Pellegrino.

 

[Ken-Kaniff]

They don't actually have to bring Lucifer back, they could just have the plot revolve around someone trying to free him again.

That would be pointless! Just for the sake of mentioning Lucifer? Been there done that. I'd love if they bring him back, but like I said, have a different storyline! He can do some bad@$$ $h!t to humanity really and it will be really challenging for Sam & Dean, I mean we hardly saw him in Season 5 anyway!

And Marvolo, I agree, Mark was great as Satan! Also: "|There is much more that could be done with that character" CORRECT!!

 

[S. Grundy]

Yeah, his story is done. He was brought in to bring forth the Apocalypse, and Sam and Dean averted it. He doesn't like humanity and wants to destroy it, there's no point in treading that water again.

Also, if Lucifer were to come back, it wouldn't be Mark Pellegrino, because if you remember Lucifer burned through that vessel.

 

[Kar]

They missed their shot at bringing back Michael and Lucifer in season 7 if you ask me. Freeing them to kill the supposedly almighty Leviathans would have been cool in my opinion.

And I agree about the whole corporate feel the Leviathans had. It made sense for Dick cause of the form he took. But it was beaten to death. I'm also getting tired of it being used with the angels as well. It wasn't like this in 4 but ever since they've been talking like they're from Wall Street instead of Heaven. I think it started with Zachariah. It just needs to be toned down.

 

[S. Grundy]

That would have been dumb, and wouldn't have made a lick of narrative sense. There's no reason to bring them back, ever. There was a story to tell using those characters and they told it. People need to get over that.