The President Obama Thread: "Move That Bus!" Edition

[SentinelMind]

Bachmann would motivate lot of social liberals who are growing cold to Obama to get out the vote. I don't think she can survive the media scrutiny as much as Romney would. I can see independents staying home if Bachmann is presented like Palin, which is what the media will do. I can see the media painting her like female Pat Buchanan.

 

[DBryan]

Why don't the conservatives here vote Ron Paul?

He's obviously the most honest and the most interesting candidate out of them all.

 

[hippie_hunter]

It's partisan for a liberal to say Obama's done a horrible job and doesn't deserve votes?

Would that not be, the opposite of partisan?

The point that Sentinel is making is that when someone as hyper-partisan as Superman is, makes such comments, Obama has a problem. Superman represents the core of Obama's base and a candidate that fails to inspire his core base (the way McCain did), has problems.

Superman is not being the opposite of partisan. He's expressing his anger of Obama failing to live up to his expectations.

 

[hippie_hunter]

Why don't the conservatives here vote Ron Paul?

He's obviously the most honest and the most interesting candidate out of them all.

I plan to vote for Ron Paul in the primaries. I'm willing to bet money that StorminNorman will vote for him as well.

 

[SentinelMind]

He is the most honest and interesting and he has some good solutions on several issues...but he also says ridiculous-sounding crap like "slavery would have ended anyway" and "who cares if Iran has a nuclear weapon" and "let's legalize everything" that is completely out of the minds of mainstream America that he has little to no chance.

 

[hippie_hunter]

Calling Obama the "greatest threat to the country", when the USA is involved in several wars, is pretty darn fringe.

How much more fringe does it have to get?

I can easily find things more fringe than that. Take the Westboro Baptist Church for example.

 

[StorminNorman]

Calling Obama the "greatest threat to the country", when the USA is involved in several wars, is pretty darn fringe.

How much more fringe does it have to get?

No, I think that calling your ideological opponent "the greatest threat to the country" is pretty normal really - especially in context of the extreme times.

Now Perry and Obama aren't really all that different politically - and for that reason this is all irrelevant crap anyway - but I think Perry probably genuinely believes he and Obama are two polar opposites politically, and with his being President, that makes him a grave threat to the country.

Why don't the conservatives here vote Ron Paul?

He's obviously the most honest and the most interesting candidate out of them all.

Anyone who claims to be frustrated with the status quo should vote for Ron Paul.

 

[hippie_hunter]

Out of Romney, Bachmann and Perry, I genuinely think Romney would be the easiest candidate for Obama to defeat. Bachmann and Perry would be about much more than the candidates themselves - it will be sold as an ideological battle for the soul of America. I don't think you would have that with Romney. It would be more traditional fare.

Most here underestimate Bachmann. She's crazy, but she's not the joke people want her to be.

I have to completely disagree here. Bachmann may not be the joke that people want her to be (but she is still a vile, disgusting, hateful woman), but she is still Sarah Palin +. She will turn off independents the way Christine O'Donnell and Ken Buck did in Delaware and Colorado. Conservative Democrats will never give her the time of day.

Romney is the hardest candidate to beat because he can beat Obama in the Electoral College. Polls have him beating Obama in moderate states like Pennsylvania, New Hampshire, and Michigan where more conservative candidates just don't stand a chance. Add in a more conservative, yet compatible, running mate for Romney and what we have here is essentially a guarantee that Romney will beat Obama in the general election.

 

[StorminNorman]

He is the most honest and interesting and he has some good solutions on several issues...but he also says ridiculous-sounding crap like "slavery would have ended anyway" and "who cares if Iran has a nuclear weapon" and "let's legalize everything" that is completely out of the minds of mainstream America that he has little to no chance.

But he's right about all of those things too

 

[StorminNorman]

I have to completely disagree here. Bachmann may not be the joke that people want her to be (but she is still a vile, disgusting, hateful woman), but she is still Sarah Palin +. She will turn off independents the way Christine O'Donnell and Ken Buck did in Delaware and Colorado. Conservative Democrats will never give her the time of day.

Romney is the hardest candidate to beat because he can beat Obama in the Electoral College. Polls have him beating Obama in moderate states like Pennsylvania, New Hampshire, and Michigan where more conservative candidates just don't stand a chance. Add in a more conservative, yet compatible, running mate for Romney and what we have here is essentially a guarantee that Romney will beat Obama in the general election.

The key to this election will be passion. Romney destroys passion. He would wither away GOP support and force his entire organization rallied behind the idea of defeating Obama rather than promoting himself. I think Romney is unelectable in the general.

Bachmann may turn off more people than Romney does, but she also excites more people than Romney does.

 

[SentinelMind]

In early August, Obama was above Bachmann in Florida by 12. Of course anything can change between now and then, but that's still pretty significant.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2012/president/fl/florida_bachmann_vs_obama-2177.html

Here in same period, Romney and Obama are tied.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2012/president/fl/florida_romney_vs_obama-1883.html

The fact that Bachmann just promised $2 gas shows she can't be trusted and she will be maligned in general election.

 

[SentinelMind]

I can see a 2010 Reid situation happening with Bachmann against Obama. Everybody and their mother thought Reid was gone, but he won by like 5 points. The Obama machine will be motivated by a firebreathing Bachmann who has no real credibility in economics.

 

[hippie_hunter]

The key to this election will be passion. Romney destroys passion. He would wither away GOP support and force his entire organization rallied behind the idea of defeating Obama rather than promoting himself. I think Romney is unelectable in the general.

Bachmann may turn off more people than Romney does, but she also excites more people than Romney does.

Except this election is no longer about choosing between the most competent candidate or the most passionate candidate or the most liberal or conservative candidate. This election has turned completely into a referendum on how people approve of Obama's job.

In normal circumstances, I'd completely agree with you that Romney is unelectable in the general due to his lack of any genuine passion and inability to ignite the conservative base. But the conservative base hates Obama so much, that they will go out and vote just to get rid of him. The same way the liberal base went out and voted for John Kerry.

What doomed John Kerry though was that Bush was at least perceived as competent enough to win the independent vote. That is why Kerry lost, despite the massive amount of progressive support just to get rid of Bush, just having the progressive base is not enough, you need the independent voters as well. The same applies to the conservative base, rallying them up is important, but capturing the independent voter is a necessity. The independent voting bloc is by far and large the most important voting block.

This is where Mitt Romney benefits because independent voters have abandoned Obama en masse. They'll vote for the challenger because in the eyes of the independent voter (that will never vote for Michelle Bachmann), the incumbent has utterly failed. This is why Mitt Romney comes extremely close to or even beats Obama in polls conducted in Michigan, New Hampshire, Pennsylvania, Florida, Nevada, New Mexico, North Carolina, Virginia, Ohio, and Iowa.

 

[hippie_hunter]

I can see a 2010 Reid situation happening with Bachmann against Obama. Everybody and their mother thought Reid was gone, but he won by like 5 points. The Obama machine will be motivated by a firebreathing Bachmann who has no real credibility in economics.

Reid would have been gone if it were any other candidate than Sharon Angle. Sue Lowden would have been guaranteed to beat Harry Reid.

 

[Nokio]

I have to completely disagree here. Bachmann may not be the joke that people want her to be (but she is still a vile, disgusting, hateful woman), but she is still Sarah Palin +. She will turn off independents the way Christine O'Donnell and Ken Buck did in Delaware and Colorado. Conservative Democrats will never give her the time of day.

Romney is the hardest candidate to beat because he can beat Obama in the Electoral College. Polls have him beating Obama in moderate states like Pennsylvania, New Hampshire, and Michigan where more conservative candidates just don't stand a chance. Add in a more conservative, yet compatible, running mate for Romney and what we have here is essentially a guarantee that Romney will beat Obama in the general election.

Can you give me next week's Powerball numbers while you're at it.

 

[Nokio]

I can see a 2010 Reid situation happening with Bachmann against Obama. Everybody and their mother thought Reid was gone, but he won by like 5 points. The Obama machine will be motivated by a firebreathing Bachmann who has no real credibility in economics.

If anything I've learned about politics is that the Average American voter is stupid and uniformed. I wouldn't rule out Bachmann losing to Obama. A year is a long time and things change.

 

[Nokio]

All of Obama's problems are of his own making. If he got his @ss in office a focused on jobs and working class America he'd still have a lot of support their. Even if he couldn't accomplish lower unemployment and a better economy people would've saw that he is fighting for them and with his explaining that the situation the US is in right now was years in the making I think people would've tolerated it. But no he did what every other president and the congress does. He allowed the Washington elite and Corporate fat cats who don't give a d@mn about the working class to drag him into making Bankers and Wall Street the number 1 priority and also giving the Tea Party a platform to oppose him and rally on.

Health care reform: Good lord was that a royal F up. You'd think with what the Clintons went through back in the 90's that Obama and the Dems would've been ready for the attacks to come. But no and once again he followed the power brokers in DC and went into making back door deals with the Corporate elite and then he stayed out of it and let the Dems in Congress write the reform bill and then he got back in it and spent way to long on it where the American people got tired and got misinformed with all the BS that came from the other side. The worst mistake of his presidency.

The stimulus package: Another f up where he allowed the republicans to craft the message for starters. Even worse he let the Dems in Congress write the stimulus instead of the White House. He couldv'e put together a team to do draw up a target stimulus but nope.

Always vague on his positions. I still don't know where this man stands on issues. Thinking that he is going to pull the republicans over to his side or a compromise with them on issues. It's not going to happen. Instead of him boxing them in he let them box him in. I can go on but this man has been a disappointment to me on the way he's governed. He needs a over haul of his team cause as it stands now he got the worst advisers who gets it wrong time and time again.

 

[Nokio]

Obama will make the mistake of following them piss poor advisers and go into attack mode, trying to discredit and attack Romney if he is the front runner or Perry. Bad mistake in my eyes. I hope he crafts a message for why he should be re elected and what big things he want to accomplish and not make the race about it's either us or them and who you like the best, which didn't work in the 2010 mid terms. Big big mistake if he does that. All the American voter will do is " I'll take a chance on this new guy cause i'm not hearing anything from you for a vision towards the future".

 

[DACrowe]

THIS is what leads you to believe Perry may be "too fringe"?

It's an example of him being a gaffe machine. In less than a week in the race he has that and the Bernake thing. They're insignificant now as all he's doing is pissing off the GOP establishment (which to be fair does hold the purse strings) but riling up the base.

However, if is in the general election and made a handful of these kind of gaffes...the kind that could play into a bunch of negative stereotypes about Southerners, Texans, Republicans, etc., then he is going to be laughed out by the independents assuming of course the global economy hasn't completely collapsed (and looking at Europe, that is very possible). He just doesn't have self-control and doubles down on the crazy when he is called out on it. That was my point.

 

[DACrowe]

PALIN SAYS OBAMA IS 'TONE DEAF' FOR GOING ON VACATION AND IS 'BURYING HEAD IN SAND'
http://www.newsmax.com/InsideCover/Palin-Obama-vacation-fiscal/2011/08/19/id/407915

The irony does not need to be said.

 

[Donut]

Obama going on vacation right now is making him look bad. Enjoy your last year in the White House Obama

 

[chaseter]

Out of Romney, Bachmann and Perry, I genuinely think Romney would be the easiest candidate for Obama to defeat.

It's like you live in Bizarro World.

 

[chaseter]

Why don't the conservatives here vote Ron Paul?

He's obviously the most honest and the most interesting candidate out of them all.

A lot will. But, politics is sadly more than about voting for the person you think has the best policies. Politics is also about who has the best chance of winning. It's why the bulk of the GOP are more about Romney than Paul. The media has also been ignoring Paul so that doesn't help. Rick Perry and Michelle Bachmann are far more interesting because they exhibit loony behavior so air time goes to them.

It's also the same reason why a lot of liberals will vote for Obama again even though he has continued the wars and started a new one, not increased taxes on the rich, not supporting gay marriage, not closing Guantanamo, etc. He hasn't really been the ideal liberal for that party. It's because they are voting for the person who has the biggest chance of winning. There are a lot more suitable DNC candidates out there.

 

[metr0man]

Obama's going to lose, the economic numbers are just too bad and he hasn't shown the governing-political skill to turn things around in perception.

To me, it's very important that we don't get a hardcore social conservative in office, particularly on the issue of gay rights (which have turned the corner the past 4 years, we're definately trending towards more acceptance/apathy towards gay rights than hostility, both polls and anecdotal evidence are pretty overwhelming).

The republican meme has been that the social issues aren't important right now in a bad economy.

Of course they're not important when you're on the wrong side of said social issues!!!

It's why I'm desperately hoping Romney wins the Republican nomination. Heck he could steal every economic policy idea Perry/Bachmann/Palin have, and I wouldn't really care, as long as he is able to stay socially moderate.

Economic policies will just ping-pong back and forth every time the white house changes parties anyways. Social trends will not.

 

[Marx]

Obama's going to lose, the economic numbers are just too bad and he hasn't shown the governing-political skill to turn things around in perception.

To me, it's very important that we don't get a hardcore social conservative in office, particularly on the issue of gay rights (which have turned the corner the past 4 years, we're definately trending towards more acceptance/apathy towards gay rights than hostility, both polls and anecdotal evidence are pretty overwhelming).

The republican meme has been that the social issues aren't important right now in a bad economy.

Of course they're not important when you're on the wrong side of said social issues!!!

Having a social conservative in the White House again scares me. I cannot stomach the thought of all of the progress we've made (specifically on the issue of gay rights and equality) to be stopped dead in its tracks or possibly reversed.

It's why I'm desperately hoping Romney wins the Republican nomination. Heck he could steal every economic policy idea Perry/Bachmann/Palin have, and I wouldn't really care, as long as he is able to stay socially moderate.

Economic policies will just ping-pong back and forth every time the white house changes parties anyways. Social trends will not.

Mitt Romney is no longer in the camp for gay rights. He's not really even a moderate on the issue anymore. You can call it pandering or whatever you want to, but he signed NOM's "marriage pledge" a few weeks ago. The pledge promises support of a constitutional amendment to ban gay marriage. He has also said that he will defend the Defense of Marriage Act, that states marriage is between a man and a woman. He has also said that he would nominate federal judges and Supreme Court appointments who would "reject any insertion of gay marriage rights into the constitution". (Not to mention a PRESIDENTIAL commission that would investigate claims of harassment against those who hold anti-gay views.)

Mitt Romney is the epitome of a slimy opportunist that will say whatever he can to get elected. He has changed his stance on almost every single issue there is when it seems to benefit him in some way. And we all thought John McCain was bad...

Edit: I would also add that Romney has a history of opposing gay marriage, domestic partner benefits, and has also made comments like every child is supposed to have a mother AND father. He also said that "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" is an effective policy.