BvS Batman or Superman: Which do you prefer?

I'm just happy that the material for both characters is being handled like it is.

I think we are in for a treat...I just hope the world is ready for it !

Some people I talk to , surprisingly, to me, prefer the old ways, meaning, that they wanted a repeat of the past in tone and presentation. They also prefer the Roger Moore 007 over Craig... which tells you something. Moore's Bond was "fun" for the times but wouldn't fly now, IMO.

I see no reason to rehash exactly what came before and I for one am glad they chose this new path to explore.
 
Yeah that's the problem with icons there's some much history to pull from. There's been great stories, bad stories and down right mediocre stories.
 
So are we circling back to the "Superman sucks after 1985" argument again? I think the problem with that perception is that the character has appeared SO many times in comics and has been represented by so many different artists and writers. When you're depicted that often and in that many varieties, it's easy to point to all of the stories you didn't like as "proof" that the character is now written poorly. There are just as many bad silver and golden age stories as there are modern age ones. It's just as easy to make fun of Superman dragging planets behind him on a giant chain in the silver age as it is to make fun of the way John Byrne wrote him.

It can be argued Batman has had far more variety over the years, so I don't think that's the sole contributor. A bigger influence is likely how inconsistent and how rare great Superman stories can be found in any given era.

Writers seem to have had an easier time adapting Batman for modern audiences.
 
^ Exactly.

I recently tried rereading John Bryne's run. I ended up becoming so bored with it, that I moved on to something else. This run is one of, if not the definitive runs for modern Superman, not just some bad story.

Batman has been a jerk in good stories,and in bad ones. Doesn't mean Batjerk is valid to me, or as equally valid as 70's Batman. Same thing with Post-85 Superman. Even though there are a few great modern Superman stories, I still think much of modern Superman is inferior, especially on a conceptual level.
 
Last edited:
I think the problem with that perception is that the character has appeared SO many times in comics and has been represented by so many different artists and writers. When you're depicted that often and in that many varieties, it's easy to point to all of the stories you didn't like as "proof" that the character is now written poorly.

Speaking only for myself here but I've read so many superman comics (in both english and arabic) ranging from the golden to silver to bronze and finally post crisis eras and I comfortably concluded that good superman stories are sadly rare while great ones are an exception to the rule.


Some people I talk to , surprisingly, to me, prefer the old ways, meaning, that they wanted a repeat of the past in tone and presentation. They also prefer the Roger Moore 007 over Craig... which tells you something. Moore's Bond was "fun" for the times but wouldn't fly now, IMO.

I see no reason to rehash exactly what came before and I for one am glad they chose this new path to explore.

I don't want you guys to get me wrong here, I like the bronze age stories in a "it's so silly it's actually fun" sort of way but no way in hell would I want that kind of story telling now because it simply does NOT work.
With saying that however I do miss some aspects of that era's superman namely his great intellect, I miss that more than anything!
Superman to me has always been a thinker, somebody who gets around almost impossible situations because of his great mind, not just his superpowers but when Byrne revamped the character he took away that aspect of the character and I always resented his take because of it.

One of the reasons why I liked the STAS take so much was because supes was remarkably smart in that show, possibly due to the fact that he was so depowered that he had to rely on his brain more often.
The STAS superman was so smart infact that he showed up Batman in the world's finest and in the demon reborn episode batman begrudgingly admitted that superman's quick thinking surprised even him.

Intellect is in my opinion the most attractive quality about a character and it's one of the major reasons why Batman is so appealing to so many people, because while the audience know he'll pull through and win everytime they'll still stuck around to find out just how he'll do it.
It's for that reason that I love Shelock Holmes so much and why I loved superman as a kid when I read those old bronze age issues.
Now however superman doesn't use to his mind because the writers don't use theirs; a continent made of krpytonite? no prob! Superman just powers up alittle bit and comes down and LIFTS the whole thing, kryptonite and all!
An antigravity beam pinning him to the ground while being weakened by krptonian atmosphere? Again no biggie, superman will just shout like a viking and torpedo the thing with abit of an effort, and it's because of that the audiences leave the theater thinking superman is boring and I can't blame them for it one bit.


^ Exactly.

I recently tried rereading John Bryne's run. I ended up becoming so bored with it, that I moved on to something else. This run is one of, if not the definitive runs for modern Superman, not just some bad story
Byrne's run was interesting for the time (due to the novelty of the whole thing) but it's almost unreadable now.

Even though there are a few great modern Superman stories, I still think much of modern Superman is inferior, especially on a conceptual level.

Totally agree!
 
Alright I just realized that I left the post on a sour note, so instead of me b****ing I'll give you all a list of modern superman comics that I recommend:

1. The world of new krypton 12 part. I honestly can't say enough good things about this; it's written by Greg Rucka and James Robinson and they hit it out of the park giving us THE best depiction of superman in any era and if there is one 'superman in regular continuity' story you should read then it's this one.

2. up, up and away 8 parter by Goef Johns and Busiek. Another excellent story arc where superman's intellect is used to a great effect.

3. Action comics 775, a brilliant all round issue that has superman sticking up for his ideals all the while facing a great threat (Manchester Black and his Elite) and overcoming that threat with strategy.

4. Action comics annual #3, an else-worlds story inside regular continuity (wrap your head around that!) where superman becomes the president and help usher a new era.

5. Alan Moore's supreme, which is silver age superman done right!
 
I don't hear a sour note. Just opinion. The comics are one thing but movies are another animal.

I think the difference is that each comic run can be a reboot.
They are not necessarily connected or bound to the prior art or logic, and are accepted as separate entities.

All can be accepted if done well.
 
Axcellent story arc where superman's intellect is used to a great effect.

3. Action comics 775, a brilliant all round issue that has superman sticking up for his ideals all the while facing a great threat (Manchester Black and his Elite) and overcoming that threat with strategy.

"What's So Funny About Truth, Justice and the American Way" has already been adapted for animated movie in Superman vs The Elite. I'd love it if the solo Superman sequel is based on that comic too. The best single issue story in AC history.
 
There are so many things that could have been done with Superman. If there were more stories that explored his alien origin, then Superman would be a more developed character like Batman is. There are many types of alien movies like Aliens, Species, Invasion of the Body Snatchers, Children of the Damned and so on that could have influenced new stories or ideas. Like now, I would love to see a graphic novel heavily inspired by Man of Steel, but it hasn't happened.
 
Somehow i find the fact that they're both neck-and-neck reinforces the fact that DC fans enjoy all DC superheroes equally without one superhero outshining the other.

i like this, a united DC :)
 
So are we circling back to the "Superman sucks after 1985" argument again? I think the problem with that perception is that the character has appeared SO many times in comics and has been represented by so many different artists and writers. When you're depicted that often and in that many varieties, it's easy to point to all of the stories you didn't like as "proof" that the character is now written poorly. There are just as many bad silver and golden age stories as there are modern age ones. It's just as easy to make fun of Superman dragging planets behind him on a giant chain in the silver age as it is to make fun of the way John Byrne wrote him.
Make that 1986, the Superman reboot started in 1987.

Stupidity of older stories is part of their charm.
 
There are so many things that could have been done with Superman. If there were more stories that explored his alien origin, then Superman would be a more developed character like Batman is. There are many types of alien movies like Aliens, Species, Invasion of the Body Snatchers, Children of the Damned and so on that could have influenced new stories or ideas. Like now, I would love to see a graphic novel heavily inspired by Man of Steel, but it hasn't happened.

I disagree. Superman as a character was developed on a farm by the Kents. And I'm sure there are graphic novels about the alien aspect of him.
 
"What's So Funny About Truth, Justice and the American Way" has already been adapted for animated movie in Superman vs The Elite. I'd love it if the solo Superman sequel is based on that comic too. The best single issue story in AC history.
The ending to that story is fantastic.

We need Superman to be above the likes of The Elite. Because Superman longs for a world of dignity, honour and justice. He has to be the example to mankind. Showing restraint is a lot harder, and he'd rather die defending those values than becoming an antihero type himself.
 
Speaking only for myself here but I've read so many superman comics (in both english and arabic) ranging from the golden to silver to bronze and finally post crisis eras and I comfortably concluded that good superman stories are sadly rare while great ones are an exception to the rule.




I don't want you guys to get me wrong here, I like the bronze age stories in a "it's so silly it's actually fun" sort of way but no way in hell would I want that kind of story telling now because it simply does NOT work.
With saying that however I do miss some aspects of that era's superman namely his great intellect, I miss that more than anything!
Superman to me has always been a thinker, somebody who gets around almost impossible situations because of his great mind, not just his superpowers but when Byrne revamped the character he took away that aspect of the character and I always resented his take because of it.

One of the reasons why I liked the STAS take so much was because supes was remarkably smart in that show, possibly due to the fact that he was so depowered that he had to rely on his brain more often.
The STAS superman was so smart infact that he showed up Batman in the world's finest and in the demon reborn episode batman begrudgingly admitted that superman's quick thinking surprised even him.

Intellect is in my opinion the most attractive quality about a character and it's one of the major reasons why Batman is so appealing to so many people, because while the audience know he'll pull through and win everytime they'll still stuck around to find out just how he'll do it.
It's for that reason that I love Shelock Holmes so much and why I loved superman as a kid when I read those old bronze age issues.
Now however superman doesn't use to his mind because the writers don't use theirs; a continent made of krpytonite? no prob! Superman just powers up alittle bit and comes down and LIFTS the whole thing, kryptonite and all!
An antigravity beam pinning him to the ground while being weakened by krptonian atmosphere? Again no biggie, superman will just shout like a viking and torpedo the thing with abit of an effort, and it's because of that the audiences leave the theater thinking superman is boring and I can't blame them for it one bit.



Byrne's run was interesting for the time (due to the novelty of the whole thing) but it's almost unreadable now.



Totally agree!

That's a good point. I do want Superman to use his brain more, both in the movies and the comics. I feel like the Post-Crisis Superman was more contemplative and more aware of the repercussions of some of his actions, so in that sense, I saw him as a thinker. But you're right; they dumbed him down a bit. I like the idea of a Superman that match wits with Batman and Lex Luthor. Hopefully we'll get that in BvS and future films, though I'm not sure. I feel like Snyder & Co. get "contemplative" Superman, but not "genius" Superman. However, Terrio wrote BvS and is writing JL, and perhaps he knows and appreciates those elements of the character and if so, he'll hopefully incorporate them. Because yeah, Superman's resolve in both MOS and SR was just him relying on his powers instead of using his brain at all (I guess you could argue that he used his brain when he worked with the military to create the singularity, but that was really just Jor-El telling Lois what to do and Lois telling Superman).
 
I disagree. Superman as a character was developed on a farm by the Kents. And I'm sure there are graphic novels about the alien aspect of him.

For example, we have stories of Batman seen in many different ways with various similar origins. Vampire, pirate, a god etc. Pieces from many of these stories were used by writers to help to develop his character. The same can't be said for Superman. That's what I'd like to see happen. Like, what if there were a really good Angel Superman story and so on.
 
There are so many great Superman comics.

One of the most underrated is Superman: for All Seasons

Superman_for_All_Seasons.jpg



It's the comic that delves the most into Superman's humanity. I love the fact that it's narrated by both friend and enemy.
 
Is it really underrated? I remember it being mentioned quite a bit as one the great Superman stories.
 
Wow, not loving all the hate for post-'86 Superman stories I'm seeing 'round here! A world without All-Star Superman, Superman Birthright, Kingdom Come, Red Son, Action Comics #775, Superman Unchained, Grant Morrison's Action Comics run and Greg Pak's Action Comics run is no world for me!!
 
^ I view those as exceptions (besides Superman Unchained), not the rule.
 
That's a lot of exceptions. Just sayin. :oldrazz:

And for the record, I prefer those exceptions over most pre-'86 stories.
 
That's a lot of exceptions. Just sayin. :oldrazz:

And for the record, I prefer those exceptions over most pre-'86 stories.
Across 20 years and several hundreds (if not thousands) of stories? It's quite a small collection.
 
IMO, A little over Half the stories flickchick listed are good because they took ideas and concepts from pre-86 Superman.

And like Jekecy said, those exceptions aren't a lot compared to the vast amount of published modern Superman comics.
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Latest posts

Forum statistics

Threads
200,560
Messages
21,760,246
Members
45,597
Latest member
Netizen95
Back
Top
monitoring_string = "afb8e5d7348ab9e99f73cba908f10802"