The Format War

[Zenien]

If you count the uncountable number of PS3s being used as Blu Ray players, imdaly, Blu Ray has almost definitely sold more this year.

 

[BatMatt]

http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/new..._Disc_Sales_Surpass_One_Million_Milestone/589

Blu-Ray discs sold surpasses one million

 

[imdaly]

If you count the uncountable number of PS3s being used as Blu Ray players, imdaly, Blu Ray has almost definitely sold more this year.

Yes, they're uncountable because nobody will ever know how many of those PS3s are being used to play Blu-rays at all (though judging by the selection of games it has, I would hope that people would find SOMETHING to do with their PS3s ). That's the beauty of Sony putting a Blu-ray player in their machine: people can go out and snag up every PS3 out there for games and have no intention of ever touching Blu-ray movies, yet Sony can proclaim "Look at all the Blu-ray players we've sold!!" Doesn't really matter if people aren't buying movies for them.

With standalones (and the XBOX360 add-on, which is not included in the 100,000 players sold tally) you can sure that every single player sold is someone buying it with the full intention of supporting that particular format. No confusion. No guessing.

So Sony has about 1 million PS3 owners in the North America so far. But how many Blu-ray buyers do they have?


Which brings me to this:

http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/new..._Disc_Sales_Surpass_One_Million_Milestone/589

Blu-Ray discs sold surpasses one million

So we have about 1 million PS3 owners in NA, about 1 million Blu-ray owners out there not even counting the standalones, and Blu-ray JUST hit 1 million discs sold. So that means, what, 1 movie sold to each owner? THAT'S what they want to brag about??

So theoretically, what this is saying is that we could've had every PS3 owner buy a PS3 and buy one Blu-ray movie to try it out and then not buy any more. Now, granted this is not the case, because I've talked to people online who own a great amount of Blu-rays, but really, a less-than-1 movie attach rate is not something you really want to shout out loud, IMO.

 

[Havok83]

So we have about 1 million PS3 owners in NA, about 1 million Blu-ray owners out there not even counting the standalones, and Blu-ray JUST hit 1 million discs sold. So that means, what, 1 movie sold to each owner? THAT'S what they want to brag about??

So theoretically, what this is saying is that we could've had every PS3 owner buy a PS3 and buy one Blu-ray movie to try it out and then not buy any more. Now, granted this is not the case, because I've talked to people online who own a great amount of Blu-rays, but really, a less-than-1 movie attach rate is not something you really want to shout out loud, IMO.

thats bc NOT every PS3 owner uses BR and not every PS3 owner owns an HD TV, HD cables, etc... Not every PS2 owner used the DVD player when it was first released. Obviously a sale for the PS3 isnt necesarily a sale for BR, at least not right now. I think the 1 million number is significant bc it reached that milestone after being out for less than a year and in a shorter time span than its rival HD-DVD. The fact is BR is doing better than that format.

 

[hippie_hunter]

I think it's safe to assume that blu-ray is going to win this one.

 

[Avalanche]

An easy win now.

 

[Fading]

IMO the $300 HD player won't make a huge difference. I could be wrong, but it's probably still too early for most ppl to switch, by next Christmas both will probably have $200 players. On top of that it's Wal-Mart. I know in small towns (like mine) there isn't a large variety of choices, but when I want electronics, and ones I'm spending a decent amount ($200-300+) I go to a Best Buy or something and buy a better version, not a cheap version of an expensive thing from Wal-Mart. It will probably get some impulse buys, but I doubt a ton of ppl will switch before Christmas hits because it hit $300 or so.

However for those who do buy it, I hope it's decent. I remember when DVD's first came out we had a main one, and my bro wanted one in his room and bought a cheap one. It had no way to access the menu, it was basically a play, stop, rew, and fast set of buttons wrapped in cheap plastic that died after half a year.

 

[Zenien]

Yes, they're uncountable because nobody will ever know how many of those PS3s are being used to play Blu-rays at all (though judging by the selection of games it has, I would hope that people would find SOMETHING to do with their PS3s ). That's the beauty of Sony putting a Blu-ray player in their machine: people can go out and snag up every PS3 out there for games and have no intention of ever touching Blu-ray movies, yet Sony can proclaim "Look at all the Blu-ray players we've sold!!" Doesn't really matter if people aren't buying movies for them.

With standalones (and the XBOX360 add-on, which is not included in the 100,000 players sold tally) you can sure that every single player sold is someone buying it with the full intention of supporting that particular format. No confusion. No guessing.

So Sony has about 1 million PS3 owners in the North America so far. But how many Blu-ray buyers do they have?


Which brings me to this:

So we have about 1 million PS3 owners in NA, about 1 million Blu-ray owners out there not even counting the standalones, and Blu-ray JUST hit 1 million discs sold. So that means, what, 1 movie sold to each owner? THAT'S what they want to brag about??

So theoretically, what this is saying is that we could've had every PS3 owner buy a PS3 and buy one Blu-ray movie to try it out and then not buy any more. Now, granted this is not the case, because I've talked to people online who own a great amount of Blu-rays, but really, a less-than-1 movie attach rate is not something you really want to shout out loud, IMO.

Your defense is basically "Well you can't count how many people are using their PS3's as Blu Ray players, so there!" The fact that you can't count how many doesn't deminish their impact on the market. I mean your defense of how much an impact the PS3 has made as a Blu Ray player is basically 'The PS3 doesn't have any games lol!' which is like not addressing thew actual issue in either instance.

No one is argueing that 100 or 50 percent of the people who own the PS3 are using it as a Blu Ray player. Not that it means something even if 10 percent were using it that would still be what about 300 thousand people? Let's say the PS3 has sold to consumers about 3 million worldwide so far based on sales... 5 percent is still 150 thousand, more then HD-DVD has sold Since Inception in America, and back at christmas we had articles stating statistics based on market research saying Blu Ray and HD-DVD were selling neck and Neck (that is for dedicated players mind you).

"Blu Ray is stomping HD-DVD, but not hard enough!" makes for a bad arguement.

 

[Fran]

If he said, "Blu-ray will win" would you shut up?

 

[Zenien]

Probably not.

 

[Zenien]

Week Ended 4/29: 71% BD, 29% HDDVD
YTD: 68% BD, 32% HDDVD
SI: 58% BD, 42% HDDVD


Top 5 BD
1. Night at the Museum 100.00
2. Deja Vu 75.04
3. Planet Earth 24.14
4. The Queen 17.29
5. Casino Royale 14.33

Top 5 HD-DVD
1. Planet Earth 100.00
2. Smokin' Aces 52.60
3. Digital Video Essentials 16.47
4. Batman Begins 13.98
5. Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind 13.00

HIGH-DEF SELLERS

1. Night at the Museum BD 100.00
2. Deja Vu BD 75.04
3. Planet Earth HD DVD 32.78
4. Planet Earth BD 24.14
5. The Queen BD 17.29
6. Smokin' Aces HD DVD 17.24
7. Casino Royale BD 14.33
8. Happy Feet BD 7.19
9. Black Hawk Down BD 7.05
10. The Departed BD 5.82

 

[Avalanche]

So Blu-Ray is still in the lead then...

 

[Zenien]

Pretty much, HD-DVD got very close the week before with the release of Smoking Aces and the "Buy HD-DVD" Day that happened during that week with a split of 52-48 in Favor of Blu Ray.

 

[Fading]

Anyone know if this is true or just a rumor?

http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=180

May 9, 2007

Heise Online, a German IT website, is reporting that during a press conference, representatives from Pioneer announced that Universal will break their exclusivity agreement with HD DVD. This would allow Universal, the only large studio exclusively supporting HD DVD, to freely distribute their movies on Blu-ray. It is important to note that this announcement has not yet been confirmed by Universal.

It has long been speculated that Universal was receiving monetary compensation for being an exclusive HD DVD studio. This announcement would signal that they have decided to forgo the compensation in order to release titles on Blu-ray. Most would agree that this move would effectively end the war, and no matter what side you support, a single HD format is the best long term solution.

Keep watching this space, and we'll update the story as needed.

That's just a few days ago, but has Universal denied it? Also what pull do Pioneer representatives have over Universal to say that? If this is true then HD-DVD is probably over, it may not be, but I'm curious. At most this is just saying they can go neutral which doesn't mean Universal will, but that they aren't bound to if they don't want to.

Edit - Did some searching and apparently it is a real story. It turns out it was in Germany that Pioneer said this, and Universal Pictures Germany didn't deny it, however one site said they recieved an email from the head of Universal denying it like crazy, but who knows if that's true. Guess we'll need to wait on an official announcement. Here's the original text -

http://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/89498

It's in German of course, but this site said they translated it, and it matches up with what others sites have translated it as. This guys translation matches with the one above of a Pioneer guy saying Universal isn't exclusive. Guess time will tell.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=845226

 

[BatMatt]

I think it was proven false, although I feel it is inevitable

 

[Zenien]

Universe said it was 'Entirely False' whch is litteraly all they sai about it.

 

[RedIsNotBlue]

Just bought my PS3 with The Prestige on blu-ray. Picture looks amazing. When will American History X make it to blu-ray?

 

[BatMatt]

Just bought my PS3 with The Prestige on blu-ray. Picture looks amazing. When will American History X make it to blu-ray?

I'm not sure on that film, but great choice on a Blu-Ray movie, it was my first as well. It's very highly rated as one of the best BD out there so far

 

[RedIsNotBlue]

Yeah I haven't watched it all the way through just bits and pieces but the clarity is awesome. I can't wait to watch a movie like Spider-Man or Batman Begins on it. But American History X is up there on my list too I want that really bad.

 

[imdaly]

Anyone know if this is true or just a rumor?

http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=180





That's just a few days ago, but has Universal denied it? Also what pull do Pioneer representatives have over Universal to say that? If this is true then HD-DVD is probably over, it may not be, but I'm curious. At most this is just saying they can go neutral which doesn't mean Universal will, but that they aren't bound to if they don't want to.

Edit - Did some searching and apparently it is a real story. It turns out it was in Germany that Pioneer said this, and Universal Pictures Germany didn't deny it, however one site said they recieved an email from the head of Universal denying it like crazy, but who knows if that's true. Guess we'll need to wait on an official announcement. Here's the original text -

http://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/89498

It's in German of course, but this site said they translated it, and it matches up with what others sites have translated it as. This guys translation matches with the one above of a Pioneer guy saying Universal isn't exclusive. Guess time will tell.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=845226

Yes, they flat-out denied it almost immediately.

Just bought my PS3 with The Prestige on blu-ray. Picture looks amazing. When will American History X make it to blu-ray?

There's no mention of AHX hitting HD DVD/Blu-ray yet, but I agree with "The Prestige". I cannot WAIT to get it on HD DVD! That's one awesome movie!

 

[BatMatt]

May be a while for the Prestige to hit HD DVD, if it ever does at all

 

[Zenien]

"We made our bed with Blu-ray because we believed more in that format for a variety of reasons; some technical in nature, some due to the fact that it simply had broader support from a variety of industries, notably the motion picture studios but also what I’ll call the consumer electronics and the tech industry.

What we are seeing lately is that sales of Blu-ray discs are outpacing HD discs by at least two to one. As more quality Blu-ray product comes on the market, which is going to happen, notably with Pirates on May 22, we actually believe that the difference or the advantage of Blu-ray is only going to widen.

What we are also seeing is that the adoption of the platform right now is being held back a bit by a perception among consumers, really, that there is a format war; and that the hardware or the players are too expensive. We see the players coming down in price nicely, particularly by the Christmas season. We also believe that if Blu-ray continues to outpace HD DVD the retailers are ultimately going to weigh in, because they only have a limited amount of shelf space, and they are going to have to choose a format in order to manage their own shelf space. Once that happens, the advantage is going to go even more in Blu-ray’s direction.

I think the single greatest thing we can do right now is to not waffle, but to be very, very blunt about it, to continue our support of Blu-ray because we sense a real advantage. The best thing that could happen is for the format war to end, which will be very pro-consumer, particularly as hardware comes down.

The other thing I want to note is, if you look across the globe, the only place there is really a format war is in the United States. In other markets where next-gen DVD is starting to penetrate, Blu-ray is winning, and substantially; so much so there isn’t even a perceived format war.

So I think we made the right decision, the trends we are seeing seem to validate the decision. We think long-term, this is going to be a nice growth area for the company, because as you know sell-through DVD is a big business for the Walt Disney Company, even though we believe in things like VOD and the rental model. People want to own a Disney DVD, particularly in the next-generation format."

http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/s...CEO_Iger_Talks_Up_Blu-ray_in_Analyst_Call/622

 

[imdaly]

May be a while for the Prestige to hit HD DVD, if it ever does at all

I've got about 3 whole weeks to wait

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Prestige-HD...5-1202825?ie=UTF8&s=dvd&qid=1179195776&sr=1-4

 

[RedIsNotBlue]

Do those dvds play in US players?

 

[imdaly]

Absolutely!


One of the great advantages of HD DVD over Blu-ray is the fact that not one single HD DVD is region-encoded, meaning that any HD DVD owner here in North America has access to many "Blu-ray Only" HD DVDs from other countries.