Civil War Cap 3 or Avengers 2.5?

[warhorse78]

that pisses me off so much, If they're gonna kill him do it right! Leave him dead! If they want Captain America, there's this guy I know named Sebastian Stan!

I hate to say it, but Steve Rogers/Captain America/Chris Evans is pretty much the only thing really keeping me coming back to this franchise. If they kill him off, I'll probaly lose whatever excitement I had for this thing, maybe next in line to him IMO is Charlie Cox Dare Devil. But I highly doubt we'll see him as a major character in the movies.

This also has me wondering, how well will Marvel be able to keep this thing chugging along once heavy weight favorites like RDJ/Ironman, Evans/Cap, Hemsworth/Thor and JoHansen/Black Widow are out?

 

[drod1985]

This also has me wondering, how well will Marvel be able to keep this thing chugging along once heavy weight favorites like RDJ/Ironman, Evans/Cap, Hemsworth/Thor and JoHansen/Black Widow are out?

They're going to either James Bond it and just recast, or they're going to rely on the new players they're introducing. Ant-Man, Black Panther, Captain Marvel, Dr. Strange, Wanda, Vision, etc.

 

[Spider-Fan]

They're going to either James Bond it and just recast, or they're going to rely on the new players they're introducing. Ant-Man, Black Panther, Captain Marvel, Dr. Strange, Wanda, Vision, etc.

I think it will be a little of both. Some will be recast, others will die or just disappear and be replaced. Some may even skip phases before recasting. I think it will be a case by case basis.

 

[BullMcGiveny]

Real talk

Captain America: Civil War picks up where Avengers: Age of Ultron left off, as Steve Rogers leads the new team of Avengers in their continued efforts to safeguard humanity. After another international incident involving the Avengers results in collateral damage, political pressure mounts to install a system of accountability and a governing body to determine when to enlist the services of the team. The new status quo fractures the Avengers while they try to protect the world from a new and nefarious villain.

Whether Cap gets more focus than any or not, that sounds like an Avengers story.

 

[Protar]

I'd rather not see recasting. It destroys the continuity that the MCU has built up. I don't want it to move into comicbook time. They can keep setting up new characters indefinitely. Each batch of characters should last for about 10 years, with overlap between the old and new groups of course. And they can use the comics to build up new characters with the express purpose of having more source material for the movies.

 

[Raiden]

I think they can use the new Avengers without recasting to continue into Phase 5 or 6, and maybe do a rebooting a la DOFP with Kang the Conquerer to reset the universe they have built up. That way, they will be able to recast in this new universe instead of recasting a few people but leaving others the way they are.

 

[MadVillainy]

I mean I think it's pretty clear that this is leaning more toward Avengers 2.5 rather than Cap 3.

Im ok with that as long as the movie is good.

 

[drod1985]

As Protar pointed out, the continuity in these films is so strong. I highly doubt they'll pull a DOFP and reset everything they've worked for. It would almost invalidate a lot of it. They'll pull replacements from the comics and probably only recast when absolutely necessary.

 

[MadVillainy]

I think they'll recast more than pass the torch

I don't think many people care to see BuckyCap, SamCap, LadyThor, RhodyIronMan, etc. for an extended period of time

 

[Matt]

I think it will be a little of both. Some will be recast, others will die or just disappear and be replaced. Some may even skip phases before recasting. I think it will be a case by case basis.

Honestly, I think a big part of it will be how the public reacts to some of the lesser known heroes like Black Panther, Ant-Man, etc. I think if Ant-Man bombs, Marvel may very quietly nix movies like Black Panther and Captain Marvel and start thinking about recasting Iron Man, Captain America, Thor, etc (or backing up dump trucks full of money to Downey, Evans, and Hemsworth's front doors).

 

[MadVillainy]

I think Hemsworth will re up his deal. He is very well liked but I don't think he's found that role that has everybody going "Oh yeah he's going to have life after the MCU". He has the talent and he was great in Rush, but I still think he needs something. Now if his role in In the HEart of the Sea is very good maybe even award worthy I don't think he'll re up

Evans I wish he would stick around but it doesn't seem like he's into it anymore. I remember there were/are rumors of him quitting acting after his time as Cap. Evans is very underused and is a great actor I hope he sticks around.

 

[Dark Raven]

Honestly, I think a big part of it will be how the public reacts to some of the lesser known heroes like Black Panther, Ant-Man, etc. I think if Ant-Man bombs, Marvel may very quietly nix movies like Black Panther and Captain Marvel and start thinking about recasting Iron Man, Captain America, Thor, etc (or backing up dump trucks full of money to Downey, Evans, and Hemsworth's front doors).

I don't see why, if Ant-Man were to bomb, that Marvel should pull the plug on other movies like Black Panther and Captain Marvel. What do they have to do with Ant-Man and what bearing does his success or failure have on them?

If Ant-Man were released before GOTG, and Ant-Man bombed, then imagine if they nixed GOTG. They're about as obscure as you could get. However, they were a huge success, and giving them the chop simply on the grounds that one lesser-known property didn't succeed so all lesser-known properties would follow suit seems rather premature and baseless.

 

[Matt]

Evans is good, but his talent is a bit wasted on playing a relatively bland hero (sorry Cap fans, I love him too, but he is bland ). The hard one to recast is going to be Downey. He basically launched the MCU. He is by far the most popular character and actor associated with the MCU. Hell, he has essentially become the face of Marvel films. And sadly he seems to be making it fairly clear that he is done after IW.

I really think Marvel is going to have to choose between killing him off in IW (to let the public know, he is 100 % out) or recasting with someone along the lines of Bradley Cooper, Johnny Depp, or someone of equal popularity/recognition (and good luck finding an A-lister who wants to take another actor's scraps after the actor made a character iconic). It is a complicated situation and I think how the public responds to Ant-Man is going to greatly impact what Marvel opts to do.

 

[MadVillainy]

Evans is good, but his talent is a bit wasted on playing a relatively bland hero (sorry Cap fans, I love him too, but he is bland ). The hard one to recast is going to be Downey. He basically launched the MCU. He is by far the most popular character and actor associated with the MCU. Hell, he has essentially become the face of Marvel films. And sadly he seems to be making it fairly clear that he is done after IW.

I really think Marvel is going to have to choose between killing him off in IW (to let the public know, he is 100 % out) or recasting with someone along the lines of Bradley Cooper, Johnny Depp, or someone of equal popularity/recognition (and good luck finding an A-lister who wants to take another actor's scraps after the actor made a character iconic). It is a complicated situation and I think how the public responds to Ant-Man is going to greatly impact what Marvel opts to do.

YEah RDJ is going to be really difficult. AS you said he is one of the big 3 guys who the MCU basically owes it's success to (Feige, RDJ, and Faverau)

I personally can't see another actor taking the role and not doing a RDJ impression when playing Stark

That's going to be a real difficult one to replace

 

[Matt]

I don't see why, if Ant-Man were to bomb, that Marvel should pull the plug on other movies like Black Panther and Captain Marvel. What do they have to do with Ant-Man and what bearing does his success or failure have on them?

If Ant-Man were released before GOTG, and Ant-Man bombed, then imagine if they nixed GOTG. They're about as obscure as you could get. However, they were a huge success, and giving them the chop simply on the grounds that one lesser-known property didn't succeed so all lesser-known properties would follow suit seems rather premature and baseless.

Its a different situation entirely. GOTG was separate. It wasn't really advertised as part of the MCU, it was marketed differently. It was seen as its own thing (and it had a brilliant marketing plan). Sure, there is tie in potential, but it was at the same time, separate. Plus it is kinda a different genre all together.

Black Panther, Captain Marvel, Doctor Strange...they are all kind of the same as Ant-Man...B-list heroes that Marvel plans to fill Phase 4 and beyond with (due to the actors of Phase 1-3 being over it).

Beyond that, I am not saying it makes sense. I am not saying because audiences do not respond to Ant-Man, they will not respond to Doctor Strange. I am saying that studio logic would make one hesitant to take a shot on a B-lister after one bombs. In the end, the show business is still a business and using something like Ant-Man as a model can provide guidance on anticipated success of someone like Black Panther. As such, a studio may use such models to determine how best to invest moving forward.

 

[MadVillainy]

I think BP and Marvel will definetly still happen even if Ant Man bombs.

I mean besides the fact that BP will already be introduced I feel there is a significant following calling for Captain Marvel and BP movies

And besides that, hate to pull that card but can you imagine the s***storm if Marvel pulls the only women led and minority led solo films out of its schedule?

 

[Matt]

YEah RDJ is going to be really difficult. AS you said he is one of the big 3 guys who the MCU basically owes it's success to (Feige, RDJ, and Faverau)

I personally can't see another actor taking the role and not doing a RDJ impression when playing Stark

That's going to be a real difficult one to replace

I think it is going to be where Spider-Man comes in. I think if Ant-Man bombs and Marvel (translation: Disney...the ones who will really call the shots) starts to get cold feet about investing in a bunch of B-list heroes, Marvel is going to heavily shift what is left of Phase 3 and Phase 4 to build around Spider-Man (much as Phase 1 was basically built around Iron Man following IM's success) and then try to use Spider-Man as a platform to launch some of these lesser known heroes. Then at some point down the road (Phase 5 or so), they can recast with Downey far enough from the public's mind (or perhaps itching to come back after taking some time off).

 

[Matt]

I think BP and Marvel will definetly still happen even if Ant Man bombs.

I mean besides the fact that BP will already be introduced I feel there is a significant following calling for Captain Marvel and BP movies

And besides that, hate to pull that card but can you imagine the s***storm if Marvel pulls the only women led and minority led solo films out of its schedule?

They may still happen, but I think the marketing strategy, release schedule, and what not will definitely shift. Like I said in my other post, they will start using Spider-Man to build to these heroes.

I don't think Captain Marvel is a guarantee. I think BP PROBABLY is. I think if Ant-Man bombs, Captain Marvel may be replaced by a Black Widow/Hawkeye solo...if they can get Renner and Johannson on (because as you said, Marvel is already getting **** for lack of female led movies).

 

[Illegal Seafood]

Its a different situation entirely. GOTG was separate. It wasn't really advertised as part of the MCU, it was marketed differently. It was seen as its own thing (and it had a brilliant marketing plan). Sure, there is tie in potential, but it was at the same time, separate. Plus it is kinda a different genre all together.

Black Panther, Captain Marvel, Doctor Strange...they are all kind of the same as Ant-Man...B-list heroes that Marvel plans to fill Phase 4 and beyond with (due to the actors of Phase 1-3 being over it).

Beyond that, I am not saying it makes sense. I am not saying because audiences do not respond to Ant-Man, they will not respond to Doctor Strange. I am saying that studio logic would make one hesitant to take a shot on a B-lister after one bombs. In the end, the show business is still a business and using something like Ant-Man as a model can provide guidance on anticipated success of someone like Black Panther. As such, a studio may use such models to determine how best to invest moving forward.

Not really marketed differently. Any ad I saw always had to mention "from the studio that brought you The Avengers, comes the next chapter...etc"

They already have Ant-Man in Civil War, so they must have faith in the character. Even if the film bombs (which I doubt), why would they pull the plug on other films that have nothing to do with Ant-Man?

Ant-Man's reception reflects very little on the potential reception for a Cumberbatch, Dr. Strange, or a Boseman, Black Panther (who will be seen for the first time in Civil War) So if that's the studio logic, it's very poor logic because it's equating two distinct variables.

 

[Illegal Seafood]

They may still happen, but I think the marketing strategy, release schedule, and what not will definitely shift. Like I said in my other post, they will start using Spider-Man to build to these heroes.

I don't think Captain Marvel is a guarantee. I think BP PROBABLY is. I think if Ant-Man bombs, Captain Marvel may be replaced by a Black Widow/Hawkeye solo...if they can get Renner and Johannson on (because as you said, Marvel is already getting **** for lack of female led movies).

If they start changing films in their Phase 3 lineup, that will cause more backlash and make them look weaker than if they released those films and hoped for the best.

Just look at Pixar. Cars 2 was their first and really only critical bomb. But it still made a lot of money at the box office. The critical flop hasn't stopped them from making films or drastically altered their formula for films. Since Pixar and Marvel are under the same umbrella of Disney, I highly doubt you'll start seeing films removed/replaced if one film is a critical bomb.

 

[warhorse78]

They're going to either James Bond it and just recast, or they're going to rely on the new players they're introducing. Ant-Man, Black Panther, Captain Marvel, Dr. Strange, Wanda, Vision, etc.

But, what if they don't get the response like Tony, Thor, Cap and GOTG did? They already established that while people like The Hulk character, they don't like him enough to go see him in his solo movies, so it's pretty much why there will be no more Hulk solos in the future.

I honestly think Ant Man is going to be their first bomb. Out of the rest of these, the only ones I see having any kind of magnitude with the general audience is Black Panther and Wanda. Cumberbatch is more of an internet darling, not real world darling, and Vision seemed to be more of a hit with straight up comic book fans than the regular General Audience.

 

[falconcrest87]

Honestly, I think a big part of it will be how the public reacts to some of the lesser known heroes like Black Panther, Ant-Man, etc. I think if Ant-Man bombs, Marvel may very quietly nix movies like Black Panther and Captain Marvel and start thinking about recasting Iron Man, Captain America, Thor, etc (or backing up dump trucks full of money to Downey, Evans, and Hemsworth's front doors).

I don't think they have much of a choice but to make Black Panther, Cpt. Marvel, Dr. Strange and Ant-Man work. Yes they could recast but IDK who they would get to play Iron Man, Cpt. America, or Thor. They come with pretty stringent casting requirements that if someone were to tell me that they literally wrote the characters for those actors, I'd believe it. I also don't think any of the actors who are currently in the MCU are going to want to continue being major headliners in the franchise for very long. I mean think about it: RDJ, Chris Evans, ScarJo and such had already finished doing a major press junket that kinda went off the rails. And then what, 2-3 days later they're shooting Civil War all of a sudden?! Then after they shoot this movie and come back for the junket for this movie, they have all of 8 months to get their affairs in order before they spend 1-2 years shooting Infinity War. That's a lot of damn work. Just sayin. I would not be mad if the money was not enough for them to stay.

 

[warhorse78]

I don't see why, if Ant-Man were to bomb, that Marvel should pull the plug on other movies like Black Panther and Captain Marvel. What do they have to do with Ant-Man and what bearing does his success or failure have on them?

If Ant-Man were released before GOTG, and Ant-Man bombed, then imagine if they nixed GOTG. They're about as obscure as you could get. However, they were a huge success, and giving them the chop simply on the grounds that one lesser-known property didn't succeed so all lesser-known properties would follow suit seems rather premature and baseless.

Like it or not, but the BO of one of these movies will cause the CEO's to dictate with what happens. Why do you think there is so much emphasis on RDJ/Tony Stark in so many of these movies? It's not because for continuity's sake, it's because he brings in the $$$$$$$$$$$$$$. Heck, I have very strong feelings for Black Panther, I really believe this is going to be a damn good movie and probably one of the very best characters for the MCU, but, the sad fact is, Black leads have a track record of not doing so good at the BO unless he's Will Smith or Denzel Washington.

 

[MahvelBaby!]

I think after phase 3 just concentrate more on the new characters BP, AM, CM, Inhumans, SM. and bring in the old guys to cameo once in a while, I think they'd be willing to do that here and there.

 

[Illegal Seafood]

I don't think they have much of a choice but to make Black Panther, Cpt. Marvel, Dr. Strange and Ant-Man work. Yes they could recast but IDK who they would get to play Iron Man, Cpt. America, or Thor. They come with pretty stringent casting requirements that if someone were to tell me that they literally wrote the characters for those actors, I'd believe it. I also don't think any of the actors who are currently in the MCU are going to want to continue being major headliners in the franchise for very long. I mean think about it: RDJ, Chris Evans, ScarJo and such had already finished doing a major press junket that kinda went off the rails. And then what, 2-3 days later they're shooting Civil War all of a sudden?! Then after they shoot this movie and come back for the junket for this movie, they have all of 8 months to get their affairs in order before they spend 1-2 years shooting Infinity War. That's a lot of damn work. Just sayin. I would not be mad if the money was not enough for them to stay.

I agree that some of them can get tired of playing the role, but I think Hemsworth and Evans have both shown interest in returning after phase 3. But I guess that's tbd.

And while Evans especially has a long film shoot ahead, he did just take 6 months off after shooting AOU. There's not a lot of jobs in this world where you can do that. And the shoot is 9 months for Infinity War, not 1-2 years, and that starts fall of 2016. So when Civil War shooting ends probably around August/Sept, he will have another 6 months off from the character (I mean he can also do other films) but then he comes back in April for the press release, then is off for another 6 months until Infinity War.

So if I could take 6 month breaks from work and get paid well, I don't know why I would leave