About the butler scene

[Jack O Lantern]

Is it that far out of left field. I mean let's just look at some things

1. Norman OsBourne is found on the floor of his living room with no recolation of the previous night. This happens to be the day after Mendel Stromm is murdered and the Goblin Suit/Glider is stolen
2. Immediately following this Norman begins to act strange including shouting at himself
3. Just as it is announced that the Oscorp board are selling to Quest Industries, runing Norman they are murdered by a guy wearing the Goblin suit. Norman is nowhere to be seen all day.
4. On the same night that Spider-Man saves Mary Jane and a bunch of kids from the Goblin, he turns up with the body of Norman, with a ginat stab wound in his mid-section. The Goblin is never seen again.
5. Harry begins to act like his father.
6. One day you return to the manison to find that the mirror in the livingroom has been smashed revealing a secret room filled with Goblin equipment, plus Harry is lying with half his face blown off.

Is it possible that he didn't always know but instead pieced all this together. I mean when you think about it he would have to be pretty dense not to.

 

[chaseter]

^But Bernerd always leaves for the night...ala SM2. Harry found his father dead...not Bernerd. Harry also finds his dad on the floor in SM1 not Bernerd. And the mirror was obviously replaced by Harry...so others wouldn't stumble in. Plus, Bernerd mentioned his dad only obsessed over his work, which means he was never home...which is why Bernerd took care of Harry because Norman was never there. It was dumb however you cut it and way out of left field.

 

[The Chris]

When was it said that he always leaves for the night. i only remember him doing that once in spidey 2?

 

[chaseter]

When was it said that he always leaves for the night. i only remember him doing that once in spidey 2?

Which coincedentally was his ONLY SCENE!

 

[Jack O Lantern]

^But Bernerd always leaves for the night...ala SM2. Harry found his father dead...not Bernerd.

Most of these incidents happened during the day and a lot were reported on

Harry also finds his dad on the floor in SM1 not Bernerd.

So if you found your father on the floor with no memory would you not tell the guy who was going to be looking after him all day? Cause i would

And the mirror was obviously replaced by Harry...so others wouldn't stumble in.

How was obviously replaced by Harry, we see them both standing in the room after his fight with Peter, and even if he did replace the mirror what did he do about his face.

Plus, Bernerd mentioned his dad only obsessed over his work, which means he was never home...which is why Bernerd took care of Harry because Norman was never there.

He can work from home, besides in spider-Man every seen in which Norman talks to the Goblin takes place during the day at his home.

 

[chaseter]

Most of these incidents happened during the day and a lot were reported on



So if you found your father on the floor with no memory would you not tell the guy who was going to be looking after him all day? Cause i would



How was obviously replaced by Harry, we see them both standing in the room after his fight with Peter, and even if he did replace the mirror what did he do about his face.



He can work from home, besides in spider-Man every seen in which Norman talks to the Goblin takes place during the day at his home.

I would call the doctor about my dad, not the Butler. Harry broke the mirror in SM2 and in SM3 it was fixed...it makes more sense that Harry replaced it, not Bernerd. And Norman only started spending more time at home because he lost his business contract, lost his company, and lost his life...so he killed those people. Plus his Goblin lair was at his house so it is kind of obvious he would spend time at his home after becoming the Goblin.

 

[weezerspider]

Who said the Butler didn't know? After all, he did tell Harry he cleaned Norman's wounds, So the Butler pretty much knew. He even said that Normans wounds were from his own glider. Also, the Butler said he had seen many strange things in the house. I thought it was pretty obvious that the butler found out that Norman was the goblin the night he died.

 

[Jack O Lantern]

I would call the doctor about my dad, not the Butler.

I'm sure he called a doctor but the doctor is only going to give him a check up, it's the butler who's going to be looking after him the rest of the day.

Harry broke the mirror in SM2 and in SM3 it was fixed...it makes more sense that Harry replaced it, not Bernerd.

i'm talking about when they break the mirror in SM 3 and Peter throws a bomb in harry's face. Who dou you think found him?

And Norman only started spending more time at home because he lost his business contract, lost his company, and lost his life...so he killed those people. Plus his Goblin lair was at his house so it is kind of obvious he would spend time at his home after becoming the Goblin.

Whats your point? The reason that he is at home doesn't matter, the only thing that does matter is that he is at home where bernard can see that he is acting strangly

 

[lordofthenerds]

Harry also finds his dad on the floor in SM1 not Bernerd.

Well, in his only scene in Spidey 1, Bernard did come in the room after Harry helped Norman get up. He was with the woman from Oscorp who informed Norman that the glider was stolen.

 

[Murder]

All in all the scene didn't ruin the movie for me, though I would have much rather liked it if Harry was just shown by himself and decides to go help Pete.

I mean the scene in SM2 where Harry throws the knife at the mirror when he's talking to Norman. Have that in 3 and he gets his stuff to go help Pete.

Oh and.. I don't mean become the Goblin then , he already is just you know decide for himself and show him saying no to his conflicted personal demons.

 

[chaseter]

Who said the Butler didn't know? After all, he did tell Harry he cleaned Norman's wounds, So the Butler pretty much knew. He even said that Normans wounds were from his own glider. Also, the Butler said he had seen many strange things in the house. I thought it was pretty obvious that the butler found out that Norman was the goblin the night he died.

All that you mentioned was from SM3, the scene that a lot people went WTF too. The problem with Bernerd is that he is a trivial character...having maybe 3 scenes total in SM1 and SM2...with less than 30 seconds of screen time. The only development, the only background, the only knowledge we have of him is that he is a long time butler to the Osborn family...that is it. Yet in SM3...he delivers a huge plot moment, a scene that ultimately changed the course of the third act's fight scene and delivered a lot of drama to the dialogue between himself and Harry. Had Bernerd been in more scenes in SM1 and SM2...to set up his character, then it would have been alright. But he didn't. They didn't even develop the man in SM3...until that moment. It was just all hoaky and convenient for that to happen. If Peter, the guy that was Harry's best friend, couldn't convince him, hell...even Mary Jane being in peril couldn't convince him to go to help save her...yet he gave Peter the information he needed in SM2 to help save MJ from Doc Ock, just right after he found out Peter killed his father. It just came out of left field and all of a sudden.

 

[chaseter]

Well, in his only scene in Spidey 1, Bernard did come in the room after Harry helped Norman get up. He was with the woman from Oscorp who informed Norman that the glider was stolen.

Which you can reason that Bernerd let the lady into the house and took her to where Norman was...that is what butlers do. I mean that was his only scene in SM1 and his only scene in SM2 he said "Your father only obsessed over his work." THAT IS IT! Yet in SM3 he delivers a huge bit of information that changes the whole dynamic of the third act.

 

[Vile]

Who said the Butler didn't know? After all, he did tell Harry he cleaned Norman's wounds, So the Butler pretty much knew. He even said that Normans wounds were from his own glider. Also, the Butler said he had seen many strange things in the house. I thought it was pretty obvious that the butler found out that Norman was the goblin the night he died.

1: Who cares if he did clean his wounds. That tells him....what? He was stabbed. Thats about it.

2: How would Bernard the butler even KNOW about the blades in the glider?

3: How would he know what kind of wound they would make?

4: How could he POSSIBLY know it was 'caused by Norman's own hand'.

DOES. NOT. MAKE. SENSE.

 

[chaseter]

1: Who cares if he did clean his wounds. That tells him....what? He was stabbed. Thats about it.

2: How would Bernard the butler even KNOW about the blades in the glider?

3: How would he know what kind of wound they would make?

4: How could he POSSIBLY know it was 'caused by Norman's own hand'.

DOES. NOT. MAKE. SENSE.

Never thought of that and it pisses me off even more. How the hell does he know Spider-Man didn't really do it! Sure he probably assumed Norman did it to himself but he doesn't know for sure...he wasn't there and the only two people there didn't tell him what happened.

 

[Vile]

THANK YOU!

That pretty much sums it up, folks. I think it would have been better if Raimi had Harry search his own damn heart and find forgiveness...I mean, Pete's only been telling him for 2 and half movies right?

 

[webhead731]

When Harry found his dad the morning after the accident in the first one, the butler was there.

Still, the scene in SM3 needed to be explained more.

I like how in the first one Harry hears weird laughs coming from his father's room and then really never thinks anything of it.

 

[webhead731]

1: Who cares if he did clean his wounds. That tells him....what? He was stabbed. Thats about it.

2: How would Bernard the butler even KNOW about the blades in the glider?

3: How would he know what kind of wound they would make?

4: How could he POSSIBLY know it was 'caused by Norman's own hand'.

DOES. NOT. MAKE. SENSE.

It all makes sense! Especially #2!!!!

BERNERD IS THE HOBGOBLIN!

 

[chaseter]

^Bernerd is the Hobgoblin! He will team up with Aunt Carnage and wreak havok in NYC!!!

 

[webhead731]

DUDE! YOU IDIOT! YOU JUST SPOILED ALL OF SPIDER-MAN 4! NOW EVERYONE KNOWS!














Aunt Carnage>BernerdGoblin

 

[Jack O Lantern]

1: Who cares if he did clean his wounds. That tells him....what? He was stabbed. Thats about it.

2: How would Bernard the butler even KNOW about the blades in the glider?

3: How would he know what kind of wound they would make?

It's called not being the dumbass. Norman is brought home, by Spider-Man, dead, the same night that Spider-Man fought the Goblin on the bridge. The Goblin is never seen again. Then years later Bernard arrives at the mansion to find Harry with half a face in a room with Goblin suits and equipment. He puts it together.

4: How could he POSSIBLY know it was 'caused by Norman's own hand'.

DOES. NOT. MAKE. SENSE.

I could be wrong but I'm pretty sure that Bernard says "He was killed by his own glider." Not hand.

Is it that unbelieveable that he could have put everything together after he finds out that Harry is the new goblin.

 

[Robotchicken]

^Bernerd is the Hobgoblin! He will team up with Aunt Carnage and wreak havok in NYC!!!

ROFL!





not another shh board fad...lol
we definently need a manip, lol

 

[webhead731]

I'd do one but I just woke up and I'm lazy.

I've made two Aunt Carnage manips in the past if you wanna see them but that's all so far.

 

[Vile]

It's called not being the dumbass. Norman is brought home, by Spider-Man, dead, the same night that Spider-Man fought the Goblin on the bridge. The Goblin is never seen again. Then years later Bernard arrives at the mansion to find Harry with half a face in a room with Goblin suits and equipment. He puts it together.



I could be wrong but I'm pretty sure that Bernard says "He was killed by his own glider." Not hand.

Is it that unbelieveable that he could have put everything together after he finds out that Harry is the new goblin.

Yes, it is unbelieveable - If he puts it together by walking in on Harry in the goblin lair, that still doesnt explain how he knows the glider has blades, what the blades look like/what kind of wound they make....or AGAIN....That NORMAN was KILLED by his **OWN** glider.

He can't possibly know those things - could he have figured out that Norman was the goblin? Yes, no, WHO cares! Thats not the point! Since Bernard is a member of CSI for all he knows Spidey could have pulled a Venom and impaled Norman on the glider himself...he has NO working knowledge of the glider, and can't possibly know that Norman was killed by it...by his own hand. Even if he COULD magically read wounds, those still wouldnt tell him that.

Knowing Norman is the Goblin is secondary. The facts dont change.

t:

 

[Jack O Lantern]

Yes, it is unbelieveable - If he puts it together by walking in on Harry in the goblin lair, that still doesnt explain how he knows the glider has blades, what the blades look like/what kind of wound they make....or AGAIN....That NORMAN was KILLED by his **OWN** glider.

He can't possibly know those things - could he have figured out that Norman was the goblin? Yes, no, WHO cares! Thats not the point! Since Bernard is a member of CSI for all he knows Spidey could have pulled a Venom and impaled Norman on the glider himself

But he doesn't say spider-man didn't kill him.

...he has NO working knowledge of the glider, and can't possibly know that Norman was killed by it...by his own hand. Even if he COULD magically read wounds, those still wouldnt tell him that.

Norman had a glider in the liar. And you don't think that this would leave a distinctive mark

 

[Spider-Fan83]

ROFL!





not another shh board fad...lol
we definently need a manip, lol

LOL