The Good, The Bad, and The Official Western Thread

[C. Lee]

Yesterday I watched -

ANGEL AND THE BADMAN (1947) starring John Wayne, Gail Russell, Harry Carey, Bruce Cabot.

Quirt Evans (Wayne) is a man with a past of note. He was once a deputy for Wyatt Earp in Tombstone, and now has a shady reputation as a gunslinger and possible outlaw. After a shootout and a hard ride, the wounded Quirt's horse can go on no longer and collapses in front of the house of a Quaker family. Insisting he needs to get to town to the telegraph office, the rancher (John Halloran) and his daughter (Gail Russell) take him there. After he dictates a message, staking claim to a piece of land, he passes out into Russell's arms. As she cradles him in her arms on the floor, you can tell that it is love at first sight for her.

They take him back to their ranch and nurse him back to health. They learn of his reputation, but their religious beliefs tell them to treat him as a friend and give him their trust. Russell makes no attempt to hide her attraction to him, he likes her looks and the family's kindness, but he's a saddle tramp on a mission to find the murderer (Bruce Cabot) of a friend of his. Federal marshal McClintock (Harry Carey) also shows up to let him know that he's keeping an eye on him.

Various events ensue - a neighboring rancher cuts off the water supply and Quirt goes over to "convince" him to undam the creek, the Quaker community happily accepts him into their midst (which confuses him), he runs off for a bit to town and after a night at the saloon with "loose" women and barfights he returns to the ranch for some home cooking and quiet time. Laredo Stevens (Cabot) who knows that Quirt is after him, catches him and Russell out for a buggy ride without his guns and attack. They survive, but Russell is in bad shape...so Quirt who had been leaning towards the quiet life straps on his guns and goes to town for revenge.

I will spoiler tag the end.....

Spoiler

As he goes to town, a "miracle" happens and Russell awakens, her parents put her in a wagon and head into town to stop Quirt from killing. Quirt calls Cabot and his partner out....shaken by the news he is still alive, they have to take a little liquid courage to prepare to meet him. As Quirt waits outside the bar, Russell and her family show up. She convinces him there is no reason to kill the men because she is alright...he hands his pistol over to her. At that point Cabot and his partner come out and start the fight.....but they are both dropped from gunshots off camera. You then see federal marshal McClintock with a smoking rifle in his hands. He walks over and tells them, he had planned for them to shoot it out and then hang the winner, but when he saw that Quirt had decided not to fight he had to step in. Quirt picks up the still weak Russel and puts her in his lap as he sits on the back of the wagon...as it drives off with them in it, Quirts says "Looks like I've become a farmer."

This was the first movie that John Wayne produced.

Gail Russell would play his romantic lead again a year later in WAKE OF THE RED WITCH. She would unfortuantly die at the age of 36 due to alchoholism.

Harry Carey had been a star of early films in the silent era through the 30's. He was one of Wayne's idols, and he patterned many of his mannerisms after him. He would become a good friend with Carey's son (Harry Carey Jr) and would feature him in dozens of his later movies.

Bad guy Bruce Cabot also appeared in around a dozen of Wayne's movies.

There are characters named HONDO and McCLINTOCK in this movie...bothe were later titles of John Wayne movies.

 

[C. Lee]

Yesterday I watched -

THE BIG TRAIL (1930) starring John Wayne, Marguerite Churchill, Tyrone Power Sr.

Directed by Raoul Walsh

Breck Coleman (John Wayne) a well known and respected frontiersman is hunting for the murderer of a friend. The trail leads to a wagon train of settlers starting out in Missouri and headed to Oregon. He joins the train as their scout. All the way across the country he is in a love/hate relationship with Ruth Cameron (Marguerite Churchill), playing cat and mouse with the men he suspects are the murderers (they are, and make several attempts on his life along the way), and deals with hazards of a trip like this; hostile Indians, severe weather, harsh landscapes.

This was the first starring role for Wayne...and those used to the older looking man from his later films will be surprised by the young boyish face and shy actions of the man.

The main bad guy is played by Tyrone Power Sr (the father of more famous actor Tyrone Power). This was his last movie (and only talkie)....and while his son was known as a handsome man, senior could not boast the same. Not knowing the exact history of the Popeye the sailor man cartoons, I could swear that they created Bluto after his appearance in this movie. He plays a large barrel chested bearded hairy armed rough sandpaper voiced man.

There are apparently multiple variations of this movie. It was shot in both 70mm wide screen and standard industry size. According to IMDB both versions still exist, but they differ in content....it was also simultaniously shot in German, French, and Spanish (different main actors, but using the same extras, sets, props...)

Except for a couple of scenes in a house at the beginning, it is all shot outdoors, sometimes in terrible weather. They are shown crossing deserts, mountains, and rivers. The rain scenes may have been from rain machines, but the blizzard scenes in the mountains looks as real as can be. There is also some nice shots of John and others under the giant redwood trees.

This is one of those that I definately recommend film fans to take a look at. It's an early talkie, so there are sound problems (and interesting to see some of the story explanation cards that silents were known for) but to see an epic early film shot in real life wild country (you know that there isn't a McDonalds just out of range of the camera) a 23 year old fresh faced John Wayne, and scenes that show native Americans not as evil bad guys, but some as friendly helpers and the others as defenders of their land being invaded by Europeans.

 

[C. Lee]

Today I watched -

EL CONDOR (1970) starring Jim Brown, Lee Van Cleef, Patrick O'Neal, Marianna Hill, and Iron Eyes Cody. Directed by John Guillermin

In the 60's a sub-genre of the WESTERN appeared called THE SPAGHETTI WESTERN....in the 70's a sub-sub-genre appeared called the BLACK EXPLOITATION SPAGHETTI WESTERN.

The story starts with Luke (Jim Brown) in a prison chain gang in the southwest USA (we don't know why he is there). Another prisoner tells him about a Mexican fort holding millions in gold and run by an evil commadant. Luke escapes and goes looking for it. He meets up with Jaroo (Van Cleef) a nutty gold prospector/outlaw/wanderer and teams up with him. Jaroo has connections to a bunch of Apaches led by Santana (Iron Eyes Cody) and brings them in on the plan to overtake the fort. The fort is run by Chavez (Patrick O'Neil) who we are first introduced to as he fights a bull with a sword while riding his horse in front of his men. We also meet his mistress Claudine (Marianna Hill) a beautiful woman who we find is only with Chavez because he is strong and in charge.

Through the rest of the movie we have action of all sort....guys having cannons shot at them for the sport of it, Apaches attacking soldiers, soldiers attacking villagers, a mass rape scene where a dozen soldiers take the women of a village, and a mass killing of the naked soldiers by Luke, Jaroo, and his Apaches. This is not a kiddie movie...there is a lot of nudity in this scene of both women and men. Later in the movie there is another nude scene of Claudine doing a strip tease to distract the soldiers at the fort. All in all, over a hundred men killed in various ways and a dozen women raped and appearing nude. Like I said, not a film for the kids.

 

[Victarion]

What sort of critical reception did El Condor recieve back when it came out? Speaking as an outsider looking in (Unforgiven is the heaviest Western I've seen thus far), that sounds pretty intense for a Western.

 

[C. Lee]

What sort of critical reception did El Condor recieve back when it came out? Speaking as an outsider looking in (Unforgiven is the heaviest Western I've seen thus far), that sounds pretty intense for a Western.

I was around 12 when it came out, there was no internet back then...so don't personally know of any reaction to it (I didn't even learn of the movie until around 15 years ago, didn't get to see it for the first time until about 10 years ago)....but I have read that this was one of the first movies to get the then newly instated "R" rating.

There are many westerns starting in the mid 60's that can be considered pretty intense....you don't hear as much about them mainly because people today rarely talk about westerns at all.

I like all types of them...from Gene Autry's singing do gooder to Franco Nero's original bad boy Django......I have a decent collection of all kinds and will post about them as I get them watched again.

 

[gwynplaine]

I was around 12 when it came out, there was no internet back then...so don't personally know of any reaction to it (I didn't even learn of the movie until around 15 years ago, didn't get to see it for the first time until about 10 years ago)....but I have read that this was one of the first movies to get the then newly instated "R" rating.

There are many westerns starting in the mid 60's that can be considered pretty intense....you don't hear as much about them mainly because people today rarely talk about westerns at all.

I like all types of them...from Gene Autry's singing do gooder to Franco Nero's original bad boy Django......I have a decent collection of all kinds and will post about them as I get them watched again.

 

[gwynplaine]

 

[gwynplaine]

 

[C. Lee]

I just finished -

FORT APACHE (1948) starring John Wayne, Henry Fonda, Shirley Temple, Pedro Armendáriz, Ward Bond, John Agar, George O'Brien, and Victor McLaglen.

Directed by John Ford

Many people when they comment on Henry Fonda playing a bad guy, they referance ONCE UPON A TIME IN THE WEST (and yes, he played an evil bastard in that)...in this he is the bad guy also....but because he is a self centered stuckup bigoted dick. As another reviewer said, he isn't evil, he's just a stupid bastard that gets many people killed because of his arrogance.

Lt. Col. Owen Thursday (Fonda) and his daughter Philadelphia (19 year old Shirley Temple) are going to Fort Apache Arizona where he is to now assume command. We learn immediately that he is a stuck up prissy idiot with his incessant complaining about the west, the locals, the heat, the dust, the "ignorant savages", and so on. Through the whole movie he never shies away from expressing his disdain for everything and everyone out west. Before they make it to the Fort, they stop at a way station where they encounter new West Point grad 2nd Lt. Michael Shannon O'Rourke (John Agar.....many may know Agar from his many "B" sci fi movies, of note is the fact that he had married Temple a couple of years before this movie, and the notoriety from that led to this, his first acting role)....Philadelphia is instantly smitten (which stick up his butt Fonda is oblivious to) and Col Thursday is thoroughly disgusted that a troop of soldiers had arrived at the station to escort O'Rourke to the fort and not him.

When he arrives at the Fort, he misses no time in letting everyone know how much he hates the idea he is there, how much he hates how they are doing things, and how much he hates various troopers he encounters because they aren't as snappily dressed and stiff as he is. Basicly....he proves he is a dick. When he meets his assistant Sgt. Maj. Michael O'Rourke (Ward Bond) he asks if he is any relation to the 2nd Lt. O'Rourke he met on the way there....Bond tells him he is his son. Thursday acts astonished and rudely asks how a lowly sgt could get a son into West point. Turns out the father was awarded the medal of honor during the civil war, and one of the benefits of that is one of your kids gets an all expenses paid scholorship to West point. When Lt. Col. Thursday's daughter lets him know she is interested in the young O'Rourke, he forbids she have anything to do with him because he comes from a lower "class" of people than they do.

Others at the Fort are Capt. Kirby York (John Wayne...loved by all the fort, a decent wise intelligent officer), Capt. Sam Collingwood (George O'Brien....who we find is a decent fellow, but has a past with Thursday that the Lt. Col holds a grudge against him for) and for comedic relief Sgt. Festus Mulcahy (Victor McLaglen). Trouble starts brewing with the local Apaches. It's shown that they are leaving the reservation and raiding because of corrupt Indian Agents cheating, starving, and violating their women. Thursday of course will not listen to any of his officers who have actually fought the Apache's out west and countermands anything they recommend. Capt. Kirby says he thinks he can bring Cochise and his men in peacefully (he has known him for years, and they trust each other)...he thinks that if they can guarantee changes at the reservation, thinks will settle down. Thursday send him out to do this....and Kirby does meet with Cochise and makes an agreement for them to meet at a certain spot with Thursday and government officials to talk it out.

I will spoiler cover the rest -

Spoiler

When they go there, Thursday of course just takes this as a chance to attack and defeat Cochise. Kirby protests because he gave his word to talk, Thursday accuses him of cowardice and tells him to take the supply train to a ridge and watch the encounter "from safety". Thursday then leads most of his company into a canyon charging the few Apache's that had come out and shot at them....as they ride into the canyon, the several hundred Apache's in the rocks open fire and decimate the troopers.

This a classic movie. Ford does a fantastic job filming in Monument Valley, there are good performances throughout...several great action scenes and a fine story about the folly of conceit.

 

[C. Lee]

Yesterday I watched -

KID VENGEANCE (1977) Lee Van Cleef, Jim Brown, Leif Garrett, Glynnis O'Connor, John Marley, Matt Clark.

Tom Thurston (Leif Garrett...a big teen heartthrob of the day) is traveling with his parents and older sister Lisa (Glynnis O'Connor - ODE TO BILLY JOE) on a wagon heading further west. McClain (Van Cleef) is the leader of an outlaw gang out hunting for trouble. Isaac (Jim Brown) is a loner gold prospector who is being harassed by several local idiots (they include Matt Clark -BUCKAROO BANZAI, OUTLAW JOSEY WALES - and Timothy Scott - BUTCH CASSIDY AND THE SUNDANCE KID, LONESOME DOVE). After Isaac fights off the harassers he runs into the Thurston family out in the desert, they treat him kindly, feeding him and watering his horse. After he leaves, Tom goes out hunting...then Van Cleef and his gang arrive. Lisa manages to hide in the wagon while the gang kills dad and rapes and kills mom. Tom sees this happen, but is greatly outnumbered (there are around 15 gang members). After this, the gang takes off with the wagon and it's contents, which include Tom's sister that they don't know about.

Leif Garret is around 16 years old when the movie was made, but to me he looks 12 (they never mention the characters age, but his looking that young could have been intentional)....so what happens next is a little surprising for a movie of that time. He sets out hunting them....and manages to kill around six of them before he comes across Isaac again...only this time he is tied up to a rock left to die in the desert by Van Cleef and his gang after they steal his gold. The gang finds Tom's sister...and instead of raping her, they decide to take her off and sell her to the highest bidder. They take her back to their base village while trying to figure who is killing their men (they don't know about Tom). Tom and Isaac show up to break her out, and with the help of Ricardo, a young gang member who seems not to be cut out for the outlaw road they take off. The gang finds out about this and a big shootout occurs through the town. Isaac is killed....and Van Cleef faces off with Tom. Van Cleef, obviously not expecting any trouble from the 12 year old looking kid...is mighty surprised when Tom puts six bullets in him. His family is avenged and he rides off after his sister who is being taken to safety by Ricardo. The End.

This is worth watching at least once.....if for nothing else seeing the baby faced Garrett killing off a bunch of guys in various ways - snakes, scorpions, stones, bow and arrow, guns.....

 

[gwynplaine]

Great reviews, thanks, C.Lee

 

[gwynplaine]

 

[Tao43]

There is a western/horror film coming out this year or next titled Bone Tomahawk. Stars Kurt Russell as a sherriff who has to save Jennifer Carpenter from cannibals. Gathers up a posse, including a gunslinger played by Timothy Olyphant. Sounds like it might be worth a view.

 

[DarkKnight]

There is a western/horror film coming out this year or next titled Bone Tomahawk. Stars Kurt Russell as a sherriff who has to save Jennifer Carpenter from cannibals. Gathers up a posse, including a gunslinger played by Timothy Olyphant. Sounds like it might be worth a view.

Kurt Russell and Timothy Olyphant as cowboys again... Deal, Sign me up.

 

[gwynplaine]

There is a western/horror film coming out this year or next titled Bone Tomahawk. Stars Kurt Russell as a sherriff who has to save Jennifer Carpenter from cannibals. Gathers up a posse, including a gunslinger played by Timothy Olyphant. Sounds like it might be worth a view.

Take my money nowt:

 

[DarkKnight]

Take my money nowt:

LOL need that "take my money now" Fry gif.

 

[C. Lee]

On Jan 3rd I watched -


THE DESERT TRAIL (1935) starring John Wayne, Paul Fix, Mary Kornman.

After 1930's THE BIG TRAIL (Wayne's first starring role) until 1939's STAGECOACH (the movie that changed his career and the way that westerns were made and seen by the public) Wayne starred in 56 cheap "B" and "C" grade movies. usually just around one hour long, they were short on plot but heavy on action.

The Desert Trail is a comedy/drama that can't be taken seriously. John Scott (Wayne) a rodeo rider and his friend Kansas Charlie (Eddy Chandler) a gambler travel the west getting into trouble. Besides playing loose with the cards during poker games, they are both talked up as doing well with the ladies (which is extremely more believable for a young Wayne than for the older, balding, overweight friend). They both start "wooing" the same Mexican girl Juanita (Carmen Laroux )...but you wonder what she would be doing with them, then you see her "playing" a third guy...and you get it a long time before these two guys do.

One things leads to another, and the pair are accused of a holdup and murder, so go looking for the real guys to clear their name. This leads to them going to another city, changing their names, and spending more time "wooing" the new girl they run into, Anne (Mary Kornman) who just coincidently is the sister of one of the guys they are looking for. Chases, shootouts, misunderstandings, ruses, and fights ensue until good triumphs over evil.

Not a must see by a long shot. Mainly to be watched by someone wanting to watch every Wayne movie or to get an idea what many old westerns from the 30's were like.

 

[C. Lee]

NORTH TO ALASKA (1960) starring John Wayne, Stewart Granger, Capucine, Ernie Kovacs, Fabian, Mickey Shaughnessy, Karl Swenson, and Kathleen Freeman.

Many people don't think about John Wayne when they think comedy...but they should, and this movie is a great example of it. It's 1900 goldrush Alaska....Sam McCord (Wayne) and his partners George Pratt (Granger) and his younger brother Billy Pratt (Fabian....he was a teen idol singer at the time) strike it rich. While Sam goes down to Seattle to buy bigger better mining equipment, the brothers stay behind to keep a watch on the mine because of all of the claim jumping going on. George also wants Sam to bring his French fiancee Jenny (who he can't stop talking about and is madly in love with) back up to Alaska. Sam thinks he's nuts...because women are fine to have fun with on a Saturday night, but having one around all the time is not for him. Before he can leave for Seattle we are also introduced to con man/thief Frankie Canon (Kovacs) as he tries to steal Sam's money.

In Seattle....Sam buys a bunch of clothes and "doo dads" for George's fiancee and takes them to her to give her the good news....unfortuantely George had been panning for gold for 3 years, and she is now married to someone else. Knowing this will break George's heart to end, Sam goes to the best brothel in town to console him from afar. There he runs into the French beauty Angel (Capucine)...and gets the great idea to bring her back to George instead. He talks her into doing it (she mistakenly thinks he wants her for himself) and after a day watching him pal around with a bunch of logger friends at a lumberjack howdown being all manly and studly, she really starts falling for him and they head north to Alaska. Once there, she finds out she is meant for George, and being upset, at first decides to back out of the deal. Sam puts her up at a local hotel, that we now find has been stolen from the original proprieter by crook Frankie Canon...and that he knows her from the past. Not liking how Frankie talks about stealing from the miners, and wanting to be with Sam more...she fakes that someone is messing with her in the hotel which gets Sam to come a running and protectively take her with him up to his mine site.

Once there, they find that George is over at another miner's site helping him fight off claim jumpers Sam heads over there to help them, leaving Angel with young Billy....young horney never touched a women but wants to oh so badly Billy. So we now have a bunch of guys fighting claim jumpers and Angel fighting an Angel jumper. After they fight off the bad guys, Sam tells George about Jenny being married...and he does not take it well. Sam goes back to their mine to take Angel back to town, but George shows up and kind of likes the idea of taking Angel instead...which upsets Sam. George takes Angel to the "honeymoon" cabin he built across the river from the main camp...and quickly realizes that she is in love with Sam....and after he questions her about how lewd and rude Sam had acted to her, she tells him that he had been a perfect sweet gentleman...he realizes that Sam is in love with her (but knows he will never admit it). So he hatches a plan to make him jealous, which works, but a Jealous Sam is a angry Sam and an angry Sam punches George and says he's out of the partnership. That's when the Army shows up saying that someone else has staked a claim on this mine and that no one can do anything there or use any of the gold mined from it until there is court meeting about it. This leads everyone back to town for a big fistfight through the muddy streets destroying several buildings and righting all wrongs.

You have to remember this is a comedy. There are a couple of large scale fistfights in the movie, both played for laughs. The one semi serious fight (defending the mine from claim jumpers) is 95% comical in execution. Seeing the antics of Wayne getting madder and madder as his jealousy grows or his dealing with young Fabian about all of his naivety with the world are hilarious. This a fun and action filled movie for most everyone in the family.

 

[GremlinZilla89]

I'm mostly a spaghetti western fan. Old school American westerns by and large bore me as I find them dry and typical. I absolutely cannot stand John Wayne. One of the worst famous actors ever.

Some of the American westerns I love/like:

Unforgiven
Tombstone
Two Mules For Sister Sara
High Planes Drifter
The Outlaw Josey Wales
3:10 To Yuma (remake)
True Grit (remake)
The Wild Bunch
Django Unchained
Open Range
The Assassination of Jesse James By the Coward Robert Ford
Lonely Are the Brave
McCabe and Ms. Miller

One's I find overrated:
Shane
The Magnificent Seven
True Grit (OG)
High Noon
The Searchers
Stage Coach
Hondo
Rio Bravo
The Man Who Shot Liberty Valence
Little Big Man
Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid
Dances With Wolves

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

High Noon is one of the greatest Westerns ever.

 

[gwynplaine]

So are Rio Bravo, The Searchers, The Magnificent Seven, Liberty Valance, Stagecoach, Little Big Man, Butch Cassidy...
Take it tho the "unpopular thread" Gremlinzillat:

 

[GremlinZilla89]

 

[gwynplaine]

Just kidding, to each their own of course

Spoiler

Also, you're wrong

 

[GremlinZilla89]

Say that again.

 

[gwynplaine]

t:

Spoiler