Superman Returns what u would do to improve superman returns.

retconned said:
It's nice to see that, besides being easy to please, your also a very smart person.

lol

You've been asked specifically what you would have done to improve the movie and all you've provided are vague answers about, "different directors" and such. Your remarks about that person's intelligence are not needed...what do you get out of putting down someone who likes the movie?
 
I liked the movie, but some changes I would make:
  1. Shorten it (2 1/2 hours is long, and I think some fat could have been trimmed)
  2. More screen time between Superman and Lex - there needed to be more of a climactic showdown between the two (besides the "beatdown")
  3. Explore Luthor's hatred for Superman in greater detail (he's clearly painted more evil than in previous movies, flesh it out)
  4. I know Singer had said the Krypton scenes didn't seem to fit the way he would have liked, but I have to believe if incorporated properly it could have helped support some of the prevalent themes of the movie (now if this was included, some others scenes would really need to be trimmed)
  5. I really liked the scenes with Routh as Clark Kent, and would have like to seen more of that persona.
There's probably more, but I could take just about any movie that I liked and think of something I might have done a bit differently (as seems to be the case with a lot of those in here :) )
 
i really dont understand how people can overlook the flaws in luthors scheme and the events after it.
how can people think that it worked well that the film completley ignored superman CARRIED A KRYPTONITE LACED ISLAND into space when 20 mins before hand he was powerless and getting his arse kicked by lex, on this same island. let alone that he had a kryptonite shard still in him. this event alone goes totally against everything we have been told about superman. and even what this movie led us to believe before this event. that superman is powerless on or near this island. yeah right. powerless enough to carry it into space. lol.
please explain to me your explanation to this massive flaw. its ruined the movie for me. that and the inclusion of superkid.
overall. the story was was a big letdown.
 
nogster said:
i really dont understand how people can overlook the flaws in luthors scheme and the events after it.
how can people think that it worked well that the film completley ignored superman CARRIED A KRYPTONITE LACED ISLAND into space when 20 mins before hand he was powerless and getting his arse kicked by lex, on this same island. let alone that he had a kryptonite shard still in him. this event alone goes totally against everything we have been told about superman. and even what this movie led us to believe before this event. that superman is powerless on or near this island. yeah right. powerless enough to carry it into space. lol.
please explain to me your explanation to this massive flaw. its ruined the movie for me. that and the inclusion of superkid.
overall. the story was was a big letdown.

Will is everything...
 
1st. Superman gets the girl, not cyclops. Stay in your own movie. :p

2nd. Lexcorp. Swindling some old woman out of her money IS all lex needed to do to get his cut in this whole film. Building the land was just extra and really didn't seem necessary nor make much sense (what do they eat, is there plumbing in krypto-island, where's the water, we need water you know, not to mention while that island's growing, the armies of the world would blow lex to hell). If he used the technology to build stuff in lexcorp like you said, that'd have been brilliant.

3rd. No superboy. no piano launching. no cutesy kid moments to endear him to the audience so they think he's a great addition. No sale here. he'll grow up to become superboy and take the emphasis off of superman. And it's too early for this. Let Superman settle his relationship with lois first. Show us how richard reacts to his son being superman's boy also. It'd have been interesting.

4th. About the relationship. I'm not clear on what they're trying to do to the superman/lois dynamic. Both have an undying love for each other. But both don't want to wreck the family she started with some guy who she once believed was the father of her child. I do get it. It's pretty interesting, but I forsee nothing more here than what we'd see on a day in dawson's creek. Lois is conflicted but the best answer's that she'd settle for supes... and it'd have been a fine ending if not for her kid probably being traumatized discovering he's a kryptonian kiling machine. He should be after all he saw in this. Richard will likely be erased from the picture at some point. I hope. I'd keep the focus more on Romance than tragedy of lost love. superman is not a jealous stalker either. I've never seen him portrayed like that until now.

5th. Kryptonite. Make it work correctly. Like some poster says, it's really a little unbelievable how its effects were downplayed here. Superman feels no pain from deadly kryptonite? There's a piece of it still in him and he can still fly and do hero stuff? (I read the argument about the size of the kryptonite being a factor in its intensity or concentration bla bla bla. When was that rule made? Haven't we seen kryptonite rings and even lana's necklace on smallville had a tiny rock that brought clark to his knees so I hope you understand why I think this. )His body doesn't splatter to pieces when he falls back to earth, the doctors can't poke a needle through his skin, and the defribrilater doesn't work. None of that would happen if kryptonite did what it's supposed to really do to superman.

6th. No young clark with glasses. That scene was the definition of superfluous.

7th. the suit. Make it look more like the comics. I'd sit and Read the comics in fact before touching the script. The S was there on the cape for years. Watching fleischer and STM to get a general idea of this huge history of supes doesn't count enough for me. superman's a lot more than fleischer's serials or donner's classic. Taking the cape s off and sticking it everywhere else, darkening colors to make it look less bold because that's how it looked in the old degraded badly colored fleischer dvds isn't what i'd do.

8th. Suspenseless action. Cut that out. No Titanic scene with lois, richard, and superboy would be in my movie, and no plane drop either. It was done better in STM with lois dying in the car while supes saved people elsewhere anyway. If you're going to do it again and try to build the same suspense, do it well. I wouldn't have superboy there so there'd be no chance of him breaking the door open and them all escaping. Like STM, i'd have shots of superman doing super things inter-cutting with the drowning.

9th. Passion of the clark. Make him fight back some instead of getting completely raped so we feel sorry for him. I'd actually leave parts of this out since I thought it was really tasteless shock value like the passion, but I see its good points too to show how superman can be an inspiration even when he's weak like the rest of us. I'd probably make it less intense, but keep the stabbing though.

10th. Teschmacher 2.0? No kitty for the new returns she can't act. I'd have a henchwoman who knew kung fu and was a better intellectual match for luthor. Well atleast there's no otis... except for jimmy. He's a lot like otis in this. I'd tone him down and make him question why clark left the bar.

11th. Make it clearer that jason used his flying powers to lift the plane.

12th. Superman flys off to find a big led sheet of metal to form into a shield for himself as he lifts krypton 2.

13th. Better dialogue. The kid's lines were stock kid stuff. some of the dialogue felt too bland, so spice it up a little. And don't re-use old lines from the 70s movie so blatantly, also redundantly. this one stuck in my head-> I'm always around? what meaning is implied with that. the movie shows us that you aren't so I didn't realy undestand. How about "I'll always love you" instead or "Tell Richard to go find his own woman."
Clark's dialogue's alright, mildmannered, dull, prettymuch who he is, but superman should be everything but that. routh's a little coy and stiff as supes. I'm not sure why i think this way. Maybe it's the suit. He did really well, I thought though. I'd only improve his suit and tell him to play supes more gentle but confident, more like the scene with the kid.

14th. Show people's reaction to his return. A few blank stares from onlookers and cheers from the audience show us people are in shock and astonishment, but where's the "Why the world doesn't need superman?" element besides lois' little tirade that won her a pulitzer.

Ok that's enough for now.
 
What would I do to improve Superman Returns? Simple. I'd make the movie about Superman. Not about Superman's supporting cast with Supes simply thrown in whenever someone needs to be rescued. All of these complaints about the ridiculousness of Lex's plan, the KID, the apparently pointless voyage to Krypton, etc. are all valid, but I could have overlooked all of them if I felt like I was watching a movie where Superman was the main character. Superman Returns was a good movie, but in a sense it was like a serious version of the Batman movies from the late 80's and 90's. In ALL of those films, the villains and the supporting cast, not Batman, were the main characters. Unfortunately, that's how SR turned out to be too, and that is why I'm not singing its praises like I was fully intending to do if I really liked the film.
 
Galactical said:
...11th. Make it clearer that jason used his flying powers to lift the plane...
He did? Really?

Jeeze. I missed that part as I was half asleep by the time that scene had played out.
rolleyes.gif


Nice list, btw. :up:
 
skruloos said:
The only thing I would do to improve the film is to make it more explicit that Luthor set up Superman's leaving for Krypton.

Everything else was handled well.
Co-Sign :up:
 
This just occurred to me...apparently Superman's telescopic vision can't reach far enough to just "see" if krypton is really still there?
 
AgentPat said:
He did? Really?

Jeeze. I missed that part as I was half asleep by the time that scene had played out.
rolleyes.gif


Nice list, btw. :up:

thanks, it's quite long film. Cutting some of the fat might have helped you and probably a lot of people remain engaged with it all the way through.
 
coast city said:
It's pretty clear that what Singer was trying to do was thematically and structurally replicate Superman the Movie with a fresh approach. Similar to Terminator 2 following the exact same structure of Terminator 1. Both sets of movies even have the same lines being repeated in the sequels. With this approach in mind, I would have done the full Krypton sequence, really fleshed out the Smalville part as well; with Superman really wrestling with his uncertainty over returning. In order to make room for this, I would have trimmed the Luthor bits. The same way Luthor isn't introduced until the 3rd act in STM, Lex shouldn't have appeared until Act 3 in SR. We don't need to see how he got his money or how he got the kryptonite. Beyond that, I wouldn't change much. I liked the story and the progression of the characters. I might've included a little more investigative journalism for Clark just to give CK more action. My 2 cents.

I concur...SR was still good, though.
 
well...
As much as love the film, my story would have been almost completely different.
Instead of growing the land from crystals, Lex learns from Jor-el that one of the crystals(a Purple one) contains a living supercomputer called Brainiac.
Lex uses his newly obtained fortune to develop a way to use it, but when he finally does, the technology he used begins to evolve, and the Humanoid Brainiac is born. It turns on Luthor, and sets about his plan to shrink Metropolis so he can study it and the Humans. Brainiac asks Luthor about the other crystals, because his record of the History of Krypton is incomplete, and it does not show how he arrived at Earth. Luthor offers him the Crystals, but asks for the only thing in return be Metropolis when Brainiac is done with it. Brainiac agrees, and absorves the crystals, learning that his record is incomplete because he was beginning to evolve, and beginning to take over parts of krypton. They put a stop to it, by severing the brainiac crystal from the part of Krypton he had taken over.
Pretty much all of the relationship stuff is intact. but the ending parts are different.
Brainiac creates a miniaturizing ray, from equipment Luthor had stored in a Warehouse in Nevada.
Then He, Luthor and crew hijack the spaceshuttle attached to lois' plane.
The reason that the plane doesn't seperate is because Luthor just doesn't care. Superman Returns, and Luthor is pissed. He sees him flying around, and screams and hollers the whole way up into space.
They dock with the International Space Station, Brainiac takes out the crew and begins to install the ray.
there are many more Rescues this time around, one with a Volcano in the Pacific.
During this rescue, Metropolis begins to shrink. Superman hears the screams and flies toward Metropolis, only to find it shrunk and covered with a glass jar. Then, it begins to rise into the air and float toward the space station.
Superman flies up, only to be met in space by Brainiac. They fight Luthor at the helm of the ray, shooting it at Superman. At the end of the fight, Superman tears Brainiac's head off(He's a robot, so no gore), and sends it flying deep into space. He docks in the station, beats up Luthor's thugs, and then confronts Luthor. Luthor has the Kryptonite dagger, because the Kryptonite they stole from the museum in the film was needed for the ray. He stabs Superman, then makes presses a button that makes the Space stations rockets force the station to loose it's orbit and crash into earth. He, Kitty and the thugs run toward the shuttle, and Kitty looks back as Superman writhes in pain. She rushes toward his side and pulls the dagger out. She then starts the sequence to make Metropolis big again and runs back to the Shuttle just before it takes off. Luthor screams at her, and the crash land on a large deserted island. Superman flies outside of the station, tears off the engines from the station and restores it's orbit. then Flies back down to metropolis,
He returns to a disastrous looking Metropolis. this time, Jason stopped a beam of steel from landing on Lois. During the film, we see Lois, Richard, Jason, Jimmy and Perry try to survive in Metropolis during an Earthquake caused by the city rising WITHOUT Superman to save the day.
same ending, except for the Death, But this time, Jason figures out Clark's secret, and tells Clark as he's babysitting him while Lois and Richard go out for lunch. Jason swears that he'll never tell. Then he tells him that he stopped a beam from landing on his mommy, Clark looks surprised, but knows that if he said anything about him being his son, he's worried that it might make Lois become more distant. So he does the whole speech in Jason's room.

AAAANNDDD....
That's how I would have done it.
 
SpeedballLives said:
well...
As much as love the film, my story would have been almost completely different.
Instead of growing the land from crystals, Lex learns from Jor-el that one of the crystals(a Purple one) contains a living supercomputer called Brainiac.
Lex uses his newly obtained fortune to develop a way to use it, but when he finally does, the technology he used begins to evolve, and the Humanoid Brainiac is born. It turns on Luthor, and sets about his plan to shrink Metropolis so he can study it and the Humans. Brainiac asks Luthor about the other crystals, because his record of the History of Krypton is incomplete, and it does not show how he arrived at Earth. Luthor offers him the Crystals, but asks for the only thing in return be Metropolis when Brainiac is done with it. Brainiac agrees, and absorves the crystals, learning that his record is incomplete because he was beginning to evolve, and beginning to take over parts of krypton. They put a stop to it, by severing the brainiac crystal from the part of Krypton he had taken over.
Pretty much all of the relationship stuff is intact. but the ending parts are different.
Brainiac creates a miniaturizing ray, from equipment Luthor had stored in a Warehouse in Nevada.
Then He, Luthor and crew hijack the spaceshuttle attached to lois' plane.
The reason that the plane doesn't seperate is because Luthor just doesn't care. Superman Returns, and Luthor is pissed. He sees him flying around, and screams and hollers the whole way up into space.
They dock with the International Space Station, Brainiac takes out the crew and begins to install the ray.
there are many more Rescues this time around, one with a Volcano in the Pacific.
During this rescue, Metropolis begins to shrink. Superman hears the screams and flies toward Metropolis, only to find it shrunk and covered with a glass jar. Then, it begins to rise into the air and float toward the space station.
Superman flies up, only to be met in space by Brainiac. They fight Luthor at the helm of the ray, shooting it at Superman. At the end of the fight, Superman tears Brainiac's head off(He's a robot, so no gore), and sends it flying deep into space. He docks in the station, beats up Luthor's thugs, and then confronts Luthor. Luthor has the Kryptonite dagger, because the Kryptonite they stole from the museum in the film was needed for the ray. He stabs Superman, then makes presses a button that makes the Space stations rockets force the station to loose it's orbit and crash into earth. He, Kitty and the thugs run toward the shuttle, and Kitty looks back as Superman writhes in pain. She rushes toward his side and pulls the dagger out. She then starts the sequence to make Metropolis big again and runs back to the Shuttle just before it takes off. Luthor screams at her, and the crash land on a large deserted island. Superman flies outside of the station, tears off the engines from the station and restores it's orbit. then Flies back down to metropolis,
He returns to a disastrous looking Metropolis. this time, Jason stopped a beam of steel from landing on Lois. During the film, we see Lois, Richard, Jason, Jimmy and Perry try to survive in Metropolis during an Earthquake caused by the city rising WITHOUT Superman to save the day.
same ending, except for the Death, But this time, Jason figures out Clark's secret, and tells Clark as he's babysitting him while Lois and Richard go out for lunch. Jason swears that he'll never tell. Then he tells him that he stopped a beam from landing on his mommy, Clark looks surprised, but knows that if he said anything about him being his son, he's worried that it might make Lois become more distant. So he does the whole speech in Jason's room.

AAAANNDDD....
That's how I would have done it.

Wow...that's some pretty good napkin plotting there. I wouldn't have minded seeing that. Pretty comic-like but I think it might've worked on screen...shrinking Metropolis just to study it seems a little too comic-like in my opinion to be a serious plot though. But then again...raising a rock continent to use for real estate purposes isn't too sound either.
 
No it made it through. that happened to me too some times. Must be a glitch.
 
nosebleed said:
Wow...that's some pretty good napkin plotting there. I wouldn't have minded seeing that. Pretty comic-like but I think it might've worked on screen...shrinking Metropolis just to study it seems a little too comic-like in my opinion to be a serious plot though. But then again...raising a rock continent to use for real estate purposes isn't too sound either.

I just like the whole thing with Brainiac shrinking cities so he can study human behaviors and emotions. There's just something very sinister and Machievellian there.
And one of Luthors' motivations to help Brainiac is because then he can say he owns Metropolis, and maybe use it against Superman if he returns(which he does).
The only reason he doesn't get Metropolis is because it never got inside the station in time.
 
nosebleed said:
You've been asked specifically what you would have done to improve the movie and all you've provided are vague answers about, "different directors" and such. Your remarks about that person's intelligence are not needed...what do you get out of putting down someone who likes the movie?

As far as movie idea's go, I live by the philosphy that anything I would, or could, create should be mine and mine alone. Im not going to posting idea's or scripts on this site.

As far as different directors go, I dunno, the usual picks are there. Steven Spielberg, James Cameron, Peter Jackson. Both Spielberg and Cameron have both expressed interest in doing a comic book based film one day, they would just want total creative control, which for some odd reason Singer and his wack pack recieved. And not to mention, I would take Jackson's King Kong over Singer's Superman any day, and thats sad as hell for me to say considering I love Superman. But Singer just made a boring, emotionally unsatisfying film that floating post-flush turds like Kal-El2006 enjoy because of the naive reason that Superman is flying again. Im a fan of Superman, but like I do everything else, I graded this movie on quality, and the film didn't have that much in both the dramatic and the action scenes.

As for other directors, I have some choices that some might refer to as out of left field, but so be it.
 
1. It would be an Origin film but Similar to the pilot of Lois And Clark . I'd begin the film in Smallville with Clark leaving behind Lana , Ma Kent and Pa Kent. The Guy who played Ben Hubbard could have played Johnathan . Afterwords he comes to Metropolis for the first time .

2. Parker Posey as Lois Lane , and Hugh Laurie as Perry . I know he was doing House but he would have made a great Perry White . I'd Keep Routh as Superman but his Clark would be normal . I'd keep the same Jimmy .

3. Lex Corp and Metallo with the guy who played the monk in Da Vinci Code as Corban.

4. Anthony Hopkins as Jor El . I think he would have elevated the film much as Brando did in Superman 1.

5. Set up Brainiac for Part 2 .
 
Oh, well, yeah. If I was making the film as well. It wouldn't be a sequel to Superman II
It would have been a new origin, With Krypton actually looking like Krypton(It looks like Earth, but much more advanced)
The Kents would be younger, like in Lois and Clark.
Pa Kent does not die, and never does in any future film.
I would have kept the same actors, Except for Ma Kent.
The first time Lois and Superman meet is the space plane rescue.
Luthor and Metallo are the villians, Luthor uses Metallo because he discovers his Kryptonite heart makes Superman weak.
 
there was A LOT of important material cut from the film. I'm curious to see it all when the dvd comes out. I think it was obvious that the film was going to be too long for most viewers, so some of this much needed stuff was cut. personally, i would eagerly watched it if the movie was 3 and a half hrs long. yes, there wasn't enough of the krypton stuff; yes, the whole smallville thing wasn't as well developed and interesting as it could have been; yes lex wasn't this and wasn't that and etc. etc. etc...
maybe it was just from the years of anticipation, maybe it was the power of the IMAX and 3D scenes; maybe it was the fact that i seemed to be in a theatre full of nerds like me - (people were clapping - yes - clapping. you could actually hear the universl gasping during some of the "big" stuff) BUT i have to say, i was pretty well sucked in throughout - yes, even during the first 30min. i mean, c'mon there is just SOOOO much ground to cover and so little time. i think overall, the film flowed well. i wouldn't change much. i think the ONLY thing i would HAVE to change if i had any say at all - and i don't - none of us do - ao we have to just suck it up and try to enjoy what we're given - is the hair. i would do something with that stupid, overdone curl on the front of his head. i mean the hair looks like a plastic wig or something.

-d
 
I would have kept the Smallville sceens, married Richard & Lois, and made Lex like the one from TAS.
 
Well. I would:

1) Remove "The kid" from the movie - completely

2) Cut the scenes of Superman spying on Lois n her fiancee

3) Include more dialogue, both for Clark, and Superman

4) More scenes with Ma Kent in Smallville

5) Give Lois more edge

6) Make Richard aware that Clark may have feelings for Lois

7) Simplify Lex's plan concerning New Krypton

8) Extended action sequences in IMAX

9) More Lois/Clark - Daily Planet scenes

10) Reduce the whole Emo-Superman aspects of the movie
 
Just one thing...the kid.

That is all.

For those of you "Bored" with this one...how did you sit through the original?
 
That-Guy said:
What would I do to improve Superman Returns? Simple. I'd make the movie about Superman. Not about Superman's supporting cast with Supes simply thrown in whenever someone needs to be rescued. All of these complaints about the ridiculousness of Lex's plan, the KID, the apparently pointless voyage to Krypton, etc. are all valid, but I could have overlooked all of them if I felt like I was watching a movie where Superman was the main character. Superman Returns was a good movie, but in a sense it was like a serious version of the Batman movies from the late 80's and 90's. In ALL of those films, the villains and the supporting cast, not Batman, were the main characters. Unfortunately, that's how SR turned out to be too, and that is why I'm not singing its praises like I was fully intending to do if I really liked the film.
Agreed,

Thats why Allstar Superman is one of the BEST Superman books ever!. Grant Morrison basically said he was writing a book about superman and he mentioned that most writers think Superman is too big to write about so they write AROUND him rather than about him.
They should fire Brian singer and hire Grant Morrison to write a new origin epic .
Superman Returns was such a bland and crappy movie. I really don't understand how anyone could find it exciting especially if they've read any of the books.
 
retconned said:
Thats good for you man. Atleast you know that while going through life, you will never be that disappointed seeing that you have set such low standards for perfection.

Here's to you, Kal :up:

Or maybe his standards are high and you are just a malcontent over the top fanboy?
 

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