Discussion: Guns, The Second Amendment, NRA - Part II

[Teelie]

Self-defense and the defense of others is the primary reason for people owning guns in this country. They care very much about protecting themselves and others against acts of violence.

Why is this so hard to understand?

How many of those guns are ever used for self defense as opposed to murder, suicide or assault? How hard is that to understand? And a lot of these guns are impractical for self defense because the owners are not trained how to use them, or the guns are bad for self defense in general because they aren't right for being indoors, where most self defense cases would be.

I also forgot to mention the biggest problem: accidental gun deaths. More people die from an idiot with a gun than ever saved by the "good guy with a gun" mythos. And chlidren. So many children die because guns are so prevalent. Other countries do just fine without the wild wild west gun culture you realize.

There is no training, there is no education, there is no real regulation for guns yet people get their license for driving only after they are taught how to use a vehicle and they still manage to screw that up.

 

[Holiday]

Then they wouldn't be his supporters. Bloomberg has some very concerning views on law enforcement and criminal justice from the average Democrat. Frankly, only Delaney is more right than Bloomberg. There is a reason he has less minority support than Buttigieg.

I don't know what else to call people who would show up to a Bloomberg rally. I admit I've only read the quote, and haven't seen the video. Maybe there were boos.

 

[MovieSlave]

Self-defense and the defense of others is the primary reason for people owning guns in this country. They care very much about protecting themselves and others against acts of violence.

Why is this so hard to understand?

It's not hard to understand, some people like being willfully ignorant to certain things if it doesn't fit their agenda.

Also hilarious how some biased leftists are stating it's only white people at this rally. I just came across a bunch of pictures of minorities there.

How many of those guns are ever used for self defense as opposed to murder, suicide or assault? How hard is that to understand? And a lot of these guns are impractical for self defense because the owners are not trained how to use them, or the guns are bad for self defense in general because they aren't right for being indoors, where most self defense cases would be.

I also forgot to mention the biggest problem: accidental gun deaths. More people die from an idiot with a gun than ever saved by the "good guy with a gun" mythos. And chlidren. So many children die because guns are so prevalent. Other countries do just fine without the wild wild west gun culture you realize.

There is no training, there is no education, there is no real regulation for guns yet people get their license for driving only after they are taught how to use a vehicle and they still manage to screw that up.

This is absolute false nonsense. There are more gang related deaths in this country and a lot of these civilian deaths are overblown due to the media and internet sensationalism.

 

[Sithborg]

I don't know what else to call people who would show up to a Bloomberg rally. I admit I've only read the quote, and haven't seen the video. Maybe there were boos.

Once again, fans of Bloomberg are not exactly representative of the Democratic party. A lot of his views run against a lot of the common belief of the Democratic party. He is frankly the only Democratic candidate I would not vote for in the general if he was able to buy the nomination.

As for the Virginia stuff, must be nice to see the few pockets of POC. Because a lot of these groups are white supremacist adjacent, at best.

 

[BoredGuy]

It's not hard to understand, some people like being willfully ignorant to certain things if it doesn't fit their agenda.

Also hilarious how some biased leftists are stating it's only white people at this rally. I just came across a bunch of pictures of minorities there.



This is absolute false nonsense. There are more gang related deaths in this country and a lot of these civilian deaths are overblown due to the media and internet sensationalism.

Point the first: the NRA used to mainly promote rifles and long guns, and said they were for hunting and sport, now its all about pistols and rifles for "self-defense"... why the change in strategy? It's almost like they now its all bulls**t and they're just trying to sell you a product. And they know, given how much over-the-top vitriol is spewed all over this country that they can sell it to people off of civil war part 2 dog whistles. Crime rates in this country have fallen for decades, so why is self-defense such a huge concern now, when it wasn't before??

And I have not seen a single article saying "it's only white guys"
every article says "mostly white crowd", which is factually correct

And on your last point, the statistics completely disagree with you, unless you believe in nonsense conspiracies

 

[MovieSlave]

How many of those guns are ever used for self defense as opposed to murder, suicide or assault? How hard is that to understand? And a lot of these guns are impractical for self defense because the owners are not trained how to use them, or the guns are bad for self defense in general because they aren't right for being indoors, where most self defense cases would be.

I also forgot to mention the biggest problem: accidental gun deaths. More people die from an idiot with a gun than ever saved by the "good guy with a gun" mythos. And chlidren. So many children die because guns are so prevalent. Other countries do just fine without the wild wild west gun culture you realize.

There is no training, there is no education, there is no real regulation for guns yet people get their license for driving only after they are taught how to use a vehicle and they still manage to screw that up.

Point the first: the NRA used to mainly promote rifles and long guns, and said they were for hunting and sport, now its all about pistols and rifles for "self-defense"... why the change in strategy? It's almost like they now its all bulls**t and they're just trying to sell you a product. And they know, given how much over-the-top vitriol is spewed all over this country that they can sell it to people off of civil war part 2 dog whistles. Crime rates in this country have fallen for decades, so why is self-defense such a huge concern now, when it wasn't before??

And I have not seen a single article saying "it's only white guys"
every article says "mostly white crowd", which is factually correct

And on your last point, the statistics completely disagree with you, unless you believe in nonsense conspiracies

Well I'll even admit the NRA is full of **** and an extremist group. As for "nonsense conspiracies", they're not. People just don't want to admit those factors I brought up.

 

[Sithborg]

We are talking about white people at the rally, because the militia groups are the point of concern. And militia groups tend to be white.

 

[Teelie]

Seeing the news today, a lot of shooting deaths, none are gang related.

 

[Holiday]

Once again, fans of Bloomberg are not exactly representative of the Democratic party. A lot of his views run against a lot of the common belief of the Democratic party. He is frankly the only Democratic candidate I would not vote for in the general if he was able to buy the nomination.

As for the Virginia stuff, must be nice to see the few pockets of POC. Because a lot of these groups are white supremacist adjacent, at best.

I find it surprising then that other than the WSJ and Right Wing news sites, no one is calling out Bloomberg's ridiculous statement by pointing out the high profile shootings in the last few years where police got it wrong.

 

[Mike5575]

How many of those guns are ever used for self defense as opposed to murder, suicide or assault? How hard is that to understand? And a lot of these guns are impractical for self defense because the owners are not trained how to use them, or the guns are bad for self defense in general because they aren't right for being indoors, where most self defense cases would be.

I also forgot to mention the biggest problem: accidental gun deaths. More people die from an idiot with a gun than ever saved by the "good guy with a gun" mythos. And chlidren. So many children die because guns are so prevalent. Other countries do just fine without the wild wild west gun culture you realize.

There is no training, there is no education, there is no real regulation for guns yet people get their license for driving only after they are taught how to use a vehicle and they still manage to screw that up.

According to a 2013 , self-defense is an effective crime deterrent and firearms are used in self-defense at least 500,000 times a year. This far outnumbers the people killed and injured by guns.

Accidental gun deaths account for less than 3% gun deaths annually. Just Google "accidental gun deaths a year."

There is plenty of training and education available for folks who want it. Also, some states mandate it as a requirement for concealed carry.

CDC Study: Use of Firearms for Self-Defense is ‘Important Crime Deterrent’

 

[Teelie]

None of which changes the fact more guns are more of a problem than less guns being more of a problem.

Fewer guns means fewer gun deaths. It is simple math.

 

[Mike5575]

None of which changes the fact more guns are more of a problem than less guns being more of a problem.

Fewer guns means fewer gun deaths. It is simple math.

Simple math shows the exact opposite to be true.

 

[Teelie]

Twist the facts all you like but less guns makes sense. Correlation does not equal causation. Why else are we the only 1st world country with such astronomical gun violence rates? There are only a few war torn countries with worse statistics.

 

[TheGuy]

 

[:eek:]

‘Back To The Future Part II’ Stuntwoman Killed In Shootout – Deadline

 

[Teelie]

Reading the story behind that... it is still too early to know what was going on but apparently it was her ex-husband who shot her after she and her current husband ambushed him on his property.

 

[Holiday]

Stunt woman, 59, who doubled for Jessica Alba, and her husband are shot dead by her ex-husband | Daily Mail Online

More details. Looking like a justified self defense shooting.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

According to a 2013 , self-defense is an effective crime deterrent and firearms are used in self-defense at least 500,000 times a year. This far outnumbers the people killed and injured by guns.

Accidental gun deaths account for less than 3% gun deaths annually. Just Google "accidental gun deaths a year."

There is plenty of training and education available for folks who want it. Also, some states mandate it as a requirement for concealed carry.

CDC Study: Use of Firearms for Self-Defense is ‘Important Crime Deterrent’

Le sigh...

The study that gun-rights activists keep citing but completely misunderstand - The Washington Post

So it would appear the "good use" of guns outweighs the "bad use." That may be true, except the study says all of those statistics are in dispute -- creating, in the study authors' eyes, a research imperative.

The study (available as a PDF) calls the defensive use of guns by crime victims "a common occurrence, although the exact number remains disputed." While it might be as high as 3 million defensive uses of guns each year, some scholars point to the much lower estimate of 108,000 times a year. "The variation in these numbers remains a controversy in the field," the study notes.

As for your source:

CNS News - Media Bias/Fact Check

A factual search reveals multiple failed fact checks for CNS News. Below is a list of failed fact checks either directly or indirectly tied to CNS News:

• In Oregon, do 15-year-olds have complete control over sterilization? (False)
• Did the ACLU Complain That Trump Said ‘America’ Too Many Times in State of the Union? (False)
• Did Melania Trump Hire an Exorcist to Cleanse the White House of Obama ‘Demons’? (False)
• Are there more welfare recipients in the U.S. than full-time workers? (False)
• Shrub found in wild during California highway project transplanted for $148,000; move wasn’t paid for with Obama-approved economic stimulus aid (Mostly False)

Overall, we rate CNS News Questionable based on extreme right wing bias, promotion of propaganda and numerous failed fact checks. (6/18/2016) Updated (M. Huitsing 9/26/2019)


Media Research Center - RationalWiki


From rational wiki:

The Media Research Center is another right-wing self-proclaimed "media watchdog" organization founded by perpetual crybaby L. Brent Bozell III.

And for those that are unfamiliar with all around hypocritical piece of pond scum in the form of a human being that is Bozell:

L. Brent Bozell III - RationalWiki

Some more evidence to undermine your assertions:

Nearly 40,000 People Died From Guns in U.S. Last Year, Highest in 50 Years

From the article about the difference between Red Kansas and Blue NYC:

Dakota Jablon, who analyzed the C.D.C. data for the Educational Fund to Stop Gun Violence, noticed another trend underlying the data: state-by-state variations, which she believes could reflect differences in gun laws.

For example, Kansas, which received an F from the national advocacy group Giffords Law Center’s gun law scorecard, had increases in both its firearm suicide and homicide rates over the past decade. New York, which was given an A-minus, had both rates decrease, according to her analysis of C.D.C. data.

“Some states are doing incredible work,” Ms. Jablon said. “They are passing these lifesaving policies that are clearly working.”


But... I'm positive you won't bother to read any of that, just as I'm sure you didn't actually read the 2013 study and I'm sure you still haven't bothered to read this despite it being way shorter than an actual government study paper:

Trump Engaged in Suspect Tax Schemes as He Reaped Riches From His Father

 

[:eek:]

Rising Rapper Pop Smoke Shot Dead in L.A.

 

[Sithborg]

Figured I would put this here, since he is a popular topic in this thread.

George Zimmerman sues Pete Buttigieg, Elizabeth Warren over Trayvon Martin birthday tweets

And the offending tweets.



Along with his suit against Martin's family, just a reenforcement of the need for a federal anti-slaap law.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

I just wonder... How does Zimmerman, or indeed many on social media and forums who feel the need to defend a walking scumbag like him, ever walk into a convenience store or gas station without fear... What with all the bags of Skittles laying about.

 

[Holiday]

I just wonder... How does Zimmerman, or indeed many on social media and forums who feel the need to defend a walking ******* like him, ever walk into a convenience store or gas station without fear... What with all the bags of Skittles laying about.

How does he make it across the concrete sidewalk, like the one Trayvon Martin bounced his head off of, would be a more appropriate question.

The Skittles narrative was made up by the same leech who put a false witness on the stand. It's a joke, but I guess that's all a person can do when they have no real arguments.

 

[DJ Kornphlake]

Zimmerman is too busy autographing bags of Skittles to be scared of them.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

Zimmerman is too busy autographing bags of Skittles to be scared of them.

Indeed. Because he's human pond scum.

Which doesn't seem to stop him from amassing support from folk that seem to be okay with human pond scum that go out of their way to kill teenagers armed with a bag of candy.

Go figure.

 

[Holiday]

Reminder of what Zimmerman looked like after being hit by a teen "armed with a bag of candy".