The Dark Knight Batman VS Joker: The final Battle

[Scarecrow_King]

personally, if two-face isn't "made" in court by sal maroni (since he is a confirmed character), i will be outraged. that's one of the things that i really think should stay true to teh funny books. and with all the mobs running around and what not, its a perfect oppurtunity.

on the bats/joker final showdown, i assumed it was the scene in the street with the batcycle (i refuse to call it the pod). but in retrospect, there really is no evidence to support that. i do think it would be a cool setting for a smack down, though.

 

[The Battousai]

personally, if two-face isn't "made" in court by sal maroni (since he is a confirmed character), i will be outraged. that's one of the things that i really think should stay true to teh funny books. and with all the mobs running around and what not, its a perfect oppurtunity.

on the bats/joker final showdown, i assumed it was the scene in the street with the batcycle (i refuse to call it the pod). but in retrospect, there really is no evidence to support that. i do think it would be a cool setting for a smack down, though.

Although it isn't going to physically be Maroni scarring Dent, he will have someone do it in his place nonetheless.

 

[Scarecrow_King]

how do you know? is that official somewhere?

 

[The Battousai]

One of the script sides describes someone named "Rossi" doing the deed in court.

 

[tigerknight]

how do you know? is that official somewhere?

read a few post back and you will see it be talked about and I do believe they confirmed it we had a threat about it. somewhere??

 

[-Crusher-]

it would be more "mafia" like if Maroni got one of his underlings to do it for him. i mean, in the godfather you didnt see vito corleone go and whack anyone, because the don of a mafia has earned his way to the position hes in, therefore he doesnt have to do s**t, someone else always does it for him.

 

[sad lieutenant]

Okay, here's my take...

Spoiler

Here's what I think I've put together, in terms of one long action sequence, perhaps in the middle of the film (more on that in a minute):

1. Joker crashes Bruce's party for Dent, clearly aiming at flushing Dent out as Batman (hence threatening Rachel, if the rumors are true.) Batman shows up in the flesh, they fight (perhaps it's one-sided, since Joker has so many armed thugs), and Joker escapes out the window (based on spy reports - maybe or maybe not with Rachel, depending on whose spy reports you read.)

2. The semi chase follows the party scene - ending with Joker confronting the Pod-riding Batman on the streets outside Wayne Tower. Joker is somehow captured - perhaps he goes willingly, as we all suspect.

3. In jail, he's interrogated to no effect, so Batman is brought in - either officially by Gordon, or on his own intent. Clearly, Batman kicks the tar out of Joker, but all for naught - Joker laughs in his face.

4. Joker somehow escapes - many spy reports indicate it's because one of his henchman (or just some random inmate) has a bomb in their stomach, which explodes. In any case, putting together some side information, here's what I think happens: before Joker gets out, he sabotages the police station - he ties up various police officers, kills Loeb (who's there, as we can clearly see in the trailer during Gordon's voice-over with Joker in the holding cell), and steals some cop uniforms. He then escapes in a police cruiser (also seen in the trailer.)

5. Loeb's funeral is held - which Joker crashes dressed as a police officer. He tries to off Mayor Garcia during the 21-gun salute, but fails to kill him...

6. However, in my interpretation, the mayor is badly injured and is taken to the hospital under heavy security. So, rather than try to sneak in and finish the job, Joker elects to just blow the whole dern thing up (also in the trailer.)

Here's where it gets interesting: clearly, if I'm mostly right about these sequences, the semi chase isn't Batman and Joker's final confrontation, since so many things happen afterwards. However, it's also not their FIRST - Batman is clearly wearing his new suit in the party scene (can see this, too, in the trailer) and also drives the Pod during the chase sequence. Rumors hold that Joker causes Batman to change both his suit, and also use the Pod - the ol' reliable info is that Joker blows up the Tumbler, and Batman nearly drowns in the old suit. Whether this is true or not, it's clear they've met before.

What's interesting, then, is not what we've seen, but what we HAVEN'T seen. Clearly, Nolan and Co. wouldn't show us the final fight in the first official, regular trailer. But he also hasn't shown us much else, either. All of Joker's shots, outside the cell and the party, have been from that one post-semi chase scene, where they're in the street. What we've seen, basically, is the middle, but not the beginning or the end confrontations.

Sounds totally plausible to me!

 

[sad lieutenant]

Another alternative: someone else also suggested that Joker is clapping in a sarcastic manner to "salute" Gordon and the cops for capturing him. In the first shot of him clapping, he looks kind of unimpressed, as though it's him giving them a dose of sarcastic Joker attitude, like "Congratulations, whoop dee doo, you caught me."

Exactly.

And I assure you that the Joker did not hook up any bomb to a "clapper".

 

[The Joker_1000]

He has to have some reason to have been clapping.

 

[Marx]

Sounds totally plausible to me!

That really makes alot of sense. I hadn't thought about it like that. I do not believe that The Joker and Batman's final showdown is the batcycle sequence. I'm still holding out for some kind of amusement park or fair confrontation. I can hope can't I???

He has to have some reason to have been clapping.

He's clapping just to be a sarcastic ***hole.

 

[Conebone69]

He has to have some reason to have been clapping.

It could be anything. Nobody knows

 

[Infinity9999x]

Since Nolan is modeling the Joker more after his first appearances, I'm really hoping that he'll be able to hold his own against Batman physically too.

In his first appearance the Joker was actually able to throw down with Batman pretty evenly. It's been suggested in some comics that his madness gives him an insane strength, and I wouldn't mind seeing this.

I'm not saying the Joker should be skilled like Ras, but I would like to see him have a Brutal erratic fighting style that involves unexpected attacks (like kicks to the groin, biting, headbutting, clawing at the eyes) and a combination of special devices to hold his own in a brutal fight against Bats.

 

[Symbiotic]

Since Nolan is modeling the Joker more after his first appearances, I'm really hoping that he'll be able to hold his own against Batman physically too.

In his first appearance the Joker was actually able to throw down with Batman pretty evenly. It's been suggested in some comics that his madness gives him an insane strength, and I wouldn't mind seeing this.

I'm not saying the Joker should be skilled like Ras, but I would like to see him have a Brutal erratic fighting style that involves unexpected attacks (like kicks to the groin, biting, headbutting, clawing at the eyes) and a combination of special devices to hold his own in a brutal fight against Bats.

Just as long as J doesn't constantly have the upper hand.

 

[Infinity9999x]

Just as long as J doesn't constantly have the upper hand.

Oh yeah, I'm not saying having Joker be a better fighter. I just want to see him be able to hold his own. It's an element the character hasn't had for a while.

That's something I liked in ROTJ. When Joker roles up his sleeves and says something to the effect "you're good kid, but you're not Batman," and then proceeds to beat the crap of out Terry, I thought it was awesome. I was getting tired of seeing Bats beat down the Joker without breaking a sweat.

 

[-Crusher-]

people keep saying how the joker shouldnt stand a chance because batman has all this martial arts experience and stuff. but honestly, no one really knows the true past of the joker, so how do any of us really know his fighting capability?

 

[Infinity9999x]

people keep saying how the joker shouldnt stand a chance because batman has all this martial arts experience and stuff. but honestly, no one really knows the true past of the joker, so how do any of us really know his fighting capability?

Well, I wouldn't make him a skilled martial artist. That's never really been an aspect of the character, but I'd just make him an amazing scrapper.

Have him go ape***** nuts when he fights Bats. Trying to kick him in the groin and knee, biting him, clawing at his eyes, headbutting, basically putting his own body at risk to do as much damage as possible. He'd obviously fight dirty too, and use any weapon that he had on him.

And honestly, you can have all the martial arts training you want, but if the Joker gets the drop on Batman and shoves a knife into his leg and hit him in the head with a brick, then Bats isn't going to be able to fight too well.

 

[The Joker]

Well, I wouldn't make him a skilled martial artist. That's never really been an aspect of the character, but I'd just make him an amazing scrapper.

That's never been an aspect to Joker, either. He's never been a physical match for Batman one on one. That fight in Batman #1 was a one off.

Joker sometimes tries to fight Batman when he's cornered and has no way to escape. But he never matches Batman. Normally ends up getting his ass severely kicked. Joker relies more on his nasty toys and weapons. Knives, guns, acid squirting flower etc to try and get the upper hand etc.

 

[Infinity9999x]

That's never been an aspect to Joker, either. He's never been a physical match for Batman one on one. That fight in Batman #1 was a one off.

Joker sometimes tries to fight Batman when he's cornered and has no way to escape. But he never matches Batman. Normally ends up getting his ass severely kicked. Joker relies more on his nasty toys and weapons. Knives, guns, acid squirting flower etc to try and get the upper hand etc.

Yes, I'd want that to be an aspect of the character too, but it has been said in some comics that Joker's insanity sometimes gives him a great strength. That could be explored.

Also, Joker learned from his beatings from Batman, as was evidenced in TLH where he easily takes down Dent.

And, as I said above, Batman Beyond had Joker be a good fighter because he was in so many scraps with Batman. He pretty much beat the crap out of Terry in that too.

I wouldn't have Joker be a physical match for Batman. In a straight fight, yeah, he'd get stomped, but I'd have Joker use his various weapons to fight Batman off, and also have him be a dirty fighter. While It hasn't been used often, I think it would be a nice change to see him able to hold Batman off for a bit just because he goes for dirty cheap shots (scratching the eyes, kicks to groin).

While it's never really been a part of the character, Nolan obviously isn't staying 100% true to the comics, and I don't think it would be out of character. Making him a skilled martial artist would be too much, but making him a nasty scrapper fits nicely with the character I think.

 

[Solidus]

That's never been an aspect to Joker, either. He's never been a physical match for Batman one on one. That fight in Batman #1 was a one off.

Joker sometimes tries to fight Batman when he's cornered and has no way to escape. But he never matches Batman. Normally ends up getting his ass severely kicked. Joker relies more on his nasty toys and weapons. Knives, guns, acid squirting flower etc to try and get the upper hand etc.

Yea he's a dirty fighter, to me he could for a brief time hold against Batman for a bit, to me I like the fight in TMWL, where Joker uses the dark to surprise attack, and Batman was claiming on how quick he was, see I never saw Joker as strong, no where near Bats strength, but he's quick and a dirty fighter. To me dirty style is Joker's fighting ways.

 

[-Crusher-]

dont get me wrong, im not saying the joker is a ninja


or is he?...................-

 

[The Joker]

Yes, I'd want that to be an aspect of the character too, but it has been said in some comics that Joker's insanity sometimes gives him a great strength. That could be explored.

When has his insanity given him great strength?

Also, Joker learned from his beatings from Batman, as was evidenced in TLH where he easily takes down Dent.

He simply kicked Dent in the crown jewels t: And, as Joker said, Harvey was no Batman.

And, as I said above, Batman Beyond had Joker be a good fighter because he was in so many scraps with Batman. He pretty much beat the crap out of Terry in that too.

That was a Joker who's DNA was on a microchip uploaded into Tim Drake's body. He knew all the fighting tricks from Tim's mind.

I wouldn't have Joker be a physical match for Batman. In a straight fight, yeah, he'd get stomped, but I'd have Joker use his various weapons to fight Batman off, and also have him be a dirty fighter. While It hasn't been used often, I think it would be a nice change to see him able to hold Batman off for a bit just because he goes for dirty cheap shots (scratching the eyes, kicks to groin).

Since movie Batman wears armour, would a kick to the groin really be that effective on him?

While it's never really been a part of the character, Nolan obviously isn't staying 100% true to the comics, and I don't think it would be out of character. Making him a skilled martial artist would be too much, but making him a nasty scrapper fits nicely with the character I think.

He can be a nasty fighter, he just shouldn't really be able to hold his own against Batman without relying on weaponry of some kind. And if these pics is anything to go by, it seems Joker cannot hold his own against Batman by himself:

 

[BatSpider]

Nice Comparision

 

[GoogleMe94]

im wondering why batman would throw joker into a window.

 

[-Crusher-]

hes the god**n batman?!

 

[The Joker_1000]

dont get me wrong, im not saying the joker is a ninja


or is he?...................-

It'd be really strange if he actually were a ninja. Imagine the Joker doing martial arts.