I think Begins had a certain vibe to it. It was when TDK rolled around that they were evidently like “Okay, we’re giving you the Joker of a lifetime and one of the best sequels ever made, but we’re gonna have to drop the ball somewhere…”
Yep, I'm the one who was blown away by TDK on the day of its release but was also immediately missing the more stylized look of the previous film before I even got to the cinema parking lot...
I'm a very receptive viewer to the “mood” in films, but in the end, this was a rather secondary consideration as the focus was elsewhere with this one.
I don't think there's any Batman movie that has an ill-fitting Gotham. There are ones I like more or less, but I wouldn't want any of them to switch around. Across both Gotham and Hong Kong, The Dark Knight feels dauntingly vertical. Like the world is a structurally-unsound tower with Joker hammering away at the foundations. That particular sense of scale isn't something I feel any of the rest of the films have, even its closest cousin in Rises has a different feel, and I appreciate it. The Batman's is wonderful too, just different. I like the grime, I like the sense of urban density, I like the claustrophobia. Wouldn't want it to look like The Dark Knight, wouldn't want The Dark Knight to look like it.
That pretty much sums it up.
Despite our fan debates and comparisons, it's always important to put this in the context of artistic intent.
TDK’s Gotham was faaaaar superior to Begins, but that doesn’t mean I don’t like stylization. I just didn’t find BB’s use of soundstages to be particularly “stylized.” It was more just basic “soundstage replicating city” vibes to me. The Batman’s Gotham already feels more stylized to me, and it is now my favorite Gotham. The perfect blend of soundstages and on-location shooting for me.
I agree.
It's funny, I'm always intrigued by what people get out of
The Batman (and the Penguin). Despite all the talk and even Reeves' comments about his universe, I get the impression that the license is back to something visually quite stylized, but I'd go even further and say that this also applies to the writing, where we find very
pulpy elements
(secret clubs with classic gangsters sharing drugs with crooked cops and politicians, a deliciously whiny and hammy Riddler, etc...). This is by no means a reproach, as far as I'm concerned, this is the way to go, I love that approach.
While creators are obviously welcome to make pertinent comments through their adaptations, I never intended to view Batman's world as a strict variation of our own. I like to imagine Gotham, as a whole, as the fictional place it is, with its hellish asylum, weird gangs here,
freaks lurking there and so on.
Does that make sense?
I don't want to reopen the "
grounded" debate, but I definitely think this qualifier refers to the stakes and thematics of the story much more than to the depiction and rules of this universe.
------
More generally, on the discussion about shooting on location or sets, as
@SwordOfMorning said, it all depends on the director's intention first and foremost.
But to add a remark, and this is probably a digression, I think we shouldn't confuse “
real” with “
palpable”.
I sometimes get the impression that modern audiences are a little hermetic towards artistic approaches that don't aim for photorealism in their rendering.
What I mean is, I don't subscribe to the idea that if a world is obviously “fake”, it prevents immersion. When I see
The Empire Strikes Back or
Batman Returns with their models and matte paintings, I can see that things aren't real, but the patina that emanates from them totally contributes to immersion in these worlds.
Anyway, as I said, I digress.
