The Amazing Spider-Man The Amazing Spider-Man General Discussion & Speculation Thread - Part 10

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Is this thing about Peter´s dad experimenting on his kid coming from somewhere?
Or is this just another ridiculous "Aunt-Carnage" kind of speculation?

Because it is just a horrible idea.
And I´ve seen NOTHING to support it in the trailer.
 
Honestly, I don't see why people are making such a big deal if Webb changes the origin. I think, if anything, we should all embrace it!

I personally think its cool. Not only is the general audience getting something different but so are the die hard Spider-Man fans as well. That's exciting! Sure it might not be close to the source material but honestly, why should it be. Webb and co want to do something different. Let them have their fun. Webb has already assured that all elements will be there from the mythos. They will just be presented differently.

That's really cool because now our generation might get our own way of Spider-Man's origin. And maybe this new origin will have a little bit more substance?

Webb is infamously known for crafting emotional experiences. I welcome the change and I think a lot of fans should as well.

And if it sucks in the film, do what we always do...

Grab your torches and pitchforks. :hehe:
 
I'm getting sick of this whole Peter's dad experimenting on Peter business. What exactly makes people think that that's what's going to happen?

Richard loves his Peter a lot. You can see that in the trailer, so why exactly would he experiment on his one and only son?
Maybe his Dad experimented on himself, and it passed over to Peter? Maybe he was born with whatever it is?
 
Okay, I just want to gather all evidences for our I-hope-it-is-not-true theory.

Evidence:
The card of with picture of Richard-Genetics Laboratory
The spider bit Peter
Peter was looking at the two DNAs
The web that came out Peter's neck

What did I miss? Anybody?
 
Yes, I don't get where people have come up with the idea that Peter was experimented on, nor why - if it's true - it somehow undermines WHO Peter is and WHAT makes him special.

Let's say his Dad DID messed with his DNA...so what? How does that change his character? How does this change the fact that he's a smart, nerdy, shy kid who gets spider powers, and uses them poorly before learning to use them responsibly after Uncle Ben's death? It's not like he even KNOWS that is what happened and walks around school with girls swooning over him because he has super genes.

People seem to be hanging on the fact that because his DNA being messed with changes Peter because now instead of "anyone" being able to be Spider-Man, now, ONLY Peter can.

Guess what?

ONLY Peter can be Spider-Man, regardless of what's in his DNA prior to the spider bite. It is PETER'S personality, his life lessons, his desire and his mistakes and need for repentance that MAKES Spider-Man. It has NOTHING to do with his DNA. And remember, it the comics, he learned of the Spider-totem, which is pretty much a mystical version of the dad-messing-with-his-DNA angle.

Yes, as an audience, we know that only Peter Parker is Spider-Man--it's his story that we want to read and watch, after all. But on a symbolic level, Spider-Man is supposed to be Marvel's equivalent of the everyman, the "hero who could be you" and that Peter Parker is essentially supposed to be "one of us." Peter doesn't gain his great powers as a result of having unique genes or coming from the right background or social class; he gets them through a simple quirk of fate, in that he just happened to be at the right place at the right time (or the wrong place at the wrong time, depending upon how you look at it). If Peter Parker is supposed to be "one of us," then symbolically any one us could have been in his position, suddenly finding great power bestowed upon them. The question behind the overall story with Spider-Man is what do we do with that power?

Because you're right: it has nothing to do with his DNA. But the film, even though it could very well try to make the case that "it's not who you are but what you do that matters," is ironically making it all about his DNA. Because if not for his special DNA, then he could not acquire his spider-powers. In other words, the film suggests, on a thematic level, that Peter's greatness is predetermined, that he is one of the "chosen few" who can become great, for good or ill, because of his special abilities.

People can have more than one motivation. It's his desireto learn about his parents that starts the ball rolling. This does not take away from Ben at all. In fact, to me, it seems like it will help ACCENTUATE Ben's importance. Being obsessed with his parents might cause a rift between Peter and Ben, which would be a much more believable, and dramatic version of the little fight that Peter and Ben had in SM1. Upon his death, Peter will realize that by obsessing over his parents, he did not appreciate Ben.

Yes, but when one is telling a story, there is usually a single motive a character which drives all the other motives. In the comics, films, cartoons, etc. Peter's primary motivation is one of guilt, to make amends for his culpability in his uncle's death. Current Spider-Man editor, Steve Wacker put it much better than I can in a recent interview he made with CBR:

CBR News:
...Peter Parker became Spider-Man when he was bitten by a radioactive spider, but Spider-Man didn't become a hero until his Uncle Ben was tragically murdered by a burglar Peter let escape a previous crime he witnessed but didn't involve himself in preventing. Since then, guilt has been a strong force in Peter's life, but he has come a long way since then. So, is Spider-Man still primarily driven by guilt? Or does it not have as a big a hold on him as it used to?


Steve Wacker: I think it's his defining characteristic, overall. That's the big bang for Spider-Man -- the moment he lets his Uncle Ben down. It sort of defines the whole book. The reason the book was successful was because, arguably for the first time, we saw a character whose life as a hero put a cost on their regular life. They paid a price for the gift that they were given. To me, that's the whole ball game. The minute that goes away you've got a different character.


In terms of the status quo of the ongoing book, I don't think it's a good idea to have Peter get completely over that guilt that he feels about letting his Uncle Ben down. I think what makes him a great hero is that he's trying to make up for that fatal flaw every day. It's Greek drama.



So a Peter Parker whose primary motivation is find out the truth about his parents disappearance and along the way live up to the ideals and expectations of his parents essentially makes him a different character because he now he is driven by different motives to do what he does.


Also, you pointing out that his obsession with trying to find the truth about his parents making him overlook the importance of Uncle Ben actually highlights another problem with the focus on the parents. In the original comics, and even in the Raimi films, Peter Parker had a loving, healthy relationship with his Aunt and Uncle; they were, for all practical purposes, his mom and dad, even if they weren't his biological parents. The problem for Peter wasn't that he lost his mom and dad--it was that he wanted to be popular, to have lots of friends and everybody to look up to him. And in doing so, it ironically cost him the one person who already was his best friend and more. That argument in the car with Ben in the first movie? That's Peter being frustrated over what he thought was his Uncle treating him like a child when he thought he was already becoming a man, too busy thinking about his own needs and taking his love and friendship with his Uncle too much for granted.


Stories are full of "coincidences" if you want to look at it that way. But really its as simple as cause and effect. One event leads to another, which leads to another, etc.

Having some coincidence is fine. But if you have too many then it strains credulity, undermining the "suspension of disbelief" that's very important in a story like this.

Heh, you should be in the Olympic Long Jump competition, because that was one of the biggest jumps to a conclusion I've seen lately.

Ignoring the fact that we have NO IDEA if the rumor concerning Peter's DNA is true, there is NOTHING that suggests Peter getting bitten was some elaborate design by his father. ALL we know is that Peter's parents left in a hurry and were never heard from again. Plenty of stuff would have been left behind. The suitcase is a plot device - nothing more. Its what starts Peter's desire to find out more about his parents.

Again, if this rumor is accurate, the way Peter gains his powers is that his father did something do Peter's DNA that specifically requires the bite from a spider--the DNA of which Peter's father also apparently tampered with--in order to activate Peter's powers. And then, about ten years later well after his father has disappeared, Peter just happens to find his dad's briefcase, which just so happens to find an ID card and a pair of glasses belonging to his dad, which Peter just so happens to wear to pass himself off as his own dad to get into Oscorp--in spite of how many updates to the security Oscorp would have undergone all that time--and just so happens to find a room with all those spiders, in which one of them just so happens to bite Peter and "activate" his dormant powers, which just so happens to be what his dad years ago designed his own son's DNA to do.

To be clear, I'm NOT saying that Peter's father actually had this all planned out. What I am saying is that in order for this story to work, it requires one massive coincidence after another to the point of ridiculousness. And the alternative, that somehow this actually was all planned and foreseen by his dad is even more ridiculous. That's why, if this plot development about Peter's powers is true, it's a massive plot hole.

The second sentence doesn't change the first. The second sentence - if true (which again, we have no idea, and I've yet to see any evidence that supports the hysterics) - does nothing but add a little bit more story to the event, it fleshes it out. It can still be easily explained as "Peter Parker gains super-powers after being bitten by a radioactive spider." because that is STILL what happens.

Ah, but the point is that, according to the rumor, the spider DOESN'T actually give him powers because Peter had these powers all along. It just takes the spider's bite to "jump start" them. That's different that simply saying "the spider gave Peter his powers." Heck, even the totem origin (which just as equally unnecessary) even has the spider give Peter powers via the bite. Having the powers JUST be the result of the spider bite and nothing more has worked for all these years without unnecessary embellishment because it follows the KISS rule. And if you have to over-explain something, then maybe you should have just left it well enough alone.

Once again, we have no idea if this is true, and therefore we have no idea of the context of the rumor. I would agree that if his dad just came home one day and decided he wanted to dick around with his son's DNA, that'd be a problem. BUT not knowing what the context is - why he did it, and what, exactly did he do if anything - doesn't allow us to judge his actions. Even still, I, as an audience member, WOULD care about Peter uncovering the mystery, because I WOULD want to know why.

But you see, that's my point--if Peter's dad did mess around with his own son's DNA, you have to come up with a VERY good reason why he felt compelled to do so. Otherwise, we would absolutely hate this guy's guts and feel that Peter is wasting his time trying to figure out what happened to a guy who not only "left him" but also "abused him."
 
Again... Could someone tell me where is this nonsense coming from, please?
 
@stillanerd:

So you want the original origin where Peter gets his powers from a spider bite...but why would a spider with radioactivity cause a person to have powers? It makes sense if this rumor about Peter's father is true b/c it actually adds more intelligence to the origin. Radioactivity ALWAYS GAVE people powers in the 60's. I think it's a bit too immature to leave the origin how it is. Let's grow up and add some intelligence to stories so they make sense. We aren't children. We all understand science.

You're right that having a radioactive spider bite granting Peter powers is a little silly nowadays given what we know about radioactivity. Ultimate Spider-Man had the spider be a escaped test subject for a super-soldier serum; the Sam Raimi movies had it be a genetically-altered "super spider"; in Spider-Man: Noir, the spider that bites Peter is one of many that gets free from a broken idol of a spider; in Marvel 1602, the spider that bites Peter has been hexed by magic. The point is, the spider is the MacGuffin; it doesn't matter how the spider is able to give Peter his powers, so long as it the only thing that gives Peter his powers and that Peter, prior to the bite, is a physically ordinary person with normal DNA just like everyone else.

It is really funny when the reboot was announced alot of people was complaining that they had to do the same origin all over again. I didn't want either.

Stillanerd( I know you are from the CBR), tell me... do you think all people want to see the same origin again?

I can NOT believe that CBR forum people didnt impress with the amazing trailer AT ALL.

Well, speaking for myself, I would have rather they approached the origin they way David Fincher would have gone with with it had he actually got the gig--just briefly recap it in the opening credits a la The Incredible Hulk and move on from there. Because everybody already knows the origin of Spider-Man so why waste screen time telling it all over again? Or, if you were going to revisit the origin, show it in a series of flashbacks, but with the focus more on events that affect the main story in "the present" a la Lost. For instance, if the main story involves Peter meeting Gwen for the first time, you can have it be revealed that Gwen was actually there during the day Peter was bitten by the spider but Peter didn't notice her before. Or have the scene be shown from her perspective, not realizing why Peter suddenly has to leave the room and is getting ill, etc.

Okay, I just want to gather all evidences for our I-hope-it-is-not-true theory.

Evidence:
The card of with picture of Richard-Genetics Laboratory
The spider bit Peter
Peter was looking at the two DNAs
The web that came out Peter's neck

What did I miss? Anybody?

Richard Parker's chalkboard as shown in the trailer:

04.jpg


*The spider under glass on his desk.
*Richard Parker telling Peter on the night he leaves him with his Aunt and Uncle "You'll be safe here."
*The shadowy figure in Connor's cell wanting to know "Did you tell the boy about his father?"
*And of course, the quote from the trailer "Do you think what happened to you, Peter, was an accident? Do you have any idea what you really are?"
 
New trailer was a lot better than the last two. Couple of really iffy cgi moments (burning car) and the lamest action shot of skateboarding ever but it was a pretty good trailer. Still not getting the goosebumps but I remain cautiously optimistic until we start getting reviews.
 
New trailer was a lot better than the last two. Couple of really iffy cgi moments (burning car) and the lamest action shot of skateboarding ever but it was a pretty good trailer. Still not getting the goosebumps but I remain cautiously optimistic until we start getting reviews.
Really? I actually thought the fire looked really good. There were some other moments that didn't have the best CGI, like the shot of Lizard and the green gas.
 
Well yeah that looked eh-ish too. From all the talks about practical stunts and effects...this movie seems to be loaded with cgi. There was so much cgi in that trailer. Lizard looks to be full cgi all the time and most of the swinging seems cgi apart from the under the bridge sequence.

But no...the burning car seemed eh to me...it seemed really cgi-y.

I wish we could have heard Lizzie talk or roar or something. All and all...it was a good/average trailer.
 
It would be pretty cool if they found a way to practically film a car actually hanging off a bridge and burning. I have to say tgat would definitely look better, but I'm satisfied with what we got especially because I like how colors blend. It just looks vibrant.
 
Saw the trailer in 3d before the Avengers twice now and it looks dope
 
Can anyone confirm for me if James Horner is the composer?
 
Can anyone confirm for me if James Horner is the composer?
Horner is doing the score.

Music in the film. He just heard James Horner’s first cue for the film, which he was really happy with. He wanted someone who could do both grandeur and intimacy. I also tried to find out what songs would be in the movie and if he went after any bands but Webb just smiled and wouldn’t answer.
http://collider.com/marc-webb-amazing-spider-man-interview/153084/
 
I really liked the third trailer. I can't wait to see this movie, but I sure hope they won't spend too much time on the origin.
 
I just hope that we have some good strength feats in ASM. I guess holding on to a SUV is a good feat, but hopefully there will be many others. People take it for granted just how strong he really is.
 
^ I think he'll perform some more of them in the final battle at the top of the Oscorp tower. Maybe he'll have to stop the antenna from falling, who knows.
 
Now that I think about it, this movie really will have a LOT of action. First, some "spidey stopping petty crimes" probably, then lizard fights: library, sewer, bridge, Oscorp building. Doesn't matter if two of those are linked, that scene would still be at least 1,5 the lenght of a normal battle scene
 
Yeah some of the CGI looked a little too cartoony especially the burning car bridge scene. Considering how far away the release date is they are still going to be working on the CGI for quite a while. They got a pretty nice post production schedule it is usually the rushed projects that tend to have questionable CGI. (Ahem...Fox....)
 
Yeah some of the CGI looked a little too cartoony especially the burning car bridge scene. Considering how far away the release date is they are still going to be working on the CGI for quite a while. They got a pretty nice post production schedule it is usually the rushed projects that tend to have questionable CGI. (Ahem...Fox....)

To me the burning car cgi looks almost stylized, but I guess that's just me
 
To me the burning car cgi looks almost stylized, but I guess that's just me

Well it isn't laughably bad. I have a 92 inch screen with projector in my room and I have watched the trailer a few times in high definition on it. It just needs touching up. Fire is probably one of if not the hardest effect to do so I am sure that is why it is coming off as fake looking to me. This is just a preview though the final product I am sure will looked better.
 
Wait a second, David ****ing Fincher was somehow in the list of people who were offered this?

Now THAT would had been a game changer...
 
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