Sequels Thread for VILLANS in Spider-Man 4 and 5 (Don't make any more!)

[The Joker]

Are you saying the Spidey movies never had any intense or scary scenes.

Of course not. Ock's hospital scene was intense. But on the intensity level of a creature of the night with a white face, red eyes, fangs etc pounching on humans and sucking their blood in the dead of night? No.

Cause my I caught my 9 year old cousin jumping at plenty of scenes from Spidey movies.

So did I. I jumped when Norman had the brief flashback to him turning into the Goblin. I jumped when one of Ock's tentacles shot over the balcony and knocked Harry back onto the ground. I jumped when Harry appeared and grabbed MJ in her apartment and pinned her against the wall.

But they were brief moments, and nothing compared to vampires. Those creatures are the stuff of horror. Doc Ock and the Goblins were not scary. They were menacing and cool, but not scary.

Raimi mentioned liking the fact that you can mix the worlds. The worlds can be mixed. You refuse to even look at the possibility.

I don't refuse to look at the possibility. It's not like I don't know the Morbius character and what he's like in Spidey's world. I have seen the possibility. I've seen it in the comics. I saw it in the 90's cartoon. It never felt right to me. Heck, they even had to bring in Blade in the 90's cartoon episodes with Morbius just to make it work.

I have nothing against vampires. I love vampires actually. I just don't think they belong in Spidey's world.

The same can be said about vampire movies. Dracula is castly different than Near Dark which has nothing in common with Blade.

Probably one of the reasons why the movie is so unpopular. A weak villain. He didn't work as a character. He didn't feel like Dracula. He was a poor successor to Frost and Nomac.

My point being that there are a number of elements from any given movie that appears in more than one film. Again you are just refusing to even humor the idea in the least.

Not at all. Of course there's similarities. You'd have to be blind not to see that. But they are purely on a conceptual level. For example, all the heros save people. How they do it is what sets them apart. Some heros have powers, again all are vastly different.

Some heros are just regular guys with great technology [Iron Man], or are well trained [Batman]. But again they are vastly different in so many ways.

At the end of the day, a vampire is a vampire. Some look human in some movies, some look like monsters. Some can talk, some cannot. But they're all night stalkers who prey on people and suck their blood. Morbius would be no different. There's only so much you can do with a vampire. And it's been done a bazillion times in the dozens of vampire flicks floating around these days.

Why bring that into a Spidey movie?

No, but that doesnt mean he doesnt derserve any consideration.

Ok, the only way I could even remotely see Morbius working in the kid friendly Spider-Man world of these movies is if Morbius was a good guy who helped Spidey take down another beast, say someone like The Lizard.

Morbius has been a goodie in the comics, and teamed up with Spidey to help him before.

Same could be said for Morbius.

I don't agree. Morbius doesn't have enough diversity to do that. As mentioned above, it's pretty restricted to what you can do with a vampire.

I never said "Raimi is using Morbius." In fact, I already stated that I am not saying that.

I never said you did. We're debating on the premise of if he did use him, yes?

What I am saying is to hop on the character and say Morbius doesnt belong because he isnt popular and Spidey wouldnt even fight him when he obviously has is ridiculous. To think he could never make it to a Spiderman movie or that if he did it would autmoatically be a mistake is ridiculous.

Whoa, whoa, hang on a second. Who the heck said Spider-Man wouldn't fight him? Spidey would fight any danger presented to him. I said he shouldn't be dealing with foes like that. I said I don't think he fits into Spidey's world.

And as for popularity, you think it's unreasonable for not wanting to shun Spidey's more deserving and infamous villains who have a a wider range of stories in the comics, for a vampire character with a limited history with Spidey?

That's not unreasonable at all.

Or he could make a Spidey movie with Morbius, because afterall, Morbius IS a Spiderman rogue.t:

So is the Walrus, Kangaroo, White Rabbit, Hypno-Hustler etc. But I'm not keen to see any of them darken Spider-Man's door in these flicks any time soon

 

[Chris Wallace]

I'm partial to both as well, including Mysterio. I love the original villains. Kraven hopefully appears with Lizard.

There's a logical justification for this. I can see it. Of course, he could just as easily be after Spider-Man.

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

I don't refuse to look at the possibility. It's not like I don't know the Morbius character and what he's like in Spidey's world. I have seen the possibility. I've seen it in the comics. I saw it in the 90's cartoon. It never felt right to me. Heck, they even had to bring in Blade in the 90's cartoon episodes with Morbius just to make it work.

I have nothing against vampires. I love vampires actually. I just don't think they belong in Spidey's world.



Probably one of the reasons why the movie is so unpopular. A weak villain. He didn't work as a character. He didn't feel like Dracula. He was a poor successor to Frost and Nomac.



Not at all. Of course there's similarities. You'd have to be blind not to see that. But they are purely on a conceptual level. For example, all the heros save people. How they do it is what sets them apart. Some heros have powers, again all are vastly different.

Some heros are just regular guys with great technology [Iron Man], or are well trained [Batman]. But again they are vastly different in so many ways.

At the end of the day, a vampire is a vampire. Some look human in some movies, some look like monsters. Some can talk, some cannot. But they're all night stalkers who prey on people and suck their blood. Morbius would be no different. There's only so much you can do with a vampire. And it's been done a bazillion times in the dozens of vampire flicks floating around these days.

Why bring that into a Spidey movie?



Ok, the only way I could even remotely see Morbius working in the kid friendly Spider-Man world of these movies is if Morbius was a good guy who helped Spidey take down another beast, say someone like The Lizard.

Morbius has been a goodie in the comics, and teamed up with Spidey to help him before.



I don't agree. Morbius doesn't have enough diversity to do that. As mentioned above, it's pretty restricted to what you can do with a vampire.

Well, keep in mind, Morbius isn't a real vampire, in the traditional sense. He's actually a living human being, with a rare blood disease... he has terrible remorse over the lives he takes...there's a bit of Shakespearean conflict there, that i can see working.

Mind you; i'm hoping and praying to see Lizard and KRAVEN in SM4, but i can see Sam doing a spin on ASM #101 and #102, (minus the six armed saga i would hope) which involved Morbius and The Lizard...

 

[LightningFlash]

And...they can always have Morbius wanting plasma...haha.

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

And...they can always have Morbius wanting plasma...haha.

Or perhaps being particularly drawn to Peter's genetically altered "plasma"?

 

[The Joker]

Well, keep in mind, Morbius isn't a real vampire, in the traditional sense. He's actually a living human being, with a rare blood disease... he has terrible remorse over the lives he takes...there's a bit of Shakespearean conflict there, that i can see working.

Of course. But he still looks like a vampire, feeds like a vampire, flies like a vampire etc.

Mind you; i'm hoping and praying to see Lizard and KRAVEN in SM4, but i can see Sam doing a spin on ASM #101 and #102, (minus the six armed saga i would hope) which involved Morbius and The Lizard...

Yes, didn't Morbius help Spidey take down the Lizard in that arc? That's what I was talking about above. If Morbius was made a goodie, that's the only way I could see him working in these child friendly Spidey movies.

And it's not against Morbius' nature to work with Spidey to take down a greater danger. He did it in Maximum Carnage, too.

But then there's the problem of yet ANOTHER sympathetic villain who's not really bad. Especially if the Lizard is in there, too. Guarantee that'll elicit many complaints from fans.

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

Of course. But he still looks like a vampire, feeds like a vampire, flies like a vampire etc.



Yes, didn't Morbius help Spidey take down the Lizard in that arc? That's what I was talking about above. If Morbius was made a goodie, that's the only way I could see him working in these child friendly Spidey movies.

No, in the comics it was Lizard with Conner's mind helpig Peter fight Morbius, but Sam could easily switch that around, i guess.

But again; like yourself, i'd rather see another Ditko-era villain get the big screen treatment instead.

 

[Spider-ManHero12]

Well, keep in mind, Morbius isn't a real vampire, in the traditional sense. He's actually a living human being, with a rare blood disease... he has terrible remorse over the lives he takes...there's a bit of Shakespearean conflict there, that i can see working.

Mind you; i'm hoping and praying to see Lizard and KRAVEN in SM4, but i can see Sam doing a spin on ASM #101 and #102, (minus the six armed saga i would hope) which involved Morbius and The Lizard...

Agreed, and I'm curious where the battle between Spidey, Lizad, and morbius would take palce. Maybe a vertigo battle or something. Or maybe they would try to adapt that beach from #'s 101 and #102, which is where Spdiey whent and where some of the Lizard and Morbius battle talk place.

 

[Doctor Jones]

Why do people keep making claims about these film being kid friendly? Of course there kid friendly. Because Spider-Man is for all ages. I wouldn't want to see it darker than it is. The tone is fine. People may mean by the constant appearance of kids in these films. But hey, they're usually are alot. Kids love superheroes too. You can't always want something for your own. You'll never get that. That's why everyone's always disapointed because it doesn't have their vision. Because with Spider-Man he appeals to everyone of all ages. He's a light superhero.

 

[terry78]

^I think because a lot of comics nowadays seem to tread the PG-13/R line a lot, they feel that the movies should follow suit with the subject matter. It is weird sometimes seeing these characters that were somewhat PG-fantasy fluff back in the day suddenly wrapped up in some kind of NC-17 **** in their books.

 

[Spade]

I don't feel Spider-Man is as light as some make him out to be. The Other is definitely too dark a story for Spider-Man, but we've seen members of the supporting cast die off permanently, drug abuse, and battles ending in death. He's not a creature of the night, but he's hardly Superman. If you really want to show him as an Everyman there has to be an edge to his world.

Morbius would be fine if that wasn't just a passing comment from Raimi. It might allow Peter to be a bit more scientific in his adventures than he's been shown to be up to this point, and that's not a negative in my book.

 

[VenomVsSpidey]

well it'll be someone new; and a returning villian from 3.i say this because i dont know who; but one of the characthers from sm3 has been quoted on how his character "didnt really die".obviously this rules out sandman;bringin harry back is utter nonsense.i think venom but hes gettin his own movie so.......who knows?

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

Oh boy.



Um OK...I think the character is fine, but he's far from what I want to see in a Spider-Man movie.

Why exactly? His storyline and character could bring some much needed freshness and a bit of needed darkness to the movies. He would certainly be a villain we havent seen before. And he does have a somewhat sympathetic storyline which would satisfy Raimi. I would personally prefer The Scorpion but IMO Morbius would do just fine.

Nip/Tuck doesnt have the same tone and atmosphere as Spidey. Whedons stuff did. It wasnt graphic, it was about characters were both emotional and upbeat. There were plenty of attempts at humor and action.



Morbius is a living vampire, a product of a lab accident studying bats, not unlike most of Spideys rogues gallery. Theres also plenty of superhero movies to shake your stick at, but that doesnt seem to matter. Choosing a villain shouldnt always be about just finding the more popular character and sticking him in. Luckily there werent only stories but themes that revolved around the choices of Joker, Two Face, Doc Ock, and Green Goblin. Morbius implies a much different kind of movie than the other characters have had through the natural characteristics of a vampire movie, but also has much in common with Spideys other rogues that doesnt make him a gross mistake either. So if Raimi has a reason to use Morbius, he most certainly should and it would be as valid as any member of Spideys rogues.

Agreed, he would at least bring something different to the movies rogue's gallery of Spidey.

 

[sauronthegreat]

This whole story about Morbius in a Spidey film is hard to picture. As I remember there was some talk a while back about Morlun, and how producers wanted to take Spidey in that direction. I personally don't see a supernatural plot for this movie series. Especially when they have many other great villains to use... Mysterio, Scorpion, Electro, Lizard, Kraven, Vulture... and many others.
But as I recall this same Raimi talked about Vulture and Electro, that he would like to see them incorporated in film... also there was a talk about a Sinister Six, that I am personally most fond of, and there was a fan favorite topic about Lizard and Kraven which also was in a way confirmed by Raimi.

 

[Frodo]

Maybe Morbuis can team up with Mephisto .. Sorry , I'm not feeling it guys. Now as said previously, this could be Raimi just talking about his favorite characters as opposed to who's actually gonna be in the film .

I reallly do think it's the Lizards time and delaying him for Morbuis would be lame IMO. I'd rather see Electro or Mysterio then see Morbuis. Spiderman and Vampires?..Meh. Vampires have been over exposed with Underworld, True Blood, Twilight, Moonlight etc to put one in a Spiderman film would seem like desperation . It wouldn't seem fresh IMO. Now this is part 4 in a series but still. That's my two cents .

 

[Venom'sDad]

Sorry , I'm not feeling it guys. Now as said previously, this could be Raimi just talking about his favorite characters as opposed to who's actually gonna be in the film .

That's all it is... seriously. Besides, no one attached to this franchise has ever release information on who the pending villain will be this soon. Come on...

What you have said Frodo, is all it is... don't sweat it.

 

[Neptune]

The King Pin. He is way to good of a villain to be in that Daredevil crap.

 

[Adrian89]

The King Pin. He is way to good of a villain to be in that Daredevil crap.

I wouldn't wanna see the fatso in a SM Movie, no thanks!!

 

[Neptune]

Why not?

 

[Adrian89]

Because there are more deserving villains than him and much better ones too!

 

[Doctor Jones]

^I think because a lot of comics nowadays seem to tread the PG-13/R line a lot, they feel that the movies should follow suit with the subject matter. It is weird sometimes seeing these characters that were somewhat PG-fantasy fluff back in the day suddenly wrapped up in some kind of NC-17 **** in their books.

Agreed.

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

Agreed, and I'm curious where the battle between Spidey, Lizad, and morbius would take palce. Maybe a vertigo battle or something. Or maybe they would try to adapt that beach from #'s 101 and #102, which is where Spdiey whent and where some of the Lizard and Morbius battle talk place.

If Sam were to recreate that Lizard vs Morbius fight to the big screen, i would freak the Hell out!

 

[Venom'sDad]

^I think because a lot of comics nowadays seem to tread the PG-13/R line a lot, they feel that the movies should follow suit with the subject matter. It is weird sometimes seeing these characters that were somewhat PG-fantasy fluff back in the day suddenly wrapped up in some kind of NC-17 **** in their books.

I understand what you are saying and for the most part, you are correct. However, that's another sign of the changing times. Children are more acquiesce to mature themes nowdays than in days past. Batman is a prime example as far as Batman89 compared to TDK... or comics from that era to now. So it's a natural transition, imo.

Now, I wouldn't go so far to say NC17; but I can see how the producers flirt with PG13-R.

 

[Spiderine]

The King Pin. He is way to good of a villain to be in that Daredevil crap.

He could have been phenomenal in Daredevil. I actually think he works better for him. Wasted opportunity.

 

[Adrian89]

I hope Lizard & Kraven will make it in SM4 and in SM5 I'd like to see Scorpion & Mysterio!