Thanos is not the be all end all of the Marvel Universe

[hadi]

HAhaha, you have certainty given me a laugh with your condescending comment about me watching those horrible FF movies or the Cartoons.

I am enthused by your "quick to judge me" or stereo type me based on what my opinion is of things that I or We can not control. Please put personal comments aside, I have not said anything about who you are or what you do. I have just talked about the movies.... THIS IS THE MARVEL FILMS FORUM CORRECT?

now your true in stating that Doom is a Marvel Universe villain. But where did he originate from? lol... i couldnt help but to laugh at that question because that pretty much sums it up. Wouldnt Marvel just do a Skrull/Kree war? or Kang? or Korvac? All of those are/would be better to use than Dr. Doom.

 

[ares834]

And Galactus doesn't work as a long term villain because he doesn't have a lot of depth. He comes and eats your world....that's nice for a movie but you can't really use that as something to build multiple movies around in and of itself. Like I said, most powerful =/= better villain.

Hmm, I could see them doing some cool stuff with Galactus actually. While your right, multiple movies couldn't be built around him I think that over the course of phase 4 or 5 they could have some brief mentions of something stirring in the cosmos. Maybe in the GotG film of that phase we could see refuges fleeing from The Devourer and in the Thor film Odin mentions that something has awakened. Heck, if the first FF film was released during this time they could somehow tie the cosmic rays that grant them their powers with Galactus.

 

[DrCosmic]

So I see a lot of people say, ever since Thanos was revealed at the end of Avengers, that he is the "baddest of the badies" in the Marvel Universe and there's really nowhere to go after him....but that's not true. The REAL biggest badass in the Marvel U is Doom...which people are overlooking. Yeah he's with the FF, but if Fox effs up and the rights revert back to Marvel, that's where you go from Thanos. Doom.

He's not the baddest, but he's pretty much the biggest. After him you kinda have to do a (very) soft refresh to cleanse the palette so you can fight non-cosmic villains and it not seem like a step down. And those villains need to be Doom-level in terms of being incredibly awesome on a personal level to make up for the lack of scale.

Doom will likely not be available. That's my thing, people keep dreaming about these properties coming back to Marvel, and not only is it not likely, but it comes at the cost of other properties like GOTG never seeing the light of day.

 

[R_Hythlodeus]

I guess it will come down to this:
Phase 1 - Loki
Phase 2 - Ultron
Phase 3 - Thanos
Phase 4 - Doom
Phase 5 - Masters of Evil
Phase 6 - Kang

 

[Mr. Dent]

HAhaha, you have certainty given me a laugh with your condescending comment about me watching those horrible FF movies or the Cartoons.

I am enthused by your "quick to judge me" or stereo type me based on what my opinion is of things that I or We can not control. Please put personal comments aside, I have not said anything about who you are or what you do. I have just talked about the movies.... THIS IS THE MARVEL FILMS FORUM CORRECT?

now your true in stating that Doom is a Marvel Universe villain. But where did he originate from? lol... i couldnt help but to laugh at that question because that pretty much sums it up. Wouldnt Marvel just do a Skrull/Kree war? or Kang? or Korvac? All of those are/would be better to use than Dr. Doom

Well what do you expect when you say he's only an FF villain, Thanos is better than him simply because he ties in GotG, and that he's only serviceable as a follow up villain in Avengers 2 (which also implies you didn't even realize Marvel doesn't own the rights to him) rather than the climax, and basically implying he's a throwaway villain in comparison to Thanos and even lower than Ultron.

And you sure are taking me saying "you must only know Doom through the movies and cartoon" hella personal and not actually offering a whole lot to convince me otherwise with how hysterically you're defending it. And comments like them just using "Kang, Korvac, or Skrull/Kree war" isn't helping your case either. He trumps all of those villains. More powerful or bigger =/= better villain. Loki with the scepter and an alien army is bigger and arguably more powerful than just Ultron but that doesn't make him/them better villains. Doom with the Cosmic Cube is just as powerful as anyone in the Marvel Universe sans Thanos with the Infinity Gauntlet anyway.

The only villain in the Marvel Universe that is in the same conversation as Doom is Thanos. It's sort of laughable you bring up villains like Kang and Korvac. Now those ARE follow up villains you'd just use in sequels and not the actual climax...well, Kang is somewhat arguable, but definitely Korvac.

And if Marvel ever actually gets the rights to be able to use the Skrull/Kree war as inspiration, an event like that isn't going to substitute for a villain like Doom. That's nearly like saying the alien invasion in Avengers substitutes for Thanos. Of course the Kree/Skrull war would have more intricacies and politics involved, but it's still a pretty bad comparison.

Anyway, I'm not sure what you're getting at with the "where did Doom come from" question.

Hmm, I could see them doing some cool stuff with Galactus actually. While your right, multiple movies couldn't be built around him I think that over the course of phase 4 or 5 they could have some brief mentions of something stirring in the cosmos. Maybe in the GotG film of that phase we could see refuges fleeing from The Devourer and in the Thor film Odin mentions that something has awakened. Heck, if the first FF film was released during this time they could somehow tie the cosmic rays that grant them their powers with Galactus.

I could see them sort of building up to the coming of Galactus like that. Hint at rumors of worlds being wiped off the map in GotG like you said and show Galactus working his way toward Earth leading up to another Avengers film. That would be a cool way to get the most out of him without making it silly.

He's not the baddest, but he's pretty much the biggest. After him you kinda have to do a (very) soft refresh to cleanse the palette so you can fight non-cosmic villains and it not seem like a step down. And those villains need to be Doom-level in terms of being incredibly awesome on a personal level to make up for the lack of scale.

Doom will likely not be available. That's my thing, people keep dreaming about these properties coming back to Marvel, and not only is it not likely, but it comes at the cost of other properties like GOTG never seeing the light of day.

My point is you don't need to do a soft-refresh, just go straight into Doom after introducing him in a FF film (this is assuming Marvel gets the rights back of course). Doom is just as cunning and devious as Thanos while being more personal because he IS on Earth. My stance is him being on Earth actually makes him a better villain, it's not a liability. As Joss said, how do you follow up bigger? You go deeper and more personal. Doom is also (imo) a better character in general than Thanos and always has been. The poster boy of Marvel villainism is Doom, not Thanos.

FF has the best chance of coming back to Marvel (although this thread obviously assumes they get the rights back). And I don't think a Guardians movie would have been sacrificed if they had the FF because if they really wanted to get deep into cosmic Marvel lore and live there, Guardians would always have been the best vehicle, even over the FF. FF deal in cosmic but they're still prominently Earth-based heroes.

 

[Mr. Dent]

I guess it will come down to this:
Phase 1 - Loki
Phase 2 - Ultron
Phase 3 - Thanos
Phase 4 - Doom
Phase 5 - Masters of Evil
Phase 6 - Kang

To me it's more like this:

Phase 1/2/3 - Thanos (Loki, Ultron as sub-villains)
Phase 4/5/6 - Doom (Korvac, Galactus as sub-villains)
Phase 7/8 - Kang

Obviously we're getting pretty arbitrary on predicting the phases and what not, but I count Thanos as being the villain of all three phases because he's pretty much the mastermind of all of them. Loki and Ultron are just sub villains leading up to him in the climax. Doom to me would act like that as well, being the mastermind of all three phases leading up to a confrontation between the Avengers and him in Latveria.

 

[Green Goblin]

I like the idea of Thanos being the big bad guy. I hope though TA3 doesn't end up being the avengers in space...

 

[Mr. Dent]

It would be sort of weird if it weren't. The Avengers never really fought Thanos anywhere but space in the comics, with the exception of his first appearance where he took on Iron Man and Drax.

 

[pr0xyt0xin]

Doom and Galactus sure... But they are out of reach. Not to mention being squandered.

 

[DrCosmic]

My point is you don't need to do a soft-refresh, just go straight into Doom after introducing him in a FF film (this is assuming Marvel gets the rights back of course). Doom is just as cunning and devious as Thanos while being more personal because he IS on Earth. My stance is him being on Earth actually makes him a better villain, it's not a liability. As Joss said, how do you follow up bigger? You go deeper and more personal. Doom is also (imo) a better character in general than Thanos and always has been. The poster boy of Marvel villainism is Doom, not Thanos.

FF has the best chance of coming back to Marvel (although this thread obviously assumes they get the rights back). And I don't think a Guardians movie would have been sacrificed if they had the FF because if they really wanted to get deep into cosmic Marvel lore and live there, Guardians would always have been the best vehicle, even over the FF. FF deal in cosmic but they're still prominently Earth-based heroes.

Physical proximity, like being on Earth, doesn't make things personal. Or else, me and my next door neighbor would be the best of friends. Emotional interactions make things personal, and Doom done right isn't personal for anyone except Reed Richards.

Marvel is only making two films each year. Which films should be cancelled so that Marvel Studios can make a Fantastic Four film?

I guess it will come down to this:
Phase 1 - Loki
Phase 2 - Ultron
Phase 3 - Thanos
Phase 4 - Doom
Phase 5 - Masters of Evil
Phase 6 - Kang

Not bad, mine's similar

If Phase 1- 3 is Loki-Ultron-Thanos with Thanos overarching...
Then Phase 4-6 would be Masters of Evil - HYDRA - Kang with Kang overarching.
Perhaps Phase 7-9, if such things exist could be Graviton - Supereme Intelligence - Grandmaster with Grandmaster overarching everything.

 

[Mr. Dent]

Obviously comparing you and your neighbor to a story with metaphorical structures is ridiculous.

And they don't need to "cancel" films. GotG may have come later, but that doesn't mean it or anything else would have been canceled because they have one extra franchise. The fact they're making Ant-Man before Doctor Strange is proof of that.

 

[pr0xyt0xin]

I guess it will come down to this:
Phase 1 - Loki
Phase 2 - Ultron
Phase 3 - Thanos
Phase 4 - Doom
Phase 5 - Masters of Evil
Phase 6 - Kang

In other words, 35 movies.


:P

I'd be happy with the roughly 18 movie franchise we are probably already getting.

 

[misjuevos]

is it possible to use galactus like they are going to use wanda and pietro? i mean just by never mentioning the Fantastic Four. with all this stuff going on in space, it would really suck if galactus isn't around at some point, or mentioned. for that matter how about the silver surfer also. if it works with quicksilver and wanda, i would hope it could work with other characters.

 

[Lord]

In other words, 35 movies.


:P

I'd be happy with the roughly 18 movie franchise we are probably already getting.

Marvel wants to make this neverending like Bond, so i can see them reaching a number like that. I imagine that by that time they will finally have the ground ready for Civil War just like so many fans are beguing for

 

[DrCosmic]

There's nothing metaphorical about "more personal because he IS on Earth." I pointed out how common biology and physical proximity do not make things personal. Same is true of Justice and Whirlwind, both mutants from New York... absolutely nothing personal, and they have much more in common than Dr. Doom and any Avenger.

How does making Ant-Man before Dr. Strange prove anything at all? The problem with your 'push back' theory is that once you push something back 3 years, it's time for the sequel to the thing you pushed it back for, so which do you push back then...

Let's imagine Marvel had Fantastic Four back last year. Here's there current schedule:
2014 - Cap2, GOTG
2015 - Avengers 2, Ant-Man
2016 - Unknown (Dr. Strange) Unknown (Thor 3)
2017 - Unknown (Cap 3) Unknown and Unannounced (????)

Let's say you had enough time to make a great FF movie for 2014, so you push back GOTG until 2017... but in 2017... do you make GOTG or do you make FF2?

With limited spots we already have Black Panther, Iron Fist, Runaways, Blade, Daredevil, and Ms. Marvel in some level of development. If FF comes back, at least one of those franchise will be pushed back indefinitely, until FF fails or stops making sequels... unless you're suggesting FF be a one-and-done type of franchise?

 

[H.U.S.T.L.E.]

I believe what Mr. Dent is getting at is the perception that some are insinuating - GOTG would have never have seen the light of day if FF had been in Marvel's clutches. I haven't seen anyone say that outright, but there does seem to be discussion that GOTG would be redundant if FF existed in the MCU. The quote below gets to what I'm speaking about... it seems as if you're saying FF should take precendence over GOTG in that scenario.

Let's say you had enough time to make a great FF movie for 2014, so you push back GOTG until 2017... but in 2017... do you make GOTG or do you make FF2?

Anyways, I *think* what he's saying is that there are several characters that haven't been greenlit or given a release date (like Dr. Strange), but Marvel still has every intention of making that movie. By that same logic, GOTG still would have been a film that is made if FF is a part of Marvel's rights, but it may have been in a different context.

Either way, it's all speculation based on a scenario that hasn't presented a problem for Marvel - they don't have the rights to FF now so GOTG is the logical choice here. It doesn't mean that we wouldn't have seen it at some point, it's just a matter of finding characters that make sense in the overall scheme of the story they want to tell throughout the MCU.

 

[DrCosmic]

Ah, I see how it could be taken that way. I used GOTG because it would be the most likely to push back. The same problem would come about if they pushed Cap2 back to 2017, or Ant-Man. Do you make the movie you pushed back, or do you make FF2?

While some might call it speculation, I "speculate" that Marvel will continue to make two films a year, make sequels for their films about 2-4 years apart and only postpone franchises that underperform or where actors age out/renegotiate. This leaves room for them to maintain about 6 franchises. Right now that's: Cap, Thor, Avengers, GOTG, Ant-Man and Strange. That's it. The only way to include another franchise is to A: Stop making films in one of these series or B: make sequels spaced out 4+ years apart, allowing you to include perhaps 2 additional franchises. I don't see Avengers 3 coming out in 2019, personally.

Now we could speculate that there will be no more Thors or Caps or Ant-Mans after 2018 freeing up those spots. We're also speculating in this scenario that there will not be any more Iron Man's or Hulks. Ant-Man would probably be your best bet to stop, but even then, putting FF in that spot means no Iron Fist, no Daredevil, Blade, etc...

There are fewer release dates than great potential movies. It is a zero sum game. For FF to be made by Marvel Studios, there's another great Marvel character that would not be made any other way that's not getting made.

 

[jaqua99]

Is he though? What he did in Infinity Gauntlet was pretty bad...but that's it. Doom has a far more lengthy track record of doing horrible **** to the Avengers/FF and going up against the entire Marvel U. Not to mention he's a far more personal villain than Thanos, due to being human himself and living on Earth, while being arguably just as dangerous if not more so. And Doom is actually known for being far more of a master planner than Thanos. Thanos has really only ever "masterminded" something in his first story arc in the Captain Marvel comics.

Thanos IS a big villain, maybe the second biggest, but he's never been what people are really making him out to have been in the comics. That guy was always Doom.

Doom is #2

Thanos has achieved godhood on multiple occasions. He collected the gems two different times, the cosmic cube. Can't forget "The End" when he destroyed the marvel universe. Hell, Doom was in that arc. wanted to take the Pharaohs power. He went back in time for his plans and failed, however in the same arc, Thanos succeeded where Doom failed, and went MUCH beyond what Doom was striving for.

When Thanos wants to do something "big and bad" it's universal, and beings like galactus and abstracts, and elders of the universe have gotten involved.

It depends on the story, but Thanos is a bigger threat

 

[H.U.S.T.L.E.]

Ah, I see how it could be taken that way. I used GOTG because it would be the most likely to push back. The same problem would come about if they pushed Cap2 back to 2017, or Ant-Man. Do you make the movie you pushed back, or do you make FF2?

While some might call it speculation, I "speculate" that Marvel will continue to make two films a year, make sequels for their films about 2-4 years apart and only postpone franchises that underperform or where actors age out/renegotiate. This leaves room for them to maintain about 6 franchises. Right now that's: Cap, Thor, Avengers, GOTG, Ant-Man and Strange. That's it. The only way to include another franchise is to A: Stop making films in one of these series or B: make sequels spaced out 4+ years apart, allowing you to include perhaps 2 additional franchises. I don't see Avengers 3 coming out in 2019, personally.

Now we could speculate that there will be no more Thors or Caps or Ant-Mans after 2018 freeing up those spots. We're also speculating in this scenario that there will not be any more Iron Man's or Hulks. Ant-Man would probably be your best bet to stop, but even then, putting FF in that spot means no Iron Fist, no Daredevil, Blade, etc...

There are fewer release dates than great potential movies. It is a zero sum game. For FF to be made by Marvel Studios, there's another great Marvel character that would not be made any other way that's not getting made.

I agree with practically everything you said here, especially the bold part at the end.

There's a ton of great characters to be explored without the FF - but even if the rights do revert, I could see Marvel holding off for a while. There's been some really solid ideas given on these boards on how you can incorporate them into the MCU & I think they'd make a great centerpiece for Phase IV and beyond if it does come back in-house.

 

[Mr. Dent]

There's nothing metaphorical about "more personal because he IS on Earth." I pointed out how common biology and physical proximity do not make things personal. Same is true of Justice and Whirlwind, both mutants from New York... absolutely nothing personal, and they have much more in common than Dr. Doom and any Avenger.

There is to me. He's more powerful than most of the cosmic entities in Marvel and he's just there, on Earth, living in Latveria where he holds diplomatic immunity and the power to start a third world war if he wanted. Everyone knows he's evil **** and he lives right amongst them and they can't do anything about it. It's ****ing ace and speaks to a lot of things about today's world. The fact that he's human, like all of them, while nearly possessing the power of Thanos, is also a great dichotomy.

He's just a great villain concept all around, and if you look at his backstory he could have easily been a hero but he believes only in himself and does what he sees fit. And unlike Thanos he isn't completely driven just by trying to please Death. Don't get me wrong, Thanos is a great character and he is built on a great theme and concept, but in the end he's still single note. Doom has far more layers. Doom could beat everyone, take all their ****, and then give it back just because it was too easy (and he has...).

Anyway though...lol.

How does making Ant-Man before Dr. Strange prove anything at all? The problem with your 'push back' theory is that once you push something back 3 years, it's time for the sequel to the thing you pushed it back for, so which do you push back then...

Let's imagine Marvel had Fantastic Four back last year. Here's there current schedule:
2014 - Cap2, GOTG
2015 - Avengers 2, Ant-Man
2016 - Unknown (Dr. Strange) Unknown (Thor 3)
2017 - Unknown (Cap 3) Unknown and Unannounced (????)

Let's say you had enough time to make a great FF movie for 2014, so you push back GOTG until 2017... but in 2017... do you make GOTG or do you make FF2?

Hustle summed up my thoughts pretty well. And with Ant-Man, I'm pointing out Marvel's willingness to adapt a lesser property before a bigger one. Strange is more popular than Ant-Man and arguably has more potential as a film franchise, but Marvel is pushing out Ant-Man first. Because they're not afraid to take risks. Just because FF is back wouldn't mean they'd abandon one of their lesser properties that they could cultivate into a new franchise.

With limited spots we already have Black Panther, Iron Fist, Runaways, Blade, Daredevil, and Ms. Marvel in some level of development. If FF comes back, at least one of those franchise will be pushed back indefinitely, until FF fails or stops making sequels... unless you're suggesting FF be a one-and-done type of franchise?

People are sleeping on Inhumans.

As for FF being one and done, it doesn't have to be that way. They'd just get to the other movies eventually. Just like how they had Iron Man's franchise run its course and now they're moving on to other characters' solo films. obviously they'll come back to the franchise one day, but for now they're giving it a break. The same would happen with FF. And the great part about the MCU is that the characters can show up in other films even though their own franchise is on stand by. So the FF could potentially show up in another cosmic franchise, or maybe even a big cosmic event movie. And obvious Silver Surfer and Galactus (and his other heralds) can be used in a host of other places.

Doom is #2

Thanos has achieved godhood on multiple occasions. He collected the gems two different times, the cosmic cube. Can't forget "The End" when he destroyed the marvel universe. Hell, Doom was in that arc. wanted to take the Pharaohs power. He went back in time for his plans and failed, however in the same arc, Thanos succeeded where Doom failed, and went MUCH beyond what Doom was striving for.

When Thanos wants to do something "big and bad" it's universal, and beings like galactus and abstracts, and elders of the universe have gotten involved.

It depends on the story, but Thanos is a bigger threat

Like I keep saying, more powerful =/= best villain. To me, and honestly I'd say most Marvel fans, or at least before they introduced Thanos at the end of Avengers, Doom has always been THE Marvel villain. He's the poster boy for Marvel villainism. He's cunning, ambitious, and possess power on a cosmic scale while being a human. The fact Doom is #2 in strength amongst contemporary Marvel villains as a mere human is proof of how great a villain he is.

 

[DrCosmic]

There is to me. He's more powerful than most of the cosmic entities in Marvel and he's just there, on Earth, living in Latveria where he holds diplomatic immunity and the power to start a third world war if he wanted. Everyone knows he's evil **** and he lives right amongst them and they can't do anything about it. It's ****ing ace and speaks to a lot of things about today's world. The fact that he's human, like all of them, while nearly possessing the power of Thanos, is also a great dichotomy.

He's just a great villain concept all around, and if you look at his backstory he could have easily been a hero but he believes only in himself and does what he sees fit. And unlike Thanos he isn't completely driven just by trying to please Death. Don't get me wrong, Thanos is a great character and he is built on a great theme and concept, but in the end he's still single note. Doom has far more layers. Doom could beat everyone, take all their ****, and then give it back just because it was too easy (and he has...).

He is a great concept, that's never been in doubt, but that's only personal if it becomes relevant to the characters' lives. As you implied, there's lots of people in the world like that, but none of the Avengers take it personally do they? So if they don't take, I dunno, Idi Amin personally, why would they take Dr. Doom in some other country minding his own business personally.

They can make him personal, of course, like they made Loki personal, but he is not inherently more personal and if they do make him personal it will not be 'because he's on Earth.' That's what I'm saying. Great character... not more personal, neither is he generally portrayed that way. If anything he's extremely IMpersonal in dispensing his uberness.

Hustle summed up my thoughts pretty well. And with Ant-Man, I'm pointing out Marvel's willingness to adapt a lesser property before a bigger one. Strange is more popular than Ant-Man and arguably has more potential as a film franchise, but Marvel is pushing out Ant-Man first. Because they're not afraid to take risks. Just because FF is back wouldn't mean they'd abandon one of their lesser properties that they could cultivate into a new franchise.

So... you're talking about pushing back another franchise 10+ years? In a world as uncertain as this one, indefinite postponement is usually the same as canceling. I doubt any FF fan would feel very confident in an FF franchise that Marvel "fully intended" to start after GOTG had run its course, with no assurance GOTG would only run 3 films.

Them being willing to take risks doesn't conjure up the money and time for more films. They would logistically have to virtually abandon some property (but not really abandon, because they intend to make it someday, say 2025 or so... as long as something better or more opportune doesn't happen before that...)

But you're right, I did forget about Inhumans and how much Marvel wants to do that.

 

[Captain Marvel]

Thanos as a threat is possibly the biggest, but he's certainly not the most important is he? In all these years he hasn't had that many appearance.

He's had fewer appearances than Doom for the same reason Doom has had fewer appearances than Scorpion. The bigger the threat the less you can use him while still retaining their potency. Thanos appears less often than Doom because he IS the bigger threat. You can't have universe-shaking events on a regular basis, after all. And if you have Thanos making an appearance without an attendant universe shaking event, then you're not using Thanos right.

As for Thanos Vs. Dr. Doom, sorry, but Thanos is the bigger menace of the two. Dr. Doom never graduated from being the arch-nemesis of a single team of superheroes, the Fantastic Four (Who aren't even the most powerful team). Thanos, however, has moved into the position of universal threat and arch-nemesis of the entire Marvel Universe. So yes, Thanos IS the end-all and be-all of the Marvel Universe.

 

[Captain Marvel]

And Doom is a MARVEL UNIVERSE villain, not just a FF villain.

Incorrect. He has been and remains a primarily Fantastic Four villain. Has he appeared in other titles and fought other heroes? Sure. But so has most every other villain. Loki has fought the X-Men several times. Magneto has fought the Avengers several times. The Juggernaut has fought Spider-Man, the Hulk, and Thor a few times. Even the Mandarin has fought the X-Men.

Loki is still a Thor villain, though. Magneto and Juggernaut are still X-Men villains. Mandarin is still an Iron Man villain. Likewise, Dr. Doom is still a member of the Fantastic Four's rogues gallery. He hasn't graduated from that role because that's where most of his appearances occur. If Dr. Doom shows up, then nine-times-out-of-ten it's in a Fantastic Four comic, and that's because he's still predominantly a Fantastic Four villain. He's not a universal Marvel Universe villain the way Thanos is.

 

[hadi]

Thank you!!!

lol.

I see your love for Doom. He is a good Villain... But to the Avengers there are better villains. Doom is not the poster child for MCU villains. Ultron would be that guy for Avengers... that Reoccurring villain. Ultron to avengers is like Doom to FF. You know what... I'm even gonna say it cause I just feel that much confident about it..... Ultron is better/stronger than Doom.... Boom I said it! you want me to pull out the guns and have info to back it up just let me know.

Now I could totally see them using Kang if they could start introducing time travel after Avengers 3 or GotG. I don't think that GotG was made cause marvel didnt have rights to FF. I think FF is old and played out. And that they wanted to start introducing new members and characters from the MCU.
​

 

[Captain Marvel]

I agree with the above that Ultron is a more quintessentially Avengers villain than Dr. Doom, not the least of which because of his personal connection to so many of them (Although I'd still kill to see Doom appear in an Avengers movie, although he's definitely not the "Ultimate Avengers Villain" that the OP makes him out to be). But to be fair, Doom DID make Ultron his ***** in Secret Wars. But then again that WAS the 80's. Since then Ultron also had his time as a universal threat with Annihilation: Conquest, whereas Doom's still getting knocked around by Ben Grimm and Johnny Storm.

Incidentally, I REALLY hope that Guardians of the Galaxy succeeds at the box office and gets sequels, because I'd love to see an Annihilation: Conquest adaptation. How great would it be to see Avengers: Age of Ultron, think Ultron's defeated, only for Ultron to reappear in the galaxy at large and become a threat to the major galactic powers like the Kree Empire and so on in a Guardians of the Galaxy followup?