The Force Awakens Adam Driver as Kylo Ren - Part 1

[Joefixit]

Ehhh, now you lost me. Much like Midichlorians being retconned by word of mouth, I don't buy into Anakin being conceived as Immaculate Conception by the Force. I'm more willing to bet he was conceived by a Jedi/ Sith, that Mind Tricked Shimi afterwords. Be it Qui-Jon or Palpatine on a layover 9 years prior.

This pops up when you do a search on it:


Darth Vader began life as Anakin Skywalker, a young slave from Tatooine skilled in piloting and strong in the Force. Anakin's very origins are mysterious. His mother, Shmi, revealed that there was no biological father.

This is from wiki:

In Star Wars Episode I: The Phantom Menace (1999), Anakin Skywalker appears as a nine-year-old slave. Raised on the planet Tatooine by his mother Shmi, Anakin has no father.[23] A gifted pilot and engineer


Not to mention it was in the first prequel which are still considered canon.. That was the entire story of Star Wars .. The rise fall and redemption of Anakin Skywalker, and that's part of his story.. It is cannon. He has no father, he Concieved from the force itself .. Which is why Star Wars continues to be about the skywalkers , who are more powerful in the force than any Jedi before or since.

 

[jaqua99]

This pops up when you do a search on it:


Darth Vader began life as Anakin Skywalker, a young slave from Tatooine skilled in piloting and strong in the Force. Anakin's very origins are mysterious. His mother, Shmi, revealed that there was no biological father.

This is from wiki:

In Star Wars Episode I: The Phantom Menace (1999), Anakin Skywalker appears as a nine-year-old slave. Raised on the planet Tatooine by his mother Shmi, Anakin has no father.[23] A gifted pilot and engineer


Not to mention it was in the first prequel which are still considered canon.. That was the entire story of Star Wars .. The rise fall and redemption of Anakin Skywalker, and that's part of his story.. It is cannon. He has no father, he Concieved from the force itself .. Which is why Star Wars continues to be about the skywalkers , who are more powerful in the force than any Jedi before or since.

Beautiful, very well said, much better than I could. Thank you.

Anakin started it all. Which is why I personally can get behind the Plagueis idea if he's responsible for him. Eh, I dunno how I feel about that when I start rationalizing.

But it's for the reasons you've stated, that I feel Rey has to be Luke's daughter. It's always about the Skywalkers

 

[Jostru]

Beautiful, very well said, much better than I could. Thank you.

Anakin started it all. Which is why I personally can get behind the Plagueis idea if he's responsible for him. Eh, I dunno how I feel about that when I start rationalizing.

But it's for the reasons you've stated, that I feel Rey has to be Luke's daughter. It's always about the Skywalkers

Get out.

Anyway, I absolutely hate the idea of Anakin having no father and being "conceived by the Force itself". It pretty much makes Anakin the Star Wars version of Jesus. I don't want to offend religious people here, but it's goddamn ridiculous.

 

[Marvolo]

Get out.

Anyway, I absolutely hate the idea of Anakin having no father and being "conceived by the Force itself". It pretty much makes Anakin the Star Wars version of Jesus. I don't want to offend religious people here, but it's goddamn ridiculous.

Yeah and magical space wizards totally isnt ridiculous.

You don't like it because it reminds you of a myth that's connected to religion which you clearly have a disdain for. You know that Jesus isn't the only mythological figure that was born without a human father, right? All throughout mythology are beings born in a similar manner. And star wars is a mythology. That's why "A long time ago in a galaxy far far away..." is at the beginning of every star wars episode. Star wars has always been fantasy and had a mythological bent to it. So a magical energy that binds the universe together and can be manipulated by space wizards manifesting itself in a physical being is hardly outline with the nature of star wars. If it makes it easier for you to swallow just remember that star wars is a myth in itself and a fatherless being is a mythological trope that predates Jesus by thousands of years.

Also, you should watch the Mortis arc in The Clone wars. In those episodes, Anakin, Obi, and Ahsoka discover a planet that's in a temporal void outside of regular space and time. On the planet they discover three beings made up of the Force. The Force manifests itself in the Father, the Daughter (lightside) and the Son (Darkside). What they are exactly isn't said, but they are basically gods. An example of their power: The Father holds an entire planet together outside of space and time with his mind. Anakin is likewise a manifestation of the Force itself. He was balance and was meant to balance the Force and that's why he was brought into being. Had he not been injured and corrupted he could have been the most powerful being in the universe because he was a creation of the Force itself. He was like a focal point of sorts.

 

[BatLobster]

I always found it kind of odd that people took such exception to the idea of a Christ parallel being baked in along with the plethora of other influences. It's a modern myth full of ideas from various culures ans traditions. There have been religious undertones and interpretations to the saga from the beginning.

It's not laid on nearly as thick in Star Wars as it's been in other films like The Matrix, Children of Men, Man of Steel etc. It's also not like Anakin was meant to be a direct Christ metaphor anyway, as he ends up falling to the dark side. He's a failed messianic figure. His failure has consequences for the whole galaxy and helps usher in an age of darkness. It's ultimately a subversion of the chosen one trope. Yes, he tries to make things right in the end, but ultimately Anakin is a tragic figure. Had he made better choices it could have been a much different story with a happier ending.

Back to Kylo, I do think it's interesting that the evil part of Anakin/Vader's legacy is still causing problems for the galaxy.

 

[jaqua99]

Get out.

Anyway, I absolutely hate the idea of Anakin having no father and being "conceived by the Force itself". It pretty much makes Anakin the Star Wars version of Jesus. I don't want to offend religious people here, but it's goddamn ridiculous.

Boo hoo 😋 Ultimately, who cares.

But anyway, I feel you may be just rationalizing your frustration with the Anakin/Jesus thing. I never thought he felt like a Star Wars Jesus. All it is, is his origins which are almost irrelevant to the character arc itself. It's about the rise and fall of Anakin; I see nothing religious about it, personally. And again, like it or not, it's canon, it's not an idea, it's canon

 

[Mad Ones]

Thinking of Vader in ANH as a failed messianic figure is rediculous to me.

 

[BatLobster]

ANH Vader is barely developed. It's kind of a stretch to think of him as Luke or especially Leia's father in that movie too. Vader doesn't really start to get pathos until Empire.

 

[Superwoman Prime]

His psychotic tantrums were awesome. He comes across as though he'd still be a deeply disturbed person had he been born without Force sensitivity.

 

[Golgo-13]

ANH Vader is barely developed. It's kind of a stretch to think of him as Luke or especially Leia's father in that movie too. Vader doesn't really start to get pathos until Empire.

I think this is one of the many reasons why 'Empire' is considered the best in the franchise as it's very Vader-centric movie.

 

[Loki882]

Yeah I've said that Kylo here is a more INTERESTING villain than ANH Vader, and I stand by that. ANH Vader is kind of like Darth Maul in TPM (well he had a bit more character, and more screentime than Maul, but the basic point still stands). A cool/scary-looking guy who was like a force of nature (no pun intended) and who was mostly there to menace the heroes. He has little actual character in ANH. All of his interesting character development happens in ESB and ROTJ.

Kylo, by comparison, is ALREADY an interesting/complicated character. And I suspect that he will end up being even more so as we move forward.

And yes, I to HATE the idea of "Space Messiah" Anakin, I feel like Lucas let the fandom dictate that too much. Vader in the OT was simple a powerful/respected Jedi who was seduced by power and became a cool villain. But he wasn't the be all end all of everything, just a part of a bigger story. But the fans love Vader, and think that he was awesome, and so Lucas ran with that in the PT (where he becomes the center of the freaking universe). To the detriment of other, potentially much more interesting things imo.

 

[Hotwire]

I just want to say, I was impressed with Adam Driver's ability to convey emotion with that heavy helmet on. (They really went out of their way to say it was heavy the two times he takes it off.)

 

[NoLaNitE007]

So did Kylo save Rey from being slaughtered in Lukes Jedi Academy ?? Hmm.....

 

[smappy45]

I imagine Kylo and Rey had a brother and sister relationship back in the Jedi academy days, even if they're just cousins or not related at all. The way he react to her, there was something different.

 

[godisawesome]

Here's a different question; exactly how do you guys envision Kylo's betrayal of Luke's fledgling order, especially in comparison to Anakin's betrayal of the Old Jedi Order?

According to Pablo Hidalgo, Ben only recently betrayed the Jedi Order, supposedly even well after Rey was left on Jakku. And considering his level of inexperience and immature combat skill, it seems highly unlikely he'd actually defeat Luke if they had any kind of face-to-face confrontation, and supposedly that flashback of him killing that guy in the rain isn't the attack on the temple either, so he might not have even had the Knights of Ren backing him up.

I'm thinking that the majority of his betrayal was just by joining Snoke and giving away Luke's academy's location, leading to a First Order strike where he probably got his hands dirty with some of his fellow students' blood, followed by leading the Knights in destroying any escaping academics.

 

[FlareKnight]

Yeah, I'm going to go with the stance of....I hate this character's existence. It has nothing to do with him killing Han, I just think he sucks as a character.

Oh joy he has some complexity and depth....and they couldn't have done that in a way that made him at least interesting? What am I supposed to care about with this poor-man's Loki? I get that they did exactly what they set out with this guy and did him well in that respect. But say someone crafts a really nice pile of garbage. No matter how well done it is....it's still a pile of garbage.

I'm not even sure this guy is actually particularly powerful in the force. He just happens to have some force ability because of lineage. How is this guy even going to be the #2 villain of the movie? A bit of training isn't going to salvage this guy as a villain. The only things I see him capable of killing are inanimate objects, old people that refuse to move....and that's about it.

As far as I'm concerned he's the biggest black mark on this new series of movies being any good.

 

[Mad Ones]

I liked him because it was interesting seeing someone struggle against being seduced by the light side of the force. The movies are always so concerned with the opposite so I thought this was refreshing. I could have easily hated him but Driver's performance sold it.

 

[smappy45]

I love the fact that Kylo Ren is phenomenally controversial among the fans. They should really make Spaceballs: Episode II with emo Kylo as the lead.

 

[Hotwire]

I imagine Kylo and Rey had a brother and sister relationship back in the Jedi academy days, even if they're just cousins or not related at all. The way he react to her, there was something different.

I'm thinking Rey is his little sister and that she's way more powerful than him. He's obviously for a lot of young Anakin in him so, that would easily spark jealousy and fears of inadequacy. The perfect tools for Snoke to use to turn him.

As for the reason he doesn't recognize her, she was taken away and hidden when he betrayed Luke and her memory was somehow wiped. So, Ben hadn't seen her close to 10 years and she doesn't even know who she is.

 

[Pecola1]

I felt that he was un-intimidating. He was intimidating with the mask on, but once he took it off he looked like he was just some guy... idk... he also reminded me of Snape...

Spoiler

And he looked nothing like Leia or Hans Olo. Also, was he named after Obi Wan? Ben? (As Han would have known Obi as Ol' Ben) Not to mention the scene where he killed Han, that was really interesting how they had the whole "Part of me hurts and I need your help getting rid of it" Did anyone actually think that he wanted help turning light though? He had already mentioned before that he would have no trouble killing Han just because he is his father. But it just seemed... normal?

The actor had no emotions... Even after killing his dad, there was no regret or sorrow in his face, but also no rejoice or sinister smile. It was as if instead of being an evil psychopath, he was merely a sociopath. He felt nothing when killing. He didn't feel good when he killed, but felt no bad. That's the main problem I had with the actor, he had no clear emotions. Heck... I only remember him being angry, but that was with his mask ON. He showed more emotions when you couldn't see his face?

 

[terry78]

He's supposed to act cold, in order to gain power. That's what he was told.

 

[JtheDreamer]

I felt that he was un-intimidating. He was intimidating with the mask on, but once he took it off he looked like he was just some guy... idk...

Yup. The moment he took the helmet off, it killed it for me.

 

[kickass]

Nope, the moment he took the helmet off I was able to sympathize with him on a more human level and right then and there I knew Kylo was going to be kept for the next 2 movies. It seems to me people have a problem with the character not being what they want him to be, versus appreciating what he actually is and has the potential to become.

All of my friends thought he was awesome, and had more depth than they were expecting. He isn't "emo", not everyone who is emotionally conflicted is "emo", that's just a term thrown around by people who don't know how to describe something they don't understand. A lot of the people complaining about him sound more "emo" than anything he did in the movie lol.

Kylo is still a rookie and has much to learn, that we are all aware of by what happens (and what is said) in this movie. Based on who Kylo Ren is now at this stage in his life in TFA, how can anyone not be excited or cuurious to see how he grows and develops in the next Episode? I would suspect after Snoke trains him and brainwashes him some more, he'll be even more of a force to reckon with in EP 8. OR he might be even more conflicted. Who knows, all I know is if I was the next writer or director of the film and they handed the character of Kylo Ren to me and said "It's your turn now. You can do what you want with him" I would be ecstatic.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

Nope, the moment he took the helmet off I was able to sympathize with him on a more human level and right then and there I knew Kylo was going to be kept for the next 2 movies. It seems to me people have a problem with the character not being what they want him to be, versus appreciating what he actually is and has the potential to become.

All of my friends thought he was awesome, and had more depth than they were expecting. He isn't "emo", not every who is emotionally conflicted is "emo", that's just a term thrown around by people who don't know how to describe something they don't understand. A lot of the people complaining about him sound more "emo" than anything he did in the movie lol.

Kylo is still a rookie and has much to learn, that we are all aware of by what happens (and what is said) in this movie. Based on who Kylo Ren is now at this stage in his life in TFA, how can anyone not be excited or cuurious to see how he grows and develops in the next Episode? I would suspect after Snoke trains him and brainwashes him some more, he'll be even more of a force to reckon with in EP 8. OR he might be even more conflicted. Who knows, all I know is if I was the next writer or director of the film and they handed the character of Kylo Ren to me and said "It's your turn now. You can do what you want with him" I would be ecstatic.

Agreed, thought he was an awesome villain and I can't wait to see where he goes next.

 

[GuestStar2004]

I honestly think the intention was to show some of anakin in kylo