The Horror Thread - Part 2

[GremlinZilla89]

I'll be the brave one to say Lords of Salem is freakin' great. Utterly misunderstood (sometimes purposefully) imo.

 

[redhawk23]

Even Zombie admits he ran out of money and just kind of crapped out on the end.

 

[Heretic]

How is Lords of Salem misunderstood?

Is it because Zombie...a guy who made his money and name in music for decades...completely got the radio system wrong in his film about radio djs??? One would assume he'd actually make that a bit realistic.
Maybe the fact that the author's obsession is COMPLETELY unwarranted, given the facts he is presented with...so we are likely talking about a guy who spends his life stalking people for no reason.
Maybe it's the fact that the lead character says "Bye" to her friends who are worried about her and on their way with her somewhere, as she ducks into a building...and then her friends are never seen again...apparently shrugging their shoulders and walking off?
Maybe it's the fact that scenes that take place in the film are never mentioned again...except in explanatory footage as the credits roll...as if they realized that they forgot to handle those plot points?

No...this is not a misunderstood movie...it's jumbled up crap designed to look like art.

 

[GremlinZilla89]

How is Lords of Salem misunderstood?

Is it because Zombie...a guy who made his money and name in music for decades...completely got the radio system wrong in his film about radio djs??? One would assume he'd actually make that a bit realistic.
Maybe the fact that the author's obsession is COMPLETELY unwarranted, given the facts he is presented with...so we are likely talking about a guy who spends his life stalking people for no reason.
Maybe it's the fact that the lead character says "Bye" to her friends who are worried about her and on their way with her somewhere, as she ducks into a building...and then her friends are never seen again...apparently shrugging their shoulders and walking off?
Maybe it's the fact that scenes that take place in the film are never mentioned again...except in explanatory footage as the credits roll...as if they realized that they forgot to handle those plot points?

No...this is not a misunderstood movie...it's jumbled up crap designed to look like art.

Or you know, you can accept people like it. I'm not saying its perfect but I do believe it is a good example of physiological and psychedelic horror.

 

[Heretic]

Or you know, you can accept people like it. I'm not saying its perfect but I do believe it is a good example of physiological and psychedelic horror.

See what you do did there???

You flat out "blamed" viewers who don't like it...saying that they just didn't understand what you were able to grasp...and then when confronted it's "oh, you should just accept that some people like it."

Sorry...you struck first by suggesting that we are somehow beneath the intelligence of the movie. Now...back up your claim or accept that you're going to have to defend the stupidity in the film.

 

[Teelie]

If you don't like a movie I did or vice versa, you just don't know good movies and your opinion is irrelevant.

I think I just summed up every single argument about movies ever in one sentence.

 

[Heretic]

I'm all for people having different opinions...but when you say that people weren't able to understand a movie and then provide ZERO support for your position, then you have no leg to stand on.

I gave a few examples that I felt were glaring...and I kind of expected an explanation as to why I'm not smart enough to figure out the genius behind decisions that make no sense.

EDIT: I'll add that I LOVE being proven wrong. I hated the end of The Last Will and Testament of Rosalind Leigh. This dude on the net said he believed that I misinterpreted it...so I watched it again...and it's now in my top 10 of the year.

 

[Teelie]

It wasn't directly specifically at you but you are right in that giving an example of why other people should or not like a movie requires more depth than their word and no reasoning behind it beyond their own sense of importance and tastes.

I'm not against people who want to try to change the opinion of others about a movie they didn't like. Sometimes a movie takes multiple viewings or another perspective to see why it is a good movie. Sometimes it's just not going to happen and you'll have to live with it.

I still don't get the praise behind 2001 but I don't try to make people see it as the boring hours long snooze-fest I always find it. And one day I might finally see what it is that so enchanting about the movie. Until then I have to listen to some people praise it and say how anyone who doesn't get it must be lacking in some way.

Although I do really dislike people who try to dress up their explanations in high-minded critiques or symbolism they almost certainly lifted off someone else who is truly gifted in movie critiquing to make themselves seem like an authority or master of movies.

Unless you want to be seen as egotistical don't bother using obscure or fanciful explanations no one uses outside of professional film circuts. I understand a lot of it and I still don't give a **** if you can use that lingo. This isn't film school, we're not students and you're sure as hell not a teacher (and if you are you'll want to teach accordingly and maybe start charging for that service).

There's also those who seek to make other people dislike a movie because they dislike it themselves. I just hate those people.

 

[Heretic]

Let's put it this way...I'm not the sharpest bulb in the crayon box. I LOVE watching movies that make me think...but I do tend to seek out other interpretations online to see what I might be missing. Those insights can inform me, and give me a deeper understanding than I would otherwise have.

My favorite films of the year are mostly like that. Resolution is a film that I watched several days ago...then watched it again the next night with my girlfriend. She didn't "get" it...so I explained my take to her...and she now loves the film and can't wait to watch it again. Upstream Color is another. Magic Magic is a movie that I ADORE...and yet the reviews from the public are really harsh...but I thought a lot about the film and think I "get" what they were doing and I see some real genius in it. I also mentioned The Last Will and Testament of Rosalind Leigh. These films (along with Antiviral and Stoker, which don't require much "getting") are my favorite films of the year.

Meanwhile, take a film like Spring Breakers, which is supposedly some deep critique of our culture...I hated that film and look at it as being just as shallow as the films it is supposedly mocking. In fact, I believe that the movie's reason for existing was to try to make the directors wife into a sex symbol, since she was the unknown cast alongside Disney stars (and of course, there is no genius behind putting girls that guys want to have sex with in bikinis). If someone wants to educate me in a convincing manner why Spring Breakers was actually genius, then go for it...but I haven't believed the arguments I've heard thus far.

 

[GENERAL RAAM582]

I don't know if I really like saying this, but I'm halfway through Jason Goes To Hell and it's actually not too bad.

 

[GremlinZilla89]

See what you do did there???

You flat out "blamed" viewers who don't like it...saying that they just didn't understand what you were able to grasp...and then when confronted it's "oh, you should just accept that some people like it."

Sorry...you struck first by suggesting that we are somehow beneath the intelligence of the movie. Now...back up your claim or accept that you're going to have to defend the stupidity in the film.

I never blamed anybody. You're putting words in my mouth. Saying I think a film is misunderstood isn't saying people are too stupid to get it. And yes, I do think SOME people have a predisposition to rag on Rob Zombie and anything he does. I didn't excuse anyone here of doing such a thing. So no, YOU struck first with what perceived (possibly wrong, this is the internet) as an offhanded dismissal of my opinion. One you didn't even bother to quote directly...but simply had to dismiss.

 

[66 Face]

After I get off work today, can't wait to pick up my bluray boxset of Chucky (including the much anticipated Curse of Chucky)..I am so excited

As for a 31 days of horror, if I were to do it: this would be my viewing list if I was to do one a day since I am obsessed with horror, I usually watch more than 1 easily:

Halloween (John Carpenter’s)—NUFF SAID
Halloween 2 (1981 not the sequel to the remake by Rob Zombie) (the one time where I will include the first and sequel together since they take place on the same night and is just a true continuation of the same story…plus it’s a kickass sequel…my personal favorite in the genre)
The Texas Chainsaw Massacre (1974)---BBQ never tasted so good…with Leatherface making it …love this and part 2 (1986)
Phantasm (1979)---low budget creepy effort that has a great cast with Angus Scrimm as a graverobbing mortician simply called THE TALL MAN.
Salem’s Lot (1979)—Great mini series that was written by Stephen King about vampires…James Mason is awesome!!!
Prince of Darkness (1987)—John Carpenter directed this underrated film about a group of students who find the Devil in an abandoned church and bringing about the end of the world…Donald Pleasence (Dr. Loomis from Halloween series) is a priest and Alice Cooper is a street schizo who turns violent 
The Omen (1976)---never a creepier name in the English language than Damien…
The Exorcist (1973)---Peasoup, the Devil, and Possession…
Psycho (1960)—Hitchcocks’s masterpiece that gave birth to the modern horror film…a boy’s best friend is his mother
George Romero’s Day of the Dead (1985)—3rd part of his “Living Dead” Saga (First was Night of the Living Dead, then Dawn of the Dead)---his masterpiece about scientists and military personnel dealing with the global threat of the undead
Friday the 13th (1980) (personal favorite is part VII: The New Blood) but the original is the one so many cling to so I can recommend it
Nightmare on Elm Street (1984) (personal favorite is part IV: The Dream Master) but like the original Friday the 13th , so many cling to this one as well…also one of the few times Freddy is truly scary and not as comedic as he would become.
Creepshow (1982)—Stephen King wrote it, George Romero directed it, and master of special Efx Tom Savini did the special effects for this 5 part anthology…brilliant!!! In fact it will be shown at midnight at the Baxter on October 12…I will be there 
I, Madman (1989)---low budget fare about a book obsessed woman who starts living her books as the killer escapes from fiction into reality…very underrated
Hellraiser (1987)---Clive Barker’s sadomasochistic nightmare about a puzzle box that unleashes demons on earth…first appearance of Pinhead (played 8 times by Doug Bradley)…this and part 2 are the best
Child’s Play (1988)---Chucky…ooh boy…creepy doll…gotta love his warped sense of humor…the first of 6 installments…personal favorite is part 2 and Bride of Chucky
Suspiria (1977)---Italian director Dario Argento’s masterpiece in my opinion about a ballerina student who goes to an academy in Europe only to find out a coven of witches are causing mayhem there…one of the best opening death sequences…
John Carpenter’s The Fog (1980)---An amazing cast (Adrienne Barbeau, Jamie Lee Curtis, Janet Leigh, and so many others) about a town that is haunted by ghosts who have come to avenge wrongs done to them.
Freddy vs. Jason (2003)---not really scary so much as just an incredible rollercoaster ride to see these 2 icons of terror beat the tar out of each other….saw it 9 times in the theater…NEVER get tired of it.
Hills Have Eyes (1977)---Wes Craven’s creepy experience of a family who is stranded in the desert while being stalked by cannibalistic inbred mutants. Dee Wallace and Michael Berryman (Pluto) star in this nasty little film.
Demons (1985)---Italian Director Lamberto Bava’s just flat out disgusting film about a theater that opens up in the middle of the city where after watching a movie about demons, they come out of the movie into our world and tear the flesh off the living…over the top efx (the Italians are known for their very bright red blood)…followed by a great sequel
Sleepaway Camp (1982)---Often called a ripoff of Friday the 13th, this first of a 4 part series of films deals with murders at a camp…perhaps one of the most memorable endings EVER…so shocking it has to be seen…
Scream (1996)---Wes Craven’s resurrected his career and the horror genre with this very well thought out film that pokes fun at the conventions of the horror genre…great cast…great references…the first of 4 films.
Revenge of Frankenstein (1958)—one of several films that British studio Hammer Films did with Peter Cushing as Dr. Frankenstein. This happens to be my personal favorite but any of them would work (Curse of Frankenstein, Frankenstein Created Women, Frankenstein Must Be Destroyed, Evil of Frankenstein, and Frankenstein and the Monster From Hell)
Night of the Demons (1988)—A great fun movie (the first of 3 movies plus a remake) where a Halloween party occurs at Hull House and demons are unleashed by hostess Angela…great low budget efx
Saw (2004)---Personal favorite is part 3 but this “torture porn” series kicked off a new type of sub-genre of horror about Jigsaw and his deadly machinations…live or die…make your choice!
Hatchet (2006)---A great retro slasher-quality that features the exploits of Bayou legend Victor Crowley. Jason Voorhees veteran Kane Hodder (played Jason 4 times more than anyone else) plays out the trilogy as Victor. Over the top kills.
Carrie (1976)---Sissy Spacek and Piper Laurie steal the show as mother and daughter…telekinesis gone wrong…don’t go to the prom after this. Adapted from Stephen King’s first book.
House of 1000 Corpses (2003)---A return to that gritty 70s vibe…Zombie knocked this one out of the park about some teen tourists who come across the Firefly family. Very disturbing.
Jaws (1975)---I debated putting this in horror but I guess its more horror/suspense but none the less, Peter Benchley’s novel about a shark that attacks Amity Island…that theme is forever locked in our mind when we get in the ocean. Richard Dreyfus, Roy Scheider, and Robert Shaw steal the show
Evil Dead (1981)---Favorite is part 2 but gotta respect most people’s choice to pick the first as the ultimate cabin in the woods movie…5 teens unwittingly unleash demons from reading the Necronomicon aka the Book of the Dead.

Its great to see I, Madman get a mention. Totally under rated film and pretty damn good too.

I usually watch "Curse of" and Revenge of Frankenstein in one sitting. I love how it can just be one long movie like Halloween and part 2. The new Hammer blu rays are great. At least an hour of bonus footage and Curse has a bio on Peter Cushing.

The Hammer Dracula movies can get a little spotty and as bad ass as Lee was he didn't get many speaking parts but those Frankensteins are downright awesome... there's something great in every one.

 

[DaRkVeNgeanCe]

I don't know if I really like saying this, but I'm halfway through Jason Goes To Hell and it's actually not too bad.

Theres a lot of good to Jason Goes To Hell, though I've never been one of those that despised it I always appreciated it for them going a new route and trying something different with the franchise even if a lot of it didn't work as well.

 

[Heretic]

I never blamed anybody. You're putting words in my mouth. Saying I think a film is misunderstood isn't saying people are too stupid to get it. And yes, I do think SOME people have a predisposition to rag on Rob Zombie and anything he does. I didn't excuse anyone here of doing such a thing. So no, YOU struck first with what perceived (possibly wrong, this is the internet) as an offhanded dismissal of my opinion. One you didn't even bother to quote directly...but simply had to dismiss.

You said that it was a misunderstood movie. That is flat out saying that the critics of the film failed to understand it.

If you want to claim that I am unable or unwilling to understand this film...give me reasons WHY that is the case. I gave you a few examples as to why the movie is just mind-numbingly stupid (before degrading into a music video finale and a during-credits voice-over to explain things). I can support my stance, you've opted not to explain why I am unable to properly understand the film.

 

[superkong 500]

I can't believe they still haven't announced the special features for the In the Mouth of Madness blu-ray which leads me to think there will be none, hopefully I'm wrong though.

 

[Ant-manic]

I can't believe they still haven't announced the special features for the In the Mouth of Madness blu-ray which leads me to think there will be none, hopefully I'm wrong though.

i just showed this movie to my younger brother and mother, last Saturday. they seemed to like it. but their both fans of Sam Neil.

 

[Blitzkrieg Bop]

I think Jason Goes to Hell is the worst 13th.

 

[StarLord]

I think Jason Goes to Hell is the worst 13th.

Agreed. He looks like **** too.

 

[Blitzkrieg Bop]

Speaking of which, I finally got my sweet Jason shirt from Creepytees. I'll probably wear it to Scarowinds.

 

[GENERAL RAAM582]

I think I'd give it a 6.0 (talking about JGTH btw). It's not as bad as I thought it was the last time I saw it. It's just different that's all. It's not the worse F13, I think Part V or Part X takes that, but it's probably the third worse film.

 

[redhawk23]

How is Lords of Salem misunderstood?

Is it because Zombie...a guy who made his money and name in music for decades...completely got the radio system wrong in his film about radio djs??? One would assume he'd actually make that a bit realistic.
Maybe the fact that the author's obsession is COMPLETELY unwarranted, given the facts he is presented with...so we are likely talking about a guy who spends his life stalking people for no reason.
Maybe it's the fact that the lead character says "Bye" to her friends who are worried about her and on their way with her somewhere, as she ducks into a building...and then her friends are never seen again...apparently shrugging their shoulders and walking off?
Maybe it's the fact that scenes that take place in the film are never mentioned again...except in explanatory footage as the credits roll...as if they realized that they forgot to handle those plot points?

No...this is not a misunderstood movie...it's jumbled up crap designed to look like art.

Yeah there was originally a lot more with her friends, Ken Foree's character in particular, at the end. It either ended up on the cutting room floor or was never completed in the filming.

 

[Donnie Darko]

I think Jason Goes to Hell is the worst 13th.

I agree. I did really like it as a kid, but tried watching it about three years ago and it was rough. Maybe if I actually sit down and watch it from the beginning, really committing to it, I will enjoy it more.

 

[66 Face]

I hated Manhattan , Hell and X. IMO they're only OK in parts and its when F13th started getting overly goofy. I remember throwing my popcorn when Jason spoke in Manhattan.

 

[redhawk23]

Spoiler

Let's put it this way...I'm not the sharpest bulb in the crayon box. I LOVE watching movies that make me think...but I do tend to seek out other interpretations online to see what I might be missing. Those insights can inform me, and give me a deeper understanding than I would otherwise have.

My favorite films of the year are mostly like that. Resolution is a film that I watched several days ago...then watched it again the next night with my girlfriend. She didn't "get" it...so I explained my take to her...and she now loves the film and can't wait to watch it again. Upstream Color is another. Magic Magic is a movie that I ADORE...and yet the reviews from the public are really harsh...but I thought a lot about the film and think I "get" what they were doing and I see some real genius in it. I also mentioned The Last Will and Testament of Rosalind Leigh. These films (along with Antiviral and Stoker, which don't require much "getting") are my favorite films of the year.

Meanwhile, take a film like Spring Breakers, which is supposedly some deep critique of our culture...I hated that film and look at it as being just as shallow as the films it is supposedly mocking. In fact, I believe that the movie's reason for existing was to try to make the directors wife into a sex symbol, since she was the unknown cast alongside Disney stars (and of course, there is no genius behind putting girls that guys want to have sex with in bikinis). If someone wants to educate me in a convincing manner why Spring Breakers was actually genius, then go for it...but I haven't believed the arguments I've heard thus far.

Resolution was indeed fantastic, Magic Magic was outright laughable though.

 

[Kane52630]

31 Days of Horror Marathon

Day 1: The Frighteners - 7.5/10
Day 2: Maniac Cop - 7/10
Day 3: All the Boys Love Mandy Lane - 5.5/10
Day 4: Frankenstein and the Monster from Hell - 7/10
Day 5: Prince of Darkness - 8/10
Day 6: From Beyond - 7.5/10
Day 7: Phantasm - 6.5/10
Day 8: Phantasm II - 7.5/10​