What did Bryan Singer think of X3?

[X-Maniac]

1. Never appointed myself as anyone's guardian. You assumed those you were debating with were or acted like "Slacker's"....I said you dont really know these people...which is true.

I never used the word 'slackers', I said something about XBox gamers in their bedrooms, meaning the young fanboy generation. Nothing to do with slacking, but to do with the culture of fanboyism.

2. I've not denied nor admitted to any sort of trolling...I did say that you are more of a firestarter than i am, which i believe to be true. Other individuals have complained about you in this thread. you can claim you're a debater all you want...you're attitude makes you a firestarter.Nell for example essentially feels the same way you do, and yet, no one is attacking him. And the only reason I havent said anything on X3 is because i really dont care to get into an argument with you where nothing is resolved.

You're right that nothing would be resolved, unless you had some utterly convincing positive/negative argument. I don't regard myself as a firestarter, though I do know I stand my ground and have done so (consistently) for the time I've been on here. If you feel I'm a firestarter, so be it, but I do not agree.

3. Let me make this clear: you implied that my supposed trolling is fanning the flames....which says to me that you assume that im inspiring people to flame you. This is what i'm debating...anyone flaming you is doing so because you've irked them...not because of me...i left this thread temporarily, and came back only to find that people were responding to you with heavy vitirol...and you're claiming I'm the cause of this? By your own admission, the debate was already heated...so, once again, my comments dont mean squat. all i am is your scapegoat because you're avoiding the real issue

No, I implied that you were not so much inspiring people to flame me as adding to the intensity of debate that already had enough intensity of its own. It was nothing to calm matters or mediate, it had the purpose of trying to incite response from me or to build up the opposition to me. I had no argument with you, yet you started one with me.

And, it's worth adding, I have talked extensively over the years about the negative in X3 as well as the positive. I know people don't like my irrepressible enthusiasm for many parts of X3 but that is their problem. My willpower and opinion will not be eroded by anonymous posters on a message board, as my willpower and opinion exist beyond the message board. Some of the people I've argued with have provided some excellent ideas and thoughts, even if they ventured into what seemed to me to be excessive nitpicking.

There are intense arguments in all areas of this forum. It's part of forum life. Not to mention the often childish standard of commenting to be found on the front page of the Hype in the comments to news items.

But this all has very little to do with the topic and my argument with other people in here is really none of your business at the end of the day.

 

[The Batman]

I never used the word 'slackers', I said something about XBox gamers in their bedrooms, meaning the young fanboy generation. Nothing to do with slacking, but to do with the culture of fanboyism.

You came off as insulting, and thats why your post came off as calling "fanboys" slackers.

You're right that nothing would be resolved, unless you had some utterly convincing positive/negative argument. I don't regard myself as a firestarter, though I do know I stand my ground and have done so (consistently) for the time I've been on here. If you feel I'm a firestarter, so be it, but I do not agree.

Again...Nell stands his ground, and yet people dont flame him...

No, I implied that you were not so much inspiring people to flame me as adding to the intensity of debate that already had enough intensity of its own. It was nothing to calm matters or mediate, it had the purpose of trying to incite response from me or to build up the opposition to me. I had no argument with you, yet you started one with me.

And, it's worth adding, I have talked extensively over the years about the negative in X3 as well as the positive. I know people don't like my irrepressible enthusiasm for many parts of X3 but that is their problem. My willpower and opinion will not be eroded by anonymous posters on a message board, as my willpower and opinion exist beyond the message board. Some of the people I've argued with have provided some excellent ideas and thoughts, even if they ventured into what seemed to me to be excessive nitpicking.

There are intense arguments in all areas of this forum. It's part of forum life. Not to mention the often childish standard of commenting to be found on the front page of the Hype in the comments to news items.

But this all has very little to do with the topic and my argument with other people in here is really none of your business at the end of the day.

I wasnt speaking to you in my first post...I was speaking about you...you couldve said "Whatever", and that would've been it. Me speaking to you wouldve been addressing you...I did not address you directly. And at the end of the day, if your arguments are none of my business, instead of taking up space on a thread called "what did singer think of X3" with an off topic discussion of "how did you feel about X3?"...take it to PM. No one is bashing your willpower...people are saying you are coming off a certain way, and honestly, I think you're claiming to have "willpower" and "enthusiasm" is just another way to explain your bad attitude, as many posters here have "willpower" and "enthusiasm", and dont incite as much flaming as you do.

 

[X-Maniac]

You came off as insulting, and thats why your post came off as calling "fanboys" slackers.

I never used the word slackers, it's not even a term i use. You're trying to put words in my mouth.

Again...Nell stands his ground, and yet people dont flame him...

Nell's been in a fair few heated arguments in this forum. He just isn't in this one. Good for him.

I wasnt speaking to you in my first post...I was speaking about you...you couldve said "Whatever", and that would've been it. Me speaking to you wouldve been addressing you...I did not address you directly. And at the end of the day, if your arguments are none of my business, instead of taking up space on a thread called "what did singer think of X3" with an off topic discussion of "how did you feel about X3?"...take it to PM. No one is bashing your willpower...people are saying you are coming off a certain way, and honestly, I think you're claiming to have "willpower" and "enthusiasm" is just another way to explain your bad attitude, as many posters here have "willpower" and "enthusiasm", and dont incite as much flaming as you do.

You speak as though I somehow incite flaming all over the place. That's untrue. Just because I have heated debates with people who have opposing views over a film (which has become controversial among the fanboy community) does not make me a firestarter.

You ask why I didn't take it to PM, but why didn't you?

As I said, the debate in here is none of your business. That's a fact. If you speak about someone in a thread, there is a good chance they will respond to defend their position. Did you think you could make those remarks and that I wouldn't say anything?

At the end of the day, you should just have kept your snout out. Simple as that. It's solved nothing.

 

[[A]]

Make love, not forum war

 

[The Batman]

I never used the word slackers, it's not even a term i use. You're 687]trying to put words in my mouth.

Sigh...never said you did

Nell's been in a fair few heated arguments in this forum. He just isn't in this one. Good for him.

And yet his rep's not as bad as yours...

You speak as though I somehow incite flaming all over the place. That's untrue. Just because I have heated debates with people who have opposing views over a film (which has become controversial among the fanboy community) does not make me a firestarter.

When posts become more about your attitude than the actual topic, you are inciting flaming. Am I saying you're a troll? No, but the heat is coming from your behavior when debating, not the debating itself.

You ask why I didn't take it to PM, but why didn't you?

did you miss the part where i said my post wasnt really addressing you?

As I said, the debate in here is none of your business. That's a fact. If you speak about someone in a thread, there is a good chance they will respond to defend their position. Did you think you could make those remarks and that I wouldn't say anything?

At the end of the day, you should just have kept your snout out. Simple as that. It's solved nothing.

Did you also miss the part where I said "you couldve responded and said 'whatever'" and that would be that...and before you try to twist my words, that was in response to the idea that I'm trolling/flaming...my comment was not to meant to have you burst out screaming...it was merely my commentary on the situation....which, if it were so private, it should not be on a public forum...the minute you have these debates on these forums and not pm it becomes everyones busines...and that is a FACT, whether you like it or not. now, its obvious you merely want to suck me into a black hole so you can somehow come out the victor...lets just agree to disagree...you think im a troll, i think you're an arrogant snob. done and done

 

[X-Maniac]

Sigh...never said you did

You implied I called people slackers. I never called them slackers, never implied they were slackers. I said some people on here were 'fanboys' which, quite clearly, is true and is bound to be true. That doesn't mean they are slacking at anything, it means they are extremist/obsessive as is implied by the word fanboys. There quite clearly are fanboys on here whose responses are disproportionate and lack perspective.

And yet his rep's not as bad as yours...

I wasn't aware I had a bad rep.

When posts become more about your attitude than the actual topic, you are inciting flaming. Am I saying you're a troll? No, but the heat is coming from your behavior when debating, not the debating itself.

Sometimes responses are heated, for sure, but not always. Sometimes personalities and egos clash, i'm aware of that and I know I've been in those sorts of arguments.

did you miss the part where i said my post wasnt really addressing you?

No, but you did end up addressing me. I saw your behaviour as you poking your nose in and responded accordingly. When you speak about someone, even if indirectly, there is the possibility they will respond.

Did you also miss the part where I said "you couldve responded and said 'whatever'" and that would be that...and before you try to twist my words, that was in response to the idea that I'm trolling/flaming...my comment was not to meant to have you burst out screaming...it was merely my commentary on the situation....which, if it were so private, it should not be on a public forum...the minute you have these debates on these forums and not pm it becomes everyones busines...and that is a FACT, whether you like it or not. now, its obvious you merely want to suck me into a black hole so you can somehow come out the victor...lets just agree to disagree...you think im a troll, i think you're an arrogant snob. done and done

I don't like it when people step into arguments and snipe. I've never liked it and I think it's pretty natural to respond and want the other person to butt out.

Your suggestion that we should agree to disagree is the only thing you've said with which I agree.

So, yes, I agree we should agree to disagree.

 

[LastSunrise1981]

It's time to let go of the past and move on. As much as I hate X3 myself I realize that nothing we say or do will change the product of the film itself. All we can hope for is that Wolverine is a success so we can have an X-Men film that is handled with the same care and attention that Wolverine is.

Let's look on the bright side though, at least X3 didn't turn out like Spider-Man 3.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

It's time to let go of the past and move on. As much as I hate X3 myself I realize that nothing we say or do will change the product of the film itself. All we can hope for is that Wolverine is a success so we can have an X-Men film that is handled with the same care and attention that Wolverine is.

Let's look on the bright side though, at least X3 didn't turn out like Spider-Man 3.

You're right about one thing - nothing we do will change the outcome of the movie now. It's been over 2 years now since the movie released. It's not changing anytime soon (unless Fox has an alternate version in the vaults that they plan to release at some point).

Discuss the movie all you want - that's the fun of forums. I for one still enjoy discussing this film, the elements that I enjoyed (and there were many), and the elements that I thought sucked (and there were a few).

I admit, I have gotten into some heated arguments. My debates with thewheepeople and LastSunrise1981 haven't always been pleasant. In particular with thewheepeople, I fundamentally disagree with his reasons for disliking the film. So I admit to getting a bit heated at times when really, I think the reasoning is flawed.

But some people just don't, and won't, like certain things. I guess I have illogical dislikes of certain things as well.

Fact of the matter is, we don't need to end discussion on the film. If it's fun to do, it's fun to do.

But we need to learn to respect each other. I think the movie r0xx0rz, others think it suxx0rz. That's okay. Let's talk about what we like, dislike, or whatever, but we need to quit with attacking each other for our opinions. Nobody is better or worse than someone else for their opinion of a comic book film.

And yes, I think the X-Men films are better than the new Batman films

You're not worse than me for thinking otherwise.

 

[LastSunrise1981]

You're right about one thing - nothing we do will change the outcome of the movie now. It's been over 2 years now since the movie released. It's not changing anytime soon (unless Fox has an alternate version in the vaults that they plan to release at some point).

Discuss the movie all you want - that's the fun of forums. I for one still enjoy discussing this film, the elements that I enjoyed (and there were many), and the elements that I thought sucked (and there were a few).

I admit, I have gotten into some heated arguments. My debates with thewheepeople and LastSunrise1981 haven't always been pleasant. In particular with thewheepeople, I fundamentally disagree with his reasons for disliking the film. So I admit to getting a bit heated at times when really, I think the reasoning is flawed.

But some people just don't, and won't, like certain things. I guess I have illogical dislikes of certain things as well.

Fact of the matter is, we don't need to end discussion on the film. If it's fun to do, it's fun to do.

But we need to learn to respect each other. I think the movie r0xx0rz, others think it suxx0rz. That's okay. Let's talk about what we like, dislike, or whatever, but we need to quit with attacking each other for our opinions. Nobody is better or worse than someone else for their opinion of a comic book film.

And yes, I think the X-Men films are better than the new Batman films

You're not worse than me for thinking otherwise.

Well I don't agree that the X-Men films are better than the recent Batman films. I feel X1 and X2 are somewhat on the level of BB and TDK. Both start out similar with their origin films and how they're good, but not great or a masterpiece. Then once the second film rolls around the directors really began focusing on their vision and created films that were and are critically acclaimed, box office hits, and etc.

With that said, it's kind of hard for X-Men and Batman to be on the same level to some extent. Mainly because Batman is one character and you don't have to worry about seven or eight other characters you know? X-Men everyone wants to see the main characters get their time to shine. With as many characters as the X-Men someone is bound to get shortended on screen time and character development.

As far as X3 is concerned? I still have my views on it. I believe we all agree it could've been a lot better and it deserved to have stronger development for the characters, more powerful emotion, and a final battle that could've been superior to something like Helms Deep or Braveheart. Now for me personally, I'm not singling anyone out, but for me as a fan of the comics, animated series, and the first two films I feel if I were to like X3 it would be accepting a mediocre product on MY part. I truly believe that a lot of it may have been the faults of fanboys too. We(including myself) went in with such high expectations that we were let down by our own perspectives.

Now there are certain films that deserve high expectations. For example The Dark Knight, the upcoming Watchmen, Terminator Salvation, Star Trek, and even Wolverine.

Overall I think it's time for all of us to mellow out and just grow up a bit. I know from experience that holding anger takes a toll on the body and the mind.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

It's time to let go of the past and move on. As much as I hate X3 myself I realize that nothing we say or do will change the product of the film itself. All we can hope for is that Wolverine is a success so we can have an X-Men film that is handled with the same care and attention that Wolverine is.

Let's look on the bright side though, at least X3 didn't turn out like Spider-Man 3.

I actually think Spiderman 3 is 100 times better than X3 personally, though Spidey 3 has its share of faults also.

You're right about one thing - nothing we do will change the outcome of the movie now. It's been over 2 years now since the movie released. It's not changing anytime soon (unless Fox has an alternate version in the vaults that they plan to release at some point).

Discuss the movie all you want - that's the fun of forums. I for one still enjoy discussing this film, the elements that I enjoyed (and there were many), and the elements that I thought sucked (and there were a few).

I admit, I have gotten into some heated arguments. My debates with thewheepeople and LastSunrise1981 haven't always been pleasant. In particular with thewheepeople, I fundamentally disagree with his reasons for disliking the film. So I admit to getting a bit heated at times when really, I think the reasoning is flawed.

But some people just don't, and won't, like certain things. I guess I have illogical dislikes of certain things as well.

Fact of the matter is, we don't need to end discussion on the film. If it's fun to do, it's fun to do.

But we need to learn to respect each other. I think the movie r0xx0rz, others think it suxx0rz. That's okay. Let's talk about what we like, dislike, or whatever, but we need to quit with attacking each other for our opinions. Nobody is better or worse than someone else for their opinion of a comic book film.

And yes, I think the X-Men films are better than the new Batman films

You're not worse than me for thinking otherwise.

I have never had a problem with people liking the movie Nell, never have, never will, I am glad there are people out there who can watch and enjoy, I know for a fact the discussions me and you have had over the years have NEVER once got heated, despite our opposing views. But with CERTAIN posters on here, its impossible for the discussion to NOT get heated, which is a shame as its never something I want to happen.

 

[NightCrawler]

on both films... as i said... its hard to treat movies to the fans of the comics.

With both X3 and Spidey 3... those were planned endings. I mentioned before that they try to make their movies a single movie because they don't know what reaction they'll get. They don't know if they'll get the greenlight again so they make a movie with an ending.

With X3... they tried to make it the end of the X-Men universe. THIS IS HOW IT ENDS in the movie's X-men universe. So, we're watching that not everyone will survive in the war. And that some would have taken the cure. In the sense that they destroyed the comics... they did so with the idea... "how would the comic end in this story"

Spidey 4 wasn't on Rami's list. He and Toby had said that they wanted to make the 3rd their last... things change so yes they're going on... but they wanted to make a story with and ending... once again... a main character falls.

I think its stupid they killed off Venom, which i TOTALLY felt had a spin-off coming which he fights to gain control of himself... almost as Peter had... but deeper and also having to fight Carnage. Thats for another thread tho.

Yes we all wish that X3 could have done something else... but thats what we got... we're spoiled and didn't want it to end... hence why we can't grasp the fact that this was suppossed to be the "end"

 

[X-Maniac]

Well I don't agree that the X-Men films are better than the recent Batman films. I feel X1 and X2 are somewhat on the level of BB and TDK. Both start out similar with their origin films and how they're good, but not great or a masterpiece. Then once the second film rolls around the directors really began focusing on their vision and created films that were and are critically acclaimed, box office hits, and etc.

I see where you are coming from although I think the X-Men and Batman franchises are very different. I prefer X-Men because I'm more of an X-Men fan but Nolan's film-making is more powerful and cinematic, Singer's more intimate and subtextual.

If the first X-Men had seen Xavier gathering a team from across the globe and if X2 had really focused on the necessity and tensions of the good and bad mutants being forced to join forces against Stryker, then we might be getting near the power of the Batman movies.

With that said, it's kind of hard for X-Men and Batman to be on the same level to some extent. Mainly because Batman is one character and you don't have to worry about seven or eight other characters you know? X-Men everyone wants to see the main characters get their time to shine. With as many characters as the X-Men someone is bound to get shortended on screen time and character development.

Totally agree. While the X-Men provide great variety (of characters, personalities, powers, action scenes) it does mean some will have to be sidelined and that therefore some fans will always be angry and disappointed.

As far as X3 is concerned? I still have my views on it. I believe we all agree it could've been a lot better and it deserved to have stronger development for the characters, more powerful emotion, and a final battle that could've been superior to something like Helms Deep or Braveheart.

Yep, it could have been better (as a film it needed more of Angel and Phoenix). But a final battle superior to Helms Deep is totally unrealistic. The first two movies never came anywhere near LoTR's first two films so there's no way the third one, with all its production headaches, could come near RoTK.

Now for me personally, I'm not singling anyone out, but for me as a fan of the comics, animated series, and the first two films I feel if I were to like X3 it would be accepting a mediocre product on MY part. I truly believe that a lot of it may have been the faults of fanboys too. We(including myself) went in with such high expectations that we were let down by our own perspectives.

There certainly were high expectations. Ironically, people were screaming for the stuff Singer hadn't included (Beast, Angel, Danger Room, Juggernaut etc) and then when they got it, they didn't want it and said they never wanted it.

Now there are certain films that deserve high expectations. For example The Dark Knight, the upcoming Watchmen, Terminator Salvation, Star Trek, and even Wolverine.

Perhaps, but it's unwise to get expectations too high. We're not always going to get what we want.

 

[The Batman]

I never understood the need for fanboys to see everything onscreen...one of the things im glad the flicks did is ignore all the complicated soap operas--i'm glad there was no shiar, or mystique being rogue and nightcrawlers parents, etc. The characters were better streamlined, and honestly, there wasnt a need to have in depth origin stories for everyone.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

^To be honest I have never heard about anyone complaining that the Shi'ar werent in the movies. Everybody knew they wouldnt have fit the one and I for one definately didnt want them to be in the 3rd movie.

 

[X-Maniac]

^To be honest I have never heard about anyone complaining that the Shi'ar werent in the movies. Everybody knew they wouldnt have fit the one and I for one definately didnt want them to be in the 3rd movie.

In the Ultimate X-Men comics, the Shiar is 'grounded' much more into a religious sect that wants to get to Jean, believing her to be an incarnation of the ancient god they worshipped. (as far as i can remember).

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

In the Ultimate X-Men comics, the Shiar is 'grounded' much more into a religious sect that wants to get to Jean, believing her to be an incarnation of the ancient god they worshipped. (as far as i can remember).

That could have worked, but I think they made the right decision to leave them out completely. Hell, the movie was too short for the storylines it did tackle let alone the ones it didnt, so they made a correct decision here IMO.

 

[Grommers]

I personally enjoyed x3 a lot more than the first two, I found it in better relation to the comics with there over the top story lines, and a great interpertation. Although a lot of characters were off, I felt the overall feel of the story was much more something the comics would produce. Which made me enjoy it more, as some of the characters on screen performances I felt were spot-on (Beast in particular).

Frankly I wish the first two stories were more inline with comics with the same sort of tone that Singer managed to grasp with some sort of realism. I just wish tehy had a 3rd director to work on character portrayal.

 

[Leenie]

She's a great actress, but ...Sigourney Weaver as Emma Frost?


Ok...

I think that would have been awesome, to be honest. I can totally see her acting that part well.

And I think that Weaver looks better than she ever did in her younger years. Plastic surgery or not, age has been really kind to her.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

^It just would have been nice to see the likes of Emma Frost rather than the likes of Quill and Arclight, who I dont think anybody was excited about seeing.

 

[EnDz0n3]

Honestly I actually would've preferred it if Omahyra, the girl (yes she was a girl LOL) who played Arclight, turned out to be Stacy X, as she was first cast to be...

Dania Ramirez's whole team was just plain annoying...

 

[X-Maniac]

Honestly I actually would've preferred it if Omahyra, the girl (yes she was a girl LOL) who played Arclight, turned out to be Stacy X, as she was first cast to be...

Dania Ramirez's whole team was just plain annoying...

I have a hard time believing that Omahyra was going to play a mutant prostitute. But it's possible.

Early script drafts did include Stacy X and also Scarlet Witch.

I'd have liked to see the electrical arcing effect retained, and enhanced into a blinding white light, when Arclight used her powers.

 

[EnDz0n3]

I have a hard time believing that Omahyra was going to play a mutant prostitute. But it's possible.

You have to admit though that Omahyra does look like StacyX, including her crocheted tanktop that created the illusion of scales.

 

[X-Maniac]

You have to admit though that Omahyra does look like StacyX, including her crocheted tanktop that created the illusion of scales.

Yes indeed... and, ironically, Stacy X was herself inspired by the movie version of Mystique.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

Didnt know were else to post this, but has anyone in the UK read the new issue of Total Film and the interview with Hugh?

He totally dodges a question about "the lacklustre reception to X-Men:the Last Stand."

 

[X-Maniac]

Didnt know were else to post this, but has anyone in the UK read the new issue of Total Film and the interview with Hugh?

He totally dodges a question about "the lacklustre reception to X-Men:the Last Stand."

I'll check that magazine out tomorrow....but it's worth bearing in mind:

1. I doubt HE felt the movie was lacklustre, he had top billing and got what he wanted out of it

2. The opening weekend for the film was incredible and record-breaking, not at all lacklustre

3. Even the film as a whole doesn't have a 'lacklustre' reception, it had a mixed reaction (which is fair enough) and bitterness has festered among hardcore fans in the period after the film, for various reasons such as what happened with Cyclops (and Rogue) and because the film was, in many ways, so conclusive and final - fanboys like to be left being able to imagine more, so they can obsess about possibilities endlessly with feverish anticipation.

You can see how tiny bits of information or milliseconds of footage are dissected on this forum (such as the Wolverine movie threads) - people love to be excited about what's coming. They don't like it when it seems to be over and when some characters have been written out.

Love it or loathe it, The Last Stand was intended to close off the trilogy and wrap up storylines. The mainstream aren't so bothered about that, but fanboys hate that because they are used to comic book storylines that always return to the status quo (no one ever really dies or whatever in comics, nothing stays final).

I'm sure Hugh is aware of online reactions but I am not surprised that, with his movie coming out in a couple of months, he is not entering into debate over the movie that spawned this spin-off. It would be dangerous ground to tread on. The Last Stand is part of the Blu-ray trilogy set being reissued as part of the promotional push for Wolverine so I can see why he might want to avoid being drawn into debate on the previous movies!