The Amazing Spider-Man

[TheCorpulent1]

Of course, I keep forgetting that "regular ongoing penciler" now means "penciler for a handful of issues before he/she moves onto another project." I hate the creator turnover rate these days. I want more Brubaker/Perkins/Epting Captain America and Johns/Kolins Flash and even Bendis/Bagley USM runs rather than the here today, gone tomorrow runs we've been getting on a lot of comics..

 

[PhotoJones]

Of course, I keep forgetting that "regular ongoing penciler" now means "penciler for a handful of issues before he/she moves onto another project." I hate the creator turnover rate these days. I want more Brubaker/Perkins/Epting Captain America and Johns/Kolins Flash and even Bendis/Bagley USM runs rather than the here today, gone tomorrow runs we've been getting on a lot of comics..

I'm sure a part of the problem is related to work ethic, but the fact remains that art today is more advanced the art of yesteryear, and it just takes a longer amount of time.

On the other hand, those guys you mentioned in addition to guys like Guy Davis, Fegredo, Yu and Ottley pump out issue after issue of quality work without skipping a beat.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

It's a lot of factors. Yes, the higher quality art of today sometimes takes a lot longer to produce, but that's why you have fill-in artists. Another part of the problem, however, is this new mentality that the artist must remain consistent on big-name teams at all times. You want the big name, but the big name can't handle a monthly schedule, but you can't use a fill-in because you want the big name, and around and around it goes. I sometimes wish the big 2 would either use fill-ins better or just cancel all their ongoings and make everything a series of minis, where you can assure one artist has the time necessary to complete the whole series before it's solicited. Granted, the latter is kind of what they've already moved to--trade-sized mini-series that just happen to have the ongoing title's name rather than individual mini-series titles.

 

[PhotoJones]

It's a lot of factors. Yes, the higher quality art of today sometimes takes a lot longer to produce, but that's why you have fill-in artists. Another part of the problem, however, is this new mentality that the artist must remain consistent on big-name teams at all times. You want the big name, but the big name can't handle a monthly schedule, but you can't use a fill-in because you want the big name, and around and around it goes. I sometimes wish the big 2 would either use fill-ins better or just cancel all their ongoings and make everything a series of minis, where you can assure one artist has the time necessary to complete the whole series before it's solicited. Granted, the latter is kind of what they've already moved to--trade-sized mini-series that just happen to have the ongoing title's name rather than individual mini-series titles.

The series of minis is working pretty well for Hellboy and BPRD. The latter, even includes the "real" issue number on the inside cover as if it were an ongoing. I wouldn't mind if Marvel did that. They won't. But I wouldn't mind it.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Yeah, I like the BPRD mini structure. Hellboy's minis have been far fewer and farther between, though. So long as Marvel stuck to a series of minis that came out uninterrupted from month to month, that would be cool.

 

[PhotoJones]

Yeah, I like the BPRD mini structure. Hellboy's minis have been far fewer and farther between, though. So long as Marvel stuck to a series of minis that came out uninterrupted from month to month, that would be cool.

Hellboy's slow because Mignola's slow.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

I thought Mignola just decided to stop doing Hellboy for a while. Anyway, he's got Fegredo now. I hope we get a mostly uninterrupted flow of Hellboy minis like we've gotten with BPRD now.

 

[PhotoJones]

I thought Mignola just decided to stop doing Hellboy for a while. Anyway, he's got Fegredo now. I hope we get a mostly uninterrupted flow of Hellboy minis like we've gotten with BPRD now.

Fegredo's supposedly fairly quick. And the movie tied Mignola up for a while, but he's notoriously slow.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Darkness Calls has been timely despite the fact that the second movie is currently in production, right?

 

[PhotoJones]

Darkness Calls has been timely despite the fact that the second movie is currently in production, right?

It's about a year and a half late. But since the first issue dropped, yes it's been timely.

 

[PhotoJones]

Reposted from elsewhere:

Amazing Spider-Man #542 - There's something in this book that I'm not sure was intentional on JMS or Garney's part. I can only assume it is, considering how perfectly fitting it is when you take into account the scene's location. If in fact it is a coincidence, though...well, it's a great one. In the middle of the prison, in front of all the prisnors, after Peter beats the living snot out of Fisk, he picks him up by the fat of his chest...and proceeds to *****slap the holy hell out of him. Not once or twice. TEN times. That's a beating. It's such a brutal, one-sided beat down, that I almost wish Brubaker hasn't been using Fisk in Daredevil. We knew that whatever might have occured in this issue, Fisk would have been fine since he's now out of prison and hiring minors to his dirty work. I really would have liked to see Fisk been removed from the spotlight for a while after this...just excruciating display of power by Peter. It seriously would be hard to watch in person, in real life. Even knowing the circumstances, I would have probably still looked away.

Garney is to be praised every bit as much as JMS on the intensity of that "fight". I know I say it everytime I review this book, but he's great. I'll really miss him when this title goes thrice-monthly.

There's still no advancement of the plot as far as May's condition is concerned, and we're left with that ominous cover for next issue with the sorrowed Spidey pulling back the sheets of a seemingly dead person on a slab. I still don't think it's May and it's definitely not MJ, but if I'm being honest...I'm not really sure who it could be. We'll find out soon enough...

 

[LouFerignoDemon]

Reposted from elsewhere:

Amazing Spider-Man #542 - There's something in this book that I'm not sure was intentional on JMS or Garney's part. I can only assume it is, considering how perfectly fitting it is when you take into account the scene's location. If in fact it is a coincidence, though...well, it's a great one. In the middle of the prison, in front of all the prisnors, after Peter beats the living snot out of Fisk, he picks him up by the fat of his chest...and proceeds to *****slap the holy hell out of him. Not once or twice. TEN times. That's a beating. It's such a brutal, one-sided beat down, that I almost wish Brubaker hasn't been using Fisk in Daredevil. We knew that whatever might have occured in this issue, Fisk would have been fine since he's now out of prison and hiring minors to his dirty work. I really would have liked to see Fisk been removed from the spotlight for a while after this...just excruciating display of power by Peter. It seriously would be hard to watch in person, in real life. Even knowing the circumstances, I would have probably still looked away.

Garney is to be praised every bit as much as JMS on the intensity of that "fight". I know I say it everytime I review this book, but he's great. I'll really miss him when this title goes thrice-monthly.

There's still no advancement of the plot as far as May's condition is concerned, and we're left with that ominous cover for next issue with the sorrowed Spidey pulling back the sheets of a seemingly dead person on a slab. I still don't think it's May and it's definitely not MJ, but if I'm being honest...I'm not really sure who it could be. We'll find out soon enough...

Just as easily could be nobody dies.

 

[PhotoJones]

Just as easily could be nobody dies.

That could be, as well. Although, that'd be a hugely misleading cover, even by Marvel's standards.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Ugh, this issue just did not work for me. "Back in Black" as a whole doesn't work for me. It's not the dark tone, it's not the black costume, it's not the lack of wisecracks--it's Peter's throwing around death threats. It's tacky, it's ultimately meaningless, and, worst of all, it's not Spider-Man. May is in critical condition with very little hope to live. I get that. But one would think Peter might remember the reason he didn't kill Ben's killer after Ben actually did die; it's because he'd been raised to value life. Ben and May would never want Peter to kill anyone, under any circumstances. That's part of the whole "with great power comes great responsibility" mantra, which has become so overused at Marvel, in spite of the newly gray morality of a lot of their heroes, that it's become little more than lip service. If Peter goes ahead and kills Fisk (which I know he won't, but that's the moral conflict this story hinges on), he will have lost the meaning of that mantra completely. Has Peter not once stopped to consider that killing Fisk is the absolute 100% opposite of what May would want? "An eye for an eye" is morally repugnant, which Peter has literally always known, yet now he's faced with the same tragedy he started his career on--the death of a parental figure--and where he knew and understood Ben's message about power and responsibility then, he's seemingly lost his understanding of it now. The kind of man who'd admit, flat-out, that he'll "make an exception" to his greatest moral directive is not the Spider-Man I'm interested in reading about. It's not exciting, it's not intriguing to see what amoral depths Peter will plumb, it's not exhilirating to see him utterly victimize others like the biggest thug the world has ever known; it's just sad.

 

[PhotoJones]

Ugh, this issue just did not work for me. "Back in Black" as a whole doesn't work for me. It's not the dark tone, it's not the black costume, it's not the lack of wisecracks--it's Peter's throwing around death threats. It's tacky, it's ultimately meaningless, and, worst of all, it's not Spider-Man. May is in critical condition with very little hope to live. I get that. But one would think Peter might remember the reason he didn't kill Ben's killer after Ben actually did die; it's because he'd been raised to value life. Ben and May would never want Peter to kill anyone, under any circumstances. That's part of the whole "with great power comes great responsibility" mantra, which has become so overused at Marvel, in spite of the newly gray morality of a lot of their heroes, that it's become little more than lip service. If Peter goes ahead and kills Fisk (which I know he won't, but that's the moral conflict this story hinges on), he will have lost the meaning of that mantra completely. Has Peter not once stopped to consider that killing Fisk is the absolute 100% opposite of what May would want? "An eye for an eye" is morally repugnant, which Peter has literally always known, yet now he's faced with the same tragedy he started his career on--the death of a parental figure--and where he knew and understood Ben's message about power and responsibility then, he's seemingly lost his understanding of it now. The kind of man who'd admit, flat-out, that he'll "make an exception" to his greatest moral directive is not the Spider-Man I'm interested in reading about. It's not exciting, it's not intriguing to see what amoral depths Peter will plumb, it's not exhilirating to see him utterly victimize others like the biggest thug the world has ever known; it's just sad.

I see what you mean, but I disagree. I actually see Peter being driven for revenge as a natural thing. Lord knows, it wouldn't matter what promises I made to whom; if someone murdered or tried to murder a loved one, I'd want to kill them. Logic and reason just do not play a factor in reactions like that, and thus do not play a factor in a story like this.

Sure, killing Fisk would result in the betrayel of everything Peter's worked hard for. Does he care about that right now? Hell, no. That's not a tangible thing. It's not real at this point in time. What's real is the need for justice and lust for revenge.

 

[Anubis]

Pretty good. Utterly pointless though.

 

[Sloth7d]

It seems reasonable to me. A guy can only take so much and with the unmasking, his death, Captain Americas death, and every other thing thats gone wrong in his life, him snapping seems reasonable.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

I see what you mean, but I disagree. I actually see Peter being driven for revenge as a natural thing. Lord knows, it wouldn't matter what promises I made to whom; if someone murdered or tried to murder a loved one, I'd want to kill them. Logic and reason just do not play a factor in reactions like that, and thus do not play a factor in a story like this.

Sure, killing Fisk would result in the betrayel of everything Peter's worked hard for. Does he care about that right now? Hell, no. That's not a tangible thing. It's not real at this point in time. What's real is the need for justice and lust for revenge.

I get that. But he felt those same things when he confronted Ben's killer and he ultimately pulled back from that darkness. Now he seems to be embracing it. He left Fisk alive, but he went on and on for page after page about how he'd kill Fisk and if May dies Fisk dies and blah blah kill blah death blah blah. It feels wrong coming from Spider-Man and, ultimately, the best I can hope for is that Peter's making empty threats and this whole thing will be forgotten--and that's never really what you want to hope for in a story.

 

[Darthphere]

LaRocca.

 

[LouFerignoDemon]

That could be, as well. Although, that'd be a hugely misleading cover, even by Marvel's standards.

Nor more than Nova/Iron Man.

 

[PhotoJones]

I get that. But he felt those same things when he confronted Ben's killer and he ultimately pulled back from that darkness. Now he seems to be embracing it.

Right, I understand. But he's a lot older now, and the past few months have been a little more stressful than worrying about homework and girls. I see it differently.

He left Fisk alive, but he went on and on for page after page about how he'd kill Fisk and if May dies Fisk dies and blah blah kill blah death blah blah. It feels wrong coming from Spider-Man and, ultimately, the best I can hope for is that Peter's making empty threats and this whole thing will be forgotten--and that's never really what you want to hope for in a story.

He's only human, dude. You're telling you wouldn't feel the outright need to completely destroy Fisk if you were Peter?

 

[TheCorpulent1]

I would, but I would also hope that my morals--which should be equally ingrained into Peter as his desire to seek vengeance--would keep me from actually doing so and keep me from blowing smoke about it constantly. Maybe it's not so much the death stuff that I'm annoyed it in "Back in Black" as it is JMS' insistence that this is a serious, life-changing event for Peter when we bloody well know it's not really going to mean anything in the long run. It's not like Peter hasn't weathered May's death before.

Also, what the **** is MJ doing amidst all of this? Come on, if May's out of the picture, MJ has a perfect opportunity to be relevant and act as Peter's moral compass. JMS didn't think to at least throw a "don't do anything May wouldn't want you to" in there before Peter left or when she calls him or something? It doesn't feel natural at all; it feels like JMS is manufacturing angst and this newfound black mood for Peter.

 

[Darthphere]

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Yeah, it's Larocca. Now post your source, you stealing stealer.

Oh, and here's something funny I thought of: what was May's hair color before it all went gray? Anyone wondering if something... weird... happens during "Back in Black" or "One More Day" that restores May to youthful vitality or something?

 

[PhotoJones]

I would, but I would also hope that my morals--which should be equally ingrained into Peter as his desire to seek vengeance--would keep me from actually doing so and keep me from blowing smoke about it constantly. Maybe it's not so much the death stuff that I'm annoyed it in "Back in Black" as it is JMS' insistence that this is a serious, life-changing event for Peter when we bloody well know it's not really going to mean anything in the long run. It's not like Peter hasn't weathered May's death before.

Wow. I'm just going to disagree and leave it at that. Anytime a loved one's life is threatened, I'd consider that to be serious.

Also, what the **** is MJ doing amidst all of this? Come on, if May's out of the picture, MJ has a perfect opportunity to be relevant and act as Peter's moral compass. JMS didn't think to at least throw a "don't do anything May wouldn't want you to" in there before Peter left or when she calls him or something? It doesn't feel natural at all; it feels like JMS is manufacturing angst and this newfound black mood for Peter.

Yeah, I see your point about MJ's lack of a real role. I do see Peter's reasoninh behind wanteing to keep her in the dark as far as what his plans are for the people responsible. If he told her, she'd stop him. He knows that, and he wants to kill Fisk (or at least scare the **** out of him).

But yeah, I wish she played a more proactive role doing...something.

The movie costume. Seriously.