The Dark Knight The Non-Spoiler Critic Review Thread

[Keyser Soze]

I've already bought my IMAX tickets. 23rd July, at the Glasgow Science Centre.

 

[FCEEVIPER]

Ok so, we have lots of great reviews here, which is awesome news.

Dare I even ask, are there any bad or so-so reviews of TDK out yet?

 

[Anita18]

Ok so, we have lots of great reviews here, which is awesome news.

Dare I even ask, are there any bad or so-so reviews of TDK out yet?

Nick and Devin at CHUD liked it (didn't love it), but you wouldn't know judging by the tone Devin used in critiquing it in the CHUD forums.

And since Firefox 3 said CHUD may have malicious software on it, I haven't been back to check if formal reviews have gone up there.

 

[FCEEVIPER]

Didn't Chud hate BB with a passion?

I could care less in their opinion.

 

[Keyser Soze]

Didn't Chud hate BB with a passion?

I could care less in their opinion.

Agreed. Devin Faradi over at CHUD has taken pains to talk about how little he cares about "The Dark Knight" and its marketing over the past year. He ripped "Batman Begins" to shreds, and seems to have an agenda against Batman as a character in general - and his fans too.

Reading any of his commentary on "The Dark Knight" in recent months, you got the strong sense of a man eagerly anticipating the chance to deflate the hype for "The Dark Knight", someone who really WANTED to hate it. So if even he can go into the film with such an agenda, and come out being forced to concede that the film is at least "good", that must surely be a testament to the film's quality.

 

[Andrex]

IGN's review is up.

Key points of interest:

It isn't an overstatement to call The Dark Knight the most sophisticated and ambitious work of its kind. Superior to all three Spider-Man installments and even its amazing predecessor in terms of conceptualization, writing, acting, and direction, Nolan's follow-up to Batman Begins is a dark, complex and disturbing film, not the least of which because it grafts its heroics onto the blueprint of actual reality rather than that of spandex-clad supermen. And while such a distinction may make little difference to those already eagerly anticipating the return of the caped crusader, suffice it to say that The Dark Knight qualifies as the first official comic book adaptation that truly succeeds in being a great artistic achievement in its own right.

Meanwhile, the violence is quite possibly the most intense I have ever seen in a PG-13 film, leaving myself and others wondering how The Dark Knight avoided an R.

...you realize that Ledger was a master of his craft, only in his final years finding roles that truly offered him the chance to explore that mastery. His is the definitive movie Joker, and he owns the role and achieves a level of abject insanity that is terrifying as it is irresistible.

There are plenty of appropriate comparisons to other sequels its quality mirrors, if not possibly surpasses: Toy Story 2, The Empire Strikes Back, The Godfather Part II, etc.

But there really is no better way to describe The Dark Knight than to call it a great work of art because it transcends both the boundaries of comic book moviemaking and even the parameters of good filmmaking.

Don't know what's considered spoilers but it's light on whatever you'd call them nevertheless.

That review is awesome. The only reviewer I really trust more than IGN is Ebert.

Edit- Oh I see it's already been posted. :P Nevertheless I find these quote extremely... encouraging, to say the least. That it's being compared to Godfather pt2 over and over is exhilirating.

 

[Voyeur]

And though they really seemed to like it, the MTV review eludes to a couple of flaws, I think. Instead of a typical review, they separate the review into different factors...

...I dunno...it's kind of a weird review.

 

[StorminNorman]

Agreed. Devin Faradi over at CHUD has taken pains to talk about how little he cares about "The Dark Knight" and its marketing over the past year. He ripped "Batman Begins" to shreds, and seems to have an agenda against Batman as a character in general - and his fans too.

Reading any of his commentary on "The Dark Knight" in recent months, you got the strong sense of a man eagerly anticipating the chance to deflate the hype for "The Dark Knight", someone who really WANTED to hate it. So if even he can go into the film with such an agenda, and come out being forced to concede that the film is at least "good", that must surely be a testament to the film's quality.

Here is Devin's first official non-review review (no spoilers at all)

Spoiler

Last night was the first junket screening for The Dark Knight, taking place on an IMAX screen in Los Angeles. The screening was at 7, but the theater was packed at 6, unheard of at press screenings. The house was so full by 6:45 that the movie started fifteen minutes EARLY, something I never thought I'd see (press screenings invariable start ten minutes late). Now the people who were at the screening, while still under an official embargo, have begun talking about what they thought of the film, and the only word that comes to mind is 'hyperbole.'

You're probably wondering what I thought of the film. While my official review won't run until the week of the movie's release, I'll tell you that I liked it. It's better than Batman Begins in every way. It's an epic crime film filled with interesting characters (none of them played by Christian Bale, sadly). It's filled with action and excitement. It's also fat - at least thirty minutes could have easily been excised in the script stage, and twenty could be trimmed now in the editing room without blinking an eye - and has a number of odd story problems. Christopher Nolan still can't direct an action scene.

These aren't major complaints, but when I see someone, like my friend Steve at Collider, call the film 'flawless' and 'a masterpiece,' I know we're in for a tough couple of weeks. The movement to give Heath Ledger his posthumous Oscar, which was starting up from about the second he died in January, will pick up so much steam that I think he's almost guaranteed a nomination based on the hype and nothing else. Between now and the film's release I think the hype over this film could build to a deafening crescendo, one that will result in an inevitable backlash when the movie finally screens for the non-junket press in about two weeks. And that backlash could easily hit the fanbase as well - when The Dark Knight fails to actually change their lives, will the hardcore fans feel a touch disappointed?

For the record, Heath Ledger gives a tremendous performance as the Joker. He makes the character his own, and I think he delivers a Joker so definitive it's going to change the way he's written in the comics and will become the touchstone version of the character. I also think that if he was alive fanboys would be the only people talking about giving him an Oscar. Dying is often the best thing that you can do for your career (just ask Elvis), and Ledger picked a good role to die on, one where he really gets to have some fun and make some interesting choices. The Joker is nowhere near the character that Ennis Del Mar is, but Ledger brings a similar sort of fascinating internal quality to the role. If Ledger gets a nomination it surely wouldn't be the most egregious postmortem nod ever, but it will still be one based more on what happened outside the film than what he did inside of it.

What's important to keep in mind over the coming days as you see more and more reactions to the current round of screenings is that there is no group less reliable than the LA junket press. These people live for the ability to name drop and for their free swag, and they get more excited about seeing the film first than about seeing a good film (imagine a whole community of Harry Knowles types and you'd probably have it). It's a good movie, and many of these people want to be out the gate first saying how much they liked it.

On the other hand, a friend of mine who writes for the web and who I think is not only a terrific critic but also has tremendous taste in films has compared it to Empire Strikes Back and The Godfather Part II. I can't even begin to agree, but I respect his position on the film, and I don't think he's coming from the same fatuous place that most of the junket press does.

I'm thinking about writing my review right now and banking it, to be honest. I like to wait a while to write a review, to let a film simmer in my head for a couple of days or a week or two, but the level of hyperbole that I'm seeing begin right now is only going to get worse and worse over the next few days and may peak for me personally at the junket on Sunday. I fear that being annoyed at over-the-top praise of a good film might hurt my opinion of the film in general (I'm only human, and if I spend all day Sunday explaining to people why this film is far from flawless, I know my mind will begin fixating on these problems in the story). I'm sort of keenly aware of my reputation as the anti-Batman guy (and I honestly don't like the character all that much), and I walked into this movie with an open mind, intending to give it a fair shake. I want to make sure my review reflects that fair shake and not the growing Browncoat aspects of the people who came into that IMAX theater in wheelchairs last night and left on their own two feet.

What I am annoyed is not that he doesn't think the film is a masterpiece - the guy isn't relevant enough for me to care that much about his opinion. What bothers me is that he seems to believe that his opinion is with out question right and those that do compare it to Godfather II, Empire Strikes Back, Heat, etc. are simply delusional fanboys. The absolute display of arrogance is incredible.

I mean who is he, a writer for a fanboy movie site, to say his opinions are more credible than, say, Peter Travers?

You rarely please everyone and I never expected TDK to do so (nor did I expect it to have the critical response it has had to date), even No Country for Old Men had Sukhdev Sandhu of the Daily Telegraph who stated " Is it a masterpiece? Not even close."

I have no doubt that Sandhu believes his (her?) opinion is every bit as correct as Devin does his.

 

[Voyeur]

Just curious...I've never read any of Devin's stuff. Is he a fan of other comic-based films? Like Spiderman or Hulk or Fantastic Four?

 

[abcdefz]

It's nice of Devin to come down from the mountain now and again to set everyone straight.


But you never know... he could be spot-on.

 

[Keyser Soze]

Just curious...I've never read any of Devin's stuff. Is he a fan of other comic-based films? Like Spiderman or Hulk or Fantastic Four?

To sum it up, Devin Faradi is a self-loathing geek. Because of this, he continually singles out fans of superheroes as being far bigger losers than him, jabbing at them with his comments about them being "homo-repressed teen fantasists." He famously stated that the whole superhero genre should have been killed off with "Watchmen" and "Dark Knight Returns", because when those stories presented the genre as adult and psychologically complex, it was essentially the genre's death-knell, as superhero comics should NEVER be taken seriously as credible adult storytelling. This agenda has extended out to his view on superhero MOVIES, and in particular he has singled out Batman - the most serious and "adult" of mainstream superheroes - as an object of his hate.

Back at the time of the release of "Batman Begins", he controversially claimed that "Fantastic Four" was much better. Why? Because it didn't "get any ideas above its station". Namely, he thinks superhero movies should not aspire to be anything other than mindless, colorful kiddie fluff. Any film that does so is being "pretentious" and appealing to us loser comic fanboys.

 

[the_monk]

In some ways I wish I could go into this movie as I did Batman Begins, which was an almost virginal state. I knew very little about it when I entered the theater, other than hoping it was a return to form for the Batman series.

Too late for that now, though.

 

[Keyser Soze]

Also, in response to Devin's comments, I should also add this correction. He talks about the praise for Heath Ledger's Joker being solely a result of a pity party in wake of his death. He neglects to acknowledge that there was Oscar buzz for Ledger's Joker several months BEFORE his death.

 

[deathfromabove]

Also, in response to Devin's comments, I should also add this correction. He talks about the praise for Heath Ledger's Joker being solely a result of a pity party in wake of his death. He neglects to acknowledge that there was Oscar buzz for Ledger's Joker several months BEFORE his death.

does anyone know where this devin fellow resides? sounds lke someone needs to put a smile on his face...

and yeah the buzz for ledger started before his death. i hate self loathing nerds.

 

[the_monk]

I think Devin has some good points in this article, actually. He's right about the junket people, at least.

 

[Keyser Soze]

I've added Newsarama's review to the front page. More glowing praise.

 

[StorminNorman]

I think Devin has some good points in this article, actually. He's right about the junket people, at least.

His point would be very good (and valid) if the opinions of the "fanboyish" LA junket were not shared by people like Peter Travers and other credible professionals.

 

[the_monk]

I hear you. But I am trying to calm myself down about this movie a little bit. Plus, I'm notorious for being harsher on my movie opinions than most. I should at least lower my expectations a bit.

 

[Keyser Soze]

But the hype's half the fun, monk.

 

[elgaz]

Agreed. Devin Faradi over at CHUD has taken pains to talk about how little he cares about "The Dark Knight" and its marketing over the past year. He ripped "Batman Begins" to shreds, and seems to have an agenda against Batman as a character in general - and his fans too.

Reading any of his commentary on "The Dark Knight" in recent months, you got the strong sense of a man eagerly anticipating the chance to deflate the hype for "The Dark Knight", someone who really WANTED to hate it. So if even he can go into the film with such an agenda, and come out being forced to concede that the film is at least "good", that must surely be a testament to the film's quality.

Devin Faraci certainly has a way with words, but I think sometimes he likes to go against the grain purely for shock value. I read CHUD almost every day and I always read his reviews/articles, but I don't always accept everything he writes - did he really hate BB or was it just satisfying for him to be negative when everyone else was being mostly positive?

Gaz

 

[venom892]

I can't lie this reviews are really making me wish these weeks would fly by already so I could see the movie.Also to think Ledger's performance is being praised simply due to his death is pitiful.Since the trailer hit in December his performance has been hyped.

 

[Keyser Soze]

Devin Faraci certainly has a way with words, but I think sometimes he likes to go against the grain purely for shock value. I read CHUD almost every day and I always read his reviews/articles, but I don't always accept everything he writes - did he really hate BB or was it just satisfying for him to be negative when everyone else was being mostly positive?

Gaz

I do think that, for a lot of the film's detractors, the popularity of "Batman Begins" has done a lot to fuel their dislike.

 

[the_monk]

As good as Begins was, it is a flawed movie. It's hard to deny that.

 

[abcdefz]

As good as Begins was, it is a flawed movie. It's hard to deny that.

Yep. It's about a 7/10 in my mind. But one thing about it that was undeniable was that it set things up so well. When I heard that Goyer wasn't writing this one and the Nolans were, I figured he probably had firm control now, and we'd be in much better shape.

 

[Jokers_Wild]

Yep. It's about a 7/10 in my mind. But one thing about it that was undeniable was that it set things up so well. When I heard that Goyer wasn't writing this one and the Nolans were, I figured he probably had firm control now, and we'd be in much better shape.

I've grown to like Begins a lot more over the past three years. It did have a few problems as far as dialogue and story, but I definitely feel that it and Batman 89 are the two best live action Batman movies, giving the edge to Begins. TDK looks to have surpassed all of the previous Batman movies by a mile...and I couldn't be happier about it!