Civil War Civil War Lopsided???

[MbJ]

This is confusing first Natasha is on Steve's side then some say she's on Tony's; what is the definitive team line up?

That's not official art. It's a photoshop the op found.

 

[Godzillasaurus]

The only individuals in the story that can be titled as "super powerful" are Vision and Scarlet Witch, one of which being the "wild-card"

Ant-Man will also be capable of transforming into Giant Man apparently, and, while miniature, could efficiently enter the Ironman and War Machine armor to potentially disable them.

But yes, I do firmly agree that the teams appear a little awkwardly-formed with the idea that Pro-Reg is obviously the more powerful of the two

 

[third3ye]

Cap's supposed to be the underdog anyway, dunno why this initial roster should be surprising.

 

[Pecola1]

^True
Another thing: I think some people here are underestimating Black Panther's power.
Also, I wouldn't be surprised if Iron-Man wanted to personally fight Cap and keep others off of him, to try to convince him but not wanting to admit that's why. Even his arrogance could come in play, thinking he could easily take down cap. (They are a pretty even match, but I think Cap has an advantage with NOT just the shield but also the fighting skills and strategy.

I really think it would be an interesting movie from Tony Stark's perspective, not just focusing on him, but showing his thoughts. (I wrote an alternate storyline to Civil War which had this idea in place.)

 

[AndrewGilkison]

In Civil War Iron Man had Cap's fighting style programmed into his suit so he'd know exactly what he would do. I thought that was a cool bit in the comic, so it would be awesome if they brought that into the film.

 

[Steamteck]

In Civil War Iron Man had Cap's fighting style programmed into his suit so he'd know exactly what he would do. I thought that was a cool bit in the comic, so it would be awesome if they brought that into the film.

I can't describe how much I hate stuff like that. It completely devalues actual skill and training and makes experience count for nothing. It only really would work at all IMO with another machine that the programmer had access to the programs off

 

[Lamashtar]

I can't describe how much I hate stuff like that. It completely devalues actual skill and training and makes experience count for nothing. It only really would work at all IMO with another machine that the programmer had access to the programs off

Agreed. It requires an insane amount of mathematics to calculate trajectories and catch a baseball. Humans do it with little effort.

Trying to dumb down real life difficulties in instantaneous biological decision making in order to make Tony Stark look smart is poor writing.

 

[AndrewGilkison]

I can't describe how much I hate stuff like that. It completely devalues actual skill and training and makes experience count for nothing. It only really would work at all IMO with another machine that the programmer had access to the programs off

Agreed. It requires an insane amount of mathematics to calculate trajectories and catch a baseball. Humans do it with little effort.

Trying to dumb down real life difficulties in instantaneous biological decision making in order to make Tony Stark look smart is poor writing.

Yes, I know it's ridiculous and illogical. But then again, Tony Stark is a ridiculous and illogical comic book science fiction tech genius that built a ridiculous and illogical robot suit, run on a power source that doesn't and couldn't possibly exist in real life.

You have no problems with that, but you have problems with Stark programming and recording moves that he knows Cap learned into his impossibly powerful flying robot suit?

The whole point of Tony Stark's character is that he is (overly) reliant on his technology. He uses it for everything. Why wouldn't he use it in a battle with Captain America? Not just the brute strength of the suit (because that is not true to Tony's character to rely on brute strength) but also the computers in the suit to neutralize Cap's strengths as much as possible.

I don't mind that. It gives Cap even more of a challenge he has to overcome, and forces him to think even more outside of the box in his fighting skills (which we know Cap can do as he is a fast learner). It makes for a much better fight, in my opinion.

 

[DanielFM]

Yes, I know it's ridiculous and illogical. But then again, Tony Stark is a ridiculous and illogical comic book science fiction tech genius that built a ridiculous and illogical robot suit, run on a power source that doesn't and couldn't possibly exist in real life.

You have no problems with that, but you have problems with Stark programming and recording moves that he knows Cap learned into his impossibly powerful flying robot suit?

The whole point of Tony Stark's character is that he is (overly) reliant on his technology. He uses it for everything. Why wouldn't he use it in a battle with Captain America? Not just the brute strength of the suit (because that is not true to Tony's character to rely on brute strength) but also the computers in the suit to neutralize Cap's strengths as much as possible.

I don't mind that. It gives Cap even more of a challenge he has to overcome, and forces him to think even more outside of the box in his fighting skills (which we know Cap can do as he is a fast learner). It makes for a much better fight, in my opinion.

But in the comics Cap got beaten into a pulp, until an outside force (Vision) deactivated Tony's suit. And that's not Cap winning, that's cheating.
Do you really want that?
Because if IM has Cap's fighting style recorded nd can anticipate every move, Cap has no advantage whatsoever (except he can invent a new martial art on the run, which I doubt).

 

[Godzillasaurus]

Y'all have to remember that Steve did a fine job against Ultron, even though he did still get his ass handed to him (not to mention that Ultron clearly was not trying particularly hard. He could have torn Cap apart with the same method that he utilized to tear Klaw's arm off and rip his Korea body apart, but instead he decided to just lightly punch him)

I wonder how it will turn out if Tony actually tries to murder Cap this time around...

 

[DanielFM]

Y'all have to remember that Steve did a fine job against Ultron, even though he did still get his ass handed to him (not to mention that Ultron clearly was not trying particularly hard. He could have torn Cap apart with the same method that he utilized to tear Klaw's arm off and rip his Korea body apart, but instead he decided to just lightly punch him)

I wonder how it will turn out if Tony actually tries to murder Cap this time around...

LOL I love your post, it starts like: hey, be more positive, Cap wasn't doing bad against Ultron. But it ends like: well, he could have destroyed him.
Not very reassuring, right? t:

 

[The_Manhunter]

Eh not really

Vision/Scarlet Witch
Iron Man/Ant-Man
War Machine/Falcon
Black Widow/Hawkeye
Spider-man/Agent 13
Black Panther/Captain America

Seems pretty even TBH, with a slight edge to team Iron Man.

 

[Stevie2020]

But in the comics Cap got beaten into a pulp, until an outside force (Vision) deactivated Tony's suit. And that's not Cap winning, that's cheating.
Do you really want that?
Because if IM has Cap's fighting style recorded nd can anticipate every move, Cap has no advantage whatsoever (except he can invent a new martial art on the run, which I doubt).

The only way Cap would win over Iron Man in a fair fight is if they agree to duel with agreed upon rules and boundaries. I doubt that would happen because an all out brawl at the height of anger won't be that civilized.


If there are no restrictions on resources and no rules to the fight to even the playing field, Steve would have to find a way to deactivate the suit or use it against Tony. And finding a way to deactivate the suit is not cheating. That's a winning strategy.


Fighting Iron Man would be like taking down a tank or a quinjet. He needs the element of surprise and he needs to get in there and do damage and shut it down.

 

[Lamashtar]

The only way Cap would win over Iron Man in a fair fight is if they agree to duel with agreed upon rules and boundaries. I doubt that would happen because an all out brawl at the height of anger won't be that civilized.


If there are no restrictions on resources and no rules to the fight to even the playing field, Steve would have to find a way to deactivate the suit or use it against Tony. And finding a way to deactivate the suit is not cheating. That's a winning strategy.


Fighting Iron Man would be like taking down a tank or a quinjet. He needs the element of surprise and he needs to get in there and do damage and shut it down.

I suppose sneaking into Tony's house and punching him cold is cheating too?

 

[DanielFM]

The only way Cap would win over Iron Man in a fair fight is if they agree to duel with agreed upon rules and boundaries. I doubt that would happen because an all out brawl at the height of anger won't be that civilized.


If there are no restrictions on resources and no rules to the fight to even the playing field, Steve would have to find a way to deactivate the suit or use it against Tony. And finding a way to deactivate the suit is not cheating. That's a winning strategy.


Fighting Iron Man would be like taking down a tank or a quinjet. He needs the element of surprise and he needs to get in there and do damage and shut it down.

Oh, so asking Scott Lang (as Vision will be unavailable in the movie) to "deactivate the suit pretty please" is a winning strategy? Someone did half the work for you!

I suppose sneaking into Tony's house and punching him cold is cheating too?

Or maybe taking away his medicines so he suffers a stroke?

 

[Stevie2020]

Oh, so asking Scott Lang (as Vision will be unavailable in the movie) to "deactivate the suit pretty please" is a winning strategy? Someone did half the work for you!

You funee! Who said anything about Cap asking for help? If Scotty or Viz (in the name of being "on the side of life") decide to step in, so be it. That's not on Cap, so it's not a cheat. There's only cheating when there's a violation of rules by the people bound by the rules. Maybe Cap himself can just get a finger up in there a pull a wire or something. Surely that wouldn't constitute cheating.


All kidding aside, I'm rooting for Cap to not be beaten to a pulp by whatever means necessary and if he is in danger of getting beaten to a pulp at some point by IM, then by all means the gloves should come off and Cap needs to pull out the long knives or the brass knuckles or whatever he carries in that utility belt of his. Or else the calvary needs to come in. Be that Vision or Ant-man or Bucky/Falcon tagging-in...with brass knuckles, course.

Because someone needs to brandish some brass knuckles in this thingt:.

I'll feel cheated, otherwise.

 

[Stevie2020]

I suppose sneaking into Tony's house and punching him cold is cheating too?

One might say that's long overdue, but that's taking the element of surprise a bit far.

 

[DanielFM]

You funee! Who said anything about Cap asking for help? If Scotty or Viz (in the name of being "on the side of life") decide to step in, so be it. That's not on Cap, so it's not a cheat. There's only cheating when there's a violation of rules by the people bound by the rules. Maybe Cap himself can just get a finger up in there a pull a wire or something. Surely that wouldn't constitute cheating.


All kidding aside, I'm rooting for Cap to not be beaten to a pulp by whatever means necessary and if he is in danger of getting beaten to a pulp at some point by IM, then by all means the gloves should come off and Cap needs to pull out the long knives or the brass knuckles or whatever he carries in that utility belt of his. Or else the calvary needs to come in. Be that Vision or Ant-man or Bucky/Falcon tagging-in...with brass knuckles, course.

Because someone needs to brandish some brass knuckles in this thingt:.

I'll feel cheated, otherwise.

t:t:

The thing is, if Tony is doing the "I got all your moves" trick Cap doesn't stands a chance of winning against him one on one. Having someone come to help him by deactivating the suit/whatever is fair and all, but then it isn't Cap winning, but both him AND the helper.
Is there something wrong on Cap needing help to defeat Iron Man? Not by principle (it's even rumoured Cap and Bucky will team up against IM). But it would constitute a plain statement of him being weaker than IM, for what's worth. Not a lot of merit going to the good old Steve.

And before someone brings it, telling a guy to use his powers doesn't constitute a showcase of strategic genius, so it wouldn't definitely prove anything about Cap.

 

[John Locke]

Can't Cap deactivate the suit by pulling out of the arc reactor? He's got the strength, no need for outside help.

 

[Lamashtar]

Can't Cap deactivate the suit by pulling out of the arc reactor? He's got the strength, no need for outside help.

Sometimes I forget that movie!Tony is not as powerful as comic!Tony.

Cap strength + vibranium shield = chopping bits off Tony bits

 

[DanielFM]

Can't Cap deactivate the suit by pulling out of the arc reactor? He's got the strength, no need for outside help.

Good one!

I even thought if Cap found a weak spot in the armor he could stick a knife (we have seen using them twice in the movies) in the crevice and slam it inside with the shield.

It's not really that difficult to imagine scenarios in which Cap could heavily damage IM. The problem? I don't think he could pull them off if they include the "combat move prediction" programming.

That's why I stated it would be bad for the film, making Tony untouchable except for outside help.

Please give us the resourceful, disingenuous Cap!

 

[Hmarrs]

Sometimes I forget that movie!Tony is not as powerful as comic!Tony.

Cap strength + vibranium shield = chopping bits off Tony bits

Depends on who you ASK?
Maybe not in the Suit but yes in Character.
Just look at that Hulk Buster Fight against a SAVAGE HULK.Took Hank Pyms Place.Did a Whole 3rd Movie without his Suit.Saved the Avengers.Was the Mouth Piece of the Avengers to Loki.
He is a Demi-God in the Movies he is the all Powerful one in terms of Character(He is the Marvel Movie Experience).

 

[Iceman]

What are the full rosters including people not on either of the 2 posters?

 

[SwiftFox]

What are the full rosters including people not on either of the 2 posters?

That's a really good question. I don't think Maria Hill is showing up but if she did she'd definitely be team Stark. Not sure on Fury (I'm sad SLJ isn't going to be in this - unless it's a cameo or something)...after all the shield stuff, he might be with Cap on this? Maybe?

 

[TheVision]

With Tonys upgrades, I dont know how Cap could beat him in a fight. It doesnt seem fair. Cap can kick and throw his shield, thats about it. But its also a thing where Tony wouldnt want to really hurt Cap, he just wants to keep him at bay by knocking him down. I dont know how far he'll go with that.