Who can pull Robin and Nightwing out of the crap they've become?

[The Leaguer]

Beechen sucks.

So it has been declared, and so it is.

 

[CConn]

Given that the majority of his first arc was the Cassandra stuff and, beyond just the revelation that she's evil, she was horribly characterized and had motives that were flimsier than hotel toilet paper, I'd say he's pretty bad. I liked his first issue, which set up the first arc's mystery. I kind of liked his second issue, where Tim was investigating the mystery, but even that had some plot holes (like none of the other cops putting 2 and 2 together and realizing that the one straggler "cop" who was still in the building after it was evacuated looked exactly like Robin). Then the next issue came and everything went **** up.

Agreed, but the arc was only 4 issues wasn't it? So half of it was at least enjoyable. If he can stay away from these JMS-like screw-ups, he could write some pretty good stories, I think.

Also, has it ever been said whether the idea was his or his editor's? DC letting (basically) a rookie writer make change a giant character change seems pretty odd to me.

 

[Darthphere]

Agreed, but the arc was only 4 issues wasn't it? So half of it was at least enjoyable. If he can stay away from these JMS-like screw-ups, he could write some pretty good stories, I think.

Also, has it ever been said whether the idea was his or his editor's? DC letting (basically) a rookie writer make change a giant character change seems pretty odd to me.

Im pretty sure it was editorial. Either way the next arc looks promising.

 

[The Leaguer]

The problem with comparing him to JMS is that JMS has quite a few great stories under his belt, including his first few on Spider-Man. Beechen f***ed up right out of the gate.

 

[sethcohen]

he needs a majority vote... so far we have:
corp: he sucks
darth: he dont suck
leaguer: he done suck
me: im on the fence, but i still look forward to reading robin (unlike nightwing and flash) so ill give him a "dont suck"

thats 2-2

 

[The Leaguer]

I count as seven votes.

 

[Darthphere]

Woah woah! I never said he didnt suck, I just said hes not as bad as these cats make him out to be.

 

[Assassin]

lol, assin just got owned1

doesn't count when i'm not online dip****, i want my dc nation pin!

 

[CConn]

The problem with comparing him to JMS is that JMS has quite a few great stories under his belt, including his first few on Spider-Man.

Good? Sure. Great? Haha, no.

Beechen f***ed up right out of the gate.

If it was an editorial decision, what could Beechen do? Quit?

 

[snipe]

Oddly enough, as horrible as she was at Nightwing's solo book, she handled him awesome in Titans, and if DC would give her an Arsenal ongoing I would cream my pants, because shes the best at writing Roy.

Not to mention how awesome she handled everyone in Gotham Knights. She's the one who had Bruce formally adopt Dick.

 

[Hush]

Did anyone notice the little DC Nation thing in the back of all the Dc books this week with Dan Didio basically saying yeah I was stupid for trying to kill Nightwing I would have gone to hell so here is Marv Wolfman taking over writing him. I laughed outloud.

 

[The Leaguer]

Good? Sure. Great? Haha, no.
If it was an editorial decision, what could Beechen do? Quit?

He could have made it less crappy? It may have been an editorial decision to turn Cassie evil, but I doubt it was their decision to do it so badly. As others have said, the fact that Cassie turned isn't the only bad thing about the story: everything else about it sucked, too. Her motives, her characterization, her actions. They were all terrible.

What could Beechen have done? Not f*** up would have been nice.

 

[sethcohen]

at least shes still alive (conner) and not a sissy (bart)

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Small comfort when she's not really Cassandra anymore. At least Conner got to die a hero and Bart's obviously going to eventually be one again.

 

[sethcohen]

i dunno... i just dont feel like this is bart...wheres the eternal optimism? kid gets shot in the knee with a shotgun at 14 and hes still cracking jokes

 

[The Leaguer]

Then you have one up on Cassie fans, because we know this isn't Cassie.

 

[sethcohen]

i have to go back and read up on cassie... you guys all love her so im interested to see what i missed... any suggested reading?

 

[The Leaguer]

Yeah, read Batgirl. It's great. Start with the first four trades, A Knight Alone, Silent Running, Death Wish and Fists of Fury, in that order. Then the trades jump forward to the end of the series with Kicking Assassins, Robin/Batgirl: Fresh Blood and Destruction's Daughter. If you want to read her first appearance, read No Man's Land.

 

[Darthphere]

No, dont read No Man's Land.

 

[The Leaguer]

Shut up.

 

[Darthphere]

No.

 

[The Leaguer]

Yes.

 

[Darthphere]

Nein.

 

[The Leaguer]

Just do it.

 

[sethcohen]

mommy! daddy! stop the fighting! **hides in closet**