Age of Extinction Transformers 4 is going to be TERRIBLE!

[TheVileOne]

I liked this movie, but the defense of "it's not gonna win Oscars/it's based on a cartoon, etc" is really silly and baseless

Exactly! There are plenty of great movies and blockbusters that make money and even get good critical reviews that don't really win any major awards.

 

[Loki882]

Heck, we've seen that you can do stuff with the Transformers that involves pretty intelligent plots, interesting characters, and no offensive elements. So it's doable.

 

[Marvin]

Exactly! There are plenty of great movies and blockbusters that make money and even get good critical reviews that don't really win any major awards.

300 or so opinions aren't the be all end all anything, no matter what they call themselves. There is no demonstrable measure of quality when it comes to art, just opinion. A majority and a minority.

There was a time when 'the church' controlled what was considered 'good art'. Often times given the two thumbs up to things that honored them or lore they were pushing. Now we seemingly let another group do similar. A small group of people pushing and pulling different types/styles/tones/traditions of film.

But that's just my opinion. A minority one no doubt.

 

[TheVileOne]

Marvin, I love you. Michael Bay should hire you as his propagandist.

 

[Piper Maru]

This film was downright awful.

 

[Marvin]

Marvin, I love you. Michael Bay should hire you as his propagandist.

Thanks. I'll settle for publicist though.

You're right people do tend to cheer on or bash on critics depending on the film. You yourself in this very thread. I'm personally of the more consistent nature. The opinion of 300 or so...does nothing to validate or invalidate a film, and the internets runs on people seeking validation to no end. Perhaps if it came down to a far far larger consensus, but even then. As an artist myself I personally just can't get behind that stuff, that's all. I used to think differently. Critics meant alot more to me personally. Then I started actually reading what they had to say(faraci for instance)..I mean at any odd time these particular forums have several thousands of people logged in or browsing. If we took a random 300 of them that watch alot of films, gave their opinions a special weight and had them go through each section validating or invalidating all the films...From the real life 300 that hated IM3 to the 300 that loved MoS...it would be for nothing in the greater conversation imo. Whether it be positive or negative. That's what it amounts to...for me anyways. I can see how it's different for others.

 

[The Caped Knight]

One thing I didn't like was the characterization of Optimus who at times acted out of character (I get he was pissed off by the senseless death of his fellow Autobots and greed of certain Humans who were trying to profit from their technology.)

But Optimus wouldn't outright Kill coldheartly, Also I can't believe Megs as Galvatron hardly did anything DAMNIT!

 

[Lord]

He wouldn't kill coldheartedly?

[YT]tE3uMlC-tME[/YT]

I also love the part when his beaten old friend is pleading for his oun life and then Optimus shoots him in the face.

 

[Loki882]

Yeah, in DOTM he:

-Let's Chicago be destroyed and everyone in it killed just to prove a point to the human governments (that the Autobots were needed).
-Does his best Punisher impression with lines like "we will kill them all."
-Rips Megatron's head off mere moments after Megatron saved his life and was offering him a truce.
-Cold-bloodedly executed Sentinel, his old friend and mentor, when he was defenseless and begging for mercy.

That's one of the big complaints that people have about the last two movies, Optimus's characterization.

 

[Quasimod0]

Optimus knows not to let a dangerous enemy remain alive. He also knows to go right for the head.

 

[Loki882]

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that they weren't bad people or that they didn't deserve it (they probably did). The problem is that it was Optimus Prime, who's supposed to be the ultimate hero (and they play him up as such) and is constantly talking about "freedom is the right of all sentient beings" turning into the Punisher. If it was someone like say Ironhide, then I could buy it much more.

 

[Marvin]

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that they weren't bad people or that they didn't deserve it (they probably did). The problem is that it was Optimus Prime, who's supposed to be the ultimate hero (and they play him up as such) and is constantly talking about "freedom is the right of all sentient beings" turning into the Punisher. If it was someone like say Ironhide, then I could buy it much more.

This is pretty much justifies his choice about chicago. To me anyways. Humans have the freedom to choose their own fate. It's why superman doesn't just walk into foreign countries and strip them of their war stuff. It was an interesting idea anyways.

Unlike the decepticons, the autobots weren't going to force anything, even if it's right. Not until the leaders changed their minds. Very much, un-punisher like.

 

[Lord]

That's also the reason why i have no idea why the Autobots would be working with the Government to fight terrorists in the beginning of TF 3, they were openly taking sides among human countries.

 

[Grommers]

I enjoyed one and two. They were "okay", they had a basic story line.

This was just down right terrible. I've seen these action scenes a billion times before, and for people talking about "characterization", it's a michael film transformers, there is NONE, he'll just do what is "cool".

The issue for me is, we've had 3 movies like that, and I'm sick of watching metal flying over transformers, and then more metal. We've seen this animation. That's why I saw the first 3. I am now done with this version of transformers, I won't be seeing the other two in theatres. The only scene that I thoroughly thought was new to the series

Spoiler

was the death of the dude at the beginning.

. Other than that, same old story, no character development, poor character portrayals, a story line that contradicts other story lines, and the list goes on and on. It's time for some real fresh air to be brought into transformers. I'm not saying what Bay did was poor, I'm saying it's be done. He should have ended it on number 3.

 

[Loki882]

That's also the reason why i have no idea why the Autobots would be working with the Government to fight terrorists in the beginning of TF 3, they were openly taking sides among human countries.

Because to Bay, "MURICA" is the bestest best country and no one else matters.

 

[Loki882]

This is pretty much justifies his choice about chicago. To me anyways. Humans have the freedom to choose their own fate. It's why superman doesn't just walk into foreign countries and strip them of their war stuff. It was an interesting idea anyways.

Unlike the decepticons, the autobots weren't going to force anything, even if it's right. Not until the leaders changed their minds. Very much, un-punisher like.

No, it doesn't. Not one bit. Because he also constantly talks about the sanctity of life. He sat back and let thousands of people die horribly just to prove a point. That is not Optimus Prime, that's a sociopathic monster. And those people in Chicago didn't get to choose anything. Heck, that's why I kind of understood Titus Welliver's character's anger in AOE. Optimus Prime doesn't let innocent people, who have NO say in the matter, die needlessly without trying to do something to save them. Oh and the Autobots were essentially lapdogs of the US in that movie. Attack other nation's soldiers without provocation, because MURICA is awesome.

 

[Piper Maru]

one thing i didn't like was the characterization of optimus who at times acted out of character (i get he was pissed off by the senseless death of his fellow autobots and greed of certain humans who were trying to profit from their technology.)

but optimus wouldn't outright kill coldheartly, also i can't believe megs as galvatron hardly did anything damnit!

They're ruining everything!

 

[Piper Maru]

He wouldn't kill coldheartedly?

[YT]tE3uMlC-tME[/YT]

I also love the part when his beaten old friend is pleading for his oun life and then Optimus shoots him in the face.

I like the part where they give Optimus their faces...wait until he meets the Quintessons!

 

[Marvin]

No, it doesn't. Not one bit. Because he also constantly talks about the sanctity of life. He sat back and let thousands of people die horribly just to prove a point. That is not Optimus Prime, that's a sociopathic monster. And those people in Chicago didn't get to choose anything. Heck, that's why I kind of understood Titus Welliver's character's anger in AOE. Optimus Prime doesn't let innocent people, who have NO say in the matter, die needlessly without trying to do something to save them. Oh and the Autobots were essentially lapdogs of the US in that movie. Attack other nation's soldiers without provocation, because MURICA is awesome.

This is the same absolutist mindset that imo wouldn't let people get around various plot developments in MOS. Superman believes in the 'sanctity of life' thus he wouldn't. As if there is some stride for moral perfection. Ignoring how violent he is to criminals with rights, that he resorts to violence in the first place, that he lies to almost everyone on a daily basis, that he acts above the law, that he's fudged his citizenship...etc. Point being, absolute statements get us nowhere.

As far as optimus, the people of chicago didn't have a choice, their leaders did, as is the fate of mankind since the dawn of civilization. If optimus let's that system run it's course as a benevolent higher being he will be in the moral clear. Secondly, it's not like he actually left, not sure how many millions more lives he would have saved if he simply sat in chicago with his arms and legs crossed and gun in his lap. There tends to be massive fall out in all the battles regardless. The point is telling the voted world leaders that they can take their freemdom of choice and screw it absolutely makes the autobots no better than the decepticons. It's a matter of idealism. I'm sure Rorschach would approve. It's about striving for what's 'right'. An entire world voting you away by way of democracy and telling them to shove it...not sure if even superman would stay on earth in that situation. Then again, it's not like they left.

That's also the reason why i have no idea why the Autobots would be working with the Government to fight terrorists in the beginning of TF 3, they were openly taking sides among human countries.

It's a dubious question.
Global matters are never cut and dry but there are somethings that are more so. For example would the autobots help the allies fight the axis(Hitler)? Down the scale would they join in the hunt to find Osama if they could?

I'm sure they wouldn't walk in take out Kim ill in NorthK just cause MURICA says so, but I'd imagine it's at the moral level of complexity of gi joe. Themselves not actually messing with north korea but they do like to punch the "evil terrorists" in the face. Dubious at the very least I'd say.

The thing is, even world leaders vote in the majority against 'terrorist' active terrorist outposts and such(if that is infact what they were attacking). And prime very much was at the beck and call of 'the world leaders'. I've only seen the film once so this is all speculation.

don't mind the derailment.

 

[Dugath]

I saw it in 3D Imax. IT was a good "Bay" movie. I mean it is what it is right ?

But one thing (well a lot of things, but this one is at the top of my list)..

When [BLACKOUT]Lockdown shot Prime and Prime was easily captured because he could no longer move all of a sudden when he is rescued is in top fighting form again..hmmm..[/BLACKOUT].

Also in that scene when Prime is shot there are all these little black uniformed rectangles blowing around which was real annoying because it just looked like bad CGI debris.

Oh I suppose the way the human built Transformers ..transformed is on my dislike list too.

 

[Mace Dolex]

My only complaints were the exhaustive run time and lack of epic music scoring.

 

[Rock Sexton]

What was Galv's stupid line at the end .... "This isn't the last we'll meet. I am reborn."

Prime's random challenge to the dinobots to fight him or join him.

Man this movie was awful.

 

[Piper Maru]

I did however like Galvatron's design and voice, to bad he didn't have an important role in the story.

 

[Drizzle]

But one thing (well a lot of things, but this one is at the top of my list)..

When [BLACKOUT]Lockdown shot Prime and Prime was easily captured because he could no longer move all of a sudden when he is rescued is in top fighting form again..hmmm..[/BLACKOUT]

Not only that, but [BLACKOUT]Optimus was captured in a freaking NET! Did he forget that he has blades that eject from his arms? [/BLACKOUT]

 

[Tony Stark]

This film should have been named "Transformers: WTF?!"