BvS Batman Physique Thread - Part 1

[lukebrodyg]

From a performance standpoint, I think Hardy was a fail. Along with Marion Cotillard.

He was good until the moment he realized Bruce had returned IMO.

I won't even get going on Marion other than to say she was awful and Nolan should be partly at fault for the horrible casting decision.

Back to Batman's physique, Ben looks good in the suit. Just leave him in it and skip the vanity shot.

 

[slumcat]

It is rare, while it may happen but the actor in 300: Rise of an Empire while not as ripped as Butler was okay, and that was all that was necessary anyway for the part. He did not look bad.

If they wanted the lead in the new 300 to have a more ripped looked they would have lit it differently and used make up, etc.

They wanted the guys to look exactly like in the first movie, there was no change in their approach. It was very challenging to train Stapleton because he was shooting another series back on another continent unlike Butler and Cavill who basically trained full time for months and lived in a gym.

The result was an OK physique which is kinda a mixed blessing for a 300 film. The extras are all stuntmen and bodybuilders and have these insane physiques, if the lead is being constantly upstaged, you wonder why is he leading the army and not the guy standing next to him - what makes HIM the lead? Butler pretty much had the best physique in 300, an example of a series where the sequel being undone by the precedents set by the original. Even Stapleton's performance was muted so people thought he was a step down from Butler in every way - performance and physicality. In as macho a series as 300, it was a woman who walked away with the film and won all the praise for 300: Rise Of An Empire.

If they want Affleck to look good, he'll get a pump before the scene, light it correctly, use CGI, make up, oil, etc. and use whatever else they need to do to make him look how they want him to look or just not have a shirtless scene. If there is one, and he will not have time to get how they want him to look, and decide they just have to have it, then they will use all they can to make him look right. In a movie like this where the suit makes it look like he is so muscular, they won't have him look bad. People would just say "hey those muscles on the suit are fake", people are dumb enough, they may think those are real muscles.

It ain't all smoke and mirrors, lighting and touch-ups will enhance what is already there, help in presentation, but it won't create something out of thin hair, the body still has to be there pretty much.

The very point of a physique shot in a movie like this is, is that it is an opportunity for the lead actor to get into fantastic shape and be paid for it, an opportunity every man would happily jump at as their is huge masculine vanity associated with having a physique that wows people. Using CGI pretty much kills the inherent point of such a scene. Such scenes are almost never a story requirement - they usually give the actor a vanity shot, sell the image of a superhero as an ideal male which audiences have come to expect and serve as a validation scene for the actor, in that he "earned the super-heroic role" in the eyes of the public.

So there won't be a pressing requirement for a shirtless scene for sure, the movie wouldn't crumble without it. But doing it with CGI would be an unfortunate cop out, and Snyder, who really believes that transforming his actors improves their performances, wouldn't be up for CGIing his actor.

---

As for Hardy, he seemed entirely unremarkable. His workout and transformation was very heavily publicized. It makes you go , he needed steroids for that??

 

[Mr. Finger]

Are my eyes playing tricks on me or am I seeing a bit of a gut there?

I think that he is thinner, and this is a paddies girdle... To hide his actual improvements in physic from pring eyes, as those that follow him around with a camera.

t:

 

[John-An]

"Insanely impressive" is a bit of an overstatement, IMO. His back development is very good, but it's not "insane" in any way. A well-defined back is not as difficult to achieve as other body parts, and most serious lifters will have a back more developed than this. Also, Bale in Begins had just as "insane" back development.

don't take insane as exaggeration. They meant that it was really impressive which it was

 

[BvS117]

They wanted the guys to look exactly like in the first movie, there was no change in their approach. It was very challenging to train Stapleton because he was shooting another series back on another continent unlike Butler and Cavill who basically trained full time for months and lived in a gym.

Yeah I'm 90% sure Cavill and Butler both trained for like a whole year for their movies.

 

[Bruce Malone]

The one thing affleck has going for him is his natural frame size. It seems the new suit is gonna be closer to what we got in the 90's batfilms, whereby the muscles were all molded.

However it won't be as noticeable as michael keaton in batsuit vs out of it for example, due to the fact ben is naturally quite big.

 

[HUMANIMAL]

not one of the best shots...cameras and lighting will do the job no doubt...but this one is just unfortunate.

 

[hafizbat]

Even Hardy in TDKR, there is the perception that it was some sort of outstanding physique I thought looked absolutely weird. And this was after taking steroids.

So its rare for actors to not deliver physically but does happen.

I like how you always post official pics of Cavill when he's oiled up, or from the gym website where he is clearly pumped, yet you choose the most unflattering pics of Hardy to claim that he looked "weird".

Why not use actual official stills...where it counts?

Hardy looked powerful and intimidating. He wasn't going for a body-builder look.

Also, if you've seen Warrior you'd know Hardy is no slouch in the physique department.

 

[hafizbat]

don't take insane as exaggeration. They meant that it was really impressive which it was

Indeed it was

 

[Bruce Malone]

Yeah it makes no sense to post behind the scene candid shots of hardy, when his on-screen appearance looked nothing like that.

He looked absolutely monstrous and intimidating on screen.

 

[HUMANIMAL]

its a trap...no wait there's two of them....

 

[BvS117]

Yeah it makes no sense to post behind the scene candid shots of hardy, when his on-screen appearance looked nothing like that.

He looked absolutely monstrous and intimidating on screen.

I think it shows how far good lighting and camera angles can go to make someone look larger than they are.

 

[Bruce Malone]

I think it shows how far good lighting and camera angles can go to make someone look larger than they are.

To an extent yes.

Bane simply had to look big and intimidating in this case. Hardy even said he didn't want Bane to look like someone who spent a lot of time working out and eating right. So the look worked here.

If we're talking about depicting someone as being ripped and defined though, then that takes more work than just lighting and angles.

 

[slumcat]

I like how you always post official pics of Cavill when he's oiled up, or from the gym website where he is clearly pumped, yet you choose the most unflattering pics of Hardy to claim that he looked "weird".

Why not use actual official stills...where it counts?

Spoiler

Hardy looked powerful and intimidating. He wasn't going for a body-builder look.

Actual production stills can be modified or doctored. Actual candid stills will show you how the actor really looked like, not stills from the movie but behind the scenes.

There are no official shirtless stills of Cavill that are released. There is only tons and tons of BTS and candid shots due to him filming out in the open and from BTS footage on home media and stuff. So people use them.

For Hardy there are both, official shirtless pics released and also candid and BTS shots from the set. And the two don't seem to correspond at all.

And my contention still remains, he had to take steroids for THAT physique?

 

[slumcat]

not one of the best shots...cameras and lighting will do the job no doubt...but this one is just unfortunate.

But it ain't just one unfortunate shot right? It is not like an exception, more like a norm in these series of photos. See below.

Spoiler

I know people have been raving about his outstanding physical transformation for the role of Batman but looking at the images below, he looks ok to but certainly nothing outstanding. He even seems to be having bit of a belly going on, a far cry from the big abs on his suit. Though I guess he still has time.

Sorry if these images have been posted before, saw them just now online somewhere.

May 16th (2 days ago)









May 13 ( 5 days ago)

 

[lc23]

Henry Cavill's efforts and gains clearly aren't worthy of any acknowledgment or praise. Nbd.

 

[Bruce Malone]

And my contention still remains, he had to take steroids for THAT physique?

That's the physique he wanted. Read my comment earlier about the look he did and didn't want for Bane.

Also you make it seem as if taking steroids gives you one kind of look. Assuming Hardy did take steroids (let's not act like Cavill or Affleck didn't or wouldn't either themselves), he was mostly taking it to put on mass in a short time span plain and simple, if he did use them.

 

[slumcat]

That's the physique he wanted. Read my comment earlier about the look he did and didn't want for Bane.

Also you make it seem as if taking steroids gives you one kind of look. Assuming Hardy did take steroids (let's not act like Cavill or Affleck didn't or wouldn't either themselves), he was mostly taking it to put on mass in a short time span plain and simple, if he did use them.

I mean that physique is just some size, no defintion at all, seems just like a dirty bulk with an overemphasis on the upper body to give you kind of like a stork like body. Surely no steroids are required to achieve that?

And Hardy has flat out acknowledged taking steroids for his film roles.

Firstly from this superb article - http://www.mensjournal.com/magazine/print-view/building-a-bigger-action-hero-20140418
Tom Hardy's more caustic explanation of his Dark Knight Rises physique: "No, I took Smarties," he replied when a reporter asked if he'd juiced for the role. "What do you ****ing think?"

And on the Jonathan Ross show he flat out said, there are two ways of getting there - the good way and the "naughty" way and that he used the naughty way. Plus a lot of people who have taken steroids said Hardy showed many visual signs of having taken steroids.

But I am not critiquing that - anything for the role I say, no problem. The thing is the end result does not seem worth it to to have taken steroids for, he could have done without steroids too, nothing exceptional.

 

[Bruce Malone]

Leaving the steroids angle out, I'm not sure why you are criticizing his lack of definition for the role? He was playing Bane, essentially a monstrous terrorist who lived in the bowels of a city.

As I mentioned, Hardy/Nolan didn't want to portray Bane as somebody who looks like they had time to hit the gym and ate right and counted calories. He simply had to look big and intimidating and on film that was perfectly captured.

Bane probably would have been a guy who just lifted heavy and ate like ****.

You have to think of the character and role first before you mold your body to it. There's no one template. It's also not like Hardy couldn't get ripped and defined if he wanted to, just look at him in Warrior.

 

[TheBat812]

Ya, I'm a little confused as to what slumcast is getting at. Yes, Hardy took steroids, and it worked for him. Steroids do not equal a ripped body, it equals an increase in mass otherwise unattainable, nor was Hardy trying to be ripped. And it looks excellent in the film. Who cares what the set photos look like, they're of no consequence. I know slumcat likes to think of himself as some sort of bodybuilding expert, but if he actually were one, he'd realize Tom was being trained by professionals and did what it took to get to where he needed to be in the amount of time he actually had. This is some weird judgmental thing based on your his aesthetic preference rather than the needs of the film from what the filmmakers' want and need. But fanboys will be fanboys.

 

[slumcat]

Leaving the steroids angle out, I'm not sure why you are criticizing his lack of definition for the role? He was playing Bane, essentially a monstrous terrorist who lived in the bowels of a city.

As I mentioned, Hardy/Nolan didn't want to portray Bane as somebody who looks like they had time to hit the gym and ate right and counted calories. He simply had to look big and intimidating and on film that was perfectly captured.

Bane probably would have been a guy who just lifted heavy and ate like ****.

You have to think of the character and role first before you mold your body to it. There's no one template. It's also not like Hardy couldn't get ripped and defined if he wanted to, just look at him in Warrior.

Maybe it was character serving but I won't put too much thought into that since little of the film and its portrayals or motivations made any sense at all.

What I am trying to say is objectively, just looking at his physique, without the character - it was thoroughly unremarkable though people think it was some kind of great physique. Do people really want to look like that? I certainly don't. And also that kind of physique is not as difficult to get as extremely ripped one. So less effort required means less impressive to me.

And even less impressive, he had to take steroids for it.

 

[BvS117]

Maybe it was character serving but I won't put too much thought into that since little of the film and its portrayals or motivations made any sense at all.

What I am trying to say is objectively, just looking at his physique, without the character - it was thoroughly unremarkable though people think it was some kind of great physique. Do people really want to look like that? I certainly don't. And also that kind of physique is not as difficult to get as extremely ripped one. So less effort required means less impressive to me.

And even less impressive, he had to take steroids for it.

A lot of actors in Hollywood take steroids to put on muscle for roles.

 

[TheBat812]

Slumcat - But intention is just as important as the process. If you're just looking for a ripped body, then ya, maybe Hardy failed to you, but that was never on his mind, so it's a horribly misplaced judgement. People don't necessarily think it was a 'great' physique, but it was very imposing in the film, which was the point. So mission accomplished.

 

[Bruce Malone]

Maybe it was character serving but I won't put too much thought into that since little of the film and its portrayals or motivations made any sense at all.

What I am trying to say is objectively, just looking at his physique, without the character - it was thoroughly unremarkable though people think it was some kind of great physique. Do people really want to look like that? I certainly don't. And also that kind of physique is not as difficult to get as extremely ripped one. So less effort required means less impressive to me.

And even less impressive, he had to take steroids for it.

For the last time he was playing Bane. I'd say it's normal to not want to look like Bane in any of the mediums he's appeared in.

It seems you have trouble distinguishing the concepts of molding your body to the role and your very narrow view of what you find attractive.

99% of movie viewers don't bother to check out spy set pics, so based on what was seen on screen, it is very understandable why viewers would be left impressed with what they saw of hardy. He looked big, he looked scary. Job done.

 

[hafizbat]

Maybe it was character serving but I won't put too much thought into that since little of the film and its portrayals or motivations made any sense at all.

What I am trying to say is objectively, just looking at his physique, without the character - it was thoroughly unremarkable though people think it was some kind of great physique. Do people really want to look like that? I certainly don't. And also that kind of physique is not as difficult to get as extremely ripped one. So less effort required means less impressive to me.

And even less impressive, he had to take steroids for it.

If you want to simply talk about the physique and not the character, you should be on the Bodybuilding.com forums instead of here. The character is everything. Otherwise, why shouldn't Commissioner Gordon have a great, aesthetic physique as well?