What are your thoughts on Feminist Gamers?

On the subject of Angry Joe, I agree that there's such a thing as opinions. And I especially don't want a person to die. I just don't like how a lot of feminist gamers treat their opinions as facts.
 
There is always extremes on either side. And there needs to be changes in games for sure. But I agree with that video that counters Anita. She is over the top, and really over-exaggerates and does take many things out of context to go over the top kinda like PETA etc.

But there is a lot of problems in the gaming industry, it's just she is not the ones figuring out the actual problems.
 
Yeah, have you seen Capcom? That's what they get for releasing god awful fighting games.
 
I understand the need for feminist gamers. Gaming still has a bit more to go before everyone is represented.

I know sometimes some of them act like a bad egg and make a mountain out of a molehill but most of them are wholly justified in what they say and usually very eloquently express it so I support them
 
This subject reminds me of the Lara Croft debate. Some women think she is the best example of how women can be cool and be the main character in a video game. Other women say she is nothing more than the spawn of a horny male artist's imagination, due to her design. I think the desire to want more female characters play less in distress roles, and more action and main roles is fine. It's when they complain and want to condemn any character based on her design that I find annoying.
 
Well, her newest incarnation, is a lot more... realistic looking. That helps.

But yeah, when you have characters (I'm not going to name names, you know them if you've been playing games for years) who wear high heels in combat, or bikini armor, it's pretty clear that that serves no other purpose than to titillate male players.
 
Again, it's video games. Let's not pretend there's no such thing as grounded video games. The best part about video games is that people can do whatever they want with them.
 
Yes, but I can see why it might annoy some women.

It's getting better though.
 
Really? It's been that way since the 90's.

And saying it's "getting better" implies that there was a ground to improve on. When really, video games were progressing no matter how much ****** games were produced.
 
Progressing in what sense? In having less sexualized female characters with depth?

I think that's a fairly recent development.
 
Really? There were quite a few back in the late 80's-90's and 2000-2008. I can't really state that over sexualization is something to ignore, but there have been quite a few female characters that have been in a strong role. Even existing characters like Zelda had stronger roles.
 
Zelda is a good example, since until Ocarina of Time, she was a pretty poorly characterized damsel. But that's what I mean by recent. 2000's.

Though her problem (feminist wise) was being a useless damsel. Sexualized, not so much.

My favorite Zelda incarnation is still Tetra. But then Wind Waker had the best characterizations all around.
 
No she wasn't? Zelda is royal status. Many responses to Feminist Frequency stated that without Zelda or Peach, their kingdom would be in a state of despair. Even in games of Ocarina of Time supports this theory. There were a lot of games that puts Zelda in a situation she has no control of. The biggest example is Twilight Princess, in which she must surrender or have her people die.

There's a difference with being useless and being in a situation one has no control of.
 
Yet, they couldn't make a game where she liberates her own country?

A character who has magic abilities?

Well, that might be more of a lack of creativity than sexism.
 
Yet, they couldn't make a game where she liberates her own country?

A character who has magic abilities?

Video Game logic :p

Anyways, a lot of games in the series has this villain capture Zelda through unnatural means. No one knows the extent of her powers. It might be speculated that there's a limit to what she can and can't do.

Or it could be that. Seriously, a lot of Zelda games play it safe.
 
Well as a Zelda fan, I have wondered that.

Quite frankly it starts to make her seem lazy. Look at Hilda, her dark counterpart, she kicks ass.

But I digress. Back to feminism.
 
I wouldn't know. I thought Zelda started being good again with A Link Between Worlds.... Though, the last unimpressive Zelda game was Skyward Sword.

I thought she was stuck in a situation she had no control of. Especially when she was in less scenes. The villain certainly supports this thesis. Mehhhhhh.... I wish she had more scenes before going ape****

Right.... Don't trust Feminist Frequency for female rights.
 
Speaking of Feminist Frequency, I've seen quite a few things that would have Anita get a lot of negative attention. One of the more infamous criticism is posting her stuff on 4chan.... Yep.

Guys, I can understand fighting for rights of certain individuals, but don't go and defend ones that demeans others. Human rights implies that all are equal... Or I'm politically incorrect.... My point is if we have the negative attitudes of feminists, then we'd have another holocaust on our hands.
 
I'm actually quite relieved with the responses in this thread. I have been a bit disillusioned with SHH as of late, and this was a nice bit of optimism for my day.

TheLastBlade, I would suggest that you try and be a bit more empathetic rather than simply the last eight letters, and see things from a woman's point of view when looking at games. Not only is there startlingly little games that actually feature women as the central protagonist compared to men, but their portrayals are often deprotagonised, sexualised, objectified, or simply placed as a blank slate. Even Mass Effect, a very well thought out series, still had the Asari, a borderline nerd sexual fantasy race.

Even worse, much of gaming culture is incredibly hostile not just to feminism, but to the existence of female gamers in general. Just look at the Fake Geek Girls debacle (interesting that the never was a Fake Geek Guys one, despite many existing), the response to Anita Sarkeesian (There are much better feminist videos on gaming, but the responses demonstrate the remarkable vitriol), and the well recorded cases of comic-con guys 'quizzing' women or belittling them in other ways as not 'true fans.'

The mere fact that you continually brush off legitimate criticism as 'it's just videogames' only reveals how startlingly entrenched issues of sexism are. You would never see such overwhelming responses with, say, racism. It is sad really, that so many gamers at once want the wider world to appreciate the possibilities and brilliance of the medium, while at the same time lashing out in that passive aggressive way only middle class guys can do so well at any an all criticism. Political criticism is vital to helping change culture in more positive and equal ways. Hell, even in small ones - like the greater recognition Femshep was given for Mass Effect 3's marketing and packaging over her almost brand invisibility in the previous two installments.
 
Speaking of Feminist Frequency, I've seen quite a few things that would have Anita get a lot of negative attention. One of the more infamous criticism is posting her stuff on 4chan.... Yep.

Guys, I can understand fighting for rights of certain individuals, but don't go and defend ones that demeans others. Human rights implies that all are equal... Or I'm politically incorrect.... My point is if we have the negative attitudes of feminists, then we'd have another holocaust on our hands.

Uhmm, not at all. I sometimes wonder if you people are watching the same feminists as i am, Feminist Frequency says a lot of true stuff, and as she said, much of the problems also come down to the image of women as objects or plot mechanisms being very deeply intergrated in the subconscious of most cultures.
 
Yeah, have you seen Capcom? That's what they get for releasing god awful fighting games.
What's wrong with fighting games? Fighting games are easily the best genre of competitive gaming. & if you're specifically calling out Capcom's recent fighting games, Street Fighter 4 & Marvel vs Capcom 3 (& their updates) are easily two of the best fighting games ever.

This subject reminds me of the Lara Croft debate. Some women think she is the best example of how women can be cool and be the main character in a video game. Other women say she is nothing more than the spawn of a horny male artist's imagination, due to her design. I think the desire to want more female characters play less in distress roles, and more action and main roles is fine. It's when they complain and want to condemn any character based on her design that I find annoying.

Pre-reboot, Lara Croft came off to me as a lame character that was trying too hard to be cool & sexy at the same time. I've been playing the reboot recently & I love it, it gives Lara a personality besides "badass" & it's make her a bit more realistic in how she acts AND her looks.
 
I'm actually quite relieved with the responses in this thread. I have been a bit disillusioned with SHH as of late, and this was a nice bit of optimism for my day.

TheLastBlade, I would suggest that you try and be a bit more empathetic rather than simply the last eight letters, and see things from a woman's point of view when looking at games. Not only is there startlingly little games that actually feature women as the central protagonist compared to men, but their portrayals are often deprotagonised, sexualised, objectified, or simply placed as a blank slate. Even Mass Effect, a very well thought out series, still had the Asari, a borderline nerd sexual fantasy race.

Even worse, much of gaming culture is incredibly hostile not just to feminism, but to the existence of female gamers in general. Just look at the Fake Geek Girls debacle (interesting that the never was a Fake Geek Guys one, despite many existing), the response to Anita Sarkeesian (There are much better feminist videos on gaming, but the responses demonstrate the remarkable vitriol), and the well recorded cases of comic-con guys 'quizzing' women or belittling them in other ways as not 'true fans.'

The mere fact that you continually brush off legitimate criticism as 'it's just videogames' only reveals how startlingly entrenched issues of sexism are. You would never see such overwhelming responses with, say, racism. It is sad really, that so many gamers at once want the wider world to appreciate the possibilities and brilliance of the medium, while at the same time lashing out in that passive aggressive way only middle class guys can do so well at any an all criticism. Political criticism is vital to helping change culture in more positive and equal ways. Hell, even in small ones - like the greater recognition Femshep was given for Mass Effect 3's marketing and packaging over her almost brand invisibility in the previous two installments.

.... Which is why I said it's video games.... There are just as much male slags as female slags. Apparently female ones are more noticeable because they seem to complain about it more.

I won't exactly pretend that stuff like that doesn't happen.... It's just that complaining about stuff that happens in Call of Duty is like complaining what the definition of drug addicts is. I will admit that stuff like that comic con berating is pretty harsh.

Oh my god... Are you seriously using the Mass Effect 3 marketing? When video games are advertised, the developers would try to use the best aspects. It's been stated that MALE gamers play Mass Effect more. Guess what happened? Even though I don't like Mass Effect 3, the series has options to choose genders. Are there any gender favoritism between the two in game? Let me know.

If female consumers don't buy games as much as male consumers, then maybe they should do a better job at being more aware of this stuff.
 
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Uhmm, not at all. I sometimes wonder if you people are watching the same feminists as i am, Feminist Frequency says a lot of true stuff, and as she said, much of the problems also come down to the image of women as objects or plot mechanisms being very deeply intergrated in the subconscious of most cultures.

I'm not sure if there's actually positive Feminists. Maybe there is, but I wouldn't go to Feminist Frequency for such sources. They complain about stuff like legos.

Apparently, complaining about stuff that targets a certain demographic means the same thing as the increase of violence. I can understand SOME complaints, but complaints like bows, skirts, and girlish appearance in games that needs consistent designs for lighter series is one of the dumbest complaints I ever heard.

Perhaps that over sexualized female characters are a problem. But then again, so are male characters with killer abs and the only distinct character trait is spewing stupid one liners. Difference? One team is complaining about it more.
 
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What's wrong with fighting games? Fighting games are easily the best genre of competitive gaming. & if you're specifically calling out Capcom's recent fighting games, Street Fighter 4 & Marvel vs Capcom 3 (& their updates) are easily two of the best fighting games ever.



Pre-reboot, Lara Croft came off to me as a lame character that was trying too hard to be cool & sexy at the same time. I've been playing the reboot recently & I love it, it gives Lara a personality besides "badass" & it's make her a bit more realistic in how she acts AND her looks.

Not a fan... I don't like fighting games set in the moon and fightings games more broken than god.

I don't mind reboot Lara Croft that much either. She's in an island that's jacked up on steroids to kill.
 

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