X-Men: The Last Stand - Scene By Scene

[XCX]

Why, when the characters and storylines never got respected by the film makers, or production company?

Stan Lee knows they respect the comics. He also knows the art of the director giving his take on it all. I admire him for his open mindedness.

 

[04nbod]

Stan Lee himself said though that some of his creations had not been handled well and as the gentleman he is said that the efforts were 'not of the highest quality'

 

[XCX]

Stan Lee himself said though that some of his creations had not been handled well and as the gentleman he is said that the efforts were 'not of the highest quality'

He has some qualms yes, but the point is hes much more rational than ive seen here. He comes back and helps the crew out from a comic perpective and gives his support by cameo-ing. Hes the wisest ambassador for comics imo and understands closer than the fans what film is about.

If that's your answer to my questions about the serious misgivings...

Those "misgivings" are as serious as monty python. If theres any disservice here, its the malnourished form that Brett forced onto x3. That not only slighted the rep of the comics, but most directly, it marred the franchises respectful presentation of these fantastic stories through live action films.

 

[Goddessreicho]

He has some qualms yes, but the point is hes much more rational than ive seen here. He comes back and helps the crew out from a comic perpective and gives his support by cameo-ing. Hes the wisest ambassador for comics imo and understands closer than the fans what film is about.



Those "misgivings" are as serious as monty python.

Now if The Man knows that something is wrong, that should tell you something.

Besides very much like Dark Phoenix is a favorite amongst so many, and that explains why there are many complaints with X3, God Loves is my favorite X-Story. So if they were going to do it, they should have done it right. They didn't. End of story. I shouldn't have felt like something was missing when the credits rolled. It's my money, and I will demand more. If people continue to bend over and accept crap, then crap will continue to be given them.

I'm no fan of crap. You apprently are. Good for you.

 

[XCX]

If people continue to bend over and accept crap, then crap will continue to be given them.

And that war must be fought not by people like yourself, but folks such as film minded fans.. to coax them to listen to critics more. What you say is true, but the issues with the film are not what is widely presented on this site.

 

[Goddessreicho]

You want to see near prefection and ignore the glaring holes, fine. I want a better film. I want a film that doesn't leave me felling empty and pissed off like the first two X-movies did. I don't ever want to leave a theater angry because I wasted my time. If I wanted an art film, I would see one. The best form of superhero drama I've seen has been on television. Heroes, 4400, Buffy...and that's sad.

As much as Batman Begins and Spiderman deviated from the books, I still had fun and didn't mind as much. Spiderman never once tried to be more than what it knew it was. There was no pretentiousness there. Batman took a page from Frank Miller and focused on the grit to begin with and it worked.

It didn't work for X-men. The shallow empty husks walking around the mansion never came across as epic or iconic. It was amazing how they appeared real and fake at the same time.

As to who appears in the movies. Claremont, the Dark Phoenix creator, was in X3... what did he have to say about the results?

 

[XCX]

Batman took a page from Frank Miller and focused on the grit to begin with and it worked.

The irony is whenever the fanatics get pleased they think the directors are appeasing them.. theyre not. It was sheer convenience. Batman Begins just so happened to, and was an astounding filmverse adaptation.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

13. The Church of Magneto – Oh yea, now we're talking. This is the kind of scene I was waiting for after seeing the trailer, and it totally delivered. Magneto's speech is wonderful. Although I would have preferred the version of it seen in the trailers, but what can ya do? The callback to Magneto's concentration camp days with his tattoo is brilliant. I absolutley love this scene all over the place.

14. Mystique on the truck – A good introduction to show us where Mystique is being held, and a nice little addition to her personality.

15. Meet Jimmy – More of everything I ever expected when seeing the trailer. Although I'm sure that there are safer places in the nation than Alcatraz, but whatever. Beast's reaction to his "normal" hand is pretty nice. For fans, it's a call back to what he would have been before he was blue (something we saw briefly in X2), for people who aren't in the know, it's still a nice piece to show his reaction to being "normal". This scene captures the tone of what this movie was supposed to be.

16. Alkali Lake I – The shot of Cyclops on the bike... Powell's theme blaring in the background, all of it just wreaks of something badass about to happen. Cyclops walking towards the lake, Jean's voice and presence getting stronger and stronger. Yup. Something badass is gonna happen. This scene is playing out just the way it should. The voices getting stronger. "Stop it. STOP!!!" *BLAST* YES!!! Wait... what's that? The water? Scott flies back. A light. It's... it's JEAN! (Who didn't see that one coming ) And then the scene goes horribly wrong.

"Jean?" "Scott?" "How?" "I dunno." "I wanna see your eyes." WHAT?! Random much? Nope, there is absolutley no possible way this is just being done to get Cyclops out of the way. "I can control it now." How do you know? Okay, the scene of them standing face to face, as she reaches for his glasses, we're back to how this should have been. Cyclops' optic blasts fading away, as they stare into each others' eyes and share a passionate kiss? Yea. That's how this was supposed to go. And then WHAT?! She gets evil and his skin bubbles. You have got to be ****ting me. This scene is so right on so many levels, and so wrong on so many levels. This scene is a perfect example of the movie on the whole; So right and so wrong, all at the same time. The lack of a Jean firebird doesn't bother me. But perhaps that's just because I'm not as big a fan of the Phoenix Saga as everyone else. This scene got so much right, and so much wrong, that I don't know how to feel about it.

17. Alkali Lake II – Okay, so we're starting to get back to what this movie was supposed to be. Let's forget about the "You don't want to be here" which is pretty random. The fog, the telekinetic activity, the creepy vibe... THIS is what this movie was supposed to be. Alright, so we're back on track here. Storm clears the fog, and the telekinetic activity becomes clear to everyone. Something is not right at Alkali Lake. Wolverine and Storm split up, and Wolverine finds Cyclops' glasses in a visually brilliant shot. The cry comes from Storm, and they find Jean alive. Everything about this scene is what this scene was supposed to be.

18. Examining Jean – A good explanation of what happened to Jean, but not enough of it. Her powers were subconcious, so Xavier put in blocks, and it made a part of her mind evil that he blocked off. She survived in a telekinetic cocoon (I buy that, didn't that happen in the comics?). And the personality called itself Phoenix. Okay, that's the part when I'm just like "wha...?!" There's no reason to call herself Phoenix, she just does it. Bleh. At least it's not a cosmic entity. However, the interaction between Xavier and Wolverine is nice. Xavier had to do what he had to do for the good of Jean, and everyone else. It was a hard decision, but he chose the lesser of 2 evils. And here comes Wolverine, who quite frankly, this is none of his business, and he's questioning Xavier? Xavier has every right to be pissed off, and doesn't come off as a dick at all. Wolverine's constant *****ing comes off as an *******. Although it does show that Xavier isn't a total goodie too shoes. Which works.

19. Angel’s Cure – Once again, a scene that did everything it was supposed to. Angel all grown up. His daddy wants to force the cure upon him, and he decides to be his own man and reject it. This scene is one of the many moments in this film that I waited 3 years for.

20. Magneto Rescues Mystique – Another scene that was everything is was supposed to be. Style and grace from Magneto as he nonchalantly destroys a mobile prison convoy to get to Mystique. Okay, so the way that Multiple Man and Juggernaut blindly followed Magneto's cause is a bit awkward. But everything else is brilliant. I like Juggernaut's intro. Mystique taking the cure dart for Magneto, and getting cured as a nice touch. Maybe it's because I hate Mystique and was pissed off when she survived Wolverine's claw in X-Men, and have been waiting for her to be out of the picture ever since. But I say good riddance. It also shows just how cold and brutal Magneto really can be. The way Mystique has been made up physically works brilliantly in this scene; being naked allowed her to be naked in this scene. And this isn't a perverted "I WANT BOOBIES!" thing. No longer mutant, Mystique is emotionally naked, and her lying naked on the floor brilliantly demonstrates that. I mean, it's the Rat-man, I'm sure he was just jumping at the chance to get Rebecca naked without the paint. But on an emotional and symbolic level, that scene works wonders.

21. Hank Resigns – So the cure has been weaponized. Motivation for Magneto. Reason for Hank to leave and go back to the X-Men, because now the war really is coming. Nice scene.

22. Logan and Jean – Once again, we have another scene that did everything is was supposed to. This scene shows the new dominance of the Phoenix over Jean, as we see Phoenix toying with Logan and his emotions and desires. When he realizes something is wrong, we see the torment and the struggle of Jean within herself. Unfortunatley, this is really the only time we get a sense of that struggle. Fortunatley for the rest of the movie, this scene deals with that struggle rather well, so even without the depth it needed, we are given a sense of what is at stake here. Jean has totally lost control of herself. It is another one of those scenes that promised to work a bit better in the trailer ("We can help you. We can fix it. We can make it like it was! Stay with me" works a bit better than what we got, but hey, what can you do?), but this scene still works brilliantly.

23. Magneto Plots – It gives a good indication of Magneto's sense of justification for his war. It also provides Magneto with the information of Jean's rising. And Magneto knows it's a good idea to have that on his side.

24. The Infirmary II – NOW Xavier comes off as an *******. "Jean? Where's Jean?" "What have you done?" "I think she killed Scott." "I warned you."

How did what you told Wolverine effect what Jean did before you told him?

Anyways... I guess Xavier does have cause to be pissed. Wolverine, once again, is putting his nose where it doesn't belong. And who knows what consequences may arrise now that he's agitated Jean and the Phoenix?

25. Jean’s House – Now this movie is where it needs to be. The stakes are high. Xavier is desperate to save his beloved pupil. And here's Magneto. The creepy aura of Alkali Lake is bumped up a notched with the shaking picture frames, the bubbling water cooler, etc... Xavier and Magneto's entrance into the house is nice. Xavier's interaction with Jean is splendid. He starts off, trying to ease her, and comfort her. But he must compete with Magneto, who is instigating her, until she finally loses control. A brilliant battle takes place; X-Men vs. Brotherhood, Xavier vs. Jean. All hell erupts. This movie promised epic events. This is the first of those epic events. John Powell's score takes the scene to another level. The whole scene is absolutley brilliant... except for the effects of Xavier blowing up into little bits. Didn't like that. I did like the way his clothes were shredded, and the way he skin began to peel. But the actual explosion, not so swell. Wolverine's struggle to get to Xavier is powerful, emotional. Magneto is in absolute shock at witnessing the destruction of his best friend. Jean is in a state of utter confussion and mental weakness, and Magneto preys upon that. Wolverine and Storm's reaction is very powerful. Although I doubt Wolverine would drop to his knees, but whatever, this was a very powerful moment. No need to ruin it so the guy can give off his macho man aura.

26. The Funeral – This part gets me nearly every time. This is one of the few moments where I buy Halle's performance. Or maybe it's seeing the emotion put in by everyone else. I dunno. But I tear up a bit everytime I see this scene. Wolverine is in character for one final moment as he stands on the balcony, isolated from everyone else. Savor it. We won't see much of Logan aka Wolverine from here on out.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

I'll finish with the rest later, possibly tonight.

 

[Goddessreicho]

Who said Nolan was trying to appease anyone? I believe that he knew the best Batman story was Dark Knight, and he knew that Miller got it right. So he put the two together.

Singer tried to do something new, and fell short. The script didn't help, and neither did the studio.

I am not the only who felt as though there was something missing in the first two films. They was! Personality, Character, things that made us love the X-men in the first place. X1 & X2 = blah, and bland, and damn near boring. how can you get the X-men and take out the personality. Whose bright idea was that?!!

X3 was just a jumbled mess. It had potential, it just went nowhere.

Scott: Goddess, how?

Goddessreicho: I dunno [shrug]

 

[XCX]

Who said Nolan was trying to appease anyone? I believe that he knew the best Batman story was Dark Knight, and he knew that Miller got it right. So he put the two together.

Who said that fans didnt think he was a "cool" director because he follows the comics? Hes a cool director because he knows how to make the realism filmverse style like nobodys business. The source material happened to be closer to recognizeable after the process was done, even though he took several stories and put them together much like any director, and so the fanatics rejoice as if they were thinking of them. The crew were thinking of good story, reguardless of source and it happened to be comics. With X-men its uber fantasy, an overwhelming amount more filtering to do, and so the stories look less like the comics. Its called random chance.

Nell, I respect many of your points but I do notice on other issues your partial unyielding loyalty to other sources

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

Nell, I respect many of your points but I do notice on other issues your partial unyielding loyalty to other sources

Hmm?

 

[XCX]

The comics... youre like a halfbreed with your povs lol filmverse/comicverse

And I also agree that Superman Returns was wondrous. Adding onto my previous post, good storys sources are found anywhere, not just comics.

 

[gambitfire]

Comic book movies that don't stay true to the source happen to do bad, those that do happen to do good stay true to the source, am i to believe that it's a giant coincidence(In some cases it may be). The reason these stories are being made into movies is because they where good and appealing to begin with.

Why make the unnecessary changes.........right because Wolverine sells.

 

[XCX]

The reason these stories are being made into movies is because they where good and appealing to begin with.

Why make the unnecessary changes.........

Because just like a comic author people favor, filmverse has its spin to make on them also. Theyre basically comic authors for a different medium. But youd respect writers of text bubbles over a director. Why should I respect comics then? Just a hypothetical question.

 

[La_She-Beast]

If I wanted an art film, I would see one. The best form of superhero drama I've seen has been on television. ?

Sorry, Goddess, I might have understood wrong... you don't want to see art in a superhero movie?

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

The comics... youre like a halfbreed with your povs lol filmverse/comicverse (Its XCharlieX BTW)

That's because I understand that the filmverse is different from the comicverse.

As long as the essence of the characters, and the foundation of the source material, is retained, I'm happy. I feel the X-Men movies did that.

Yes, there were deviations, but for 90% or so, I think it was spot on.

 

[Goddessreicho]

There's a difference between art in the film and art as the film. With Singer's superheroes the art is the film, there's very little else in the film. People love to say that there's subtly in them. But again there's a fine line between sublty and just not there at all.

One shouldn't have to look and look for substance. It should be there. In Singer's case, it isn't. Sure his films look great, but like many beautiful people, there isn't much else to them.

Just as Nell thinks that the "essance of the characters" is there, its actually not. Only three characters have similar personalities 90% of the time as the 2D counter parts, Logan, Charles, and Mags.

Everyone else got shortchanged. Scott didn't have much to work with cause he was overpwored by Wolverine, or he just wasn't there. So that left about 15 mins of a good Scott...sorry that's not good enough for me.

 

[gambitfire]

Because just like a comic author people favor, filmverse has its spin to make on them also. Theyre basically comic authors for a different medium. But youd respect writers of text bubbles over a director. Why should I respect comics then? Just a hypothetical question.

When the hell did i say that?

You love making bad assumptions don't you?

It's different medium that's fine but stories are stories and characters are characters when adapted yes they change but never should they change drastically otherwise what's the point in even given them the same title.

 

[La_She-Beast]

^^You mean he's superfitial? How would you fill that emptiness then? What would make you happy?

 

[Goddessreicho]

Psst... Gambitfire, he doesn't want to admit that the majority of the movie-verse is XINO.

 

[La_She-Beast]

I'm talking to you Reicho

 

[XCX]

Comic book movies that don't stay true to the source happen to do bad, those that do happen to do good stay true to the source, am i to believe that it's a giant coincidence(In some cases it may be).

It's different medium that's fine but stories are stories and characters are characters when adapted yes they change but never should they change drastically otherwise what's the point in even given them the same title.

Sometimes, the image of the comic book properties locks an audience into expecting very over the top, campy fun. So with some franchises, they have no choice but to deliver a film of such nature. This doesnt mean this view on adaptations is the "best" way to acheive it. There are two ways to go about it. The camp style usually more like the comics, despite silly debate: Fantastic 4, Spiderman etc. The filmverse style: batman begins, superman returns, hulk.

If there were directors who were simply told to always follow the same pattern of over the top and silly fun, there would definitely be a creative limit on behalf of the directors. There is another style that keeps things a bit more relatable to keep a different type of viewers attention, because there are millions of folks, me included that respond better to things more believable based. It brings out the texture and/or SUBSTANCE for these types, which to many people does far more compliment and pays the highest respect to the source than keeping it as is. There are bad tendencies in comics that the other style doesnt even acknowledge that is stomped out. It runs deep through the pages. That technique is used by many scifi/fiction directors (Cameron, Mctiernan, Singer, Nolan) and its a style that often clashes with comic fanatics (sans Begins etc), as it often alters things the director feels is appropriate, including character and story. Fanatics saying its not needed show ignorance and disrespect to the art, an obliviousness of whats really in their comics. This style shouldnt retire because a temporary trend says people want closer to comics. In other words, fanatics are narrow minded and dont care nor think of how various filmstyles work or if they have a right to exist. So the art is more important. This is where interests come into play. I choose films rights to practice in their own media. Others choose to ignore it for the sake of their "flawless" comic translation. Tough. Id force you types out before id force these talented directors styles out

Psst... Gambitfire, he doesn't want to admit that the majority of the movie-verse is XINO.

And thats a derogatory term for filmverse that is rubbish. XINO, CINO etc. Similarly, the flaw in this thinking is thinking catwoman sucked because it deviated from the comics.... it sucked because it sucked. Get it good. Scapegoats are ignorant.

 

[Goddessreicho]

^^You mean he's superfitial? How would you fill that emptiness then? What would make you happy?

Yea, that's what I'm trying to say. How would I fill it?

My rewrites are a place where I can do it. I would start with characterizations.

Scott would have story,and a long lost brother. Something more than Jean's arm, and what appears to be dead weight to her. He would have more to his personality than emo, and anal-ness. He would be great with numbers (cause he is) and maybe have a dirty joke ready at whim. I would make him more than "That Guy." Maybe he can be a musician when not teaching and fighting. Maybe that's how Jean fell for him. A camera pan of thier room would have been nice with a guitar in the corner. Maybe a line from Jean about how instead of falling in love with a look from Scott, she fell in love in with his voice.

Or maybe a funny line about Scott needing help with his laundry. Seeing only red, or everything with a red hue would make separating pink, reds, and whites diffucult.

All of this is actually in my rewrite.

Add on's should be not noticable and shouldn't take away from other characters. Best add on (scene) ever in a movie is a scene with Atticus and Scout in To Kill a Mockingbird. Atticus gives Scout a watch, and tells her a story about it. It was so good, and familiar. I couldn't tell that scene wasn't in the book. I read that novel so many times, and missed it.

Granted that's one of the best movies with one of the greatest actors, but that's what I'm talking about. If your going to do something, make sure to do it right, and make sure there's reason behind it.

I have more for more characters.

 

[Boba_Fett_123]

And thats a derogatory term for filmverse that is rubbish. XINO, CINO etc. Similarly, the flaw in this thinking is thinking catwoman sucked because it deviated from the comics.... it sucked because it sucked. Get it good. Scapegoats are ignorant.

If X3 were just a little worse, I could say the exact same thing. Also, knock it the **** off telling me that I can't appreciate the difference between the comics and the movies. I do. If I didn't, I'd have hated Singer's movies. Instead, X2 is my favorite comic movie. There's literal translation, and there's being faithful. X-Men and X2 are faithful, consistently (except with Storm, but I'm okay with Storm in the first two. She may be a different character, but at least she IS a character. X3 is a small role, blown up to give her more screen time). X3 is not consistently faithful. Several of the scenes are very faithful to the tone of the source and the previous films. But a lot of the scenes aren't faithful at all. A lot is technically wrong with this film, solely on a filmmaking basis.

Someone compared Jean's resurrection the scene in Psycho where Janet Leigh is killed. No comparison there, buddy. Hitchcock used cut aways and jump shots for artistic reasons. Ratner holds on Scott for I don't know why. And in Psycho, you do see the knife at some point. You see what Leigh is reacting to. Scott's reaction is very well acted, but it's not enough, because this is X-MEN 3. There are fan expectations which, yes, do need to be lived up to. The rules are different for comic book films.

The writing is objectively bad in many of the scenes. So is the acting. So is the direction. It has nothing to do with me being a fan of the comics, and everything to do with the fact that parts of this film are very bad. A lot of it is good, and some of it is pitch-perfect. But there's a lot wrong too, and I'll thank you to not simply discredit me because I don't have knowledge of the ****ing filmverse.