The "Critique The Critics!" Thread (MAJOR SPOILERS, ENTER AT YOUR OWN RISK)

[gambitfire]

*eats cookie*

This is a good cookie.

 

[Hollow Wood Director]

As an artist/writer I couldn't have said it better myself.

Thanks for the positive feedback

We still :heart: you...you are revered boy!

You are so sweet! I :heart: you too and I hope the people here aren't giving you too much of a hard time.

Did you see the pic I sent?

I did and forgive me for not getting back to you today I just didn't have the time to reply to you so now I'm back online I might as well say right here and right now...Congratulations Mr.Lee. I am so happy for you and your wife. You have a lovely looking baby daughter there. You two must be on cloud nine. Anyway it was good to hear from you old friend and great to hear some happy news.

YEAH.........aren't you supposed to be RED.......I thought there was something different....

Red is so last year darling, black is the new black!t: Hope you're having fun with the mod job, don't let the rabble get to you!

 

[Iron Maiden]

I watched the Ebert/Siskel... I mean Roeper "At The Movies" and they gave it a split decision. Rich Roeper gave it a thumbs down and then let his ignorance of the comics slip by saying that the Fantastic Four comics were always Triple A league compared to the major leaguers like Spider-Man.(??) What was cool was that the guest reviewer from the Village Voice, Robert Willonsky (sp?) called him out on it and had to explain to him about the significance of the Lee/Kirby FF. He gave the movie a .

 

[LostSon88]

Roepers a tool.

 

[gambitfire]

I watched the Ebert/Siskel... I mean Roeper "At The Movies" and they gave it a split decision. Rich Roeper gave it a thumbs down and then let his ignorance of the comics slip by saying that the Fantastic Four comics were always Triple A league compared to the major leaguers like Spider-Man.(??) What was cool was that the guest reviewer from the Village Voice, Robert Willonsky (sp?) called him out on it and had to explain to him about the significance of the Lee/Kirby FF. He gave the movie a .

Awesome, wish i could of seen it.

 

[Advanced Dark]

I'm sure this will be merged and it might be in the review thread but I missed it in the dozens and dozens of pages. I'm still in shock. Good for you Harry for stepping up against the rabid adolosescent talkbackers. Hmmm. Harry's stock is rising again. LOL

http://www.aintitcool.com/node/33012

It Must Be The End Of All That We Know... cuz Harry enjoyed the hell out of FANTASTIC FOUR: RISE OF THE SILVER SURFER!

I can’t believe I actually enjoyed myself tonight.

It is, by no means, a perfect film, but this time… it’s really really close to being an old school FANTASTIC FOUR silver age story.

Now it’s not a point for point adaptation… but tonally, this is a Fantastic Four movie. Tonally, the Silver Surfer is the Silver Surfer. The family dynamic is there, Sue ragging on Reed to get his head out of the books, Johnny teasing Ben, Ben ragging on Johnny – them both being there for each other, when they’re both in the doghouse or left out of the Smart guy stuff. Dr Doom is in Latveria for about a half minute. The FF are dealing with a world-ending scenario, and yes, they even let family dynamics get in the way of saving the world. It’s a globe-trotting story of epic proportions.

And Galactus isn’t in the movie, he’s just off camera the whole time. But I’ll get back to that later.

I had every reason to want to dislike the film, but deep down… I love the FANTASTIC FOUR. I’m a Marvel geek that prefers the FANTASTIC FOUR to the X-MEN. To me, the Fantastic Four were a front and center moderately dysfunction family of adventurers that lived in the middle of the greatest city on the planet… in an incredibly distinctive building and while the whole world watched, they performed miracles. They saved lives. They invented gadgets that helped propel the world into the future in which we should all be living. The were strong, flexible, discreet and flashy. The perfect celebrities, ones you could look up to, tear down, ***** about and praise. Even as I read every original issue in their original printing… I loved them.

They weren’t being hunted or persecuted. When other heroes needed help, they’d come to Reed and the Baxter Building and lay out the problems. Sometimes their brilliance attracted the very menaces that they fought. But at all times – they had the same problems that people have that live and work together. But underneath it all, they loved one another.

I saw FANTASTIC FOUR: RISE OF THE SILVER SURFER at the Alamo Drafthouse South tonight with a hardcore crowd of folks. How hardcore? There was a guy, in a Silver Surfer costume with a Silver… well it wasn’t a surf board, it looked more like a giant Nestle Crunch Bar wrapped in Aluminum. This guy was a serious ****ing Silver Surfer fan. God Bless him. Seeing that guy put me in the right mindset.

Before the film, they were showing special features from the recently released DVD of the first film. Watching it, then clips from the Fantastic Four animated series with Herbie the Robot… It put me in the mind that sometimes people change things. That cartoon show, when I was a kid was awesome, and I never thought of Herbie as replacing Johnny, but as standing in for Johnny when he was trapped with Crystal with the Inhumans. I was a crazy kid, well, still am.

This time out – without the clumsy, ****ty, horrible blending of the FF’s origin and Dr Doom’s origin… and in not having Dr Doom appear till much later in the story – and not having a lousy love triangle that was just dreadful… the film just got going. It starts with a planet’s destruction… those are the stakes.

By the end of the credits, the Surfer is on Earth – beginning to set it up for Galactus. There’s no Watcher. Instead what we have are scenes of the Fantastic Four being… well the Fantastic Four. Entertaining crowds, Reed and Sue are trying to get married, but something is always complicating that process. (I know the feeling) - Johnny wants to throw Reed a bachelor party. It’s appropriately goofy, but dammit… it’s the exact sort of hammy thing that Stan Lee would have done.

As in all Marvel films there has to be a dance number this summer… and yes it’s funky and stupid… but it made me laugh. It was Reed Richards trying to get loose – and it worked for me.

The whole power switch thing with Johnny works. It’s funny and exactly the sort of silly fun that would happen to Johnny – Johnny doesn’t want anybody’s powers but his own – and this bugs him.

The Silver Surfer… is absolutely fantastic. He makes me so happy to see. Is he going around wondering aloud about all the philosophical wonderings of this planet he’s visiting? No. But then, he didn’t really do that till Stan spun him off to his own series. Here, he’s the herald of Galactus, and he’s busy getting things done for his master, readying the planet for consumption. Which isn’t building a giant machine on top of the Baxter Building, it’s creating these enormous holes into the Earth, from which Galactus will draw the planet’s energy from.

What’s so great about the Surfer? Doug Jones. That man moves like something, not of this Earth. There’s a grace and a calm to him – he doesn’t ride the board like a surfer, he rides it as though it was simply an extension of his self. There’s a reason why he interacts with Doom and the FF… there’s something of the powers cosmic about them. They stand out from the other mortals, there’s a spark of the infinite in them, now… that’s never said, but you see it in the curiosity with which he holds them.

Now – when he’s covered in the silver look – He does in fact look unreal, but there’s a point where he’s separated from his board – and he takes on a tarnished look. Here is where Doug Jones shines so brightly. Spectral Motion’s make up on the Surfer is fantastic. Yes, they did do a lot of what you’ll see of the Surfer in this movie – no matter what Fox officially says – And the results are spectacular. When he’s strapped to that table and being questioned by Sue… I was just so incredibly happy. Just so happy.

That said. What SUCKS?

#1. Julian McMahon. He is… COMPLETELY and UTTERLY ****ing HORRENDOUS. Hate, doesn’t cover my utter loathing of his performance of this fantastic villain. He sucks the life out of every last second of screen time. With a few “power cosmic moments” – but that’s not his performance, but the visual effects talking. Only good thing I can say about his character is this… he’s in it so little, that it didn’t ruin the film for me. He plays Dr. Doom like a swarmy Donald Trump version of Shredder. I hate him.

#2. Kerry Washington’s Alicia Masters. It isn’t that she doesn’t look like Alicia Masters. It’s that she’s the worst blind actress I’ve ever seen. She’s so so so very very bad. She plays blind, by talking 17 degrees wrong from who she is speaking to. It’s so utterly annoying. Her lines are delivered terribly. She was ok in THE LAST KING OF SCOTLAND, so I can’t say I want her banned from film, but I can say she needs someone to direct her a whole helluvalot better than Tim Story.

#3. Brian Posehn as the Wedding Minister. He’s a huge geek of the Fantastic Four, but he is no minister – it was just bad casting.

Now… Why am I not raging furious about the “giant cosmic tornado”?

Well, because nobody ever refers to it as Galactus. When the Surfer is soaring up into it – when he stops… you can see something subtly mechanical… there’s something behind the power. He’s speaking to something…. Something we can not see.

We never see the whole – of whatever is beginning to attach itself to Earth. I like to think, that had Tim Story panned on that enormous establishing space shot… you would have seen an enormous Jack Kirby machine being powered and/or operated by the version of Galactus that I like to imagine. Is that satisfying? Not particularly, but it doesn’t mean it couldn’t be what I want it to be.

The fact is… I had a lot of fun. I would love to see someone, a helluvalot more talented than Tim Story direct the next FANTASTIC FOUR movie. I’d love to see writers that are better suited for the material. I’d love to see an even larger budget given – and better actors to the villain parts. But ya know what. This one worked for me. I’d buy this film. I look forward to taking my nephew to it, who sadly had to spend the night with his girlfriend, rather than see a Comic Book movie at midnight. Can’t fault the kid’s priorities.

And Doug Jones?

GOD BLESS YOU FOR EXISTING! Amongst all the cg, all the silliness – you lent the Silver Surfer the poise and the grace that only one who had soared the space ways of the infinite could have. And… if JMS does the job that I hope he will on the SILVER SURFER movie… and if they get a brilliant director. And they get Doug Jones back. That will be a movie, that I can’t even fathom the coolness of.

That said, I really did have a good time with this film. For once, Mark Millar was right, thank God! Heh.

 

[Panophobia]

Why didn't you just stick it in there if you knew it was going to be merged?

 

[Kelly]

#1, yes already in the review thread....

#2, yes it will be merged...


For some reason, I have a feeling that this would start out as a positive thread for ole' Harry, but would quickly turn into a very, very negative thread....


yikes.....

merging...

 

[Panophobia]

Quickest. Merge. Ever.

 

[Advanced Dark]

Whatever. LOL

 

[Advanced Dark]

#1, yes already in the review thread....

#2, yes it will be merged...


For some reason, I have a feeling that this would start out as a positive thread for ole' Harry, but would quickly turn into a very, very negative thread....


yikes.....

merging...

You're probably right but it really did make me happy. He's not souless as I thought. That was as true to the heart review as one can get. I agree with everything to the word he said...though he was a little harsh on McMahon.

 

[Panophobia]

Yeah, I like McMahon. He was terrible when in Doom armor in the first one, but he was awesome in this one, I thought.

 

[Cyrusbales]

people keep saying that people aren't backing up their problems with the film etc, that's rubbish, loads of examples have been cited....

-Silver surfer, I wonder why he likes sue, let me think of the most stereotypical and ininspiring thing possible...... "you remind me of her."

-Oh, the army girl who doesn't like johnny, no surprise who's gonna save the day against doom in a small epiphany.

-Doom's gaining of the surfers board, hmm what shot should be use.... I know, the pure cliche and undramatic BOV that has been used in crap movies since the 70's.

-predictablility, jesus, don't get me started.

-the terrible dance scene, whilst the concept it reasonably interesting, the execution left us with a showcase for poor effects, that added nothing to the character or any conflict between him and sue, because she doesn't even care after a few minutes.

-"let's go for a spin" well, could you be any more irritating and childish, someone wielding that much power and being that 'evil' is just going to belittle you, not themselves.

I can list plenty more, I haven't seen anyone back up the 'good' aspects of the film with examples though....

 

[Kelly]

You're probably right but it really did make me happy. He's not souless as I thought. That was as true to the heart review as one can get. I agree with everything to the word he said...though he was a little harsh on McMahon.

Yes, I would say, "I hate him...." is alittle harsh.....lmao

 

[Iron Maiden]

Harry hates him because Julian's had more hot women than he can even dream of with his Jabba the Hut body..... And I liked his performance in the movie too.

 

[Tony Stark]

#2. Kerry Washington’s Alicia Masters. It isn’t that she doesn’t look like Alicia Masters. It’s that she’s the worst blind actress I’ve ever seen. She’s so so so very very bad. She plays blind, by talking 17 degrees wrong from who she is speaking to. It’s so utterly annoying. Her lines are delivered terribly. She was ok in THE LAST KING OF SCOTLAND, so I can’t say I want her banned from film, but I can say she needs someone to direct her a whole helluvalot better than Tim Story.

Um, my brother is blind, and that's exactly what blind people do. It's amazing a prejudice dumb fat ass like Harry doesn't get that. WTH makes him the expert on blind people?

Blind people aren't going to make eye contact with you, but they usually will turn their dominate ear toward a conversation. Just like you have a dominate hand, you have a dominate ear, most people don't know this.

 

[Kelly]

Um, my brother is blind, and that's exactly what blind people do. It's amazing a prejudice dumb fat ass like Harry doesn't get that. WTH makes him the expert on blind people?

Blind people aren't going to make eye contact with you, but they usually will turn their dominate ear toward a conversation. Just like you have a dominate hand, you have a dominate ear, most people don't know this.

Calm down Tony.......he just gave his opinion.......no biggie....no one believes he's an expert on anything.....lol

 

[Tony Stark]

Lol, yeah I realize he's not held in high regard, here nor anywhere really.

 

[Goodfellas]

people keep saying that people aren't backing up their problems with the film etc, that's rubbish, loads of examples have been cited....

-Silver surfer, I wonder why he likes sue, let me think of the most stereotypical and ininspiring thing possible...... "you remind me of her."

-Oh, the army girl who doesn't like johnny, no surprise who's gonna save the day against doom in a small epiphany.

-Doom's gaining of the surfers board, hmm what shot should be use.... I know, the pure cliche and undramatic BOV that has been used in crap movies since the 70's.

-predictablility, jesus, don't get me started.

-the terrible dance scene, whilst the concept it reasonably interesting, the execution left us with a showcase for poor effects, that added nothing to the character or any conflict between him and sue, because she doesn't even care after a few minutes.

-"let's go for a spin" well, could you be any more irritating and childish, someone wielding that much power and being that 'evil' is just going to belittle you, not themselves.

I can list plenty more, I haven't seen anyone back up the 'good' aspects of the film with examples though....

dude why dont you try and enjoy a movie for what it is every once in a while " a fun popcorn entertatning film"


not over anaylysing a movie everytime you see it

yeah sure movies that make you think often times are interesting but wouldnt you rather every once in a while enjoy a movie for just being fun and something you and the whole family can go see????

 

[Kanny]

Ok, I FINALLY saw the movie!!!!!!!!t:

It's awesome, great, amazing, FANTASTIC!!! I loved it! There were a lot of good moments and a lot of funny moments too. It have everything! It doesn's have anything wrong in my opinion.

And, if I have to complain about something, it's that I didn't want it to end! So, even thought the movie it's perfect as it is, I would have like it to be longer, so I could have more Fantastic Four. That's the only little complain that I have, if I have to say any.

But, they did it great. The actors, the story, the special effects..... everything!!!t:

My score is 9.5/10.

 

[Lightning Strykez!]

MOVIE REVIEW: Fantastic Four: Rise Of The Silver Surfer
DIRECTOR: Tim Story
CAST: Jessica Alba, Ioan Gruffudd, Chris Evans, Michael Chiklis, Julian McMahon, Kerry Washington
STUDIO: 20th Century Fox
AUTHOR: Lightning Strykez
GRADE: B+​

"Uncertainty and expectation are the joys of life. Security is an insipid thing."

So wrote the esteemed 1670s English playwright William Congreve. His words perhaps finds no greater meaning than on comic book message boards like this one--a place where both the diehard faithful and casual fans await each comic book film release with bated breath.

And I'm one of those fanboys.

In fact, I can't remember being filled with more uncertainty and expectation for a CBM than I was for the recent release of Fantastic Four: Rise Of The Silver Surfer. Why? Because I lacked faith in the franchise's ability to give birth to a quality film. I mean, let's face it, 2005's lackluster origin film didn't exactly leave one with a sense of "security". With all the departures taken with Dr. "Marco Polo" Doom, miscasting of certain FF cast members, shoddy set pieces, terrible dialogue and nonsensical lame kiddie jokes, I was quite positive that FF2 would be nothing more than another dose of the same--just with more candied coating.

But Congreve was right. Sometimes uncertainty and expectation are the joys of life, and I found this to be the case at Midnight, June 15 as I watched the premiere of the film at a local theatre. I had read FF2's mixed reviews online and I was prepped for the worse. But to my pleasant surprise, two years of patiently waiting for this movie to arrive paid off in full because I genuinely enjoyed this sequel. It was...dare I say it? Almost Fantastic!

The whole gang--Reed Richards (Ioan Gruffudd), Susan Storm (Jessica Alba), Ben Grimm (Michael Chiklis) and Johnny Storm (Chris Evans)--return in this new adventure. Instead of meandering through boring origin explanations, this film expects you to already know the cosmically-fueled powers of Mr. Fantastic, The Invisible Woman, The Thing and The Human Torch. And this is a good thing, for there is much to see and do. The movie jumps right into the storyline--which revolves around the arrival of the fanboy-revered god of all things Chrome himself, the Silver Surfer. This intergalactic herald has come to bring destruction for the earth as we know it. The greater threat--his master Galactus--is on his way, and it's up to the Fantastic Four to stop Armageddon early.

Director Tim Story does a much better job in capturing the spirit of this super-powered family of Imaginauts. It's still a daytime affair, but he throws in heavier doses of darkness to give the picture a more foreboding sense of crisis. And just when the film starts to take itself too seriously, he counterbalances the act with a dose of humor. It's also clear that Story & Co. have combed many comic arcs to infuse this storyline with as many nuggets for the fans as possible. As a result watching this movie is like seeing a liquid comic book in motion; it comes complete with nuances to holographic receptionist Roberta, power-swapping, Dr. Doom's medieval castle in Latveria, the FF-lawsuit-happy New York City, and so on. And writer Don Payne mostly makes it work. The film is equal parts action, equal parts romance, equal parts comedy, and equal parts nerdy.

Of all of Marvel's films, this series should be pumped with the most intergalactic sci-fi flava--and this is appropriately addressed in the sequel. Right from the glorious CGI opening credit sequence, the viewer is reminded that the FF are superhero scientists and explorers, not dark, brooding crimefighters filled with angst. The futuristic element is further punctuated in other areas: The dull, retro-styled Baxter Building has been remodeled with sleek, state-of-the-art labs, lighting, gizmos and architecture. Reed's latest invention, The Fantasticar, makes its debut. And of course, we have the sterling Silver Surfer--an alien creature brilliantly realized by Doug Jones, Laurence Fishburne, WETA and Spectral Motion.

All of the principal actors have upped their game, albeit marginally for some: Alba does a satisfying job of portraying Marvel's ultimate MILF Susan Richards. The nagging, whining girl we saw in the first film has been replaced by a mature woman whose only concern is keeping her family together. Evans and Chiklis steal the show again, their love/hate brother-like banter kept audiences keeled over in laughter. Julian McMahon gives the good Doctor Doom an upgrade--not just in costume--but also in menace. His voice still needs work though--especially when masked. Kerry Washington is finally given more to do and shines as a supporting actress. Andre Brauer brilliantly makes Hagar the General you love to hate. But I must give "Lightning's MVP Award" to Welsh star Ioan Gruffudd. Of all the actors, this guy has clearly experienced the greatest evolution in this series. He infuses the "Mr. Fantastic" character with the confidence and leadership qualities that were so desperately missing in 2005's film and I hope this arc continues. There is good chemistry between the actors, and the familial dynamic has been turned up big-time in this one. For example, it was great to see the doting motherly side of Susan in relation to her kid brother (another vital element missing from the first movie).

The movie is far from perfect however; there are still glaring problems. The CGI in some places is definitely sub par (i.e. Reed's hilarious dance number in a bar). Jessica's hairstylist should be flogged and beaten with a sheep's ribcage for not putting at least a smidgen of color at the roots of that fricken wig. Tim, we get the fact that you are trying to W.A.S.P. this actress for the role--and in the majority of the frames she looked convincing--but please tone down the electric blue eyes as well. No human's eyes are that purple. Dr. Doom still had a few cringe-inducing lines (i.e. "Let's go for a spin!" Um, let's not. The Monarch is not a Top). And although the brisk 92 minute runtime didn't make you feel that whole sequences had been chopped by William Hoy, the movie could've suffered a good 15 minutes more to delve further into the Surfer's origin. We were never fully told WHY he chose to serve Galactus...everything was kept vague. This was a disservice because knowing Norrin's background would have endeared audiences to him.

Speaking of Galactus, I wasn't miffed at the adaptation's take on the Devourer of Worlds, since clearly the nebula-like phenomena is a tool this being uses to drain the life force of planets. In fact, I thought the deviation from the source material was actually quite clever and epic on screen. But the filmmakers could have dared to stop playing it safe and shown Galactus' face in all his 616 glory at some point in that flux. If they had, they could've sat back and watched fanboys return to the theatres in droves to watch it over and over again. That's why you guys didn't get your precious $80-90 million this weekend. FOX Executives: When will you learn to trust your consumers? Didn't you guys learn anything from distributing the Star Wars franchise? Better yet, didn't you learn anything from the poor reception to your X3 Sentinel and "Flaming" Phoenix copouts? Stop pinching pennies and clutching cynicism and start pushing the creative envelope!

At any rate, I learned a vital lesson from William Congreve's quote above. This summer has certainly been uncertain and unpredictable indeed with the somber Spider-Man 3 critical reviews, and virtual bombing of the much-bloviated Pirates Of The Carribean. Naturally, expectations were both high and low for this Fantastic sequel, and I'm relieved that I finally got the FF film I should've received 2 years ago. And its these unexpected summer surprises that are truly "the joys of life."--Lightning Strykez, Superherohype.com

 

[Kelly]

*sniffs* that was butiful....

 

[Spade]

("Let's go for a spin!" Let's not. The Monarch is not a Top).

Priceless.

As for the review...Lightning Strykez is either a great optimist, or this movie is- dare I say?- watchable. It'll be a while before I can see it, but if it really is as good as the review says then maybe it'll illicit a viewing.

 

[Kelly]

External reviews for
Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer (2007)
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By Michael Rechtshaffen
Maybe it has something to do with seriously diminished expectations, but Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer is an improvement of sorts over the lifeless 2005 edition.

There's actually a semblance of a story this time around and the special effects no longer look like they came out of a cable network's 1990 budget.

Sure, the dialogue can still get pretty clunky, nobody bothered to give the four lead... Read the full review and more at hollywoodreporter.com.

Variety.com [Justin Chang]
Guardian/Observer
James Berardinelli's ReelViews
BBCi - Films
New York Times (registration req'd)
Rolling Stone [Peter Travers]
Tiscali UK
Urban Cinefile (Australia)
A Nutshell Review
OhmyNews [Brian Orndorf]
Mark Reviews Movies [Mark Dujsik]
About.com
Seattle Post-Intelligencer [Sean Axmaker]
TheMovieBoy Review [Dustin Putman]
7M Pictures [Kevin Carr]
Big Picture Big Sound [Joe Lozito]
Cinema2000 (Portuguese)
Combustible Celluloid [Jeffrey M. Anderson]
EyeForFilm.co.uk
Film School Rejects [Loukas Tsouknidas]
FlickFilosopher.com [MaryAnn Johanson]
FromTheBalcony [Bill Clark]
Jesusfreakhideout.com Movie Reviews
metacritic.com - Reviews and Scores from Leading Film Critics
Moviefreak [Sara Michelle Fetters]
Reel Film Reviews [David Nusair]
Rottentomatoes.com
The Sci-Fi Movie Page
Slant Magazine [Nick Schager]
Movie Review and Scores From Nation's Top Critics
Sonic Cinema [Brian Skutle]
St. Petersburg Times [Steve Persall]
The Screen Directory
UKscreen [Jason Korsner]

For all of these reviews go to http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0486576/externalreviews

 

[Cyrusbales]

dude why dont you try and enjoy a movie for what it is every once in a while " a fun popcorn entertatning film"


not over anaylysing a movie everytime you see it

yeah sure movies that make you think often times are interesting but wouldnt you rather every once in a while enjoy a movie for just being fun and something you and the whole family can go see????

It's rather idfficult to enjoy something that has nothing to offer other than a few special effects shots. I find well written and performed films very entertaining, the "popcorn movie" excuse is like saying, "it's alright to make a crap film, as long as people know it's crap".

There are movies that are massively entertaining on primitive levels, but also have much richer platforms also.

So you're telling me that a 'popcorn flick' like FF2 etc is MORE ENTERTAINING, than something like (thinking of contemporary examples that people here will probably have seen) Blood diamond or Last king of scotland?