Sequels Can a Spider-Man movie ever top The Dark Knight?

[chaseter]

But until that happens, I will tread cautiously. I am no where near an optimist and I don't expect anything from SM4...I just hope for the best. Remember how everyone though SR was going to be the greatest thing since sliced bread and it was utterly boring. This franchise needs to be rebuilt after SM3 and certainly overhauled after Raimi dulled it down to make it kid friendly.

 

[Visionary]

I honestly don't think anyone at Sony/Marvel give a damn what you or me expect from SM4. Not with a 2.4 Billion dollar franchise. But I'm working on changing their frame of mind, and it won't be easy.

 

[Stringer]

Thats rid-donkers!!
Theres numerous films that come out each year of different genres and every now and then there are oscar-nominated films even from genres we wouldn't expect. To say that a film genre has 'peaked' that means its at the top of the top, so NOTHING will every be able to beat it no matter how much time passes by....do you really think thats going to happen? The title of "Best comic book film ever" may not occur as frequent as it has in the past few years and TDK has definitely made it harder to get that title...but it is not impossible because there is no such thing as the perfect film (for me and a lot of people), a movie can ALWAYS be topped....if it can't than that means the people who worked on TDK are the MOST creative team through out the ENTIRE human race and something deep inside me is telling myself thats not the case


....

What Im saying is the current string of comic movies topping each other will end. The movies you named most of them came within the last 10 years of each other. THAT is what will stop. We're going to start being a lot more critical of movies now that TDK has come. "Better" movies than it coming along will be few and far in between.

 

[Visionary]

That's pretty much how it is with most genres, not just comic book films.

 

[Trevor Goodchild]

.....If you think that this cycle will suddenly stop at The Dark Knight then I pity you ....because obviously you are living in a box

Yeah, I’m eagerly anticipating Watchmen.
I’m pessimistic about Wolverine, with all that crap 20th Century Fox has been regurgitating lately but maybe it has some chance to be Blade-like, which isn’t at all that bad, not unlike Ghost Rider.

It amazes me how closed-minded Spider-Man fans are about Spider-Man. That he can only be presented one way, and one way only, with only one vision, version and direction. You can have a phenomenal film with Spider-Man, that's both complexed and mature, that still captures every element that makes it Spider-Man.

I hear ya, man.

What Im saying is the current string of comic movies topping each other will end. The movies you named most of them came within the last 10 years of each other. THAT is what will stop. We're going to start being a lot more critical of movies now that TDK has come. "Better" movies than it coming along will be few and far in between.

That's pretty much how it is with most genres, not just comic book films.

Maybe Stringer has a point in that The Dark Knight may change people’s impression about the superhero genre and it will finally be taken more seriously by the neutral audience.

 

[spiderfan970]

I think spider-man's only chance was spider-man 3. It was so hyped up and everyone was so looking forward to it that had it been better, it probably could've been almost as big of a hit. But I will say that I believe Ledger's joker is what kept people coming back...If they get someone that good for a villain...Then maybe they still could have a chance. And they need to stop being so corny...You can appeal to all ages without being corny.

 

[hatebox]

Yeah, I’m eagerly anticipating
Maybe Stringer has a point in that The Dark Knight may change people’s impression about the superhero genre and it will finally be taken more seriously by the neutral audience.

Well that's pretty much it. What you have in TDK is the most watched film of the decade (assuming there are no phenomenons in 2009) which, for a blockbuster, is being taken very seriously. It couldn't have made that much money unless people who don't normally see comic book movies watched it (ie. over forties). And that's a big deal. But we'll still have to wait to see how that affects the genre as a whole. Maybe it was just an anomaly.

 

[Visionary]

It won't effect the genre at all.

 

[Anita18]

It won't effect the genre at all.

If BB affected the genre (rebooting, making things plausible, casting Oscar-caliber actors), I would certainly hope that TDK would as well.

Unless you're referring to it being an anomaly.

 

[Visionary]

BB had no effect on the genre, that's just something Nolanites like think what happen. As if Nolan was the first to reboot, make thing plausible or cast Oscar caliber actors, even though nothing acting-wise ever came close to Oscar caliber in Batman Begins.

 

[hatebox]

BB had no effect on the genre, that's just something Nolanites like think what happen. As if Nolan was the first to reboot, make thing plausible or cast Oscar caliber actors, even though nothing acting-wise ever came close to Oscar caliber in Batman Begins.

Great, we're still actually using the term 'Nolanites'

Come to think of it, what film before BB rebooted its franchise to that extent? It clearly had an effect on Hulk and the upcoming Superman...

 

[Visionary]

Great, we're still actually using the term 'Nolanites'

Come to think of it, what film before BB rebooted its franchise to that extent? It clearly had an effect on Hulk and the upcoming Superman...

They had no choice but to reboot Batman, what, did you think they were gonna continue with Batman and Robin? Just like Batman and Robin, when a movie doesn't pull in the movie goers (MONEY) the studio wants, they try something new. No one does it because of Batman, they do it in hopes to make more money. That goes for Hulk and Superman.

And yes, I still use the term Nolanites, Fanboys and Geeks. They're very fitting.

 

[Anita18]

BB had no effect on the genre, that's just something Nolanites like think what happen. As if Nolan was the first to reboot, make thing plausible or cast Oscar caliber actors, even though nothing acting-wise ever came close to Oscar caliber in Batman Begins.

TDK is at least clearly affecting WB's current movie slate. They moved HP6 to next year, and are dusting off ideas for a Superman reboot as well.

Correct me if I'm wrong, didn't Favreau himself mention BB when talking about casting IM, and Louis Leterrier mention BB when rebooting Hulk? Casino Royale didn't take the reboot idea directly from BB, but everyone likes to mash them together under the reboot umbrella.

I'm not saying that the studios were twiddling their thumbs until BB came along and then they suddenly went, "Wow, we should follow this formula!" and then went to work, but BB proved that it could be successful. And if a fellow filmmaker in the comic book movie genre says that a film has affected his own project, then I consider it affecting the genre as a whole.

 

[hatebox]

They had no choice but to reboot Batman, what, did you think they were gonna continue with Batman and Robin? Just like Batman and Robin, when a movie doesn't pull in the movie goers (MONEY) the studio wants, they try something new. No one does it because of Batman, they do it in hopes to make more money. That goes for Hulk and Superman.

I'm not sure what point you're making. It doesn't matter if they did it for money (because of course they did) the point was that they did it at all with Begins and now we've seen EXACTLY the same things now happen with Hulk and Superman in what turned out to be an even shorter turnaround period.

Therefore the argument that Begins had an influence on the genre stands. And WB have already admitted, rightly or wrongly, that it's new slate of Superhero films will be darker thanks to TDK.

EDIT: and yes, as Anita said, Favreau has cited Begins as an influence, and I'm sure the Bond producers at least kept an eye on it. Even if BB wasn't a direct influence on CR the fact that it was at least mentioned in certain articles says enough.

 

[Visionary]

TDK is at least clearly affecting WB's current movie slate. They moved HP6 to next year, and are dusting off ideas for a Superman reboot as well.

Correct me if I'm wrong, didn't Favreau himself mention BB when talking about casting IM, and Louis Leterrier mention BB when rebooting Hulk? Casino Royale didn't take the reboot idea directly from BB, but everyone likes to mash them together under the reboot umbrella.

The studio were rebooting the Hulk film regardless of what Leterrier mentioned. Ang Lee's Hulk was a dud, and there hope was to make a new Hulk movie that would make more money, and excite movie-goers. Same goes for the new rebooted Bond movie, as well. Reboots and getting the best actors in the eyes of the director wasn't created or started by Nolan. It's why Warner Bros. wanted Jack Nicholson (Oscar caliber actor) to play The Joker way back when. Not to mention, Marlon Brando (Oscar caliber actor) to play Superman's father. It's nothing new.

I swear, when you people get wrapped around your favorite comic book director, there is no end in sight to what you'll proclaim, yeesh.

 

[Anita18]

The studio were rebooting the Hulk film regardless of what Leterrier mentioned. Ang Lee's Hulk was a dud, and there hope was to make a new Hulk movie that would make more money, and excite movie-goers. Same goes for the new rebooted Bond movie, as well. Reboots and getting the best actors in the eyes of the director wasn't created or started by Nolan. It's why Warner Bros. wanted Jack Nicholson (Oscar caliber actor) to play The Joker way back when. Not to mention, Marlon Brando (Oscar caliber actor) to play Superman's father. It's nothing new.

I swear, when you people get wrapped around your favorite comic book director, there is no end in sight to what you'll proclaim, yeesh.

The same can be said for the opposite.

My comment about fellow filmmakers citing another movie as affecting their own still stands, and I think that should be the gauge. Not what fans claim, whether it be one way or another.

 

[Visionary]

The same can be said for the opposite.

There is no opposite, I'm talking about us all, myself included.

My comment about fellow filmmakers citing another movie as affecting their own still stands, and I think that should be the gauge. Not what fans claim, whether it be one way or another.

And I still stand by my comment that TDK will have zero effect on the comic book genre. Hell, if one did, I'd rather it be THE CROW, my personal favorite.

 

[Stringer]

How can you say TDK will have ZERO effect on the genre when Jeff Robinov said the upcoming DC movies will be as dark as the characters will allow because of TDK's success?

Its already having an effect.

 

[p4poetic]

No. Because Spider-Man is not like Batman, they are completely two different characters, and you can't just expect Peter Parker to be twisted around in vain into Bruce Wayne to get a story that was based off old Batman comics. Stick to your source instead of the trend; while the Spider-Man movies had depth, they had a sense of fun in them, and it wasn't overwhelmingly dark in it's elements (and I know that type of **** is ~*trendy*~ all of a sudden now, but I don't want to get into a rant now). You can't mess with that, that's not Spider-Man.

 

[Trevor Goodchild]

^Yeah, for some reason 'dark' suddenly became synonymous with quality.
But we've already established that.
Nobody's talking about making Spidey 'dark'. They can make a perfectly good movie with his own merits, which is not cheese and camp).

 

[Visionary]

How can you say TDK will have ZERO effect on the genre when Jeff Robinov said the upcoming DC movies will be as dark as the characters will allow because of TDK's success?

Its already having an effect.

That's ironic, because I found Superman Returns darker than Batman Begins. Dark comic book movies has existed before BB/TDK. Regardless of TDK's success, it's been done before, and it doesn't always work at the box office, so who ever the hell Robinov is (who seems to know nothing about Superman) better think twice.

 

[Anita18]

That's ironic, because I found Superman Returns darker than Batman Begins. Dark comic book movies has existed before BB/TDK. Regardless of TDK's success, it's been done before, and it doesn't always work at the box office, so who ever the hell Robinov is (who seems to know nothing about Superman) better think twice.

Heh, I totally disagree with you on that one, but we disagree on a lot of things.

The Blade movies were pretty dark, and those were technically the first comic book movies of the 90's, I believe. (I've never seen The Crow but I'll bet that was extremely dark too.) X-Men 1 and 2 were pretty dark as well, but I think everyone followed the Spiderman movie formula for the most part, which leaned more toward fun and camp than actual darkness. The dark parts of the formulaic movies are more for the "coolness" aspect visually than anything else.

What TDK brings to the plate is a constant, terrifying, palpable tension that's more akin to a crime drama than a comic book movie. And yeah, you can't apply that to every superhero.

 

[Stringer]

That's ironic, because I found Superman Returns darker than Batman Begins. Dark comic book movies has existed before BB/TDK. Regardless of TDK's success, it's been done before, and it doesn't always work at the box office, so who ever the hell Robinov is (who seems to know nothing about Superman) better think twice.

Its not a point of dark comic book movies existing before TDK. Robinov is saying theyre making darker comic book films as a DIRECT result of TDK's success. So you saying it will have no effect on the genre is simply wrong because it already has

 

[YJ1]

I resisted the urge to start a thread titled...

Can a Batman movie ever top Spider-Man 2? (Because Batman is 0-6 as of now)

TDK is a fine movie but SM2 is STILL the better all around film. Dark and ultra moody doesn't equal better.

We're still splitting hairs but the facts are the facts.

SM2 = 10/10
TDK = 9/10

 

[pjspider1C]

I think comparing the Spider-Man movies to Nolan's Batman movies isn't going to get anyone anywhere. They are completely separate animals and unique to their own style. Saying one is better than the other comes down to a matter of personal preference - as they are both very good in their own right.