Supes/Bats/WW in the CWverse?

[WBwins]

Do they exist in the CWverse?If so where are they?How would you want them introduced?

 

[Primal Slayer]

Yes Batman probably exists, he is probably in Gotham doing his own thang.

 

[TheComicbookKid]

What benefit is it to Arrow to have Supes/Bats/WW running around?

Flash is still too green at this point.

 

[Tec15]

They don't and I don't want them to be introduced, either.

 

[Rorschach2012]

Spoiler...

Spoiler

Bruce Wayne

exists in the CW universe.

If Supergirl is connected (she should be! Berlanti is working on the CW universe and Supergirl) then Superman will exist.

If Titans are connected to the CWverse, Batman exists

 

[TheComicbookKid]

Kate Spencer existed in the Arrowverse, but that didn't end up going anywhere.

I don't mind the three coming along after Arrow is done. They just tend to suck up all the air whenever they become involved.

Every thread in here about anything not Bats or Supes involves talking about how to bring them in.

 

[Micromind]

Kate Spencer existed in the Arrowverse, but that didn't end up going anywhere.

I don't mind the three coming along after Arrow is done. They just tend to suck up all the air whenever they become involved.

Every thread in here about anything not Bats or Supes involves talking about how to bring them in.

This.

 

[DrCosmic]

They don't. As you may know, the CW can't use Batman, Superman or Wonder Woman on the CW verse. The WB film division forbids it. Additionally, they can't use Ted Kord, The Blue Beetle, because the film division has plans for him. Perhaps anyone with plans can't be used by CW.

So if Superman, Batman and WW exist, they can never be seen or used. This means no matter how much the world is threatened by the events of Flash or Arrow, Superman will never show up to help. That means Superman will never be Superman. Perhaps Krypton never blew up and Kal-El is just kicking it with his dad doing science. This means no matter how scary and effective Batman is, no one will ever hear of Batman, and no stories will ever circulate about the Batman of Gotham City. This means Batman will never be Batman. Perhaps the Waynes were never shot. And Wonder Woman will never help either, and the news of this Goddess-Warrior-Diplomat will never be overheard on TV in the CW verse. This means Wonder Woman isn't Wonder Woman, and never will be. Perhaps she never left Themyscira. Perhaps Themyscira was never enchanted by the gods. I think it would be really cool if these things were alluded to, to cement that our heroes are the heroes of the Universe, and not someone we haven't seen yet.

Here's why that's awesome:
1. This means Arrow is the most awesome vigilante in the CW-verse. There's no one scarier, cooler, better at detective work, with more gadgets, more money or anything like that. There's no one else who can stop Ra's Al Ghul. Arrow is as good as it gets. The producers have said as much when asked about Batman showing up, they like Arrow being the best there is at what he does, and aren't interested in bringing in someone to out-Arrow Arrow on Arrow.

2. This means that Flash is the goodest good guy, and the most powerful superhero in the CW-verse. There is no one to look up to, no one who inspires people more than the Flash. There is no Superman that Flash is trying to be like. Everyone, every superhero with powers, looks to Barry Allen, the everyman, the nerd with girl problems, the down to earth good guy, as the epitome of what a superhero should be. Barry deserves that honor, imho. He's a great everyman character.

3. They don't have to coordinate with the film division or be controlled or limited in any way. They can just tell awesome Flash and Arrow stories and let the films fall where they may.

 

[Primal Slayer]

ok huh? There are big events that happen in the comics everyday where Batman/Superman/WonderWoman never show up to help, they just simply have their own thing going on.

 

[TheComicbookKid]

ok huh? There are big events that happen in the comics everyday where Batman/Superman/WonderWoman never show up to help, they just simply have their own thing going on.

So why do so many fans want to have them openly acknowledged?

Wanting Ra's to mention the Great Detective. Just assume he exist and let Arrow do his own thing.

 

[DrCosmic]

ok huh? There are big events that happen in the comics everyday where Batman/Superman/WonderWoman never show up to help, they just simply have their own thing going on.

There's lots of things that don't make any sense in comics. Comics get passes on tons of illogical stuff because they are already un-lifelike drawings for a captive audience where the passage of time is irreconcilable. "It's always been that way" works for comics, but not live action, because it hasn't always been that way on TV and movies.

I mean think about what you're saying. The world is being destroyed and Flash is too busy to help because he's... in a crime lab processing fingerprints? He's too busy to take the two seconds it would take to go and make sure the world he's solving crimes in exists tomorrow? Same with Superman, and most heroes. When you read what they're dealing with in their comics... they have plenty of time to go save the world from any threats, not just the ones that appear in their comic book. And imagine what it's like to live in that kind of world, where there is something about to destroy the world almost every single week. And the entire world waits for the one guy working on it to solve the problem, and if he doesn't, oh well, we all die. A world so incredibly saturated with world-ending threats that people have no choice but to live their lives the best they can and hope that Superman can handle it so that everyone, Green Lantern included, can live a normal life in the meantime, and then when Green Lantern is saving the world form being destroyed, Superman can have a normal life at the daily planet. Weird, and it works for comics, but not for TV. There aren't enough superheroes and they aren't proven enough to explain why someone would be doing their own thing instead of making sure they and their loved ones survive the night.

So why do so many fans want to have them openly acknowledged?

Wanting Ra's to mention the Great Detective. Just assume he exist and let Arrow do his own thing.

That assumption kinda breaks down the more time goes by where these incredible characters have absolutely no effect on the world. No one has ever compared Arrow to Batman. What does that tell you?

 

[Primal Slayer]

Meh, the world was ending every other week on Buffy and Angel and those two rarely helped each other out and they were only a couple hrs away from each other.

 

[rojac]

Spoiler...

Spoiler

Bruce Wayne

exists in the CW universe.

If Supergirl is connected (she should be! Berlanti is working on the CW universe and Supergirl) then Superman will exist.

If Titans are connected to the CWverse, Batman exists

Hmm. I was actually assuming that they were going to do a take on Supergirl that didn't require Superman.

The same thing could be done for Robin/Nightwing -- whichever version they're using in Titans.

Just because something is one way in the comics doesn't mean that it's going to be that way on TV or in the movies.

 

[Primal Slayer]

The only problem with connecting Titans or Supergirl to the CWverse, would be the fact that Arrow has covered some popular villains and powered them down. Brother Blood and Deathstroke are huge Titan enemies and I think making them more realistic wouldn't make it as much as when battling the Titans.

 

[Rorschach2012]

Hmm. I was actually assuming that they were going to do a take on Supergirl that didn't require Superman.

The same thing could be done for Robin/Nightwing -- whichever version they're using in Titans.

Just because something is one way in the comics doesn't mean that it's going to be that way on TV or in the movies.

IDK if you've been following the news, but when Titans and Supergirl were confirmed, it was implied by the trades (the most reputable source for movie news) that Batman exists in Titans universe and Superman exists in Supergirl's universe

 

[TheComicbookKid]

That assumption kinda breaks down the more time goes by where these incredible characters have absolutely no effect on the world. No one has ever compared Arrow to Batman. What does that tell you?

A lot of stuff breaks down when you think about it. Amanda Waller is able to launch missiles inside an American city without so much as an actual military unit putting boots on the ground?

No way.

I doesn't matter to me whether Batman exist or not. That's what I'm saying. The point of having other heroes (unnecessary to the story) hinted at is so fans can acknowledge their own favorites. That Batman has battled this Ra's. He's already beaten this Ra in their minds. Just let Oliver beat the League of Shadows and Ra.

 

[DrCosmic]

Meh, the world was ending every other week on Buffy and Angel and those two rarely helped each other out and they were only a couple hrs away from each other.

A couple hours is a big difference from a couple seconds.

 

[Rorschach2012]

if you're a comic book fan, and you don't want this universe to be as complete as possible you're weird.. and complete as possible means adding the trinity. They don't have to have big roles, but they should exist in this universe. They don't have to take anything away from the other heroes, stop making up stupid excuses for why they shouldn't exist in this universe. They SHOULD exist, they should just have very small roles, and they can be treated as mysterious, legendary figures

 

[DrCosmic]

A lot of stuff breaks down when you think about it. Amanda Waller is able to launch missiles inside an American city without so much as an actual military unit putting boots on the ground?

No way.

I doesn't matter to me whether Batman exist or not. That's what I'm saying. The point of having other heroes (unnecessary to the story) hinted at is so fans can acknowledge their own favorites. That Batman has battled this Ra's. He's already beaten this Ra in their minds. Just let Oliver beat the League of Shadows and Ra.

Launching missiles without boots on the ground is the order of the day bro, with controversy and cover ups included. That doesn't actually break down unless we just believe that shadow government agencies are full of integrity.

The challenge with fanservice is that it also creates expectation. If Batman exists... when are we going to see him? Why can't we see him? Is there a way you can get around that? Why doesn't anyone contact him for the CW Justice League? Creating a demand when you don't have the supply sets you up to be a disappointment. That's what happens when you connect to something you can't connect to. Much better to tease and easter egg characters you have access to, if you're actually trying to craft a long standing story instead of just titillate fans in the short term.

if you're a comic book fan, and you don't want this universe to be as complete as possible you're weird.. and complete as possible means adding the trinity. They don't have to have big roles, but they should exist in this universe. They don't have to take anything away from the other heroes, stop making up stupid excuses for why they shouldn't exist in this universe. They SHOULD exist, they should just have very small roles, and they can be treated as mysterious, legendary figures

So when Barry and Ollie form the Justice League to save the world, they should exclude the Trinity? Or go out of their way to explain how the Trinity can't be bothered to save the world? That's what you call complete?

Yes, I'm weird. I'm also right.

 

[TheComicbookKid]

Launching missiles without boots on the ground is the order of the day bro, with controversy and cover ups included. That doesn't actually break down unless we just believe that shadow government agencies are full of integrity.

Sure, for foreigners!!lol

I mean come on. We give up all hope of stopping Slade once the Starling City PD of 20 people can't stop him? Come on.

No national guard, no special forces attempt to quell the prisoners. They weren't invincible. Oh, well, just level the city. It's silly. I love it. It's silly.

The challenge with fanservice is that it also creates expectation. If Batman exists... when are we going to see him? Why can't we see him? Is there a way you can get around that? Why doesn't anyone contact him for the CW Justice League? Creating a demand when you don't have the supply sets you up to be a disappointment. That's what happens when you connect to something you can't connect to. Much better to tease and easter egg characters you have access to, if you're actually trying to craft a long standing story instead of just titillate fans in the short term.o

We're agreeing right? It's stupid to tease something for fanboy titillation. It has nothing to do with the story at hand.

 

[Rorschach2012]

So when Barry and Ollie form the Justice League to save the world, they should exclude the Trinity? Or go out of their way to explain how the Trinity can't be bothered to save the world? That's what you call complete?

Yes, I'm weird. I'm also right.

I want the big characters involved mostly if Titans and Supergirl are in the CWverse. I suspect that one of them will be in the CWverse, based on Pedowitz's comments, and the fact that Berlanti is working on Supergirl, Arrow, and Flash.

In the hypothetical Titans/Arrow/Supergirl/Flash universe, Batman can still be an urban legend in Gotham. Batman will be addressed on Titans, he can be written to be in the CWverse.

Superman is going to be addressed in Supergirl, and that Superman can be the CWverse Superman. He doesn't ever have to appear on the CW, and he would still technically be the CW Superman. Perhaps Superman in this universe is temporarily powerless or off planet.

 

[Rorschach2012]

The tv Justice League

Superman: Tom Welling (unconnected to Smallville)
Batman: Anson Mount
Wonder Woman: Bridget Regan
Green Lantern: Jensen Ackles
The Flash: Grant Gustin
Green Arrow: Stephen Amell
Black Canary: Katie Cassidy
The Atom: Brandon Routh
Firestorm: Robbie Amell

 

[Scarlet Spider]

Even though I don't think we'll be seeing the trinity on the small screen in the foreseeable future, if we're fancasting TV versions (especially on the CW), my choice for Diana Prince would be a Greek-Canadian actress by the name of Marie Avgeropoulos.

She's appeared on many CW shows and is currently a regular on one as well (The 100). When they were developing Amazon, I thought she would have been a perfect choice for a young Diana Prince, for it.

 

[DrCosmic]

Sure, for foreigners!!lol

I mean come on. We give up all hope of stopping Slade once the Starling City PD of 20 people can't stop him? Come on.

No national guard, no special forces attempt to quell the prisoners. They weren't invincible. Oh, well, just level the city. It's silly. I love it. It's silly.

An overzealous government agent is the kind of silly that doesn't undermine the story, but can actually deepen it. A superman that doesn't save the world is the kind of breakdown that undermines who Superman is.

We're agreeing right? It's stupid to tease something for fanboy titillation. It has nothing to do with the story at hand.

We are. I didn't know that.

 

[Boy Scout]

I assume they all exist, but Wonder Woman and Superman haven't gone public yet. Batman is perhaps doing his own thing and is of no concern to Starling City.

In my head, Arrow, Flash, and the rest represent the Golden Age of heroes and Batman, Superman, and Wonder Woman will usher in the Silver Age. We'll most likely never see that period of time, but I think a Trinity inspired by the feats of the champions before them is a great idea. They would learn from the previous generation's mistakes and carve their own futures as the greatest heroes we've ever known.