The Atheism Thread - Part 6

[Alex_Spider]

Sadly, the events in this thread reminded me how difficult it is for people to co exist in this world peacefully.
So many groups that get prosecuted for their beliefs from another opponent group, ideologies colliding forever without ever crossing paths and so on..
We forget that in the end we are all human beings with the same needs, instead we 're putting ideologies that exist only in our minds above everything else. Just my two cents...

 

[MrsKent26]

We still seem to be left in this uneasy aftermath where is seems some people tacitly agreed with what The Banned One said.

That makes me feel deeply uncomfortable, I must say.

Me too. In fact, it has me biting my tongue rather hard to avoid going off on people with those views.

I think I shall exit the thread until this awkwardness is over...

 

[KevanG]

As it is I suggest we all try and get along. If it suits you, don't forgive and don't forget but don't keep bringing it up. We can all co-exist and deal with each other peacefully.

 

[regwec]

I think this falls back on the age-old question about the extent to which you should tolerate intolerance, to be honest. I don't see why we shouldn't discuss the issue in this thread, so long as nobody is attacked, because tolerance is a central plank of humanism, with which many atheists identify.

 

[Schlosser85]

As it is I suggest we all try and get along. If it suits you, don't forgive and don't forget but don't keep bringing it up. We can all co-exist and deal with each other peacefully.

My thoughts are similar. If you can't disagree civilly (and this goes for everyone, on all "sides"), then just agree to disagree and stay out of each other's threads.

 

[Alex_Spider]

One of the many things I don't agree with religions in general is that, they distract from the human potential and make us think that we cannot be good men and women if we don't have faith and pray in an imaginary god.

How come there are many good hearted people out there that are atheists and help other fellow human beings when in need? Like the voluntary doctors that go and give their love and care to poor and sick children. They can't all be religious people. I know myself I'm trying every day to do as much good as possible. And I am sure many other atheists do the same thing around the world. So, what's going to happen to us if we don't recognise the power of All mighty? Will he burn us in hell?

So that to me alone makes religion obsolete and irrelevant and just a relic of past superstitious times.

 

[regwec]

I feel much the same. I think an absence of superstition or belief in the supernatural makes you attach more value to this life. Simple acts of kindness make this world a much better place, so I always try to find time for everyone.

 

[Alex_Spider]

Or the other thing, when people have terrible accidents, but they survive in the end and claim it was all a work of god and a miracle. Why does god choose one victim over another on similar accidents? Why not save all the planes that crash and all the children from preventable diseases and famine?
Is he choosing to save the faithful one's over the atheists, or is there another qualification I should be aware of?

 

[redhawk23]

And you and others still miss the point I made yesterday....why is everyone spending so much of their time insulting or making fun of someone else because they have a different opinion?

Whom exactly was I making fun of or insulting? I was reacting to news of a movie contributing to the myth of modern Christian persecution that was literally titled PERSECUTION. My point was that it is ridiculous for dominant groups to act as if they are being trampled on when others try to slip out from under their boot, be it Christians, whites, men, heterosexuals etc. The post I was responding to missed the fact that I was talking about dominant groups. Who was being insulted?

 

[Marvolo]

Or the other thing, when people have terrible accidents, but they survive in the end and claim it was all a work of god and a miracle. Why does god choose one victim over another on similar accidents? Why not save all the planes that crash and all the children from preventable diseases and famine?
Is he choosing to save the faithful one's over the atheists, or is there another qualification I should be aware of?

I dont think people think that deeply about it. If a family member survives something serious they consider it a blessing. They dont ask the question why God chose to save them and not someone they dont know. And if they do think about that they just say it was God's will.

Its just a natural thing with humans. Look at the way Americans ask God to take our side in wars. Why are we more worthy of God's blessing? We might not be, but people have a natural bias towards their own group.

 

[redhawk23]

There was a big hooplah last year when a woman implied that she DIDN'T thank God for surviving a tornado when prompted by a news interviewer.

 

[KevanG]

Its just a natural thing with humans. Look at the way Americans ask God to take our side in wars. Why are we more worthy of God's blessing? We might not be, but people have a natural bias towards their own group.

But but but... 'MURICA?

'Murica?

'murica?

 

[Marvolo]

There was a big hooplah last year when a woman implied that she DIDN'T thank God for surviving a tornado when prompted by a news interviewer.

I remember that. Doug Stanhope raised $100,000 for her doing that too.

Here is an artical from a christian that addresses the problem of christians continually saying they are blessed.

First, when I say that my material fortune is the result of God's blessing, it reduces The Almighty to some sort of sky-bound, wish-granting fairy who spends his days randomly bestowing cars and cash upon his followers. I can't help but draw parallels to how I handed out M&M's to my own kids when they followed my directions and chose to poop in the toilet rather than in their pants. Sure, God wants us to continually seek His will, and it's for our own good. But positive reinforcement?

God is not a behavioral psychologist.


Second, and more importantly, calling myself blessed because of material good fortune is just plain wrong. For starters, it can be offensive to the hundreds of millions of Christians in the world who live on less than $10 per day. You read that right. Hundreds of millions who receive a single-digit dollar "blessing" per day.

During our year in Guatemala, Gabby and I witnessed first-hand the damage done by the theology of prosperity, where faithful people scraping by to feed their families were simply told they must not be faithful enough. If they were, God would pull them out of their nightmare. Just try harder, and God will show favor.

The problem? Nowhere in scripture are we promised worldly ease in return for our pledge of faith. In fact, the most devout saints from the Bible usually died penniless, receiving a one-way ticket to prison or death by torture.

We hijack the word "blessed" to make it fit neatly into our modern American ideals, creating a cosmic lottery where every sincere prayer buys us another scratch-off ticket. In the process, we stand the risk of alienating those we are hoping to bring to the faith.

And we have to stop playing that game.

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/4868963?utm_hp_ref=tw

 

[Thundercrack85]

The South in the Civil War kind of took it to its logical conclusion, and actually had the motto "God is on our side, you Godless yankees."

It sounds better in Latin.

 

[Hobgoblin]

The South in the Civil War kind of took it to its logical conclusion, and actually had the motto "God is on our side, you Godless yankees."

It sounds better in Latin.

I actually heard that after the war they decided that God punishes those that he loves most, and clearly God loved them.

 

[rodhulk]

Why does everything have to be prefaced with "as a Christian"? Why can't it just be "as an empathetic person" or "as a human"? I have no problem with 80-90% of Christians. Only the ones who are sanctimonious and condescending. They always make it seem as if they're better because "as a Christian" they have the right to tell non-Christians what's moral and immoral. A good Christian wouldn't flaunt his faith and wouldn't tell others how to live, but just do right by what's in his or her own heart with no harm done towards others, and they'd definitely be more humble.

Because it is Christ whom I live for.

Christians aren't better than non Christians and Christians don't say that. Perhaps a few may but I don't know any personally. It is Christ who makes us who we are. Christians humble themselves and give all praise and glory to God, not themselves. In fact, I think there is even a scripture in there that says Christians will be judged harder than non Christians.

Christians don't tell others how to live but rather try to help others escape the coming judgement and punishment that they/we believe will take place. This is no different than a house being on fire and a person is trapped. Wouldn't you want to try and save that person? Exactly what a Christian is doing.

 

[rodhulk]

I'm in a really awful place religiously. For absolutely no reason at all I've started randomly contemplating our existence as humans, frantically worrying about what's going to happen to me when I die, and how I'm going to die (and I'm only 19 for goodness sake). I can't accept any religion at all really because I hit a brick wall with logic, yet science doesn't hold all the answers either. I'm miserable because of this; it's like our entire time on Earth is utterly pointless if we just fade away into nothingness (even if one day we progress to immortality, we have to worry about climate change and hope that we can all migrate to Mars or something in time); but that's another thing, we are limited by our ability to only feel what it's like to be consciously aware of ourselves and the world around us, so how are we supposed to fathom the idea of not even having that? E.g. I don't remember being a sperm, nor can I even tell you what it feels like to be asleep once I do so, it's like we can only feel the moments where we are awake, which is why when I drift to sleep I wake up in the morning having felt like it was only seconds after resting my head on my pillow. I wish I could just have faith in a God, because it would be a lot easier than having to stress about this everyday

The Bible says that if you seek, you will find. Search the scriptures and you will find life in them.

 

[Thundercrack85]

Christians don't tell others how to live but rather try to help others escape the coming judgement and punishment that they/we believe will take place. This is no different than a house being on fire and a person is trapped. Wouldn't you want to try and save that person? Exactly what a Christian is doing.

Yes, but to an atheist, there is no fire; that fire is only in your mind. Wouldn't you get a bit tired if someone kept trying to save you from a fire only they can see – or feel?

 

[Feenix]

Yes, but to an atheist, there is no fire; that fire is only in your mind. Wouldn't you get a bit tired if someone kept trying to save you from a fire only they can see – or feel?

And this just popped into my head:

 

[redhawk23]

Yes, but to an atheist, there is no fire; that fire is only in your mind. Wouldn't you get a bit tired if someone kept trying to save you from a fire only they can see – or feel?

Not to mention in the case of missionaries and the like, the "fire" they are seeking to put out is made up of peoples own beliefs, traditions, culture and identity.

Saint Louis University has a statue that most of the students agree needs to be removed.

Even at a Jesuit university, having a statue of Native Americans kneeling before a white man is culturally insensitive and is actually very different from the actual history of what happened when Des Met met with them. Des Met did a lot of good work outside of pure missionary work though, helping to negotiate peace treaties between the United States and several Indian tribes. I wish my school's statuary would reflect his legacy of treating people as equals.

 

[KevanG]

People who played Mass Effect 2 may be the only ones to find this funny but I found it similar to some of the posters here.

[YT]h8wUSk3aqgI[/YT]

 

[rodhulk]

Yes, but to an atheist, there is no fire; that fire is only in your mind. Wouldn't you get a bit tired if someone kept trying to save you from a fire only they can see – or feel?

You're correct. I'll look at it as being asleep to the eternal fire I believe in. If a house was on fire and a person was inside and was asleep, would you still not go in and try to save them even though they are unaware of the danger?

 

[Thundercrack85]

But is he sleeping? I mean, I can hear the people who yell at me.

 

[KevanG]

I imagine it's like they mixed Nyquil and sleeping pills with a few shots of whiskey before bed!

 

[rodhulk]

That yelling may be what wakes him up and alert to the danger. In the same way, a Christian wants to alert people of the danger that they are asleep to.

EDIT: Sorry, missed your point above... Yes, some people may have already talked to you about this fire but I am unaware of that. So, the alert I will give.